More PowerMac G5 Details...

[paulypants]

My guess is there has to be an update pretty quickly after this. For example, WWDC. I know it's not smart for a company to update a product and then decide to update it a month and a half later but this almost has to be the case this time. If I remember correctly the Keynote is 2 hours long, so what else could Steve possibly talk about for that time? No new iMacs, eMacs, Mac mini's or iBooks. Possibly iPods but that's worth what, 20 minutes? We know Tiger will be out and shipped by then for at least a month so they won't spend much time on that. That gives a bare minimum of an hour left. Maybe talk of a future OS but I doubt that. In that time they could announce both Dual Core Powerbooks and Dual Core PowerMacs. Even a G5 powerbook could be announced. Even if they were announced then, they may take a few months to ship, which wouldn't be the first time. This would give the new revisions at least 6 month shelf life, and then the Dual Cores would ship. If this was the case Apple would only make a limited number of this new PowerMacs knowing the Dual Core announcement would slow down the current PowerMac sales. I'm not saying this is going to happen but it is possible. I sure hope so.

Seriously what will Apple have to talk about at WWDC? If all these things are introduced right befor it? Software for sure, iPods maybe, maybe some new hardware peripheral a la iPod, but what else in that 2 hour segment? Honestly if these Pmac specs are correct I have to believe that there is a Powermac Pro line of some sort coming to top out with dual core cpus and hopefully PCIe, especially since the top models always get the 'new' tech in apple's lineup. Hopefully this may be evidenced if new Powermacs debut with said specs but at lower price points, opening up more room at the $3k mark and above...

here's to hoping.

 

[Val-kyrie]

I'm in the same boat

now i have to make one of the biggest decisions of my life.... the updated..if u can call it that powermac... or the powerbook? does anyone know anything more or heard anything about how the freescale dual g4 project is going? also, would the current powerbook handle final cut express? i need something by this fall for school, i've had to do with a piece e-machines this semester but my parents are taking it back home after this. sooo... any advice on which one to get? i'm personally starting to lean into the powerbook unless the powermac is decently upgraded. whichever one i go with.. i need it to last me about 3-4 years.

Fortunately, I don't need the laptop for video editing. To answer your question, it has been mentioned that Moto isn't due to sample the 8641(D) until Fall this year, making its release unlikely before Jan, '06. More realistic would be a summer or fall release of the PPC7448--but with the exception of a higher bus speed (200 MHz), I don't find it that appealing. There is still no native DDR support built into it.

 

[rockthecasbah]

I dunno, I'm just having a difficult time believing this story. For all we know, Apple is laughing like crazy at us debating IBM and the future of G5. Put this in the record books: Unexpectedly Apple pulls a 3ghz dual core out of no where and blows everyone out of the water (high end). The new low end is a single core 2.5ghz, then a single or double 2.7ghz (different prices according to choice). 😉

 

[BanditBill]

Cheaper PowerMacs Please

I'm not concerned about performance as much as price. I'd like a PowerMac, but I'll probably buy a mini with Tiger pre-loaded due to the price.

I don't understand many people on these sites.
They brag because their computer is soooo fast.
They complain because Apple is not coming out with faster products.
If your time is so valueable, how can you afford to waste it on rumor sites?

Bill

 

[isaacc7]

How about this...

What if they have a slight boost and a drop in price just to clear the pipeline of the "old" machines. Wild speculation here.... If they do have dual core or even dual dual core machines coming up, I'd think that they would require a new MB, different cooling system, maybe a different case, etc. If they are sitting on inventory, they will prob. want to get rid of it before announcing the new stuff. At least that's what I'm hoping🙂

 

[FlyNolJ]

2.7FX are coming tomorrow.

These revisions are true, they have to be. Apple had their special little seminar on Sunday and the only thing they put out was software.
http://www.nabshow.com/PPC2005grid.pdf
If they put out a Dual-Core 3.0 ghz tomorrow or within two weeks it would be anti-climatic. As everyone has mentioned, Steve has an ego. The PowerMac is Apple's benchmark. I don't think that they are going to tell everyone in the Motion Certification and Exam conference that "oh by the way, you all will get to work on Dual-Dual Core 3.0 ghz systems." They sure aren't going to use this time to demo how blazing fast the said machine is. I checked, that seminar costs upward of 500 dollars to 1000. I'd be pissed if I didn't get knowledge.

 

[BenRoethig]

Seriously what will Apple have to talk about at WWDC? If all these things are introduced right befor it? Software for sure, iPods maybe, maybe some new hardware peripheral a la iPod, but what else in that 2 hour segment? Honestly if these Pmac specs are correct I have to believe that there is a Powermac Pro line of some sort coming to top out with dual core cpus and hopefully PCIe, especially since the top models always get the 'new' tech in apple's lineup. Hopefully this may be evidenced if new Powermacs debut with said specs but at lower price points, opening up more room at the $3k mark and above...

here's to hoping.

Apple wouldn't want to talk about the PowerMacs at WWDC. I could see Steve now: "Hey guys, we bumped our G5s another 200mhz. Five years ago that would have been really good. I know I promised you 3ghz this time last year. we're only 300mhz off and if we're really lucky we'll get those chips to you only a year and a half late. Look on the bright side, the wait is nothing like the Guns n Roses fans have had to endure for their new album Chinese Democracy that might be out sometime before the end of days."

 

[wrldwzrd89]

Seriously what will Apple have to talk about at WWDC? If all these things are introduced right befor it? Software for sure, iPods maybe, maybe some new hardware peripheral a la iPod, but what else in that 2 hour segment? Honestly if these Pmac specs are correct I have to believe that there is a Powermac Pro line of some sort coming to top out with dual core cpus and hopefully PCIe, especially since the top models always get the 'new' tech in apple's lineup. Hopefully this may be evidenced if new Powermacs debut with said specs but at lower price points, opening up more room at the $3k mark and above...

here's to hoping.

My guess is that one of two things will happen:

1. The WWDC keynote will be shorter than usual, since most of the things that have been announced at these keynotes in the past will have already happened. The PowerMac specs will be EXACTLY as rumored.

2. The WWDC keynote will be the usual length because the rumor sites got it wrong - Apple is planning several things they're going to unveil at WWDC, including new PowerMacs. Apple will catch us all by total surprise this time.

 

[Mord]

this is BS, apple is pulling TS's chain so we are like OMFG when they come out.

 

[dosers]

Come on now: Let's be realistic here:

Allright, first of all I think it should have been obvious that there was no way Apple could have these Dual-Core chips ready in volume this soon - they haven't even been seen in other configurations yet (including Xbox 360, the dev systems are dual-CPU).
Let's face it, the speed bump is fine - is it disappointing ? SURE - but come on, a dual 2.7 is plenty fast. And you know what, as upset as we all are, other than people on boards like this, no-one really cares. Apple is not going to get into hot water of this with anyone but adament high-end fans, which are a tiny percentage of users.
I don't think there's a chance to have new system in the summer time; it makes no financial sense to change spec on systems (even just CPUs - APple isn't Dell that carries no inventory and has trucks docking at their assembly lines with less than 2 days stock on hand), and then revamp them completely 3 months later. In my opinion, we are sure to see the dual-core chips announced in Paris, shipping in the October / November time frame. ANd, frankly, I don't think it's gonna hurt Apple one bit. A small speed bump on the IMacs is going to be much bigger news to 'the public' (and Final Cut Studio to the Pro's).
My opinion, naturally 🙂

Cheers,
Dan

 

[Val-kyrie]

The Hardware IS NOT great already. The hardware was fantastic the year before last. The hardware was great last year. The hardware is just OK this year. By next year we are going to be getting into the G4 PowerMac range of ‘It works”. Anyone who says otherwise is drinking a bit too much of the kool aid.

*sighs*

Once again Apple about to demonstrate that they are incapable of keeping their hardware up to date with the industry. They let one section of their product line hang on the vine just long enough that its just the side of spoiled rotten and then at the last nanosecond they update just in time to avoid complete disaster, and then repeats the cycle all over again. Quite frankly this kind of behavior isn’t something I’d expect from a world class company. Its something I’d expect from some little no named Taiwanese company who has bad management and can’t find the funds to maintain their product line. In short what the (*@@# 9^!! Is going on at Apple?!?

Perhaps it is the result of Steve thinking different. . . . Wasn't it Steve who said, "If I were running Apple, I would milk the Macintosh for all its worth and move on to the neXt great thing." (or something close to that)

Check out this article on the "Ubiquitous Society" and Apple's role in bringing it about: http://www.macsimumnews.com/index.php/archive/apples_new_tron_bombshell/

My theory is that Steve has more in common with IBM than processors--both are moving toward revenue models based on information services rather than hardware. Think about it....

Apple better be smarter than this and i pray that if this is all we get, jobs may have to drop ibm.

Or should Apple drop Jobs????

 

[WoofJoe]

I'm confused about PCI-X v. PCI Express

All along I thought PCI-X and PCI Express were the same thing. I guess I'm wrong. Can someone in the know explain the difference to me?

Anyway, I don't mind 2.7Ghz and no dual core (AMD's at 2.7 aren't they?) nearly as much as I disagree with Apple's insistence on not making the X800 or 6800 graphics cards standard fare (with dual, dual-link) across the top three PM lines. They should ditch AGP, too. If nothing else it looks really bad on paper.

Dual 2.7, 6800 Ultra, 1GB memory (512x2), 16x dual-layer DVD "Superdrive" = $2,900. That I could swallow, despite AGP and no dual-core.

 

[aldo]

Didn't actually realize that. However, I have one question; How long did it take Apple to adopt AGP?

As it is now, Intel boards got PCIe first, then AMD, Apple could be next. PCIe is still fairly rare though even in the PC world.

Further, it would take a bit of work- NVidia and ATi don't make ONE Mac-compatible PCIe card (obviously), so Apple would have to take steps to make them start producing cards before they add the slot.

I disagree entirely. PCIe is taking off a lot faster than I thought it would. Nearly all of Dell's computers that ship with a seperate graphics card are PCIe and all the top-end graphics cards are PCIe now, you'll struggle to find an AGP one.

Not to mention PCIe allows SLI which is incredibly good.

 

[VicMacs]

yeah but

Dejá vu all over again. I feel really sorry for all the upgraders who put off the last PM upgrade hoping for something better.

by now you gotta know that this almost never works... you buy if you need. if you wait for something better, you lose time, and time is money, so buy now if you need to.

 

[plastique45]

1-OK ok ok... First of all, this is information coming from a site that is tangled in a lawsuit with apple, are we really going to get are blood pressure worked up over this? There are so many rumors running around about the specifics of all of this I feel its a bit pointless to believe anything until its announced for this one (what happend to 'tiger only FCP5?)



2-I hope they update is huge but i'll buy whatever they are. I can't afford to wait another 9-12 months. Come on apple.. YOU CAN DO IT

1-Thinksecret is virtually never wrong, hence the lawsuit. Thinksecret never said FCP would be Toger only, where did you read something as idiotic as that? No pro user switch to a new OS until they can be assured that no bugs would trouble their production machines.

2-Apple doesn't make processors, they have nothing to do with this, other than having made a terrible mistake by not switching to x86 when every app to to be re-written for OS X.

 

[illumin8]

Good news mixed in with the bad...

Actually, what am I saying... it's all bad... 🙁

I was looking at Apple's online store today in the refurb section (you know, the red tag for special deals), as I think this might be a good way to tell if a new model is about to be released, and what did I see?

$400 off the PM G5 2.5! ($2599)

$300 off a 20" Imac G5, ($1599)...

So it's not all bad... not only that, but you can get an entry-level DUAL 1.8 G5 for only $1699... That seriously kicks ass compared to buying that stupid Dell dual core system for way too much money ($3000-4000)! 😀

Besides, even the 1.8 dual G5 has a dedicated 900 mhz. FSB per processor! The crippled Intel version of dual cores has both cores sharing the same tired 800 mhz. bus!

I'm almost tempted to spring for the heavily discounted G5s before the update, but I didn't want to get the liquid-cooled version. I heard that Apple executives were already worried that the cooling systems would fail after average 2 years and leak all over your carpet!

 

[ogopogo]

"If your time is so valueable, how can you afford to waste it on rumor sites?"

Perhaps because we're waiting on our painfully slow G4 to render?

I'm with the minority here in actually NEEDING a real upgrade,
including both dual-core AND PCI-E.

The truth is, the current "high end" GPU for the G5
is scarcely better than the GeForce4MX in my G4.

I heard rumors elsewhere that ATI was developing a version of its highest-end PCI-E card, the FireGL V7100, for new Macs,
and that made me giddy, as the much older FireGL X1 in my Xeon box
screams in comparison to the GeForce4 in my Mac.

It frustrates me entirely to think that Apple could pass up the opportunity
to actually stay even with PCs on the GPU front.

And not releasing dual-cores until way after everyone else?
That would be f'n WEAK.

 

[memofromturner]

...and they used to make computers

This really doesn't seem likely. I mean, Apple moving slowly is expected, well at least from me... but moving backwards? No PCI-X?

And still no PCI-Express?

How could they not travel the dual core route!!!?!!!

This is either misinformation, or Apple now just makes iPods and computers for accessing ITMS.

 

[Proto-Clown]

I gotta ask...

Ok, I read through MOST of these posts and nowhere does anybody ask the question: If its the same processor with a speed bump, why no 2.5 ghz? I mean, its already in place, why kill it and start producing a 2.3 ghz?

If this was already asked and answered, I apologize.

-Tom

 

[afields]

Seriously what will Apple have to talk about at WWDC?

Probably some more iPod crap. 🙄 Seriously, I love my iPod as much as the next guy, but it seems sometimes this is the only hardware they give a sh*t about. They *actually* update it on a regular basis. 😱

 

[PeterQVenkman]

Ok, I read through MOST of these posts and nowhere does anybody ask the question: If its the same processor with a speed bump, why no 2.5 ghz? I mean, its already in place, why kill it and start producing a 2.3 ghz?

If this was already asked and answered, I apologize.

no apologies here. The 2.3's are in the Xserves right now. That's what makes these rumors pretty realistic. I don't think those 2.3's in that pizza box are water cooled!

I'm in the camp of disappointed, but I needed a PowerMac in January. I'll take what I can get and be happy. Jump from a 800mhz iMac to dual 2.3?

Yes Please!

 

[wrldwzrd89]

Ok, I read through MOST of these posts and nowhere does anybody ask the question: If its the same processor with a speed bump, why no 2.5 ghz? I mean, its already in place, why kill it and start producing a 2.3 ghz?

If this was already asked and answered, I apologize.

-Tom

First of all, the 2.3 GHz chip isn't new. It's currently being used in the XServes. Secondly, remember how long it took for 2.5 GHz production to ramp up? Perhaps the 2.5 GHz CPU was just hard to produce, and IBM thinks they can produce a 2.7 GHz CPU better and faster. Finally, I think, assuming this is true, that temporary problems at IBM's production plants, which have since been resolved, are a significant factor in Apple's decision.

 

[daveL]

This really doesn't seem likely. I mean, Apple moving slowly is expected, well at least from me... but moving backwards? No PCI-X?

And still no PCI-Express?

How could they not travel the dual core route!!!?!!!

This is either misinformation, or Apple now just makes iPods and computers for accessing ITMS.

Don't know where you got the bit about no PCI-X. TS said no PCI-X 2.0; that doesn't translate into no PCI-X.

 

[FriarTuck]

Eh. Meh. Feh.

I hope this doesn't mean the initial report re: iMac specs was similarly overoptimistic.

 

[Object-X]

It's going to happen

Slow down buddy.

The Cell is extremely good at floating point but terrible at integer calculations- and I mean absolutely terrible in comparison to the floating point scores. And it's 3-4 times more expensive than a normal processor. So Cell is really hit or miss. It's awesome for a video editting machine and good for a gaming machine but sucks for a normal user.

Don't get too excited.

Sorry, but it's coming fast. It's not just the Cell, but the Cell working with the G5! Remember Job's statement about GPUs? Why was the Pres of Sony on stage? To promote a video camera? Ya right. He's there because Jobs is about to take over the TV and Movie business just like he did with music. That's what the H.264 codec and streaming TV is all about. Digital movie projectors running off of Xserves. TV from your television to your cell phone to your iPod all using this codec and streaming from Apple's servers. Cell chips will make this happen and they will be a HUGE part of Apple's hardware.

"Apple is going to be one of the most profitable "internet" companies in the next ten years" -- Steve Jobs

That was five years ago. I'm telling you, Jobs thinks really really BIG. He wants his technology to control music, video, and TV. The iPod and iTunes is just the first wave. The tidal wave is coming and it will begin with Tiger. Why have they made such a big deal about over 300 million downloads of Quicktime? ::yawn:: Who cares? But that is Apple's secret weapon...a system within system. It's on almost every PC. Quicktime will allow Apple to stream internet content to all computers, TVs, cell phones, PDAs, iPod, whatever, as a service. Imagine your cell phone, iPod, car system, ect. all connected to a MAN (Metropolitan Area Network) wireless network with the up/down speeds of broadband. And all these devices will be using the Cell chip. It's coming.

Imagine an OS X client application running on your Sony HDTV. Sony has. Poor Ando couldn't even express it:

"And I think...ah...what...you know this...well, I don't know...and then...we should together - We'll really create this great HD world and everything - right?" -- Kunitake Ando

To which Jobs replied, "We're in!"

It's coming I'm telling you. What Microsoft has wanted to acheive the last 10 years Apple is going to do by next year. The technologies in Tiger are ready made for this. A Cell based workstation running apps like Shake are where it's at in the video world.

Microsoft is dead. I'm telling you they are gone in 5 years. They can't do it. Apple is supporting open standards and all the various industries are on board. Tiger is out in a week. It is superior in every way to Windows and everyone knows it. Software as a service (think iTunes) is the next generation of software and it's platform independent. IBM has been pushing thin client for years and Apple's iTunes is a perfect example of it. Soon to be on your phone and TV. Coming soon.

Let me elaborate. Quicktime is going to be the basis of video content on computers, TVs, cell phones, ect. I know it' only been a "player" but it's about to become the Video application of choice that will change everything. Imagine downloading your movies using Quicktime and purchasing your movies, just like with iTunes, but using Quicktime or Safari on your TV or computer. You're going to use it to control your television; sort of like Tivo. Sony is going to create a TV that is a glorified computer with the Cell chip and it's going to be running software developed by Apple.