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Unsure about that new keyboard, may see a torrent of returns by Jan 7th... (side by side, I prefer MBA K/B)


Also why leery of the sales data. Does not reflect returns. I am bitter and jaded from the gaming industry. An industry that too likes preorders, and e-peen waving about it. I am more of lets see what happens the day after....since major players like steam offer an iron clad no questions asked return policy as well.

Days before release Arkham knight was sitting pretty preorder sales wise. It was the day after release that told a different story as steam recorded record returns and cancellations. Not the only game to see a day after sales report much less rosy than before release.

Apple too has had this problem. IPP was a stunning sales success at release. Or so they said. Numbers in the latter part changed. Why? It wasn't preorder data. It was live sales data factoring in returns. Yes it sold. Takes weeks later to take off those thousands of sales to get the more accurate data.

inb4 hater. Not wishing this on apple. But its something they deal with. There will be buyer's remorse. IPP (both) had it.
Mac (lap and desktop) have had it.

Internet preorder became reality, returns as reality not as grand as predicted. Some will be the schemers. Buy the 2016, sell the 14 or 15...easy peasy. Week or so later, why so many low ballers out here? damn This is a shiny 2015, why can't cheap asses pay top dollar for it.

Some could return if others don't think that 2015 is worth what they want. Worse given the time of year. Like said before santa is coming. PX on base has already started its early black Friday stuff. Internet is showing many have started black friday activity....no where near turkey day. Better father than tech geek....nice start to kids shopping was done. I make sure santa has his priorities. Kid first, wife then see what St. nick has for me lol.
 
Guess people DO like it! You wouldn't say so by looking at these forums.

It's like in all online news forums... people who are happy with it don't feel the urge to comment. Only all negative always spills out... that's why I essentially stopped reading any comments. Even when you read in forums of highly intellectual newspapers -- all the same. Really annoying.

And I did order the new MBP with Touchbar because I think it's a phantastic way of productive working and much much better than any touchscreen (which nobody uses except if the device is used in a pad style).
I'm not a "creative pro", but still a professional user with heavy office documents, browsers and often a Windows VM used in parallel and am absolutely fine with 16 GB (was already good with 8GB). And especially in that environment the Touchbar will be highly productive by reducting lots of mouse travel on the screen.
So compared to the usual un-inspired me-too approach of all other manufacturers with touch-enabled laptop screens, I think this is a highly innovative idea and was worth the wait.
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Apple doesn't care about specs as much as experience. You should know that by now. It's still a powerful machine through perfect hardware and software integration.

Exactly... everybody whining about specs - go and buy a overstuffed Windows PC and see "Application not responding" 100 times a day....
I have a brand new HP laptop from my company sitting at home that I never use exactly because of this... a brand new state-of-the-art laptop with almost nothing installed than Windows + Office... just unresponsive all the time!
 
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https://9to5mac.com/2016/11/10/macbook-pro-review-video-editor/

Carter’s conclusion is that the new 15-inch model he was using (he doesn’t detail specs), is more than capable of handling daily editing in FCP X with 5K ProRes footage. He also notes that machine “tears strips off ‘superior spec’d’ Windows counterparts in the real world.”
When it comes to addressing the issue of dongles that might be necessary for pros now that the new MacBook Pro has all USB-C ports, Carter explains that it isn’t an issue for his setup: “I already use USB-C Samsung T3 SSD’s as my external drives. These things are super fast and have the footprint of a credit card. The only change here is that I don’t need a USB-A to C cable to use them now, they’ll plug straight in.
The rest of the review mostly focuses on the Touch Bar, which Carter notes he quickly warmed up to and started using to replace keyboard shortcuts after initially being skeptical.

Nothing like a little real world experience to completely and utterly debunk hundreds of ignorant, irrational criticism.

On a side note, I like that his rationale for using Samsung T3 flash devices largely mirrors my own. For those not familiar with it, it connects using a USB-C to USB-A cable, and I bought one to use precisely so I could swap out the cable with a USB-C cable when the time comes.
 
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Pss, i know what posts you were banned for. it wasn't that one. THat was just the first one they probably saw with your name and hit you

IIRC, you were running around to every forum and telling people who had opinions different than you that they were filthy liars and idiots and even ignored actual facts to continue to call people liars.

you weren't banned for being an Apple fanboy, you were banned for being insufferable troll

Liking Apple on an Apple forum: insufferable troll...

As if MR isn't known for being full of Apple hater trolls
 
Unsure about that new keyboard, may see a torrent of returns by Jan 7th... (side by side, I prefer MBA K/B)
I like the new keyboard. I find I type faster on it once I take a few minutes. There may not be as many returns as you think.
[doublepost=1478869298][/doublepost]
Also why leery of the sales data. Does not reflect returns. I am bitter and jaded from the gaming industry. An industry that too likes preorders, and e-peen waving about it. I am more of lets see what happens the day after....since major players like steam offer an iron clad no questions asked return policy as well.

Days before release Arkham knight was sitting pretty preorder sales wise. It was the day after release that told a different story as steam recorded record returns and cancellations. Not the only game to see a day after sales report much less rosy than before release.

Apple too has had this problem. IPP was a stunning sales success at release. Or so they said. Numbers in the latter part changed. Why? It wasn't preorder data. It was live sales data factoring in returns. Yes it sold. Takes weeks later to take off those thousands of sales to get the more accurate data.

inb4 hater. Not wishing this on apple. But its something they deal with. There will be buyer's remorse. IPP (both) had it.
Mac (lap and desktop) have had it.

Internet preorder became reality, returns as reality not as grand as predicted. Some will be the schemers. Buy the 2016, sell the 14 or 15...easy peasy. Week or so later, why so many low ballers out here? damn This is a shiny 2015, why can't cheap asses pay top dollar for it.

Some could return if others don't think that 2015 is worth what they want. Worse given the time of year. Like said before santa is coming. PX on base has already started its early black Friday stuff. Internet is showing many have started black friday activity....no where near turkey day. Better father than tech geek....nice start to kids shopping was done. I make sure santa has his priorities. Kid first, wife then see what St. nick has for me lol.
Can you post a link to the return data? I've never seen any info on returns of the IPP, but I've seen a lot about the sales, and they went very well.
 
Most can afford it, literally if they save and refrain from going out for a month or so. It's more so is it worth it?

As of right now to me it isn't but I wasn't planning on buying it anytime soon any ways i got my rMBP last year (mid-2015) and upgraded it with a TarDisk via SD Slot so I'm pretty happy with my 750 GB of Storage.


I travel for business internationally, statewide, and within the cities (to different clients) for support, sales presentations, training presentations and the like.

It really is ridiculous for me to carry around a bunch of dongles and adapters. Hope they find a better solution, or I'll wait until the rest of the business world gets on board with USB-C.

I can't expect all my clients to have USB-C ports and have updated tech all the time, thats the least of their concern, since I'm technically their IT support I have to be compatible and I'm definitely not keen on getting in to CC debt buying all this crap.
 
I am happy for Apple that the new MBPs are selling well. However, I bought a 12" MacBook in May and sold it this month. I hated the keyboard and lack of ports. I thought I could get by with only one USB-C port but it really is a big inconvenience. The kicker though was the keyboard. I hated typing with it. The feel is terrible. The new MBPs looked like they had potential with the touch bar thing, but the lack of a USB-A port and SD card slot will make me use my current 13" MBP for the foreseeable future. I went to the Apple store last night and tried out the new MBPs. The keyboard is better than the 12" MacBook, but not by much. The keyboard is a big step back and towards the 12" MacBook from the MBPs, so unfortunately I won't be buying a new MBP any time soon. Disappointing since it will be at least 4 years before they might change this. The new MBP are thinner but so what, I'd rather have the USB-A port and an SD card slot, who cares about more USB-C ports? Not me. Apple has really disappointed me lately. Additionally, the iPhone 7 was meh and the loss of the headphone jack and weird feeling Home button has made me strongly consider the Google Pixel. For me to change from iOS to Android shows that Apple is really not in touch with their customers.

I used to buy Apple products without even trying them out first. Well, no more. I lost $400 selling my 12" MacBook. I will probably get a google pixel for the better camera and sell my iPhone 6. I will keep my MBP for at least 3 more years before changing. I'm really disappointed with Apple products lately.

Side note: After I left the Apple Store, I stopped by the Microsoft store and looked at the $3000 Surface Studio. I saw a demo of Word and Photoshop. I was very impressed. I haven't been impressed my a Microsoft product since, hmmm, ever. The knob thing was a good idea and the screen is easy to move to different angles with a couple of fingers. There are also 4 USB-A 3.0 slots but no USB-C slots and an SD card slot. The RAM though is soldered and not user upgradeable according to the sales guy. Still, I was very impressed.
 
I wonder how it does compared to Dell XPS, which seems to be quite a popular PC alternative.

Yes, more to point.... Notice how they're comparing their "PRO" line to something closer to Ultra Books. This static would hold more relevance had they'd compared it to--- say, IBM's T line laptops, HP's EliteBooks, or Dell's XPS or Precision line.

This stat is simply a marketing illusion. Nothing more.
 
I like the new keyboard. I find I type faster on it once I take a few minutes. There may not be as many returns as you think.
[doublepost=1478869298][/doublepost]
Can you post a link to the return data? I've never seen any info on returns of the IPP, but I've seen a lot about the sales, and they went very well.


From a bit ago.

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-of-apples-tablet-sales-last-quarter.2011257/


Yes they sold...but not as high as some think or apple probably would have liked.
 
Good for Apple. I still think it would have been even more popular with a built-in USB-A port. Just one would have made a huge difference. Even if they charged the extra they'd lose on the adapter, I mean they're so expensive anyway, what's another $30 or whatever...?!

I think Apple is losing the plot a bit, but I still think there is a lot to like about these Macbook Pros. It's just for the price one shouldn't 'like a lot', you should love almost everything about them. That's how I still feel about my late 2013 15 inch rMBP, despite having to buy firewire and ethernet adapters, but adapters for everything is just silly. If I wanted a pile of spaghetti I'd order some pasta sauce.


I think it was a little soon to drop all the legacy ports. I agree 1 USB-A and 1 HDMI (opposite sides of the laptop) would have been better. I travel a lot and even at customer sites I move around a lot during the day and being able to walk into a conference room and just plug right into the projector or TV would be nice. Many days I don't even carry the power cord around so I don't really want to have to carry an adapter in my pocket in case I need to present.
 
Well color me surprised.

Indeed, me too. If this keeps happening, these are just the kinds of upgrades we can keep expecting. No love for the actual pro's, etc.

Voting with wallets works. Tried and true.
 
No, the previous generation was fast But they almost tripled the speeds and the fastest out there right now. Now it is insanely fast! Most consumer laptops come with mediocre SSD's capable of speeds less than 500 Mbs, and these are upto 3Gbs

Top of the line graphics were never a priority on MacBooks and never will be on something that portable.

Skylake doesn't support LPDDR4, so there isn't much option. Making use of just DDR4 results in higher power usage and a lot more wasted space. LPDDR3 is something like 25% more effiecent than DDR4.

So they would have to actually move backwards to include DDR4. Which would consume more power and use more space just so we can have 32GB? The performance for 99% of the people will even be negligible with the current speeds of SSDs

I don't think Intel is going to be able to support LPDDR4 until Canyon lake, so it will be a while before we get there.
Finally, someone who understands. People love to bitch about things they don't understand don't they? YOu are spot on and none of the trolls will believe you.
 
I've kept saying this on these Macbook Pro articles (as you can see from my previous comments) and I'll say it again, this forum is greatly out of touch with the general public!
Fandroids on this forum keep predicting everything will flop and Apple is dying yet they're wrong every time.

Wrong about the Macbook, wrong about iPhone 7 and now wrong about the Macbook Pro!

So much for the MBP being "an epic fail"! :D
 
I am happy for Apple that the new MBPs are selling well. However, I bought a 12" MacBook in May and sold it this month. I hated the keyboard and lack of ports. I thought I could get by with only one USB-C port but it really is a big inconvenience. The kicker though was the keyboard. I hated typing with it. The feel is terrible. The new MBPs looked like they had potential with the touch bar thing, but the lack of a USB-A port and SD card slot will make me use my current 13" MBP for the foreseeable future. I went to the Apple store last night and tried out the new MBPs. The keyboard is better than the 12" MacBook, but not by much. The keyboard is a big step back and towards the 12" MacBook from the MBPs, so unfortunately I won't be buying a new MBP any time soon. Disappointing since it will be at least 4 years before they might change this. The new MBP are thinner but so what, I'd rather have the USB-A port and an SD card slot, who cares about more USB-C ports? Not me. Apple has really disappointed me lately. Additionally, the iPhone 7 was meh and the loss of the headphone jack and weird feeling Home button has made me strongly consider the Google Pixel. For me to change from iOS to Android shows that Apple is really not in touch with their customers.

I used to buy Apple products without even trying them out first. Well, no more. I lost $400 selling my 12" MacBook. I will probably get a google pixel for the better camera and sell my iPhone 6. I will keep my MBP for at least 3 more years before changing. I'm really disappointed with Apple products lately.
I love typing on my rMB, and the USB-C is no biggie to me since I do most everything wirelessly and the little tiny bit I do as a regular transfer I simply use the adapter. But to each his own.

Side note: After I left the Apple Store, I stopped by the Microsoft store and looked at the $3000 Surface Studio. I saw a demo of Word and Photoshop. I was very impressed. I haven't been impressed my a Microsoft product since, hmmm, ever. The knob thing was a good idea and the screen is easy to move to different angles with a couple of fingers. There are also 4 USB-A 3.0 slots but no USB-C slots and an SD card slot. The RAM though is soldered and not user upgradeable according to the sales guy. Still, I was very impressed.
You might not be so impressed when you realize that not only can the memory not be upgraded, it starts at $3000 for the 8gb version, and is $4200 for the 32gb ram version. That's fairly pricey and I'm used to paying Apple prices! And it still runs Windows.
 
You might not be so impressed when you realize that not only can the memory not be upgraded, it starts at $3000 for the 8gb version, and is $4200 for the 32gb ram version. That's fairly pricey and I'm used to paying Apple prices! And it still runs Windows.

Don't make that comparison. it's a bad comparison. The Surface Studio comes with a 28" Fully capacitive touch, AND the real influence of the price, a fully functional, extremely high density and precise digitizer for active styluses.

Similar Displays alone from companies like Wacom are aroughly $2500. And none of them are at the resolution that Microsoft is running at. I'm pretty sure that Microsoft is taking a significant hit up front with this display.

I would have liked to see better hardware in the PC portion, thats for sure. But after doign a little research, I've discovered that the dev process for the surface Studio is almost a year old.

at $3000, for many people who NEED / WANT that display, it's a steal when you recognise to get similar functionality, you'll be spending thousands more if you tried to create your own computer, and then add such a display.
 
I've said it before: I think these are priced too highly and Apple is taking advantage of the pent up demand. They've done it before with the iMac retina. It feels disrespectful. But it seems we're willing to take the abuse. :/
Yeah, I'm actually really bummed out by this new line of MacBook Pros, specifically because the lack of magsafe. Touch Strip doesn't really do anything for me. I always like OSX for its speed and stability, however I'm having trouble seeing why I would get this over a Windows 10 laptop anymore.
 
I'm not the least bit surprised by it's success. Everyone who loves a cute little toy buys the 12" macbook. Those who don't think that's manly enough but still want a pretty little useless thing buy the "Pro" version so they can feel more professional. Those who prefer a machine they can use are left with their current machines.

Never underestimate the amount of people who are willing to pay any price for a new toy.
 
I've been a lot of (usually older) conference rooms where there's no power built into the conference room table, so wit gets run on cords behind us .. and with every single coffee break, there's a dozen people walking through between the table and the wall, navigating over said power cords.

And sure, while we can say that with a long life battery, we no longer need to be plugged in while at these all-day meetings, but that's not quite the case either, because after our business is concluded, odds are good that we're going right to the airport for a flight home and we want the laptop to be charged up because we may need to be using the laptop on the flight home. Aircraft power jacks aren't ubiquitous yet (especially when your employer only pays for Coach), and even when they are present, they don't necessarily work adequately to reliably retain the weight of a charger brick. Some are even low power such that you can't recharge while working.

I'm not saying there are not scenarios where it isn't nice. I'm saying they're not in the 90% zone. How many people are in this scenario: all day in a conference room followed by a plane flight with no charging time in between?

With that said, I don't know why (actually, I do know—it's because accessories = cash) Apple doesn't make some tiny adapter like they did with MagSafe 1 to 2 for MagSafe into a single USB-C end. The wattages are sufficient. I'm not so much annoyed about the lack of MagSafe as I am about the fact that I have a bunch of extra MagSafe chargers (one at the office, one on my old Cinema Display, etc.) that I can't use going forward. And lordy lord... the prices on the new chargers.

And since the connector is proprietary... no one else can step in. Yuck. I'd like to see someone take a better crack at a charging cable than Griffin's BreakSafe which is meh at best.

It is called a MacBook Pro for a reason. Launch Final Cut X, After Effects and Photoshop and start editing that video holding 10s of Audio Units and Filters for effects. The 2016 MPB will last you about 45 Minutes on Battery.

IF you get 10 hours of battery from the 2016 MBP then you are not using it for what the Pro moniker stands.

The 2016 MacBook Pro is a fine machine as it was 4 years ago. This whole battle of the new 2016 MBP is that it brings nothing new Pro to the table. And anyone using Xcode or Video apps etc etc will testify to the fact that the MacBooks PROS Battery in such a scenario is a non-viable option.

I've about had it with people telling me what "Pro" means. The "Pro" in the marketing means nothing because what a "pro" is and how a "pro" uses a computer has such variance it is meaningless. At this point I wish they'd drop the label entirely just to end the conversation. The "reason" it's called a "Pro" is because Apple has a marketing department. The needs of web professional web developer and a professional videographer are not even remotely the same.

I use my laptop professionally as a developer. I can probably get near the advertised battery life out of a given Apple laptop at any time. I happily used a MacBook Air for a few years. I've never noticed that Xcode was some monster on battery life.

I would argue that if you need the kind of horsepower that kills your battery in 45 minutes, you bought the wrong tool when you got a laptop. Unless you're carrying a generator with you, you'll need to be plugged in. There just aren't laptops out there where you can render video for hours on end with so I have no idea what you're even arguing.

You're either at a desk doing "pro" work with your extra monitors, keyboard, drives, etc. where battery life does not matter because you're plugged in, or you're on the go. The main power of laptop for "pros" that I have seen has less to do with portability in terms of using it off site and more to do with having a workstation to carry between a home office and an actual office. Then again, a security pro I work with (and make no mistake, he's a pro) rocks an rMBP. He also has an iMac for heavy lifting—which is probably the most ideal solution for a lot of "Pro" setups. A mobile device is ALWAYS going to compromise something for the sake of power efficiency and portability.

For me, someone who just doesn't not super duper raw power, this generation is a perfect professional notebook. Thunderbolt 3 is going to do more to mitigate the compromises made by mobile units (e.g. external high capacity SSDs and eGPUs), which is great when moving to a dedicated workstation.

And as always, if it isn't "Pro" enough for you, actual professionals tend to buy the right tools for the right job. There's a word for people who don't: amateurs.
 
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I'm not saying there are not scenarios where it isn't nice. I'm saying they're not in the 90% zone. How many people are in this scenario: all day in a conference room followed by a plane flight with no charging time in between?

True, it isn't necessarily a common use case, but the problem that we have in trying to de-emphasize it is that every Professional is slightly different. For example, I'm taking a daytime flight tomorrow, whereas my boss's flight schedule preference is to have the whole day off at home and then jump on an overnight Redeye because he's able to sleep anywhere.

With that said, I don't know why (actually, I do know—it's because accessories = cash) Apple doesn't make some tiny adapter like they did with MagSafe 1 to 2 for MagSafe into a single USB-C end. The wattages are sufficient. I'm not so much annoyed about the lack of MagSafe as I am about the fact that I have a bunch of extra MagSafe chargers (one at the office, one on my old Cinema Display, etc.) that I can't use going forward. And lordy lord... the prices on the new chargers.

And since the connector is proprietary... no one else can step in. Yuck. I'd like to see someone take a better crack at a charging cable than Griffin's BreakSafe which is meh at best.

Agreed, this proprietary everything has got to go. I've been hoping that the EU puts its foot down not unlike what they did a few years ago with cellphone chargers...but even there, Apple's solution was to provide an adaptor in the box to be pedantically compliant.

I've about had it with people telling me what "Pro" means. The "Pro" in the marketing means nothing because what a "pro" is and how a "pro" uses a computer has such variance it is meaningless. At this point I wish they'd drop the label entirely just to end the conversation. The "reason" it's called a "Pro" is because Apple has a marketing department. The needs of web professional web developer and a professional videographer are not even remotely the same.

Agreed, which is also why if Apple really wants to grow their base, they need to think about offering a broader variety of products instead of just a tiny handful.

I would argue that if you need the kind of horsepower that kills your battery in 45 minutes, you bought the wrong tool when you got a laptop. Unless you're carrying a generator with you, you'll need to be plugged in. There just aren't laptops out there where you can render video for hours on end with so I have no idea what you're even arguing.

Oh, I'm personally not disagreeing - - I'm totally in agreement with you on the "wrong product for you" type of discussion point. This simply circles back to the problem I just mentioned which is a woefully inadequate product variety mix: the angst is because Apple doesn't bother to offer the alternative "Super Pro" MacBook for these sorts of power users to consider.

You're either at a desk doing "pro" work with your extra monitors, keyboard, drives, etc. where battery life does not matter because you're plugged in, or you're on the go. The main power of laptop for "pros" that I have seen has less to do with portability in terms of using it off site and more to do with having a workstation to carry between a home office and an actual office...

An observation: a facilitating of ease-of-portability between sites is merely another type of requirement. I have a colleague who's a heavy-duty modeler and he uses one of those behemoth Windows luggables.

And as always, if it isn't "Pro" enough for you, actual professionals tend to buy the right tools for the right job. There's a word for people who don't: amateurs.

One can only buy the tools which exist. That's been a lot of the angst on the desktop after the debut of the Trash Can Mac Pro: it was a (at the time) great hardware solution for one very narrow type of Pro customer, but it sucked for the rest.

With the classical tower "cheese grater" killed, their choice is to seek out incremental upgrades to keep their old MP's running (well enough) while they hope that Apple realizes their mistake and corrects these deficiencies in a future post-Trashcan Mac Pro, or to transition off the OS X platform, typically either to Linux or Windows.

From there, each time that any Mac comes out, there's a pragmatic assessment that gets done which essentially asks "Well, could this set of hardware possibly replace my 2012 Mac Pro?" ... and for many of them, the answer has consistently been "no".

Case in point, one of the datasets I'm currently working with today is 1.41TB in size. Sure, one can say that pedantically a 15" MBP with the +$1200 2TB SSD upgrade will at least allow the data to be loaded, but with only 0.6TB remaining in balance for the (a) OS, (b) Applications, (c) Scratch, and (d) OS X's hidden recovery partition ... its probably not enough. Sure, would prefer to have a new desktop instead, but the trashcan's also 3 years old and to make it even equivalent in capability to a cMP would require a pair of Promise RAID's, which means it will cost $7500 per desktop that's to be replaced ... or $2K more per node than simply throwing in the towel and moving these workflows over to Microsoft. OS X is good, but it simply isn't an extra $2,000 per Machine worth of goodness.
 
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Hate to break it to ya, but I think the sheep may be the ones who are continuing to whine about it, not the ones who are buying it.

People that buy Apple products might companion about the price. But they do NOT call themselves sheep. that term is used by people that are NOT customs, in order to insult those that are. But then, one has to question the motivation of people that hang out in an Apple forum, if they don't even use the products.
[doublepost=1478916766][/doublepost]
Ummm, & they would've set world records if they were given away for free.
And???

I'm pretty sure that if they gave them away for free, they could not set any sales records. Unless you have a different definition of sale than i do. :D
 
Yeah, I'm actually really bummed out by this new line of MacBook Pros, specifically because the lack of magsafe. Touch Strip doesn't really do anything for me. I always like OSX for its speed and stability, however I'm having trouble seeing why I would get this over a Windows 10 laptop anymore.

I will admit that some of the responses to my original post have made me think. There are several features about the new Mac that justify a price bump (touch bar, larger trackpad, smaller chassis, more responsive keyboard, etc), though I still feel the price is too high. The reason? Apple's star is no longer at zenith. It has worthy competition at last.
 
I've kept saying this on these Macbook Pro articles (as you can see from my previous comments) and I'll say it again, this forum is greatly out of touch with the general public!
Fandroids on this forum keep predicting everything will flop and Apple is dying yet they're wrong every time.

Wrong about the Macbook, wrong about iPhone 7 and now wrong about the Macbook Pro!

So much for the MBP being "an epic fail"! :D
This.

While people are here complaining, other people are out there actually buying the MacBook Pro and (presumably) will go on to use them to great effect.

Tell me again which crowd Apple should be catering to? The whiners, or the people who will actually buy these things?
 
Don't make that comparison. it's a bad comparison. The Surface Studio comes with a 28" Fully capacitive touch, AND the real influence of the price, a fully functional, extremely high density and precise digitizer for active styluses.

Similar Displays alone from companies like Wacom are aroughly $2500. And none of them are at the resolution that Microsoft is running at. I'm pretty sure that Microsoft is taking a significant hit up front with this display.

I would have liked to see better hardware in the PC portion, thats for sure. But after doign a little research, I've discovered that the dev process for the surface Studio is almost a year old.

at $3000, for many people who NEED / WANT that display, it's a steal when you recognise to get similar functionality, you'll be spending thousands more if you tried to create your own computer, and then add such a display.
Of course, I'm sure you must be son much more on top of this than anyone else. I'll defer to your amazing brilliance. /sarcasm
(and just like what you posted, if you believed that load, I have a bridge to sell ya.)
 
Of course, I'm sure you must be son much more on top of this than anyone else. I'll defer to your amazing brilliance. /sarcasm
(and just like what you posted, if you believed that load, I have a bridge to sell ya.)

you can find the pricing of similar displays here

The biggest name is Wacom, with their Cintique lineup. These's displays do not have built in computers, and are lower resolutions.

So their 27" model, with a resolution of only 2k. 16:9 (instead of Microsoft's more paperlike 3:2), is $2800

https://us-store.wacom.com/Catalog/pen-displays/Cintiq-27QHD-S01#undefined2

Microsoft has included newer versions of this technology in the Surface Studio, AND then included a computer base.

SO unlike you, I researched what I was going to comment before. I too went "3,000?!!!?!?" when I saw the surface studio, and figured What it would cost to build my own, similar device.

And when I got to the prices of the display, if sold alone with that technology I was actually quite amazed. These things are NOT cheap.

Thats' why the Surface Studio is so expensive. Which makes it a terrible comparison to APple's MacBook pro. Many of us will not find value in all that, and thats not who the Studio is aimed at. It's aimed at the creative professionals who want that technology. Givin that, Someone who wants a large touch based ALl-in-One, are going to actually spend less in the long run, than if they tried purchasing the individual components seperately.

But Thank you for your sarcasm. It really showed who decided to come to the table with ignorance.
 
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