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Bah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Of course not! Thanks for answering your own question!

Eight hundred. You were joking, right?

Laugh all you want, but I was not joking... my NewEgg "wishlist" is at the bottom of this post, which will spank the internals of a high-end iMac in every way shape and form for $869. Plus it's SLI-ready for when you dual-boot into Windows.

The only things not included are the display, keyboard & mouse (because I have those). Besides, a good 24" can be had for ~$400 on sale (depending on how picky you are), still besting the iMac's price by a long shot. I got a 19" widescreen for $120 a year and a half ago. It looks great and is plenty large for most uses. Others may disagree depending on what they primarily use their computers for, but music composition isn't a big screen hog. Keyboard and Mouse are cheap... $30 for a decent USB pair.

-Clive

  • MSI P6N SLI Platinum LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 650i SLI ATX Intel - $129.99
  • EVGA 512-P3-N801-AR GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - $199.99
  • Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 Conroe 2.66GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80557E6750 - $189.99
  • CORSAIR 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TWIN2X4096-6400C5 - $114.00
  • SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - $199.98
  • ASUS 20X DVD±R DVD Burner with LightScribe Black SATA Model DRW-2014L1T - $34.99
  • Total: $868.94
(Prices include sales promotions)
 

Nice article, but he forgot one group - people who want to hook up more than one device to their monitor (second Mac, Xbox 360, PS3, PC, etc...). These people can't use an iMac and are left to choose between a Pro, which may be out of their budget, and an anemic Mini.

All they need to do is make something at least as powerful as the low-end MBP, give it a 3.5" HDD, make it $1499 and I'll be happy.
 
Laugh all you want, but I was not joking... my NewEgg "wishlist" is at the bottom of this post, which will spank the internals of a high-end iMac in every way shape and form for $869. Plus it's SLI-ready for when you dual-boot into Windows.

The only things not included are the display, keyboard & mouse (because I have those). Besides, a good 24" can be had for ~$400 on sale (depending on how picky you are), still besting the iMac's price by a long shot. I got a 19" widescreen for $120 a year and a half ago. It looks great and is plenty large for most uses. Others may disagree depending on what they primarily use their computers for, but music composition isn't a big screen hog. Keyboard and Mouse are cheap... $30 for a decent USB pair.

-Clive

  • MSI P6N SLI Platinum LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 650i SLI ATX Intel - $129.99
  • EVGA 512-P3-N801-AR GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - $199.99
  • Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 Conroe 2.66GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80557E6750 - $189.99
  • CORSAIR 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TWIN2X4096-6400C5 - $114.00
  • SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - $199.98
  • ASUS 20X DVD±R DVD Burner with LightScribe Black SATA Model DRW-2014L1T - $34.99
  • Total: $868.94
(Prices include sales promotions)

Did you miss the case & power supply?

I do agree you can put a system together for cheaper with better faster hardware than what apple sells...which is sad...
 
Did you miss the case & power supply?

I do agree you can put a system together for cheaper with better faster hardware than what apple sells...which is sad...

Oh, good point. I have those too... Again, $30 can get you a decent case and power supply combo. Or for the picky, $100 for the pair.

-Clive
 
I've seriously contemplated building a h4ckintosh rig instead of getting a new Mac Desktop. Being a 20+ year faithful, it's hard to contemplate, but I feel now more so than ever, Apple machines are just unjustifiably overpriced.
 
Oh, good point. I have those too... Again, $30 can get you a decent case and power supply combo. Or for the picky, $100 for the pair.

-Clive
BTW-if you want to consider SLI in the future, don't skimp on the power supply.
Throw in an OS and price starts to creep up...

Unfortunately I don't think Apple will ever have a good dedicated GPU. If PC gaming is important, no Mac is going to be a good deal.
 
BTW-if you want to consider SLI in the future, don't skimp on the power supply.
Throw in an OS and price starts to creep up...

Unfortunately I don't think Apple will ever have a good dedicated GPU. If PC gaming is important, no Mac is going to be a good deal.

An extra $2,000 worth of equipment can be added before it ends up costing the same as a Mac Pro with a 8800GT GPU. Another $1,000 before it reaches the price of a 24" iMac. ;)
 
Oh, good point. I have those too... Again, $30 can get you a decent case and power supply combo. Or for the picky, $100 for the pair.

-Clive

good work clivey you won!!! lol... here in Aus i could build a system probably for about that, maybe $700 (i could use my own case, PSU and cd/dvd burner and save another $100-$150).

bare minimum for a system would be like $350-$400... just RAM, CPU, mobo.

anways, systems arent that costly. and yes, PCs are cheaper than macs, they also dont last as long in terms of their depreciation and whatnot. and its more the novelty of having a mac and the fact that its running leopard.
 
....and yes, PCs are cheaper than macs, they also dont last as long in terms of their depreciation and whatnot. ......

Not true. Pound for pound you'll find, if you bother looking (which you probably won't) that Mac's are not more expensive than p.c.'s.
 
do we really have to get back into value of mac vs pc

its been proven several times that a mac is worth it

you just have to throw in everything that makes a mac a mac and youll be looking at the same value if not more in pc world... and yes that includes buying windows vista ultimate.
 
Not true. Pound for pound you'll find, if you bother looking (which you probably won't) that Mac's are not more expensive than p.c.'s.

*yawn* I've heard that one before. Beware of fanboys, team. As I just showed above, you can get a desktop system that bests the high-end iMac in every way for about $900. Add $400 for a 24" display, $50 for KB and mouse, and $300 for OS X & iLife. The price? $1650. A far cry from Apple's $2250.

The iMac's only advantage: All-in-one design in a slim form factor.

Fact of the matter is, Apple rips you off in hardware... maybe not intentionally, but they do it by forcing you to buy more expensive, less powerful mobile components. By the by, fanboys and zealots, a 3 GHz Desktop-class (Wolfdale) CPU has MUCH greater performance than a 3 GHz Mobile-class (Penryn) CPU, which is what the iMac uses (it will use the 3.06 GHz C2E upon penryn upgrade), and it only has a 21-Watt higher TDP. This is a desktop machine we're talking about here after all. No one is looking behind the screen... would it have been the end of the world to make the iMac an inch thicker and use a couple of silent fans for better cooling? I happen to think not. (You may disagree.)

So for me, I would've preferred for Apple to just give me a thicker iMac as long as it was more powerful; I would've asked them to make the Mac Mini just a bit bigger for room for a 3.5" HDD and a low-end dedicated GPU.

I want Apple to make SMART sacrifices when designing new models... not idiotic sacrifices at the expense of bang-per-buck, sacrifices made at any cost in order to satisfy Steve Jobs' contorted vision of the future of computing.

-Clive
 
*yawn* I've heard that one before. Beware of fanboys, team. As I just showed above, you can get a desktop system that bests the high-end iMac in every way for about $900. Add $400 for a 24" display, $50 for KB and mouse, and $300 for OS X & iLife. The price? $1650. A far cry from Apple's $2250.

The iMac's only advantage: All-in-one design in a slim form factor.

Fact of the matter is, Apple rips you off in hardware... maybe not intentionally, but they do it by forcing you to buy more expensive, less powerful mobile components. By the by, fanboys and zealots, a 3 GHz Desktop-class (Wolfdale) CPU has MUCH greater performance than a 3 GHz Mobile-class (Penryn) CPU, which is what the iMac uses (it will use the 3.06 GHz C2E upon penryn upgrade), and it only has a 21-Watt higher TDP. This is a desktop machine we're talking about here after all. No one is looking behind the screen... would it have been the end of the world to make the iMac an inch thicker and use a couple of silent fans for better cooling? I happen to think not. (You may disagree.)

So for me, I would've preferred for Apple to just give me a thicker iMac as long as it was more powerful; I would've asked them to make the Mac Mini just a bit bigger for room for a 3.5" HDD and a low-end dedicated GPU.

I want Apple to make SMART sacrifices when designing new models... not idiotic sacrifices at the expense of bang-per-buck, sacrifices made at any cost in order to satisfy Steve Jobs' contorted vision of the future of computing.

-Clive

well no offense or anything, but if you like the PC's so much why dont you buy them instead of macs??? the slim case isnt the ONLY advantage of the imacs.... personally (i.e. TO ME!) i use apple computers because of the OS, and their simplicity in being able to work on so much without having to be bogged down by a crappy GUI.

i am fully aware that there are better pc's for far cheaper, but i dont care and im sure a lot of other users dont either. its more than just the costs. i literally hate xp (can use it fine but prefer os8 to it), and vista....ugh.

p.s. apple isnt going to give you the desktop CPU you want, nor the desktop GPU you want... thats just not how they operate im sorry to say (yes i wish there was a desktop model "tower" mac too).
 
I'm sorry guys but a Mac is a Mac. I've sold my 3 years old Mac mini core solo, 1Gb, 800Hz, superdrive, 80Go a very good price :p, a price I just could not get with a PC.
Then I thought I should buy a mini PC or a PC notebook... Since a few mounths I am using the PC of my sweeet heart. Result: I miss my Mac so much :apple: !
I just hate Windows, I'm lost with all those "programs", the PC has viruses, and the worse is that I just realise that the PC is as slow with Internet as my mac mini was! And I don't count the many programs that quit for unknown reasons :mad:
So I am waiting with a :eek: face, 'cause I know that I will get the best next Mac generation in my hands: a small lovely machine, a MAC, which gives me emotions, simplicity and beauty, what a PC just can't give! It means the best of designed high technology computer for less than $800
"I'm waiting for my m..ac!"
 
The AppleTV is basically a low spec mac.
So take one of them and throw in the processor from the Air.
Apple has another nice Cloud Computer.
And not much use keeping the mini around.

What is smaller mini other than AppleTV?

There is big whole in the line up. with or without the mini. Not sure they want to fill it, or the right combo to fill it hasn't turned up yet. Like everyone said it sort of a desktop tower thing but it's hard to make an impression with that sort of form factor.
 
do we really have to get back into value of mac vs pc

I agree about getting off-topic - Apples and PCs are apples and oranges because there's really only one way to run the Mac OS: on a Mac.* The only reason we're commiserating here about Apple's hardware lineup is because we have a strong preference for the Mac OS. Otherwise picking up a bunch of cheap PC components would be a no-brainer.

Apple charges more for their hardware because they know that their value is in software. It's sort of elitist, but it's also part of why they are able to offer such a strong platform.

*Yes, I know about hackintoshes, but they are for hobbyists because you can't make one stable enough for pro apps.
 
*yawn* I've heard that one before. Beware of fanboys, team. As I just showed above, you can get a desktop system that bests the high-end iMac in every way for about $900. Add $400 for a 24" display, $50 for KB and mouse, and $300 for OS X & iLife. The price? $1650. A far cry from Apple's $2250.
Where are you getting a 24" H-IPS panel for $400?
 
One area where every MAC user can feel "ripped off" is the in-house price for upgradable RAM. It's about the same percentage of markup that I experience when I buy a bottle of water at the concession stand at the movie theatre. And I try to buy neither.
 
Well I'm returning mine today.

Where are you getting a 24" H-IPS panel for $400?

Who even sells H-IPS?

I'm sorry guys but a Mac is a Mac. I've sold my 3 years old Mac mini core solo, 1Gb, 800Hz, superdrive, 80Go a very good price :p, a price I just could not get with a PC.
Then I thought I should buy a mini PC or a PC notebook... Since a few mounths I am using the PC of my sweeet heart. Result: I miss my Mac so much :apple: !
I just hate Windows, I'm lost with all those "programs", the PC has viruses, and the worse is that I just realise that the PC is as slow with Internet as my mac mini was! And I don't count the many programs that quit for unknown reasons :mad:
So I am waiting with a :eek: face, 'cause I know that I will get the best next Mac generation in my hands: a small lovely machine, a MAC, which gives me emotions, simplicity and beauty, what a PC just can't give! It means the best of designed high technology computer for less than $800
"I'm waiting for my m..ac!"

Viruses huh. I have never gotten a virus, not that I would know since I don't run anti-virus. I know my Vista machine actually boots faster than my MBP; Probably the fact that my MBP is bloated with 90% full. Like any computer, one needs to reinstall everything once in a while.
 
well no offense or anything, but if you like the PC's so much why dont you buy them instead of macs??? the slim case isnt the ONLY advantage of the imacs.... personally (i.e. TO ME!) i use apple computers because of the OS, and their simplicity in being able to work on so much without having to be bogged down by a crappy GUI.

i am fully aware that there are better pc's for far cheaper, but i dont care and im sure a lot of other users dont either. its more than just the costs. i literally hate xp (can use it fine but prefer os8 to it), and vista....ugh.

p.s. apple isnt going to give you the desktop CPU you want, nor the desktop GPU you want... thats just not how they operate im sorry to say (yes i wish there was a desktop model "tower" mac too).

Do you realize that both of your examples of what makes Macs superior were OS X related? This is what I've been saying all along. OS X and iLife, to me, are the only reason to buy a Mac. Apple knows this, so they take advantage of the consumer by forcing them to buy higher-priced (and, ergo, higher margin) hardware, even though it's less powerful than standard desktop components.

What I've been trying to show ISN'T that you can build a yourself a Mac-replacement for less money, but that APPLE could build a more-powerful Mac for less money.

And yes, I do take offense to, not just yours, but everyone's suggestion to "just use a PC" or "just use Windows." It's not that black and white. I NEED OS X. I just vehemently refuse to be siphoned into one of three categories: Windows Switcher (Mac Mini), basic user (iMac), professional (Mac Pro). If I must be categorized, I am a prosumer... a notibly-sized market segment for which Apple offers NO SOLUTIONS. The iMac is too weak and isn't expandable/upgradable, and a Mac Pro has too much power. There IS a middle ground.

DoFoT9 said:
who said it was H-IPS?? probably TFT, or CRT :rolleyes:

Uhh... H-IPS is a type of TFT. Don't speak unless you know.

Besides, H-IPS has its drawbacks too... such as a narrower viewing angle than 1998's S-IPS. Regardless, I don't work with photos professionally, so I don't give a rat's ass.

Likewise:

not everybody needs H-IPS panels

and if you need a H-IPS panel you should be slapped anyway for buying an imac with it's laptop components to do such work

Well said, takao, well said.

One area where every MAC user can feel "ripped off" is the in-house price for upgradable RAM. It's about the same percentage of markup that I experience when I buy a bottle of water at the concession stand at the movie theatre. And I try to buy neither.

Exactly. It's no secret that Apple pads the price of its RAM. You can easily pay half the price for equal-quality, equal-capacity RAM and install it yourself... and RAM is one of the easiest things to install, period. Shame on Apple for charging so much.

What isn't as easy to see is that Apple posts similar mark-ups on other internals. Take a look at their internal HDD upgrades, for example. Plus, you know these guys get huge volume discounts, so they're making a killing.

Again, my point isn't that you can build a yourself a Mac-replacement for less money, but that APPLE could build a more-powerful Mac for less money.

-Clive
 
mini

What about this?
http://uneasysilence.com/archive/2007/10/12442/

I'm all for a new Mac Mini design but this is an entry level desktop computer/HTPC and leaving the optical drive out is a bit harsh. In 5 years I do believe that downloadable content will be on par with optical storage and in 10 years optical discs could very much be a piece of history. I supported MBA not having an optical drive, simply because I used my 3-year old laptops optical drive not that much when I think of it.

Mac mini needs to catch MB specs, and possible a case redesign while keeping th price point the same, if not less. But sacrificing the optical drive or leaving it as an external option is not a good idea for a desktop.
 
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