New macbook pros finally made me switch away from mac laptops.

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by fabifabi, Nov 1, 2016.

  1. fabifabi macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    #1
    First time poster, long time reader.

    So, like many I was utterly disappointed by the new Macbooks. My 2012 Macbook Air died a month ago, seemed like good timing. Sadly, as many know, the new ones are ridiculously over priced and use old components. I was angry for a while, but I thought I'd share a constructive solution.

    If you are not an iOS developer (see below) the solution is quite simple. Vote with your wallet.

    This is coming form a long term Apple user. Even I got fed up. My first mac was a Titanium Powerbook, then a 12" iBook, the very first iPod (with many different models later on), an 17" iMac, the aluminum macbook, a 21" iMac, and finally a 11" inch Macbook Air and a 27" Imac. I even recommended the hardware to others. I did my part ;). But enough is enough. Vote with your wallet.

    There are plenty of laptops from other manufactures which are good and portable. The Dell XPS 13 is an example (small footprint, light, has normal USB ports, 1 Thunderbolt 3 port, SD-card reader etc and up to date internals for a better price). I am personally not a big fan of the tiny bezels, I think they overdo it. Some protection from the background distraction around the screen is beneficial. My personal choice is the new Razor Blade Stealth, a 12.5" ultrabook, with the option to connect an external GPU. Very light, same build quality (all aluminum) as macbooks, and a good price (starting at 999) with Kaby Lake and 16GB of RAM by default. That's the config I would have expected in the Macbook Pro, with or without that gimmicky touchbar.

    As far as the OS is concerned, I get the windows hate. I really do. Though windows ten is a big improvement. But Ubuntu has come a loooong way and is very user friendly. If you are the typical mac user that wants things to work with no frills, let me tell you: You can do it! :) And if something did arise, you will become a little more computer literate in the process. Email, web browsing (chrome or firefox), youtube, facebook, twitter, messaging, music, and video (latter with VLC for example), unity, scientific computing (matlab, R, sci-python etc,), coding (eclipse, sublime), vecotrgraphics (inkscape), distraction free wring (focuswriter), libre office, all work flawlessly on ubuntu. If you need MS office you can either boot into windows or try running it with wine under linux. Gimp for basic image editing, the list goes on.

    I you need video editing or the adobe suite, you can boot into windows.

    Personally I can live with that gimmicky touch bar, and I never used siri, which the only two features you would truly give up. But if you have to have the Apple logo to show of at the coffee shop, I cannot help you.

    As far as eco-system lock-in is concerned, I feel like this is highly overrated. I cannot remember when was the last time I had to connect and sync my iPhone. I use iCloud for notes, contacts and calendars. Notes could be replaced by onenote or evernote. But keeping them on the phone exclusively for now is also an option. Contacts can be exported on the mac (as vcards) and imported in linux.

    The only reason not to switch is as a developer of iOS apps who wants to work on a laptop. You are screwed, I guess. Either continue to use older hardware (it runs x-code just fine after all) or buy overpriced smaller laptops with the same outdated internals. Sorry developers. A big FU from Apple.

    Now to some brief analysis. Why is this happening?
    Just a few ideas. These new computers, the port dropping etc, is not designing for price, or designing for experience. It is plain old designing for share-holder value. This all a symptom that Apple may have reached the limits of growth. Phone growth stagnating, iPad demand falling, mac demand falling, watch demand ???. No TV deal coming through, car project "resized". Where can future profits and growth come from? Easy: A drop as many features (e.g. ports, thus cutting cost), use old (read: cheap) components, up the price, sell adapters, and hope that people will still buy it.

    Adapters are an intergresting example. I used to work with PCs for a while, and the biggest profit margin we had was always on cables and adapters. Think, it's basically rubber (or white shiny plastic), a bit of wires and maybe a small board, produced in bulk in China at a cost of pennies a piece and sold for 30-50$. That is a healthy profit, or, oif you look at it differently, a great way to f*** over customers. To be clear, I am not saying Apple's strategy is to replace profit from Macs with profit from adapters, but is a part of the strategy.


    So that is it. I made up my mind, I am going with Ubuntu on the razor blade stealth. The hardware looks awesome and is up to date at a good price. I am not saying I am never going back to Apple laptops, but for now, I'll pass.


    What do you guys think?
     
  2. Willo34 macrumors regular

    Willo34

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2015
    Location:
    Netherlands
    #2
    I wont be buying any new Mac, thats for sure. Taking the piss now i'd say.
     
  3. mbp17xxx macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2011
    #3
    I've switched to PC a year++ ago, I don't like windows but mbp prices are going up way faster than my salary :(
     
  4. Macalway macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
  5. CreativeC macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2016
    #5
    My only problem with linux currently is it's **** support of Skylake. Just search around :(.
     
  6. jackoatmon macrumors 6502a

    jackoatmon

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    #6
    Funny, this is the computer that's making me switch to laptop, after a lifetime of desktop machines!

    It's literally the perfect laptop computer. Capable of everything a pro could want to do on a desktop, in a laptop form factor. So pumped to get it!
     
  7. robertcoogan macrumors 6502

    robertcoogan

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2008
    Location:
    Joshua Tree, California
    #7
    If anyone can figure out how to turn a Razer Blade Pro into a hackintosh, I would be extremely grateful. Such a superior laptop, too bad it runs Windoze.

    :p
     
  8. Kudos6612 Suspended

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2016
    #8
    yeah the razor blade is a sweet laptop,too bad it's battery life is 1.5 hours if I play a game on it. But you guys would seem to be a lot happier if you had gotten one of those laptops.
    That and trackpad is just okay.
     
  9. meldea macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2014
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois, USA
    #9
    I think this reads an awful lot like astroturfing.
     
  10. Mathias Denichi macrumors 6502

    Mathias Denichi

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2013
    #10
    It's really a shame. I currently have the m7 rMB I bought the in waiting for the new release.

    For me, the internals ( ddr3 ram, skylake processors) keeps me waiting for a refresh or moving to the surface line, and isn't worth the value apple has put on it.

    I've skirted along the two brands buying the pro 3 the 4 and the book but returned them to hold out for the MacBook Pro redesign.

    I don't like having to bring an iPad Pro and a MacBook to do my work. And the only things keeping me on mac is iMessage, sound quality and Xcode.I want an option to use a touch screen for photoshop masking, illustrator or note taking etc.
     
  11. fabifabi thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    #11
    True, battery life while playing 3D intensive games is short. It's an ultrabook, duh ;-). It' similar on a macbook (pro). The kaby lake razor stealth actually has estimated battery life of 7.5-8 hours for productivity, some streaming etc. That's a little bit less than macbook pros, but still more than enough. But let's not get hung up on my personal choice of hardware. There are plenty of decent options. Every company is trying to turn a profit, that is legitimate, but there is a point where one feels taken for a fool. Apple has reached that point.

    As far as windows is concerned, Isympathize, but I re-iterate. Windows 10 is not too bad and Ubuntu is awesome.
     
  12. StianSylta macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Location:
    Norway.
    #12
    You underestimate why so many of us buy pro-segment macs. Creative professionals prefer the stability of mac OS for the same reasons as always. In my line of work, people hold on to 8 year old Mac Pro's with 4 year old versions of Mac Os because it works, runs their costly TDm systems, and will do the task they were bought for for years. Going to linux is rubbish for creative. If you can do all your work in linux you never really needed a mac.

    I appreciate the reactions to price, and the feeling that the tech isn't new enough. But there is no newer chip available that beats the Cpu in the fastest BTO Model 15". What it the point of newer baby lake or skyline chips if the i7's from 2015 are still the fastest. Do you want new or do you want best available?

    The most expensive 15" looks killer, but not worth it if you have the previous model. But coming from 2014 or older, it is a good upgrade, and no windows laptop will beat you in anything except gaming performance. If you only want gaming performance, you TRULY never needed a mac.
     
  13. fabifabi thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    #13

    Lots of point here, quick replies.

    As far as Creative professionals are concerned, I wouldn't know, since I do mostly scientific computing. I grant that Linux might not be an option for Creative professionals. However, Creative professionals are not the majority. The vast majority is not in the situation where they need to keep a mac pro around or have one in the first place.

    The top of the line MBP, yes, has a killer price as well. Optimized for share-holder value.

    Why was I on mac OS in the first place? Because of the good build quality of hardware, because it's a good operating system. Years ago Linux was less mature. I always liked both Linux and MacOS. Just because I don't strictly need to be on MacOS anymore doesn't mean it's not legitimate to use it (Number of mac users >>>> number of Creative professionals). My two cents.The vast majority of people doesn't really need a mac but still likes to use them. And it's legit. Just like the cost/value consideration I made is legit.
     
  14. aced411 macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2007
    #14
    I've been wanting to get back to Windows for awhile but the hardware quality of Apple was just so damn good. I was honestly pretty shocked they chose to completely do away with USB-A and use that shallow keyboard on the Pro model. I respect that some people like the new MBP. I am sure it's rock solid and runs like a champ, it just doesn't fit my needs. I'm waiting on a new X1 Thinkpad Yoga with OLED display to ship. If it's not as awesome as I think it will be I'll return it and get an XPS. Either way there are plenty of worthy alternatives these days if you are comfortable working in Windows or Linux. If you strongly prefer MacOS then stock up on adapters and soldier on :)
     
  15. Platinumjsi macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2014
    #15
    Just as a note, the Kaby Lake chips that the MBP would take have not been released by Intel yet so thats why the new machines have Skylake, only the low voltage chips are out so far.
     
  16. Mathias Denichi macrumors 6502

    Mathias Denichi

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2013
    #16
    That's fine, but the price they are charging for sky lake is not proportioned correctly. I think this wouldn't have been an issue if apple took a slight hit and released it at the same price as the previous gen.

    Instead, apple made its consumers take the hit is and charging the customers their r and d fee.
     
  17. zhenya macrumors 603

    zhenya

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2005
    #17
    The only thing that has really changed here is that the Windows PC makers are no longer making 99% junk. There are a lot more options out there that aren't terrible now. But Apple continues to do what fundamentally defines Apple. Making top of the line computers that are aggressively forward-thinking.

    I use PC's for work and Macs at home. I've been through a number of the best PC's of the last several years. They are certainly a lot better than they used to be. Long-term the user experience begins to fall apart a bit though. Real-world battery life is typically about 60% of what's advertised or that that can be achieved in a controlled test.

    Windows laptops still do not sleep reliably in their lowest power state, so it is not uncommon to put your device to sleep to wake it the next morning with 40% (or more) of your battery gone. In practice this means you charge them a lot more frequently than a Mac with 'similar' battery life.

    Windows updates still often end up hosing some process that causes new issues like this - or - and this seems to happen several times a year in Win 10 - causes a process to just use 30-40% CPU power endlessly until the next update. That takes a huge chunk from your battery life.

    Apple also has first-class control of their battery lifespan. It is common to get 1000+ cycles with 80% or better battery health. I don't think I've ever seen a Windows laptop make it past several hundred cycles usually with much more wear than that. I've seen many top of the line machines wear out their battery in less than 200 cycles.

    I'll be interested to see what you have to say 6 months or a year from now.
     
  18. huckg macrumors member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2016
    #18
    I haven't been in the scene for over a year but developing iOS apps on Windows is becoming easier every day. Microsoft bought Xamarin early this year which is a framework for developing native iOS and Android apps on windows.
     
  19. /V\acpower macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2007
    #19
    Last year I've changed my computer setup.

    It used to be a big 27' iMac powerful enough for games, work (teacher so mostly office apps) andeverything else. (and an iPad Air for presentations, notes in class and general mobility)

    I built myself a desktop gaming pc that cost me about half the price of my current iMac (not 5k) while being way more powerful for games. Second phase of the plan was to sell the iMac and buy a Macbook pro at the refresh.

    I sold my iMac this summer and been functionning only on Windows for all my need.

    And God, do I hate Windows.

    I used to think like most fols that "Windows 10 is closing the gap". No, just no. It look way cleaner on first look, but when you use it you realize that they just moved everything under the bed. The room does look clean, but when you actually are looking for something it's a big mess.

    Plus, two weeks ago, automatic Windows update at night. Last morning, the computer crash everytime I boot into the OS. After hours of lookings for solution, had to do a full format.

    Then there are all the little features that just work on the Mac that don't really do when you need them. Like File History. In theory the Windows version of Time Machine. You configure it, then it work for a while, but when you need it, seems that it didn't really do backup of your file. I have no idea why, but it simply never worked properly.

    Also had a bug that prevented me to delete some files in batch. Never found why, just had to delete one by one.

    I have a french canadian keyboard, but for some reasons sometimes it just switch to english. Have to change it back.

    My 13' MacBook Pro (no bar) is supposed to be at my door tomorrow, and I can't wait.

    I admit that I had to pay more than I expected to pay (however I usually resell my old macs whe I need a new one, they clearly keep more value than their PC equivalent), but I just don,t want to live in Windows just to save 400$ (CAD) every 2~3 years.
     
  20. Macalway macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2013
    #20
    I'm just a little worried about the touch bar. So broadly unproven in the field. God only knows how that will pan out, and it seems we are paying a bit for it. Everything else sort of looks like a refresh (after 4 years).

    touchbar = lipstick on a pig?
     
  21. Branskins macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2008
    #21
    I haven't read one negative take from those that tried it at the event. Most seemed genuinely excited for it
     
  22. aevan macrumors 68000

    aevan

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2015
    Location:
    Serbia
    #22
    You know it's gimmicky? Why, that means you must've used it! You must have - otherwise, how would you know it was a gimmick? So, you got it early, before anyone else!! Wow, man, how'd you pull that off?
     
  23. dumastudetto macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2013
    #23
    Well said. I think we all have a responsibility to at least try the touchbar and see how it works for us. MBP's are not so expensive that they are completely unaffordable. Before writing this thing off, people need to buy a new MacBook Pro and try using it for a couple of weeks.
     
  24. Queen6 macrumors 603

    Queen6

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2008
    Location:
    Enjoying Better Things
    #24
    Update of my 13" rMBP is resolved, now replaced by Microsoft`s Surface Book, bring added functionality & utility. For my 15" rMBP I will revisit Apple in 2017, in the interim I will continue to utilise my existing Mac`s and or a desktop solutions.

    I am certain for many the 2016 MBP will a good fit, personally I never thought that I would opt for a Windows system as my primary portable, let alone one produced by Microsoft, I find it all most ironic. Bottom line my is hardware used in a professional environment therefore I choose the best tools for the job...

    Q-6
     
  25. QCassidy352 macrumors G3

    QCassidy352

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2003
    Location:
    Bay Area
    #25
    As long as my current Mac keeps working, I'll keep using it. Should it die tomorrow, I don't know if there's a Mac I could see myself buying at current prices.

    I just hope Apple has a more enticing lineup when I next have to make a buying decision.
     

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