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New Claim of iOS 4.2 Launch on November 24th as Revised iPad Build Surfaces

dguisinger said:
Some people... I wear.... how poor Apple's quality control is?

The fact that they release a build to TESTERS which they thought was final, they find out there are issues and decide to FIX it before release to the PUBLIC?

Its not like the gold master was released publicly. Gold master means "we have no issues we know about and think we can release it"... now they know about it and fixed it.

If you find a problem fixed through the normal means of testing a product, I would call that GOOD QUALITY CONTROL. The issue wasn't in the prior build that was released to testers; and doesn't appear to affect all iPad users and may not have occurred within the lab.
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I don't think you're familiar with software development cycles and where the term "Golden Master" comes from.

"Good quality control" requires an organized development/testing approach, milestones (including code freeze), and regression testing after the code is frozen. Quite simply, the regression testing should have included thorough WiFi test cases and I'm surprised that it didn't catch this issue, which was apparently noticed by just about everyone who installed it. And all of this should have happened prior to the golden master being produced (unless Apple has changed their definition of "golden master").
 
I would rather wait a week or so longer for a working version of 4.2 than to have a buggy one now. :eek: This is a huge upgrade that would kill holiday sales if it was released with major bugs. Apple will release it when it is ready and they have plenty of time to meet their promise of Nov release. I am as excited any anyone to update my ipad and try these new features out :D, but I am going to be patient. :rolleyes:
 
tevans333 said:
Yeah, I'm one of those people. And it is very hard switching between iPhone4 with 4.1 to ipad 3.2.2 all day, but it seems so many people are flaming Apple lately over so called delays. It'd be nice if people would keep their heads on straight and remember a delay would only mean release AFTER November.
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Really? I have an iPT with iOS 4 on it, and I have no trouble switching back and forth between them. Sure, the folders on the iPT make me wish for them on the iPad, but really, the UI isn't that different...
 
aperry said:
I don't think you're familiar with software development cycles and where the term "Golden Master" comes from.

"Good quality control" requires an organized development/testing approach, milestones (including code freeze), and regression testing after the code is frozen. Quite simply, the regression testing should have included thorough WiFi test cases and I'm surprised that it didn't catch this issue, which was apparently noticed by just about everyone who installed it. And all of this should have happened prior to the golden master being produced (unless Apple has changed their definition of "golden master").
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As a professional software developer I assure you, I am very aware of what Gold Master means.

No software is bug free, if something got introduced and Apple didn't reproduce it, thats the whole purpose of having outside testers

And no, it wasn't noticed by everyone who installed it. Reports indicate a low percentage of users noticed it based on very specific WiFi network conditions.

Fact of the matter is, the testing process DID find the bug. Having outside testers is part of the testing process. Gold Master does not by any means require a single release. I have beta tested many products that went through multiple Gold Masters.
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/532.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0.5 Mobile/8B117 Safari/6531.22.7)

I think it's important for Apple to get 4.2 out with both AirPlay and AirPrint as soon as possible to stimulate holiday sales of iOS devices. A cool new feature or two and the press coverage will do wonders for sales. I think Steve wants this update out ASAP.
 
aperry said:
I don't think you're familiar with software development cycles and where the term "Golden Master" comes from.

"Good quality control" requires an organized development/testing approach, milestones (including code freeze), and regression testing after the code is frozen. Quite simply, the regression testing should have included thorough WiFi test cases and I'm surprised that it didn't catch this issue, which was apparently noticed by just about everyone who installed it. And all of this should have happened prior to the golden master being produced (unless Apple has changed their definition of "golden master").
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All I ever read was it was rumored to be GM. Not that it was for certain GM. Maybe it wasn't even GM.
 
aperry said:
Quite simply, the regression testing should have included thorough WiFi test cases and I'm surprised that it didn't catch this issue, which was apparently noticed by just about everyone who installed it.
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I never experienced it once, nor did many other people. Get off your high horse.
 
rwilliams said:
When we protested, saying that no one in their right mind would ever use the software in that way, he'd always say, "if I can come up with something this absurd, you can be sure that someone else will think of it too." That's stuck with me to this day.
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Awesome little anecdote. I'll keep that in mind if I ever start developing professionally.
 
I don't think the time/space continuum could cope with iOS4.2 and Gran Turismo 5 finally being released on the same day. The universe would probably implode, and then we'd all be proper fu**ed.

:apple:
 
We know it's not going to be released on 24/11 as Apple has already advised its staff that they are all being given the whole Thanksgiving week off (except for those that work retail).
 
barefootman said:
We know it's not going to be released on 24/11 as Apple has already advised its staff that they are all being given the whole Thanksgiving week off (except for those that work retail).
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Well there ya go. Sounds like how they planned it in the first place, not that anything has slipped.
 
aperry said:
...Quite simply, the regression testing should have included thorough WiFi test cases and I'm surprised that it didn't catch this issue, which was apparently noticed by just about everyone who installed it ...
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Given the number of people who have come on here to say "I haven't noticed any wifi issues", I hardly think that this assertion is fair. If the bug didn't turn up until it went out to beta testers, and then only turned up within a small subset of that group, Apple had to evaluate the nature of the bug to determine whether it was something worth chasing down for this release. I am glad that they did, mind you, but I'm sure that there are other bugs that haven't seen enough reports or been repeatable in Apple's labs, etc., that will still be in iOS 4.2. (Its quite conceivable that the wifi bug was only able to be reproduced in Apple's labs since the GM was originally issued. Prior to that point, if it was considered an unreproducible bug, it wouldn't have blocked the issuing of a GM.)
 
When iOS 4.2 comes out and I update my iPhone and iPad, will I lose all my photos and videos and apps and folders? Will I need to copy the apps to the device and organize them again?

Could someone tell me? I dont remember the answer.

Thanks.
 
Sensamic said:
When iOS 4.2 comes out and I update my iPhone and iPad, will I lose all my photos and videos and apps and folders? Will I need to copy the apps to the device and organize them again?

Could someone tell me? I dont remember the answer.

Thanks.
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Everything will be copied to your iPhone and iPad. Do a backup through iTunes beforehand though just to be safe.
 
ThunderSkunk said:
WTF, are there six people writing 4.2 for iPad?

50+ Billion dollars in the bank!

HIRE SOME PEOPLE.


ARRRRRGGGHHGHHH
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Yeah, and if you need a baby in less than 9 months maybe you should hire more mothers. You are obviously not a software developer. The same goes for construction.... if it takes one hour to install a new kitchen faucet it does not mean that 6 people can do it in 10 minutes.

If there is a problem, Apple has done the right thing to meet their committments for iOS 4.2. If they released it early with known bugs that WOULD be crappy quality control.
 
Apple did the right thing. It's a bummer to have to wait longer, but I'm glad they are taking care of this.
 
dguisinger said:
As a professional software developer I assure you, I am very aware of what Gold Master means.

No software is bug free, if something got introduced and Apple didn't reproduce it, thats the whole purpose of having outside testers

And no, it wasn't noticed by everyone who installed it. Reports indicate a low percentage of users noticed it based on very specific WiFi network conditions.

Fact of the matter is, the testing process DID find the bug. Having outside testers is part of the testing process. Gold Master does not by any means require a single release. I have beta tested many products that went through multiple Gold Masters.
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I'll try to find the post I was reading (steps for installing iPad 4.2 GM), when I was considering applying the update myself. But there were several replies, almost in a row, from different users who successfully applied the firmware but immediately noticed the wifi issues. Based on that, it seemed unlikely that this was limited only to "very specific network conditions".

No, the testing process did not do its job IMO. Golden master implies that this had completed the testing process, including the all beta testing, and it was ready to "ship" (so to speak). I think it's very likely that there is a ***** storm inside the walls of Apple about how close they were releasing this bug. No, I'm not an Apple employee, and clearly everything that has been floating around these forums is unconfirmed by Apple. But there are a lot of signs pointing to today as being the planned release date, and this issue which was undetected by their testing process and only identified by customers at the 11th hour is not exactly indicative of a solid quality process.

I know my boss would be demanding answers if some customer reported an obvious and critical issue after our testing had fully completed and moments before we were to go live! I'm not sure an acceptable response is "oh yeah, sorry, we only smoke test wifi connectivity even though it's the most critical feature for iPad users."
 
PBG4 Dude said:
More likely every engineer can only use Apple WiFi routers during testing. Us uncouth users of DLink, Linksys or other routers get to pound sand until these issues get uncovered after wider releases. :D
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Except that I'm using an Airport Extreme and have been having issues since 4.2 beta 1.
 
aperry said:
I've been following posts from people who took the golden master when it was originally released and immediately noticed the WiFi issues within minutes of installing it.

I continue to be surprised at how poor Apple's quality control is. I don't expect software to be perfect, but I would love to know how some of these obvious and critical issues make it into a golden master.
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Wait, really... issues discovered in a nonpublic release and it's a "quality control" problem? Um, isn't the fact that it was in a nonpublic release the very definition of quality control? Changes were likely made (probably to AirPrint) at the last minute that caused the issues in the PRErelease version.

Sure, I'd love to have the latest iOS on my iPad today... but I'd rather have a stable iPad than one that crashes or won't connect to WiFi. Let 'em get it right.

Heck, before the Internet, most of us hacks wouldn't have even known about developer releases, betas or golden masters...
 
aperry said:
I'll try to find the post I was reading (steps for installing iPad 4.2 GM), when I was considering applying the update myself. But there were several replies, almost in a row, from different users who successfully applied the firmware but immediately noticed the wifi issues. Based on that, it seemed unlikely that this was limited only to "very specific network conditions".

No, the testing process did not do its job IMO. Golden master implies that this had completed the testing process, including the all beta testing, and it was ready to "ship" (so to speak). I think it's very likely that there is a ***** storm inside the walls of Apple about how close they were releasing this bug. No, I'm not an Apple employee, and clearly everything that has been floating around these forums is unconfirmed by Apple. But there are a lot of signs pointing to today as being the planned release date, and this issue which was undetected by their testing process and only identified by customers at the 11th hour is not exactly indicative of a solid quality process.

I know my boss would be demanding answers if some customer reported an obvious and critical issue after our testing had fully completed and moments before we were to go live! I'm not sure an acceptable response is "oh yeah, sorry, we only smoke test wifi connectivity even though it's the most critical feature for iPad users."
Click to expand...

As someone else said, get off your high horse...

because the first thing I do when I download an iOS beta is run to the forum and write "WiFi Works!"

Of course if a small percentage of people were having problems you see reports back to back

And if you are so smart, why release a gold master to testers at all instead of the general public? GM's ALWAYS go through the beta testers which is proper procedure.
 
wilhoitm said:
Yes, it is like using 10 Senior Engineers to screw in a light bulb. Every one of them thinks they need to touch it! :eek:

P. S. Also, there is the tried and true reference http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mythical_Man-Month
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what a great book that is. the two principals i remember from that are:
1. 9 women cannot make a baby in one month
2. The cost of commnunication grows exponentially with the number of people that need to communicate to each other
 
To everyone being impatient and wanting 4.2 now, you do realize you could of just googled "iOS 4.2 GM download" a week ago, right?
 
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