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My Parents Hate Apple
- Thread starter drs68
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Vista is a solid, quick, and reliable operating system now. (Notice "now").
As mentioned earlier, you will have just as much fun and great experiences as you would do with an Apple. A PC will do everything that a Mac can do, just in a different way, and vice-versa.
Get the Dell. It is a great and solid notebook that you will really enjoy, especially if your parents approve of it.
Good luck either way you go.
As mentioned earlier, you will have just as much fun and great experiences as you would do with an Apple. A PC will do everything that a Mac can do, just in a different way, and vice-versa.
Get the Dell. It is a great and solid notebook that you will really enjoy, especially if your parents approve of it.
Good luck either way you go.
Actually that's just what I planned to do. I'm going to take all of this advice into consideration and I'm going to print out the replies in this thread that will show my parents how real people feel about my situation and are esponding to it. I apologize for not posting for a while, I've been busy and my main computer is my iPod touch (what I'm typing on this now) and that's a little frustrating as well. As far as keeping you up to date, I am starting to break my mom! She has gotten to the point where she has that "whatever" attitude. My dad on the other hand asked me yesterday if I had picked out which Dell I want yet. Like I said, he is less computer literate than even my mom and therefore trusts the opinions of people he thinks are more knowledgeable about computers (the computer guy). What I plan on doing is showing my mom the macs at a best buy in morgantown when we go school shopping here in about a week or two, show her some of these posts and others, walk her through apple.com, and then when she is more convinced I will get her to convince dad. Btw, I have decided to wait for the new MacBooks to come out (probably, depending on when that is) and I have a feeling I am going to be forking over at least some money for this laptop but I haven't given up and I'm still trying to convince them to get me a mac!
The only reason there listening to the computer guy cause he "knows what hes talking about" and he needs to sell his product, probably if u really asked him not working he would say apples are better who knows, so u have to sell apples product to your parents seeing u don't have an apple store and the people at best buy are complete idiots. Trust me my friend told me how it was when he was buying an imac
Yes, and when you go to BestBuy, let the sales people do a number on your parents. They are "reputable" and I bet your Mom would trust them. They have a very pushy, gimmicky attitude towards everything. Also, don't print out the "me or the repairman" post. It'll make everyone on Mac Rumors look like a bunch of punk kids with rich parents who buy us everything we want
And the whatever attitude is her getting annoyed about you bugging her, so she might just give in after getting sick you being a huge Apple ad all the time.
BTW: I went through the whole my touch is my computer phase too. My Dell broke and I refused to use the family computer (VERY SLOW Dell) so I just used that. The typing starts to get old on it after a while.
Good luck dude.
Mosx-
Hi, are you running Leopard?
I haven't had nearly the problems you're talking about up until trying out Leopard. Leopard is Apple's first OS as buggy as Windows. I won't upgrade to it after having used it on a friend's computer.
Also, Vista is the first Windows OS I've ever actually liked. I understand Mac fanboys hating it because it's stealing left and right from Apple, but that's been a given for years, and MS owns the US judicial system, so that that's where we are. I think that since Vista is so much more Mac-like is the reason I have no problem with it.
But a new computer with Leopard seems pretty great, and simply put the OS is much easier and nicer to use than any Windows OS so far.
So it definitely matters what you want a computer for. Certainly as always it seems, Windows machines are better for games. But for everything else, ESPECIALLY with the bundled iLife software, Macs are a better deal.
For the difference in price between a Macbook with it's superior iLife software, and a Dell with the crapware that is generally installed + buying software as good as the free stuff on the mac, Macs come out ahead.
Spec-wise, yeah a PC is probably a better bang for your money. My GRANDMA bought an HP 17" widescreen for $800... vs. almost $3000 for the 17" Macbook... ouch. Though my set up has always been until recently, a small mac notebook and a large second monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc.
If I had such limited funds... I don't know which way I'd go... actually I'd probably get a mac mini... oh wait, that's what I did!
Hi, are you running Leopard?
I haven't had nearly the problems you're talking about up until trying out Leopard. Leopard is Apple's first OS as buggy as Windows. I won't upgrade to it after having used it on a friend's computer.
Also, Vista is the first Windows OS I've ever actually liked. I understand Mac fanboys hating it because it's stealing left and right from Apple, but that's been a given for years, and MS owns the US judicial system, so that that's where we are. I think that since Vista is so much more Mac-like is the reason I have no problem with it.
But a new computer with Leopard seems pretty great, and simply put the OS is much easier and nicer to use than any Windows OS so far.
So it definitely matters what you want a computer for. Certainly as always it seems, Windows machines are better for games. But for everything else, ESPECIALLY with the bundled iLife software, Macs are a better deal.
For the difference in price between a Macbook with it's superior iLife software, and a Dell with the crapware that is generally installed + buying software as good as the free stuff on the mac, Macs come out ahead.
Spec-wise, yeah a PC is probably a better bang for your money. My GRANDMA bought an HP 17" widescreen for $800... vs. almost $3000 for the 17" Macbook... ouch. Though my set up has always been until recently, a small mac notebook and a large second monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc.
If I had such limited funds... I don't know which way I'd go... actually I'd probably get a mac mini... oh wait, that's what I did!
wow, this thread has become quite "interesting"
well, if i had the choice between a dell for free and a macbook for 1200 bucks i'd go with the dell.
if you're careful and if you don't do anything special you get 90% as much fun out of a dell as you would get out of a mac. 90% for 0% investment is pretty good.
seriously, i'm typing this on a lenovo that i got for free. i installed safari, itunes, picasa, photoshop, ms office, firefox, skype, a few scientific programs i need/want, i have mobileme for calendar, adressbook, email, idisk.
i only miss imovie but i don't use it too often.
to the OP if he/she is still reading this thread after all the flaming of the fanboys:
save your money, negotiate with your parents to get the best notebook from dell they are willing to pay for, take the dell, set it up for what you want, be happy with it for the next two years and then buy a quadcore macbook if you still want to switch.
you obviously don't have much money so don't waste it on a computer that will lose value every day it gets older.
and don't forget to thank your parents for buying you a computer.
co-sign...instead of being happy that ur parents are willing to buy u a laptop, ur complainin that u dont get the one u want...if my parents bought me a laptop i wouldnt really care which one...but they aren't so im saving up for a macbook right now
...just take the dell and be ahppy..
co-sign...instead of being happy that ur parents are willing to buy u a laptop, ur complainin that u dont get the one u want...if my parents bought me a laptop i wouldnt really care which one...but they aren't so im saving up for a macbook right now
Ya, I mean, really?
If your parents are willing to pay for a Dell, take the damn Dell unless you can pay for the MacBook
I don't see the problem
My parents never even gave me a computer period until I bought it using my own money.
Be happy they are offering you something
Agreed and with the money saved you can....
Buy osx leopard dvd Then....
Find out how to hack it and get leopard on your dell.
Im assuming you want an apple for the os cause i did exactly why i bought a eMac in april And my 1st gen macbook the first year but lets not speak of that.
Hehe Apple is gaining a nice narrow minded fanboy base pretty quick these days.
I like Apple as home system but for Pro I went with Vista 64bit (I had a Mac Pro for quite some time at home and even at my work I requested a switch to Win system) and I'm way happier.
First of all. EVERYTHING works with Vista if you have the right hardware and it's damn fast. I really don't know if it's a retarded user base that crated such a bad view or it's Apple mercenaries that bomb the internet with all that crap about it.
Second thing is. When i'll be upgrading my system in about 6 months with new CPU or memory or what ever I need I won't have to drop a gazillion amount of $$ JUST BECAUSE there's a apple logo somewhere not to mention IF I will even HAVE that chance as upgrading Macs is like trying to find 22" rims for a old German Panther tank.
So my point is... If you all brainiacs are giving the guy a advice at least make sure you're not as full of **** as that mechanic in OP.
Apple has better OS (but who knows what happens when Snow hits the shelves. Good on paper but might be catastrophic in terms of compatibility) and looks good. Win is way cheaper and way more loaded with features BUT you need to know how to handle it or it'll bite you.
You choose what you like best but don't listen to the fanboys as they are the ones that really don't know ****. They just follow the rest without thinking and when **** hits the fan they are those people that you hear complaining the most. Flag on a windy day.
I like Apple as home system but for Pro I went with Vista 64bit (I had a Mac Pro for quite some time at home and even at my work I requested a switch to Win system) and I'm way happier.
First of all. EVERYTHING works with Vista if you have the right hardware and it's damn fast. I really don't know if it's a retarded user base that crated such a bad view or it's Apple mercenaries that bomb the internet with all that crap about it.
Second thing is. When i'll be upgrading my system in about 6 months with new CPU or memory or what ever I need I won't have to drop a gazillion amount of $$ JUST BECAUSE there's a apple logo somewhere not to mention IF I will even HAVE that chance as upgrading Macs is like trying to find 22" rims for a old German Panther tank.
So my point is... If you all brainiacs are giving the guy a advice at least make sure you're not as full of **** as that mechanic in OP.
Apple has better OS (but who knows what happens when Snow hits the shelves. Good on paper but might be catastrophic in terms of compatibility) and looks good. Win is way cheaper and way more loaded with features BUT you need to know how to handle it or it'll bite you.
You choose what you like best but don't listen to the fanboys as they are the ones that really don't know ****. They just follow the rest without thinking and when **** hits the fan they are those people that you hear complaining the most. Flag on a windy day.
Also, which version of OS X was this on? Tiger is 100% compatible as well. However, there were some authentication issues with Jaguar I think and possibly Panther, its been a long time since I've dealt with authentication and filesharing on either of these OS's. Filesharing that is not setup to work with Mac's and/or linux/unix based systems is poorly setup as its not any harder than setting one up for windows authentication.
The only reason I ask is I see you have the older iBook.
To be quite honest with you, I really disliked those laptops, especially the version you have which should have the semiclear keys or the all white keys that match the exterior. They have a distinct smell to them, I think from the keyboard lol.
Vista 64bit does run very well with 4+ gigs of memory. That is where you start to see the difference. However, its still not mainstream for ALL applications to run faster than the 32bit Vista version. Especially since most apps are still 32bit. The improvments on memory management for Vista are leaps and bounds better than XP, even though its hard to see this visually.
Vista is a solid, quick, and reliable operating system now. (Notice "now").
As mentioned earlier, you will have just as much fun and great experiences as you would do with an Apple. A PC will do everything that a Mac can do, just in a different way, and vice-versa.
Get the Dell. It is a great and solid notebook that you will really enjoy, especially if your parents approve of it.
Good luck either way you go.
Very well put. I totally agree on making a choice either way.
Not really. The problems I have only exist in OS X. Windows XP or Vista running on the same machine is absolutely flawless.
Obviously the problem I had with the DVD writer was due to bad hardware, but my crashing issues only exist in OS X. Not Windows on the same machine.
Why is it that whenever someone points out flaws and real problems with OS X, the fanboys have to resort to using terms like "hijacking" "flaming" etc? Seriously, if you don't like the truth just stay out of it. Don't come into a thread bringing nonsense and trying to destroy it simply because someone pointed out TRUTHFUL issues with your OS of choice.
The first MacBook was not fixed because of Flextronics (the company Apple contracts to do their repair work) did not fix it.
I clearly said that I don't have kernel panics. Read my posts
And, once again, my freezing issues only affect OS X. Windows running on the same machine is 100% stable.
I've also run the Apple Hardware Test (the in-depth test) that is included on the pack-in OS X discs. It took 2 hours to run and it showed no problems. I did that a little over a week ago.
Now, clear thinking logic would suggest that since Windows is rock solid on the same machine that OS X has issues on, that OS X is at fault.
No, thats you deliberately twisting my words to fit your own argument.
I said my SuperDrive failure was one of many problems in a long list of problems. It is not my sole argument or only point. Optical drives fail. It happens. The only reason it is such a big deal for me is because of two things. First, I couldn't replace it myself (non-user replaceable drive) and second because the repair facility botched the repair, made it worse, and I ended up being without my Mac for 3 weeks over an issue that would have been a 2 minute repair with a PC and a user replaceable drive.
Again, you deliberately twisted my words for your own argument. Yes, optical drives fail. Anyone who has owned a computer for longer than 2 years knows this. It is not my only point. And, again, the only reason it gets brought up is because both it is not a user replaceable drive so you are required to send it in for repair under warranty and because the repair center made things worse, twice, and caused me to be without a system for 3 weeks when, if it was an HP or Dell, they would have sent me a replacement drive FedEx overnight and it would have taken a whole 2 minutes to flip the system over, loosen a screw, pull the old drive out, slide the new one in, tighten the screw, and thats it.
And my first MacBook was a 2GHz C2D (white) with SuperDrive.
Excuse me? Now you're making assumptions based on something I gave absolutely no indication of, ever, that I believe?In fact, several times in this forum, I've clearly stated the manufacturer of the SuperDrives.
Actually its "Matsushita", the Japanese name for the company us Americans know as "Panasonic". They just don't put the full name in the drives firmware.
And actually, there is a difference between the drives used in MacBooks, MBPs, iMacs, and notebook PCs. The drives in Macs are thinner, 9mm, versus the standard 12mm used in notebook PCs. You can, if you want, pull the drive out of the MacBook and put it into a PC. But it will be thinner and, as a result, bounce around and even come loose.
Also, with the exception of the Dell XPS line and other PCs that use slot loaders, PC manufacturers tend to use drives from higher quality manufacturers. My HP has an LG drive.
Obviously. Again, you're deliberately twisting my words for your own argument. I only bring up my problem with the SuperDrive because of the fact that I had to send it in for repair rather than being able to replace it myself, and because the repair center botched the repair. Instead of taking less than two minutes to replace (like an optical drive I had go bad on an HP a couple of years ago), I had to send it in and the repair centers incompetence caused me to be without my MacBook for 3 weeks.
Well, I have an HP dv6500t. It has a proper cooling system, so my C2D in it peaks at 61c, where I've seen my Mac get up to 88c. There is not a single piece of plastic on it that can break under pressure (like the magnetic latches causing the top case to break on the Mac) and heat will not cause any piece of the computer to break or change colors. All of the parts that are likely to fail are user replaceable. And the power cord isn't a fire hazard.
Also, as I said, aside from the issue with the botched SuperDrive repair, my only real issue is with the freezing. And that is completely isolated to OS X, as Windows runs fine on the same machine.
Somebody should take their own advice, eh?
This post actually proves that you do not have all 3 OSes running. It proves that you actually have no experience with Vista. You're basing your assumptions of Vista off of what Apple, Vista haters, and Apple fans try to push off as fact.
Heres the real truth. Vista in its current form does run faster than XP on the same hardware. It is not a "lie" from Microsoft, it is my own experience. In games, for instance, games in XP that would have the occasional frame drop or lower frame-rate in a scene no longer have those issues in Vista. The frame-rate no longer drops and it stays around the same average. That leads me to your comments on memory management.
OS X handles memory basically almost exactly the same as XP does. At first boot it loads in the OS and core components. Software is loaded into memory as you use those programs. When you close an app, just enough of the app remains cached in memory so that if you open it again, it opens quickly. That memory is freed if another application requires it. Want an example? Restart and then open Firefox 3. See how long it takes to open? Browse around a bit. Then close the app. Wait a minute or so, re-open it. It opens instantly. Vista only uses "more memory" because it caches your most used programs into memory at first boot. So instead of Firefox 3 taking seemingly forever to open like it does in OS X and XP, it opens just as fast as Safari and IE do on fresh boots.
Again, Vista caches your most used software to RAM to help speed up overall system performance. It will free up memory as needed and you don't notice the difference.
And, again (hate to repeat that so many times), but your comment proves that you're not running Vista. The difference in video quality between DVD Player in Leopard and the built-in decoder in Vista Home Premium (or any DXVA compliant software) is as staggering as the difference between SD broadcast TV and HDTV. If you go back to Tiger or older revisions of Mac OS, the image quality is barely better than that "480p" stuff you get over at hulu.com.
Yeah. But I had random freezing on my first MacBook with Tiger and this MacBook with Tiger as well. On both systems I had XP then Vista installed and either Windows OS was rock solid.
I have iLife '08. I only use iPhoto and iTunes. I could probably uninstall the rest of the software (or choose not to install it on my next re-install) and save a significant amount of hard drive space. I honestly don't know why people go on about iLife because only iTunes and iPhoto are useful. The rest just get ignored.
Actually, there are free alternatives that do everything just as good as iLife for Windows. And, again, most iLife software is absolutely pointless and useless. When you consider that you spend half as much for an HP or Dell as you would an equivalently spec'ed Mac, you'll still come out several hundred dollars ahead if you choose to buy an iLife alternative instead of getting freeware.
All "flavors" of Vista fly on 2GB of RAM for the average user much the same way the average user requires 2GB of RAM for Leopard to run smoothly.
I've been following up this thread for a while since it's interesting how something so simple can last such a long threat.
So far, this statement is the only truth I found. However for me, it's more like I need to learn to handle OSX or it'll bite me, I believe this also applies for the OP. Been running Windows all my life, I can navigate it in my sleep. Tried out Vista a few times, to me it's the most obvious OS. So honestly I doubt OSX can do anything I can't do with Windows, though I'm curious and will try it out soon.
To the OP, go to an Apple store and try out OSX, see how you like it and stick to those reasons. Never believe a forum commenting on ease of use (except things regarding compatibility issues, those are straight forward). And never print out the replies to show your parents, they'll just look at the website name and laugh in your face. If you still want a Mac and your parents won't buy it, let them pay for the price of that Dell and you work and pay for the remaining difference. You must also take into account the price of the Mac software you'll be using, which I personally find to be more expensive than Windows (I feel like a hypocrite saying this, for obvious reasons).
As a side note, no offense but you seem awfully young. If I were you, I would only get a PC while in grade school. Alot more flexibility, plus I can't stress enough how beneficial it'll be to master Windows first - for college and whatnot, and I've been through alot of job interviews/proficiency tests...they never ask about Mac. I'm in the financial industry though. But if you want to go IT, you might as well get use to RedHat Enterprise instead.
Now, read well and think about it, the next 20 posts are going to be zealots flaming me, so I'm not gonna be back in this thread again, bye!
let them buy you the dell..make sure you have a pretty big hard drive..make 3 or more partitions..put OS X 86 on one..put Ubuntu on another..and windows on the last partition..that way you can use all 3 OS..show off to your parents with OS X 86..work with ubuntu when you really want to work on your dell..and you still have windows when you want to do the sucky schoolwork..
Ok. First of all. I run Vista 32/64, XP 32/64, OS X 10.1 through 10.6 (dev version obviously). I don't know how you really come to the statement that I am obviously not running Vista. In fact, I watch all these OS's running on over 2000 machines in 10 different buildings daily.
Second, you keep talking about how much easier it is to replace an optical drive is easier to change in anything but a mac and I'm not twisting your words around. This is model to model because I've had 5 different Dell laptops, worked on numerous other-vendor models as well. Some were easy, some were hard. The quality of the optical drive isn't really less than that of any other optical drive found in another vendor laptop. Apple's choice might not have been the best, which I can agree with but its certinaly not the worst by far. I mispelled the optical drive, which is correctly "Matshita". This is what it is listed as. I full know that the actual brand name is "Matsushita." Is it necessary to argue about the name?
Third, your argument about the casing breaking and what not. I know of this, I experienced this, and I don't disagree with the fact that its unacceptable. They have changed the materials several times to remedy this and they still don't have this perfect. I know this because I have used every model of the macbook from the first intel to the latest santa rosa based models.
Fourth, your argument about OS X being the problem with your laptop freezing and It running perfectly fine on Windows is the bothers me the most. Just because it runs fine on Windows doesn't indicate that OS X is really the problem. Your issue is very isolated and indicates that there is something wrong I can agree on that. I also can see why you point the finger at OS X. But I disagree and I have my detailed explanations for it as well.
Fifth, the argument with how the OS handle memory. I know very well what a cache is and how it works. I've studied this and designed cache using VHDL as well as main memory for projects and what not. This conversatio can be very long and I do not see the reason to really argue about this down to detail. I was giving a general statement that can be explained if need be.
Also, I am not twisting your words around. I don't know why you are saying this. Sorry that I had said something about kernel panics I was reading some other post obviously. Not a big deal, but doesnt change anything here nonetheless.
I had a Dell inspiron 9100. It had terrible cooling despite the fact that is the largest laptop on the market for the screen size, over heated, replaced motherboards, memory, video card everything more than once. Again, every vendor has design issues.
If benchmarks don't prove my statements on Vista, what else do you need? First hand experience also proves it. What else are you looking for? Vista, in its current form, DOES NOT run faster on the same hardward. Vista does have better performance, for a LIMITED number of apps.
All versions of Vista DO NOT "fly" on 2gigs of ram. 64bit has twice the instruction length, therefore programs require twice the address space in memory, therefore using more memory? I don't know what it is you are trying to tell me I guess?
Bottom line, your "arguments" about your personal experiences are fine to talk about. But what you apply them to such a statement as "It's OS X's fault", they are invalid, plain and simple. Am I still twisting your words around?
Second, you keep talking about how much easier it is to replace an optical drive is easier to change in anything but a mac and I'm not twisting your words around. This is model to model because I've had 5 different Dell laptops, worked on numerous other-vendor models as well. Some were easy, some were hard. The quality of the optical drive isn't really less than that of any other optical drive found in another vendor laptop. Apple's choice might not have been the best, which I can agree with but its certinaly not the worst by far. I mispelled the optical drive, which is correctly "Matshita". This is what it is listed as. I full know that the actual brand name is "Matsushita." Is it necessary to argue about the name?
Third, your argument about the casing breaking and what not. I know of this, I experienced this, and I don't disagree with the fact that its unacceptable. They have changed the materials several times to remedy this and they still don't have this perfect. I know this because I have used every model of the macbook from the first intel to the latest santa rosa based models.
Fourth, your argument about OS X being the problem with your laptop freezing and It running perfectly fine on Windows is the bothers me the most. Just because it runs fine on Windows doesn't indicate that OS X is really the problem. Your issue is very isolated and indicates that there is something wrong I can agree on that. I also can see why you point the finger at OS X. But I disagree and I have my detailed explanations for it as well.
Fifth, the argument with how the OS handle memory. I know very well what a cache is and how it works. I've studied this and designed cache using VHDL as well as main memory for projects and what not. This conversatio can be very long and I do not see the reason to really argue about this down to detail. I was giving a general statement that can be explained if need be.
Also, I am not twisting your words around. I don't know why you are saying this. Sorry that I had said something about kernel panics I was reading some other post obviously. Not a big deal, but doesnt change anything here nonetheless.
I had a Dell inspiron 9100. It had terrible cooling despite the fact that is the largest laptop on the market for the screen size, over heated, replaced motherboards, memory, video card everything more than once. Again, every vendor has design issues.
If benchmarks don't prove my statements on Vista, what else do you need? First hand experience also proves it. What else are you looking for? Vista, in its current form, DOES NOT run faster on the same hardward. Vista does have better performance, for a LIMITED number of apps.
All versions of Vista DO NOT "fly" on 2gigs of ram. 64bit has twice the instruction length, therefore programs require twice the address space in memory, therefore using more memory? I don't know what it is you are trying to tell me I guess?
Bottom line, your "arguments" about your personal experiences are fine to talk about. But what you apply them to such a statement as "It's OS X's fault", they are invalid, plain and simple. Am I still twisting your words around?
64-bit?
Just as a bit of a reality-check here, how true is this? I'm running 64-bit binaries and operating systems on a few different UNIX boxes, and never before in my life have I heard anything about any of these systems literally requiring twice as much memory as their 32-bit counterparts.
As far as I know, my Sun system would run everything just as quickly with half the ram it has now, except for the fact that I'm running a lot of apps on it.
I haven't run 64-bit Windows or 64-bit Windows applications though, so I suppose that'd be my bad if I'm wrong about this.
Just as a bit of a reality-check here, how true is this? I'm running 64-bit binaries and operating systems on a few different UNIX boxes, and never before in my life have I heard anything about any of these systems literally requiring twice as much memory as their 32-bit counterparts.
As far as I know, my Sun system would run everything just as quickly with half the ram it has now, except for the fact that I'm running a lot of apps on it.
I haven't run 64-bit Windows or 64-bit Windows applications though, so I suppose that'd be my bad if I'm wrong about this.
Thought I'd poke my nose in and have my little say on this.
First of all, whoever just said "Get the Dell" really hasn't used one of the most recent generation of Dell notebooks. To say they're a step backward isn't quite strong enough a statement. I like to go in to my local Currys (tech store) mainly to waste time between busses in and out of town and out of curiosity after laughing at the cage they have made for the MacBook Air I'll go and poke at the non-Apple computers.
The most recent Dells are terrible. The build quality feels cheap (we're talking built-of-Lego cheap here), the glossy screens look blue-tinted no matter how you fiddle with the colour profiles, the ones on display with matte screens were tinted green to the same extent, all were running MS OS-That-Must-Not-Be-Named, and all were struggling even to show the demo videos. One of them has been stuck on the same error screen for a month with a sad little post-it note saying "Please do not touch the defective computer" on it.
Of all the non-Mac notebooks I have played with in-store, I must say I'm most impressed with the Toshiba machines (although the big 17" one looked like it could crush cars as easily as run MS Paint) which still come with the option of purchasing with XP installed - although that might be an offer this store is doing because they don't online.
However, back to the bright side of things: Apple. My family until recently always used Apple because the family business was run, up 'til 1998 if you can believe it, from a group of six Macintosh Plus'. I myself have been brought up with a Mac Plus, a Mac LC, a PM6200, an iMac G3, then I had a break with an Iridium Starbook running XP that caught fire twice, then a Mac Mini, and now this wonderful BlackBook.
Three of those machines are since 1998 (including the Starbook). After 1998 (when we closed the business) dad got a Dell. He got another in 1999. Two in 2000, a HP thingy in 2001 that lasted 'til 2004, another Dell that lasted 'til 2006, and then he bought a Foxconn on my advice thats working perfectly still.
Now maybe we had bad luck, maybe we didn't. Maybe all those machines failed because they were always of the lowest class of machines, the ones that came with bog standard or below standard parts and cost usually under £500. All I know is that my Apple machines, with the exception of the Mini which I'll admit has gone senile in just over two years, have not broken down and have only had to be replaced when their software becomes obsolete. My Mac Plus, PM6200, and my iMac all still work perfectly. None of dads machines do with the exception of the £800 Foxconn that I made him buy. And it runs XP.
Software wise, almost anything you do on a MS PC can be read by a Mac, albeit sometimes a bit crookedly. Most stuff you do on a Mac will be read by a PC, usually with only a few small freeware downloads. Sure some filetypes are outrageously different and incompatible but hell the same can be said between XP and that spawn of Longhorn. Generally speaking, most office software for Macs is cheaper than the Windows counterpart and often runs far better and gives neater results on paper.
Some of this has probably already been said but I always like to put my spin on things too >.<
Good luck trying to convince them, but if you don't manage at least save yourself the gloom of a Dell notebook.
First of all, whoever just said "Get the Dell" really hasn't used one of the most recent generation of Dell notebooks. To say they're a step backward isn't quite strong enough a statement. I like to go in to my local Currys (tech store) mainly to waste time between busses in and out of town and out of curiosity after laughing at the cage they have made for the MacBook Air I'll go and poke at the non-Apple computers.
The most recent Dells are terrible. The build quality feels cheap (we're talking built-of-Lego cheap here), the glossy screens look blue-tinted no matter how you fiddle with the colour profiles, the ones on display with matte screens were tinted green to the same extent, all were running MS OS-That-Must-Not-Be-Named, and all were struggling even to show the demo videos. One of them has been stuck on the same error screen for a month with a sad little post-it note saying "Please do not touch the defective computer" on it.
Of all the non-Mac notebooks I have played with in-store, I must say I'm most impressed with the Toshiba machines (although the big 17" one looked like it could crush cars as easily as run MS Paint) which still come with the option of purchasing with XP installed - although that might be an offer this store is doing because they don't online.
However, back to the bright side of things: Apple. My family until recently always used Apple because the family business was run, up 'til 1998 if you can believe it, from a group of six Macintosh Plus'. I myself have been brought up with a Mac Plus, a Mac LC, a PM6200, an iMac G3, then I had a break with an Iridium Starbook running XP that caught fire twice, then a Mac Mini, and now this wonderful BlackBook.
Three of those machines are since 1998 (including the Starbook). After 1998 (when we closed the business) dad got a Dell. He got another in 1999. Two in 2000, a HP thingy in 2001 that lasted 'til 2004, another Dell that lasted 'til 2006, and then he bought a Foxconn on my advice thats working perfectly still.
Now maybe we had bad luck, maybe we didn't. Maybe all those machines failed because they were always of the lowest class of machines, the ones that came with bog standard or below standard parts and cost usually under £500. All I know is that my Apple machines, with the exception of the Mini which I'll admit has gone senile in just over two years, have not broken down and have only had to be replaced when their software becomes obsolete. My Mac Plus, PM6200, and my iMac all still work perfectly. None of dads machines do with the exception of the £800 Foxconn that I made him buy. And it runs XP.
Software wise, almost anything you do on a MS PC can be read by a Mac, albeit sometimes a bit crookedly. Most stuff you do on a Mac will be read by a PC, usually with only a few small freeware downloads. Sure some filetypes are outrageously different and incompatible but hell the same can be said between XP and that spawn of Longhorn. Generally speaking, most office software for Macs is cheaper than the Windows counterpart and often runs far better and gives neater results on paper.
Some of this has probably already been said but I always like to put my spin on things too >.<
Good luck trying to convince them, but if you don't manage at least save yourself the gloom of a Dell notebook.
if you've got the money, then buy it yourself.
my mum and dad were abit shocked i was spending so much on a laptop, and were abit confused i was buying a mac as they know nothing about them, but i explained why and they simply said 'well if its what you want, its your money'
i also like to give the comparison of a 2 litre bmw not being the same as a 2 litre skoda when they say 'but this pc's a 2.4ghz too'
my mum and dad were abit shocked i was spending so much on a laptop, and were abit confused i was buying a mac as they know nothing about them, but i explained why and they simply said 'well if its what you want, its your money'
i also like to give the comparison of a 2 litre bmw not being the same as a 2 litre skoda when they say 'but this pc's a 2.4ghz too'
I really hate when people say they despise Apple computers for such DUMB reasons. Wow - what a surprise - the PC repairman says he hates Macs - because if everyone had Macs he'd be out of a job!
It's ridiculous to think about taking the computer "to the shop" when you haven't even bought it yet.
Look closely, and you'll notice that a good portion of problems people have with Macs are problems with the software (i.e. bad settings, not knowing how to do something, etc.)
Search hard through the forums and you won't find an overwhelming number of posts about 5 year old Macs needing to go "to the shop".
If you live near an Apple store, diagnostics are free. An Apple genius will tell you what's wrong with it and how much it costs to fix, if anything. You can also buy Apple Care (but that's a whole other debate...)
Tell your parents to stop trying to live their broken dreams through you.
Besides, there's absolutely nothing a PC can do that a Mac can't. Nobody can challenge me on that one. All Macs can run Windows. It's a fact.
Why won't they just let you buy it yourself?
It's ridiculous to think about taking the computer "to the shop" when you haven't even bought it yet.
Look closely, and you'll notice that a good portion of problems people have with Macs are problems with the software (i.e. bad settings, not knowing how to do something, etc.)
Search hard through the forums and you won't find an overwhelming number of posts about 5 year old Macs needing to go "to the shop".
If you live near an Apple store, diagnostics are free. An Apple genius will tell you what's wrong with it and how much it costs to fix, if anything. You can also buy Apple Care (but that's a whole other debate...)
Tell your parents to stop trying to live their broken dreams through you.
Besides, there's absolutely nothing a PC can do that a Mac can't. Nobody can challenge me on that one. All Macs can run Windows. It's a fact.
Why won't they just let you buy it yourself?
Ouch... Epic, though. Pretty much what I wanted to say, though a little more forceful than I had been.
Kiddo, get a Mac.
I agree.
But you also have to accept the fact that PC people like me hate when some Mac users say such negative things about PCs and Windows in general that are not even true.
Fact: Windows Vista is now a solid, fast and reliable operating system that can do everything that OS X can do, and then some. It now has the full driver support and dependability that most people require for most tasks. It has run like a champ on my system for over 18 months with no re-installs, and it has survived a beating in its early days. It is a great OS. Period. I don't want to hear anymore BS about Vista that I have been hearing around the forum.
- Status