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NBC and Time Warner Continue to Back Flash Over HTML5

cutmoney said:
Besides, it doesn't matter what the iPad is compatible with, it just makes more sense to encode with standard format which is compatible on a wider range of devices. Flash is slow, processor intensive, and is no longer necessary. Back when there were few (if any) alternatives for animation and interactive content, Flash made sense since it was the only option, but that's no longer the case.
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Actually, if it "just makes more sense to encode with standard format which is compatible with a wider range of devices", that would be Flash. HTML5 + h.264 + javascript as an alternative only works with about 8% of the browsers in play. Flash works with about 97% of browsers in play.

I appreciate all the "Flash is bad", "battery hog", etc arguments, but if these companies want to reach the widest possible audience but don't want to code for both options, Flash is THE way to go. They make their money by reaching the widest possible audience, not the very small audience equipped to display "the future" standard now.

The correct solution is for Apple to allow Flash as a user OPTION now. Then, let the superior technology supplant the "outdated", "buggy", "closed", "battery hog", etc technology over time... just like almost every other tech standard replaces prior standards. Forbidding it only denies users of Apple's great devices access to a thoroughly established standard in exchange for having access to a much less established standard that might become the de facto standard years from now. We users lose in that battle... only for some potential to "win"(?) somewhere down the road (when the iDevice we're using now is probably long since dead).
 
I sent NBC an email stating my frustrations. I recommend others do that same. This isn't about watching videos, as I couldn't care less about NBC's TV. But it's about the openness to accepting proper web standards and future technologies and not limiting users to something that is old, crappy, and obsolete.
 
jsbaugh said:
There are only two shows on all of NBC worth watching anyway. 30 Rock and the Office which you can get thru itunes, so who really cares what NBC does.
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Yea, now that Law & Order is finished for good, I dont think there's anything at all that I watch on NBC.

Funny, a good while back they were my favorite network, now they are irrelevant to me, other than some PGA golf tourneys that they broadcast.
 
You guys know the real reason, right?

It's two fold:

1) First the simple one... HTML5 doesn't (yet) offer the copy protection that HULU has managed to keep going for so long ( I completely understand their fear here )

2) Comcast wants NBC to remain an exclusive platform... they are going to try and leverage their infrastructure to try to dominate digital delivery in the future, and they have to take a stand against apple wherever they can.
If they stick with flash right now, it makes people upset that they can't watch that content easily, and they're hoping this will cause people to jump ship away from the itunes/iPhone OS/ HTML5 future Jobs envisions.
 
HobeSoundDarryl said:
Actually, if it "just makes more sense to encode with standard format which is compatible with a wider range of devices", that would be Flash. HTML5 + h.264 + javascript as an alternative only works with about 8% of the browsers in play. Flash works with about 97% of browsers in play.

I appreciate all the "Flash is bad", "battery hog", etc arguments, but if these companies want to reach the widest possible audience but don't want to code for both options, Flash is THE way to go. They make their money by reaching the widest possible audience, not the very small audience equipped to display "the future" standard now.

The correct solution is for Apple to allow Flash as a user OPTION now. Then, let the superior technology supplant the "outdated", "buggy", "closed", "battery hog", etc technology over time... just like almost every other tech standard replaces prior standards. Turning it off only denies users of Apple's great devices access to a thoroughly established standard in exchange for having access to a much less established standard that might become the de facto standard years from now. We users lose in that battle... only for some potential to "win"(?) somewhere down the road (when the iDevice we're using now is probably long since dead).
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Very well put.
 
This reminds me of how long it took PC manufacturers to stop using floppy disks after Mac discuntinued their use. That's why Apple continues to be the leader, and the others are all followers, and sometines follower followers. It's their decision to live in the dark ages. Best of luck to them and their incompetent top-management.
 
Jason S. said:
I always wonder how many of the people who comment on this issue are actually web developers and understand the differences between what HTML5, CSS, Javacript, and Flash can do.

You cannot do everything with HTML5.....
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Just because you 'can' doesn't mean you 'should'.
 
Time Warner did the same thing with Blu Ray they waited till just about everyone else had decided where they were going with the technology and then followed. There just doing the same here, if this is how they make all there business decisions I wouldn't want to own any of their stock.
 
pdjudd said:
I never said it was a final standard - in fact I used the word "draft" which is what the W3C refers to it as. And calling something a standard does not necessarily require it to be finalized - standardization is a overall process.
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Fair enough, I agree with standardization being an overall process. I do not agree that software companies should adopt draft specs unless there is either a real compelling reason, or the standard is very close to finalization. I think for smaller companies, HTML 5 support is doable and cheap, for larger media companies though the cost would be prohibitive if the spec were to change significantly between now and the time it is finalized. Not to mention the cost associated with either hiring developers knowledgeable in this area, or retooling their current (presumably flash) developers. If this were not the case, these companies would most certainly support this format because they are motivated by money and apple has a lot of devices that cannot view their content.
 
Yamcha said:
lol haha :p, not surprised, I knew people wouldn't make the transition that quick.. now I understand that HTML5 is the new standard, and its important that everyone follows web standards, BUT it takes some time to make the change, and that is exactly why I feel apple should support flash on iphones/ipods/ipads aswell as HTML5.. I think even if according to Apple flash causes most of the crashes on their platform, I would still like to see flash support then no support at all.. I wouldn't mind the crashes.. that way at least I can watch online videos on sites other then youtube..

Also the thing I don't understand, if flash is truly that bad, then why does apple have a youtube application.. isn't it based on flash? I mean there has been a youtube app since iphone was released.. at the time there was no HTML5 version of youtube, and even now the current firmware doesn't support HTML5..

Why support youtube at all?
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Once again... If Apple supported Flash, no one would ever need to change and we would be stuck to Flash even ten years from now.
 
Mattie Num Nums said:
Could you provide me some numbers please on the cost?

ROI would be great too.
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$10,000.

Return on investment is exposure to 80+ million mobile devices, base the average revenue potential of each over the lifetime and say conservatively half a billion dollars.

You don't even understand the issue so why should I explain it to you? They don't have to re-encode their videos or do anything of the sort. They just need to set up a new wrapper for them, and like I said, NBC.COM ALREADY does this so the cost is ZERO.

As for Jason S., I know I have been doing web development longer than you have.
 
Yamcha said:
Also the thing I don't understand, if flash is truly that bad, then why does apple have a youtube application.. isn't it based on flash?
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not at all. Youtube serves both flash and mp4 versions of many if not all of the uploaded videos. Those latter videos are pulled up by the App.
 
Some of you guys dont understand the history and the connection NBC has. Look at what they own. Any backlash from Apple would be stoopid. Also you will watch their shows because thats what they do best bring people in. THey have the NFL. So you are not going to watch Sunday games cause they have Flash....yeah ok fanboys!
 
JHankwitz said:
This reminds me of how long it took PC manufacturers to stop using floppy disks after Mac discuntinued their use. That's why Apple continues to be the leader, and the others are all followers, and sometines follower followers. It's their decision to live in the dark ages. Best of luck to them and their incompetent top-management.
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I appreciate how often this is tossed out there to show Apple as technological leader, but you can still buy floppy disc drives for Macs even today. For example: http://floppydisk.com/usb.htm

Whether Flash is great or terrible, ultimate or abomination, the big difference between Apple's decision to quit the floppy drive and Apple's decision to forbid Flash is that users who wanted a floppy drive for their new Macs could still get one and use it (even today), while users who would like the OPTION to see Flash content (which is not just video) have no such option.

For the guy who needed Floppy disc solutions beyond Apple's decision, he could still get what he needed done on his Apple equipment. For the guy who needs Flash solutions on his iDevice, he has NO POSSIBILITY of a solution as Apple has chosen to forbid it. That's a very big difference.
 
anthonyjr said:
Do they not realize that it isn't about the iPad anymore? Almost every major browser is adding in full HTML5 support.
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Yes, but the major browsers aren't discontinuing Flash support just because they're adding HTML5 support. iPhone for Safari has a 0.86% market share after 3 years on the market, it will take time before iPad reaches a similar market share, and even when that happens, NBC/Time Warner will still be reaching 98% of all users out there (all other smartphones and tablets will have Flash by then). Content providers have been known to drop support for older browsers whose market shares go well beyond 2%, so I doubt they're losing sleep over this.

Yes, yes, we know... "but iPhone/iPad users usually have lots of cash so they are an important target demographic for advertisers". Well, the advertisers will be the judges of that. If they start pushing NBC/Time Warner about ditching Flash, things will change. If not... they won't.
 
s8film40 said:
Time Warner did the same thing with Blu Ray they waited till just about everyone else had decided where they were going with the technology and then followed. There just doing the same here, if this is how they make all there business decisions I wouldn't want to own any of their stock.
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That's why you wouldn't want to own their stock? Because they waiting before investing their money into the format war winner? I'm sure their stockholders were very happy that they waited vs investing in the WRONG format.
 
nagromme said:
"Sources said” that NBC flat-out will not make an iPad app, despite ABC, CBS and other having iPad solutions? Hard to imagine even a private, internal decision being so final. I’m skeptical.
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"Sources" also say that Justin Bieber has trademarked his haircut and now receives royalties from all stylists that give someone a 'Bieber'

The NY Post isn't known for being all that authoritative. They are generally seen as being just over the line of a full on tabloid. And while their stuff is 50-60% true, they still 'unnamed sources' and spin things to the scandal side just like a tabloid.
 
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