Fabifabi: I wonder why are you wasting your precious time, preaching on your private decision in mac users forum. You supposed to write welcome post at Linux/windows forums now.
Just my 2 cents
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New macbook pros finally made me switch away from mac laptops.
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Fabifabi: I wonder why are you wasting your precious time, preaching on your private decision in mac users forum. You supposed to write welcome post at Linux/windows forums now.
Just my 2 cents
Great reasoning there and good luck with your new computer. Don't feel too bad about switching. I am a huge Apple fan, and I, for one, really love the new MacBook Pros (won't lie to you, I think they are the best choice atm), but if a day comes that I think something else is better for my job, I will use it without hesitation. In the end, it's what we do with the tools provided that counts. BTW, if I had to switch to Windows, Surface Book would most likely be my first choice.
They made exactly what was expected and exactly what I want from a laptop, couldn't care less about the nonsense spouted on here it's just making me laugh and laugh.
Except, you know, having even the minimum amount of Ram needed to do pro work. 16gb just isn't enough to justify a purchase, let alone justify the insane price tag of this first gen nrmbp.
Well, first of all I am still a mac user (on my iMac) and I just thought I'd discuss my idea with fellow mac users. I do hope there will be viable mac laptops again sometime. It is quite obvious that a lot of people are unhappy with the update (high prices and old components) and other might be looking for alternatives too.
I don't get the religious attitude of some people, which basically translates to "shut up or be gone if you don't have anything nice to say". These are the people that give apple users a bad name.
Chill, no one is forced to read or post in this thread.
As for the some of the trolls in this thread: let's not feed the trolls
I keep seeing this, but I have to ask - what old components? Kaby Lake used in Macs still isn't out (Microsoft also updated the Surface Book but no one is complaining that has a Skylake - and of course it has, because there's nothing better at the moment). Also, the GPUs are brand new. I'm really asking - what components are old?
The skylake chip they used is a year old, not the one just released a few months ago, and by extension the GPU isn't the latest one that most people expected either (due to the chosen CPU). Using this CPU threw everyone off because all year long we kept hearing that Apple was waiting for the new CPU/GPU. Turns out that wasn't the case. (So wtf why didn't they release this model last year?) Plus the Ram maxes out at the same limit as 5!! Years ago.
This is so true! Although I will say that with the surfacebook this has been reversed, with the first 6 months as terrible and the new Intel drivers finally allowing the machine to run smooth now.
Its a nice laptop minus the trackpad.
I wanted the Surface Book but 16GB of ram was out of my price range
This reminds me of HGTV. "I want a beach front home that is immaculately remodeled" and I want it for pennies on the dollar. LOL. There is a reason cheap things are cheap, otherwise they would be expensive
My recs to you are look at refurbs/used. You can probably get a great deal on a used surfacebook right now.
The classic Mac Pro is in many ways better than the new Mac Pro, which is why so many still use it to this day. It's an extremely powerful and ever expansive machine, unlike the new one which is pretty well locked down to what you get... all expansion must occur outside the can. The new one hasn't been updated once since release in 2013 and the Apple page for it still shows [discontinued] Aperture benchmarks. Tragic.
They're still using 4 year old versions of OSX because Apple isn't making things better with new releases, really. It seems like with every release, compatibility with stuff can be compromised and performance takes a needless hit.
The funny thing is though that the most recent versions of Windows and Linux still run on machines that are really old, whereas OSX/MacOS need newer machines. For example, a 2007-2008 era MacBook can't run Sierra but it can run Windows 10.
I don't really think that choosing Mac/Windows makes a huge difference beyond what software suites and possibly hardware peripherals you use. Linux, while great in many ways, is certainly ill-suited for many things such as the creative sphere.
It's called planned obsolescence. While Apple might want to make you believe e.g they support iPhones 3-5 years, everybody can attest to the fact that as soon as the new one is released, if you install the new iOS version on the older model they become unusable bricks.
The same goes for their OS.
What is this task you're doing that requires more than 16GB RAM and 4GB of vRAM?
I'm legitimately curious, because I'll run multilayered 4K video editing with both effects adjustments and motion graphics overlays, while running Photoshop/Illustrator in the background, and capping out at around 13-14GB of RAM use.
I mean, I can imagine a scenario where you would have to shut FCPX down to do complex AfterEffects compositions. But other than that... what "pro work" needs that much RAM? Serious question!
And let me be clear: I know that Hollywood level 3D animations and full-resolution RED footage might require more RAM, but for goodness sake you don't do that stuff on a laptop! Any job that's big enough to shoot on RED is big enough to tack a brand new top-spec iMac onto the budget without batting an eyelash. Cheaper than a single lunch meeting for the production team!
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Surface Book trackpad is very close to all my modern Mac`s, not 100% the same, equally a good 95%, admittedly it`s a small differentiator, however the Surface Book brings a lot more to my workflow that Apple has no intention of even exploring, or exploiting...
Q-6
Do not understand it. I have the Mid 2015 15" RMBP maxed out...it is identical to the new macbook when it comes to performance. What makes you say that the new version is the first notebook that you want to get as a desktop replacement?
That's why the updates are permanent. No choice but a new device at that point, really.
The nice thing about Windows/Linux is that not only is it supported on older systems, but it runs really well. My 2010 17" MBP is so-so on El Capitan (would likely be dreadful on Sierra), but Windows and Linux run exceptionally well on it and will for several more years.
Disagree the same goes for MacOS. I'm on a 2008 unibody macbook running el capitan. Runs better than it ever has and should be supported for the next 2 years with security updates. At that point I will have gotten 10 years of use out of it. Not bad imo.
This is very industry specific, but that Radeon R9 M370X (the top spec in 2015) is not too hot TBH (well it's quite a bit physically hotter, hur hurr). Most people I suppose don't need the AMD460 pro, but it is about twice as powerful. The rest of the 2015 is fantastic, obviously. But Mac's mobile GPUs being good enough to do serious video work is a brand new thing as of, well, 3 weeks from now.
I mean, it's personal, and subjective. But I'm hoping this new machine will finally be the answer to avoid having two computers.
No ill will towards threadstarter on my part intended.
I just don't understand all the obsolete- talk. The 2015 was obsolete and the 2016 is obsolete. That's the claim at least.
I don´t agree and I reference creative folks because they do the most taxing work among mac users.
The fact of the matter is that there is NO current Dell or ASUS laptop that can best a 2014 rMBP 15".
The gaming rigs like razor and ROG run games great but they don´t run any audio or video software CLOSE to how well FCPX runs on the 2014 models.
When a new product comes and puts the current product to shame, thrashing it performance wise, THAT's when you can talk about obsolence. My examples from Pro Audio illustrate that. And there are MANY laptops with newer chips around, but the CPU's are underpowered garbage, almost always the 6700U or less.
Lacking 32gigs of ram is a fair point, but if you want that there are the IBM/Lenovo/Thinkpad monster machines that look like ****, don't run macOS, have 3hour battery life AND use CPUs and GPUs that match or even beat the rMBP.
But if you want a machine with decent battery and performance for running pro-segment apps then you can't really find anything that beats the rMBP. Newer does not mean better.
I agree that people can bash macs as much as they want on these forums, but then you should complain about something real like the price increase or the weirdness of the trackpad size etc. The Surface book and the XPS can not do ANYTHING other than games better than the rMBP, so obsolete it is not.
I just don't understand all the obsolete- talk. The 2015 was obsolete and the 2016 is obsolete. That's the claim at least.
I don´t agree and I reference creative folks because they do the most taxing work among mac users.
The fact of the matter is that there is NO current Dell or ASUS laptop that can best a 2014 rMBP 15".
The gaming rigs like razor and ROG run games great but they don´t run any audio or video software CLOSE to how well FCPX runs on the 2014 models.
When a new product comes and puts the current product to shame, thrashing it performance wise, THAT's when you can talk about obsolence. My examples from Pro Audio illustrate that. And there are MANY laptops with newer chips around, but the CPU's are underpowered garbage, almost always the 6700U or less.
Lacking 32gigs of ram is a fair point, but if you want that there are the IBM/Lenovo/Thinkpad monster machines that look like ****, don't run macOS, have 3hour battery life AND use CPUs and GPUs that match or even beat the rMBP.
But if you want a machine with decent battery and performance for running pro-segment apps then you can't really find anything that beats the rMBP. Newer does not mean better.
I agree that people can bash macs as much as they want on these forums, but then you should complain about something real like the price increase or the weirdness of the trackpad size etc. The Surface book and the XPS can not do ANYTHING other than games better than the rMBP, so obsolete it is not.
The "CPU part" (everything else in the chip that is not graphics) is identical (6700HQ launched in q3 '15 and 6770HQ launched in q1 '16 have exact same specs other than the integrated GPU) while the GPU is different. The "CPU part" is the newest there is on the market. The only thing better will be Kaby Lake, and that is not yet out.
As Apple decided to have Radeons in all 15" configurations, the Iris Pro GPU was probably not needed. In fact, the Iris Pro draws more power than the HD 530, so this is actually a better choice: lower power drain for low level tasks that don't require a GPU, and same performance whenever the Radeon gets activated.
As for 13" models, they never had Iris Pro chips anyway, so - this Skylake is CURRENT, not OLD.
And you all assumed they waited on Intel - we don't know that. I'm certain they launched it as soon as they could - with the latest CPUs in the class they wanted. They didn't want Iris Pro for 13" and didn't need it for the 15".
It's really, really wrong to call these "old" components. Again, this is the current CPU generation. Saying they are "old" is not knowing the facts.
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Thank you for the real clarification. I had suspected this, just didn't have enough time to do the actual research.
I did some digging around this and it's very interesting how Mac actually handles this. I'm going to assume you know the diff between sleep and hibernate. But basically the diff is when a Mac goes to sleep, in the background it dumps memory and hardware state to the drive (hibernate) right away. When you open the lid, it awakes and just deletes the dump. However, if it does not wake up within an x amount of time, it just kills the power since it already has the entire sleep state on the drive. Pretty damn awesome design IMO.
You still need an iOS device to develop for iOS. There is no iOS emulator for windows.
That's good to hear. I'm trying to find a good on-site review (meaning someone who saw it during the keynote).
LOL. I meant just the emulator. If you've ever developed against a live device, it kind of sucks. Deployment takes too long. It's much easier to just run, test, compile, run test, compile run test, etc.
But that would be funny.
I read some reviews of current PC alternatives aspiring to be Mac replacement in times of crisis (HP EliteBook Folio). Some facts from review (http://www.theverge.com/2016/9/28/13088062/hp-elitebook-folio-g1-review):
Windows "experience":
"Windows 10 itself runs well on the EliteBook Folio, but I’ve experienced a variety of software issues related to HP’s own doing. HP has loaded up the Folio with a bunch of irritating built-in apps that generate notifications. You’ll get prompts for the trackpad and security apps, and if you alt-tab there’s a persistent blank keyboard app just sitting there ruining your ability to switch apps quickly. HP is ruining the Windows experience with this junk, and they’d do well to follow Dell’s example of keeping built-in apps and notifications to a bare minimum. I’ve also had a number of audio issues on the Folio where Windows 10 stops detecting that there’s speakers and refuses to play music. Sometimes a reboot solves this, sometimes it doesn’t, and it’s a frustrating experience on a premium laptop that’s coupled with Bang & Olufsen speakers. Even as I type this review right now, Windows refuses to play audio."
Dongles - NOT a problem?:
"HP, like Apple, has opted for USB Type-C on the Folio, but thankfully HP has provided two ports instead of a single one. It makes it easy to charge and use accessories at the same time, but you’ll still need adapters for even the most basic tasks like charging your phone from the Folio. I was reminded of this when I traveled with the Folio and needed to charge my iPhone, or when a colleague handed me a USB key and I couldn’t do anything with it. You’ll need to carry adapters with you for existing USB peripherals, and it’s a necessary pain until the world switches over the USB Type-C. The only other port is the headphone jack, and thankfully HP hasn’t pushed to eradicate that just yet."
Battery life - joke:
"The 4K version taxes the battery as much as the processor — stamina was nothing short of terrible. I managed around three hours on average, and it meant I was charging up the laptop a lot more than I was expecting to. The 1080p version, on the other hand, managed to survive for nearly five hours on average"
Blind chase after specs - putting 4K display into ultraportable - on paper looks soooo competitive:
"HP’s 1080p version of the Folio feels a lot less laggy. I still had the occasional hiccup during daily use even with the M7, but it was able to handle multiple apps a lot better. It’s clear the 4K panel is just too much for the Core M processors to handle, and it’s left me scratching my head wondering why HP felt it was a necessary addition."
Pricing for this engineering marvel - you must be kidding me:
"Starting at $999 and going all the way up to $1,799, it’s every bit a 12-inch MacBook running Windows 10, but HP has actually improved a few things compared to Apple’s take."
"HP’s EliteBook Folio is designed for and sold to businesses" -
Windows "experience":
"Windows 10 itself runs well on the EliteBook Folio, but I’ve experienced a variety of software issues related to HP’s own doing. HP has loaded up the Folio with a bunch of irritating built-in apps that generate notifications. You’ll get prompts for the trackpad and security apps, and if you alt-tab there’s a persistent blank keyboard app just sitting there ruining your ability to switch apps quickly. HP is ruining the Windows experience with this junk, and they’d do well to follow Dell’s example of keeping built-in apps and notifications to a bare minimum. I’ve also had a number of audio issues on the Folio where Windows 10 stops detecting that there’s speakers and refuses to play music. Sometimes a reboot solves this, sometimes it doesn’t, and it’s a frustrating experience on a premium laptop that’s coupled with Bang & Olufsen speakers. Even as I type this review right now, Windows refuses to play audio."
Dongles - NOT a problem?:
"HP, like Apple, has opted for USB Type-C on the Folio, but thankfully HP has provided two ports instead of a single one. It makes it easy to charge and use accessories at the same time, but you’ll still need adapters for even the most basic tasks like charging your phone from the Folio. I was reminded of this when I traveled with the Folio and needed to charge my iPhone, or when a colleague handed me a USB key and I couldn’t do anything with it. You’ll need to carry adapters with you for existing USB peripherals, and it’s a necessary pain until the world switches over the USB Type-C. The only other port is the headphone jack, and thankfully HP hasn’t pushed to eradicate that just yet."
Battery life - joke:
"The 4K version taxes the battery as much as the processor — stamina was nothing short of terrible. I managed around three hours on average, and it meant I was charging up the laptop a lot more than I was expecting to. The 1080p version, on the other hand, managed to survive for nearly five hours on average"
Blind chase after specs - putting 4K display into ultraportable - on paper looks soooo competitive:
"HP’s 1080p version of the Folio feels a lot less laggy. I still had the occasional hiccup during daily use even with the M7, but it was able to handle multiple apps a lot better. It’s clear the 4K panel is just too much for the Core M processors to handle, and it’s left me scratching my head wondering why HP felt it was a necessary addition."
Pricing for this engineering marvel - you must be kidding me:
"Starting at $999 and going all the way up to $1,799, it’s every bit a 12-inch MacBook running Windows 10, but HP has actually improved a few things compared to Apple’s take."
"HP’s EliteBook Folio is designed for and sold to businesses" -