More iPhone Details?

[someguy]

If these rumors are true, I won't be buying an iPhone.

What's the use? Spend $500.. $600 even on an Apple phone that is only marginally better than the phones I can get for free or $25 on eBay?

I like Apple products, but not that much.

 

[dayton]

There are PCS engineers, Motorola has a whole group of them in San Deigo.

Yeah, PCS refers to a network that operates on the 1900-mhz radio band. CDMA, GSM, etc. refer to network technologies that can operate in the PCS frequency. PCS is usually distinguished from "cellular" which operates in the ~800-~850 MHz range.

If it is GSM, I hope the phone is quad-band so that it can be used pretty much anywhere in the world. Although, I'd really prefer a true 3G phone.

 

[yg17]

There probably won't ever be CDMA support because CDMA blows.

Apple's probably planning on selling these in Apple stores. Well, can't do that with CDMA since your carrier has to activate it, and from what I've heard, the CDMA carriers won't activate 3rd party phones. Which means if Apple did do a CDMA version, companies like Verizion would cripple the thing which isn't what Apple wants.

 

[SilvorX]

I love the idea of not subsidizing the phone . . .

I assume that means that Apple doesn't want to let any carrier "customize" the interface to that carrier. At that point, why not just sell it in the Apple store and tell people it's unlocked and all they need is their current SIM card?

If the phone is going to be $400+ like one of the many rumour articles speculated yesterday, I better not be getting a freaking 3 year contract (that's the most common type of contract in Canada) for paying for an unsubsidized phone, if I was to pay for the phone.

PCS is not a phone technology. There are no "PCS" engineers. Sprint's network is based on CDMA.

exactlement!

but we aren't currently aware of Apple courting CDMA (Verizon) or PCS (Sprint) engineers.

I know quite a few of us aren't cellphone experts here but PCS is just the brand name (Sprint PCS) for Sprint, it uses CDMA/EV-DO technology like Verizon, there's nothing really that different between the two.


Something doesn't sit with me right about the whole CDMA thing, I can't recall a time in either Verizon or Sprint's life (or Telus in Canada) where you could just buy an "unlocked" phone and put it on their network, CDMA phones are tied to the network because of their serial numbers, someone can try to put a phone on a competitor's network but usually it fails, I've tried myself and I was a customer service rep who had to do all that sort of BS, didn't work. If a CDMA version was to be released, either carrier could just say "no", or both of them will release it, it's near impossible to sell the CDMA version in an Apple Store for the whole reason of the serial number being tied to the network, however if Apple was to sell models tied to specific networks, then that would be different!

There are PCS engineers, Motorola has a whole group of them in San Deigo.

That's iDen I believe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_Communications_Service it's pre-CDMA it looks like

 

[technocoy]

maybe these rumors do jive together...

apple doesn't want other providers to subsidize because they want to make it more appealing for them to be on their own network that will be launched via piggyback on cingular's infrastructure. Apple will subsidize on their network, but wants it to at least be compatible with other carriers.

They know that us mac nuts will buy it and be their guinea pigs for the network's features which will surely include pretty robust data features so that it works hand in hand with your computer, as well as downloading songs on the fly.

not sure.. there are still to many variations in the rumors to pin anything down, but i haven't seen this big of a frenzy on the phone before, so my gut reaction is that it IS coming in the next few weeks, we just know know enough to pin things down yet.

it's exciting none-the-less... i mean, CAN apple recreate the success of the iPod? even on a smaller scale? we'll see!

 

[Pressure]

I don't see why people are obsessed with the US market and tariffs etc.

You should all start thinking globally. Can they sell 12 million worldwide? Even at a pretty high price? Why not, we are 6 billion humans on this little rock.

I am feeling confident that Apple will release a phone that sets the standard and for everyone else to replicate in some manner.

Art and design are becoming a lot more important for the entire western world and it have become a question of life style. How do you want other people to perceive you..

 

[birdsong]

There probably won't ever be CDMA support because CDMA blows.

Apple's probably planning on selling these in Apple stores. Well, can't do that with CDMA since your carrier has to activate it, and from what I've heard, the CDMA carriers won't activate 3rd party phones. Which means if Apple did do a CDMA version, companies like Verizion would cripple the thing which isn't what Apple wants.

Please provide technical reasons why CDMA is bad. Something tells me you really don't know anything about it. If you don't like the carriers which provide CDMA access, that's one thing, but state it as such.

Technically, CDMA is pretty neat, employing orthogonal coding to distinguish the different senders in a given channel. It's a bit more novel than the TDMA approach. It also has a simple approach to "soft handoff" (a very difficult problem in communications engineering). In addition, CDMA has better spectral efficiency than TDMA (and GSM is TDMA).

Functionally speaking, current CDMA networks in the US have faster data rates than GSM networks. That's a plus in my book.

 

[micahy2k]

Music Video on iTunes

I might be looking at this wrong but I saw a new music video for Evanescene on iTunes that had a wierd screen size. It seemed like it is even widerscreen than normal. It is the song "lithium". It seems like it could be the size of the screen on the iPhone. Everyone look and tell me what you think. Kinda odd.

 

[puckhead193]

However, ThinkSecret claims that Apple is still courting multiple GSM wireless carriers across North America, Europe, and Asia. Apple is also said to be asking for carriers to NOT subsidize the price of the phone. GSM carriers in North America include Cingular and T-Mobile.

that is going to be one expensive phone that as of now only plays music

 

[Le Big Mac]

Convincing people to buy at that price who see the price of an se k800i as free might be tricky though.

That's going to be the problem. 1) Americans are used to subsidized/cheap phones as part of a plan. 2) The plans are all priced to assume recovery of the subsidy given for phones. It's not like the price goes down after the contract is over.

Of course, this could be apple posturing to make sure they have complete control. Release the phone unlocked, and let people who really want it buy it full price, then sign deals with phone cos. whereby they subsidize it. By rolling it out unlocked and untouched by cingular/tmobile, etc., they can show that it's best the way it is. Then cingular and tmobile are stuck with the phone the way apple has done it, and at most can put some goofy splat label on it somewhere.

 

[asphalt-proof]

So many conflicting rumors in such a short time. Methinks Apple may be seeding bad info in an effort ot discover where the potential leaks are. Nawww that's way too Machivellian. Gizmodo would be crazy to post his 'guarantee' if he even thought the info was a bit shady. It would be like Arn guarantee that the iPhone is coming out on Monday and it not panning out. He/the site would never live it down. Too much credibility is at stake. Especially with such a high profile product like the iPhone. However, this information sounds very credible as well and the details sound very Apple-esque.

I think I am finally starting to feel iPhone-rumor burnout. I know some here had this months ago but I am in the market for a new phone and have been hanging on each new morsel. No more. I'll wait for Monday then I have to buy a new phone. My Treo just gave it up and is beyond resusitation.

 

[Rychiar]

i see how sim cards are def useful but CDMA and verizon are def the best in the US, my calls are all crystal clear, never dropped and i get service allover. my friends with Cingular have all sorts of issues. Plus GSM phones make all household electronics make a weird buzz noise when a call comes in (tv's, radios, etc) whereas CDMA causes no such interference. I wish there was somethin new and global and not tied to some damn carrier here. Cingulars prices are insane, especially for data and txt plans which arent even unlimited in network

 

[Stridder44]

In a word, no. I just bought a Sony W310i Walkman phone and it works great for music, with its 1 GB Memory Stick Micro. It even works with my mac. I just plug it in and drag MP3s to it in Finder. I find it hard to believe people will pay $300-600 for an Apple iPhone WITH a plan. Apple is asking too much for the carriers not to subsidize it. I believe Steve Jobs has finally fallen off his rocker.

SonyEricsson phones rock my face off. I have one myself and it's been nothing but awesome. A MILLION times better than the crappy RAZRs.

i see how sim cards are def useful but CDMA and verizon are def the best in the US, my calls are all crystal clear, never dropped and i get service allover. my friends with Cingular have all sorts of issues. Plus GSM phones make all household electronics make a weird buzz noise when a call comes in (tv's, radios, etc) whereas CDMA causes no such interference. I wish there was somethin new and global and not tied to some damn carrier here. Cingulars prices are insane, especially for data and txt plans which arent even unlimited in network

That reminded me of this

 

[TheNipponese]

Worst News Ever

Without UMTS, 3G, or any WCDMA features, this phone is garbage to me. That is a realy disappointing speculation.

 

[dayton]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_Communications_Service it's pre-CDMA it looks like

You might want to read the first two lines from that page.

Personal Communications Service or PCS is the name for the 1900-MHz radio band used for digital mobile phone services in Canada and the United States. Code Division Multiple Access (CDMA), GSM, and D-AMPS systems can be used on PCS frequencies.

 

[TheNipponese]

Please provide technical reasons why CDMA is bad. Something tells me you really don't know anything about it. If you don't like the carriers which provide CDMA access, that's one thing, but state it as such.

Technically, CDMA is pretty neat, employing orthogonal coding to distinguish the different senders in a given channel. It's a bit more novel than the TDMA approach. It also has a simple approach to "soft handoff" (a very difficult problem in communications engineering). In addition, CDMA has better spectral efficiency than TDMA (and GSM is TDMA).

Functionally speaking, current CDMA networks in the US have faster data rates than GSM networks. That's a plus in my book.

Seriously, what the hell is the difference anymore (except that you can use GSM phones to roam on a lot more international carriers). Both the GSM and CDMA2000 protocols are slow as ****. I would have even been happy with EV1x-DO...

 

[sdhalpern]

no verizon? bad move apple... bad move.

 

[3282872]

i see how sim cards are def useful but CDMA and verizon are def the best in the US, my calls are all crystal clear, never dropped and i get service allover. my friends with Cingular have all sorts of issues. Plus GSM phones make all household electronics make a weird buzz noise when a call comes in (tv's, radios, etc) whereas CDMA causes no such interference. I wish there was somethin new and global and not tied to some damn carrier here. Cingulars prices are insane, especially for data and txt plans which arent even unlimited in network

I beg to differ. I was a Verizon customer for years until recently. Two reasons why I left. One, Verizon's business tactics. As someone who bought the Motorola V710 a while ago, I was led to believe the Bluetooth OBEX features would be fully operational when I spent $500 dollars. Wrong. Verizon admitted publicly in a press release that it had the right to cripple those features in order to charge customers download fees for pictures and ringtone and even contacts. My Mac should be able to do all that with a compliant unit. Verizon's attitude is screw the customer, let's make money. In the end, Verizon was sued by a law firm representing hundreds of customers in California and LOST. When I upgraded to the RAZR v3c, the first batch was fully operational, the one I had. However, Verizon quickly rectified that with firmware updates .03 and .04, crippling the OBEX again. I refused to upgrade my firmware out of principle, that is an inexcusable business tactic. Cingular, t-Mobile, et al do not cripple their phones in any way in order to penny pinch their customers.

Second, Verizon kept screwing up my bills. As I went over my text messaging allowance I phoned customer service to increase my monthly limit. Three times they didn't fully process it and three times my bills were 300-400 dollars a month. Apparently the customer isn't always right in Verizon's mind.

After 7+ years of loyalty, Cingular now has my business. No crippling the phones, I can download whatever I want to and from my phone. SIM cards rock, I can switch to any unlocked or Cingular phone in a second. In Europe? No problem. Phone fully functions. Customer service is excellent and not one dropped call. Verizon needs to seriously re-examine their practices and update their outdated CDMA system.

 

[Maestro64]

There probably won't ever be CDMA support because CDMA blows.

Apple's probably planning on selling these in Apple stores. Well, can't do that with CDMA since your carrier has to activate it, and from what I've heard, the CDMA carriers won't activate 3rd party phones. Which means if Apple did do a CDMA version, companies like Verizion would cripple the thing which isn't what Apple wants.

This is true, Verizion does not want unrestricted phones on their network, they simply want you to pay for everything. However, if you have an activated SIM card you can plug it into another phone. Verizon has been refusing to activitate a phone if it does not support E911 services like gps location. The question will be is if the Apple phone has the GPS chip set as well.

 

[Maestro64]

That's iDen I believe

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_Communications_Service it's pre-CDMA it looks like

No iden products are done in the chiago area, even thou Verizon and Sprint are CDMA they both work differently. In order to make CDMA phone work with sprints networks other things need to be done. Thus the reason you pointed out above a Sprint CDMA phone can not be activitated on Verizon. Which is very different than GSM where you can move a phone from one GSM provider to another by simply changing SIM cards.

 

[longofest]

Thanks everyone who chimed in on the PCS/CDMA debate. I updated the article, as it does look like PCS is a superset of a few different technologies, and Sprint currently uses CDMA for their PCS network. Of course, other networks use GSM on their PCS networks, so it PCS does not equate to CDMA.

I agree with the folks that say that its a bummer that Apple doesn't seem to be making a CDMA version of the phone (at least at first). But, lets see... maybe Kevin will be right after all...

 

[3282872]

Please provide technical reasons why CDMA is bad. Something tells me you really don't know anything about it. If you don't like the carriers which provide CDMA access, that's one thing, but state it as such.

Technically, CDMA is pretty neat, employing orthogonal coding to distinguish the different senders in a given channel. It's a bit more novel than the TDMA approach. It also has a simple approach to "soft handoff" (a very difficult problem in communications engineering). In addition, CDMA has better spectral efficiency than TDMA (and GSM is TDMA).

Functionally speaking, current CDMA networks in the US have faster data rates than GSM networks. That's a plus in my book.

If you travel internationally on a regular basis, or if you need to use your phone anywhere outside of North America, good luck on a CDMA network. Cingular already has 3G phones (such as LG's newest 3G model) that out perform Verizon's 3G units. CDMA is NOT faster, in fact it is proving to be slower. The only reason Verizon MAY have better sound quality is due to it's aggressive tactics in acquiring more towers. In fact, Verizon has faced numerous lawsuits alleging subpar business tactics in acquiring towers in many area's of the U.S. Let's not forget Verizon's business tactics in crippling the OBEX in all their phones, forcing customers to pay for services such as "Get It Now" to download ringtones and pics (that also expire after certain periods). Their customer service ratings are dropping almost daily. If Verizon doesn't get over themselves and learn to "play nice", I don't see much good in their future.

 

[gugy]

no verizon? bad move apple... bad move.

if this rumor is true is interesting why Apple would leave so many millions of verizon and sprint subscribers behind.
I wonder with these same folks will become the "switch" iPhone advertising campaign.
We'll see. My Verizon is OK, I hope Cingular is not the carrier. T-Mobile maybe would make me "switch".
Or another possibility will be Apple with their own network, so we all can tell the cell carriers to go to hell!

 

[BenRoethig]

I don't see why people are obsessed with the US market and tariffs etc.

You should all start thinking globally. Can they sell 12 million worldwide? Even at a pretty high price? Why not, we are 6 billion humans on this little rock.

I am feeling confident that Apple will release a phone that sets the standard and for everyone else to replicate in some manner.

Art and design are becoming a lot more important for the entire western world and it have become a question of life style. How do you want other people to perceive you..

It might have something to do with the U.S. being Apple's home and highest sales market. Cut off roughly half the market which is using CMDA for its better coverage and Apple is making drastically less money.

 

[chrisgeleven]

no verizon? bad move apple... bad move.

Agreed. Where I live (New Hampshire), Verizon is the only reliable option for cell service in most parts of the state.

Cingular in most areas where I go is roaming at best. T-Mobile has a good 60+ mile coverage hole from Concord, NH to Lebanon, NH on I-89, which is completely unacceptable for me. Sprint has pretty decent coverage, but I heard horror stories about customer support.