Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Originally posted by KLFloyd
Though something to consider, when Steve launches the PowerBook G5 do you think he'd so it in Paris or would he want to be on his own home turf?

This is not logical from a marketing point of view. As if the whole company would delay a much desired product so as to comply with Steve's ego, or an annual US public event.

Though your statement does raise a question about the location. Apart from wanting to make an impact in Europe, Apple might have some local news for them - iTunes Music Store perhaps? :p
 
good one edgar

I thought it was funny. Cold comfort as the pitchforks glint in the torchlight outside your window.

You gotta admit, your comment is awful close to a troll. But you knew that already...right?

:)
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 15 and 17" PBs updated Tuesday

Originally posted by edgar_is_good
Note to self: irony in the presence of this crew will not, I repeat _not_ lead to throngs of admirers for your clever wit.

ok, so you were being sarcastic, yea, i'm wicked good at recognizing sarcasm.
 
Originally posted by wood_e
Ok people, lets get it straight.

snip

All that said... Tuesday probably won't bring G5 powerbooks, but I would not be suprised if it did. We have waited a long time, and there has to be something huge in the pipeline. I guess we have to wait it out... :)
So those widely discussed visits by SJ to Mot, maybe that was just to stand outside and give them the bird? No, it would seem that Steve still wants something from Mot and presumably in large quantities. That would be the 7457 then. And what does he need it so urgently for? That would be the new PowerBooks.
 
Re: Other reasons why the G5 Mactop is a no go...

Originally posted by locovaca
I haven't had time to peruse the rest of this exponentially growing thread, so I don't know if anyone else has touched on this, but right now there isn't the memory technology to bring the G5 to a laptop, imho. The fastest SODIMMs you can buy are PC2700, so you can get a 667 mhz bus, which is only 2/3 of the 2.0 GHz bus. Now, that begs the question- how dependent are the G5's on bus speed? If they're as dependent as some of the benchmarks have hinted at, a G5 laptop may not perform any better than a G4 in non-optimized apps. For all we know Apple may be waiting for 400 MHz SODIMMs before making a G5 PB...

Take a look at the chart on Mac Bidouille.

http://www.hardmac.com/niouzcontenu.php?date=2003-09-14

It show the comparative performance of various processors configs in Final Cut pro. Take a look at the 1 GHz L3 ( G4 ) and compare to the 1.6 GHz G5. Extrapolate out a 1.25 G4 with L3 vs. a 1.2 GHz G5. They are not on the chart, but it is easy to see that the 1.25 GHz G4 with L3 would be a better performer.

The G5 may not have that much advantage at lower clock speeds. It's advantage comes with 64 bit apps and the higher processor clock speed ( also from the fact that the bus scales nicely with the proc. clock speed ).

Check it out...
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 15 and 17" PBs updated Tuesday

Originally posted by edgar_is_good
Note to self: irony in the presence of this crew will not, I repeat _not_ lead to throngs of admirers for your clever wit.

I dunno, I kind of appreciate it. That he's pointing out the obvious aside; the fact that he's pointing an obvious fact that nobody seems to hear, take in, process, or what have you. Granted, I've never been a model poster, nor have I ever pretended to. But at least I do some research and try to make myself sound like less of the idiot that I actually am.
 
Originally posted by pigwin32
So those widely discussed visits by SJ to Mot, maybe that was just to stand outside and give them the bird? No, it would seem that Steve still wants something from Mot and presumably in large quantities. That would be the 7457 then. And what does he need it so urgently for? That would be the new PowerBooks.

I'm just picturing Steve standing there giving Mot the cross armed double bird salute. Oh, the sweet satisfaction of it.
 
Originally posted by pigwin32
So those widely discussed visits by SJ to Mot, maybe that was just to stand outside and give them the bird? No, it would seem that Steve still wants something from Mot and presumably in large quantities. That would be the 7457 then. And what does he need it so urgently for? That would be the new PowerBooks.

I don't know, it seems Steve-like to me to go to Motorola just to insult them. "Tonka Truck Processor" indeed.
 
Re: good one edgar

Originally posted by hexcalibur
I thought it was funny. Cold comfort as the pitchforks glint in the torchlight outside your window.

You gotta admit, your comment is awful close to a troll. But you knew that already...right?

:)

Nah, a troll would have been "g5's are _wayyyy_ too hot, but I think dual 1.25 ghz (overclocked) 7455s in a 15in is still a possibility. I mean, have you seen the heatsink in an imac?"

Wait a sec, there's something outside my window...
 
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
Nah...how about if someone were to say a G5 would be too hot but quad 1.42 GHz G4s might be a possibility in a newly designed .6" case?

Let's try and stay serious, here. No way you could fit a superdrive into a .6" case.
 
Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
We read the rumors sites, so we know better than to buy new equipment that'll be outdated soon anyway :)

With that type of mentality you'll never have anything "new" and always be complaining about something else.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 15 and 17" PBs updated Tuesday

Originally posted by plinkoman
omg, i can't beleive this has to be said yet again, did you watch the video about the intro of the G5? it's right here if you haven't. perhaps you will notice that which has been said a thousand times since, THE 9 FANS ARE TO COOL IT WHILE KEEPING IT QUIET! 1 fan would do, but it would be loud, and they wanted it quiet, so they put in 9 slow moving fans to do the job of 1 big one. good god

Take it easy, everyone. You're all PMSing over silly little comments and completly missing their satirical nature. Now wait patiently, just as I have been, for a 15" AL p-book.

While, I 'm on the subject on this incredibly long thread, does anyone have any ideas what new p-books will mean in regards to the current education deal? According to Apple's rebate, the $200 off an ipod with any laptop purchase is good through September. I've been drooling over this deal all summer while waiting for new 'books. Anybody care to wax intellectual on the topic?
 
Re: Re: Re: 15 and 17" PBs updated Tuesday

Originally posted by panphage
It ain't a G4 w/o Altivec and the Gobi don't got Altivec.

Your other point has ALSO ALREADY been debunked AD NAUSEUM. Please read the posts in any of these threads. APPLE HAS A DEDICATED POWERBOOK DESIGN AND DEVELOPMENT TEAM. There is NO REASON Apple could not have been researching and prototyping a 970-based Powerbook system ALL ALONG. EVER SINCE THEY WENT TO IBM WITH THE IDEA FOR 970 BASED SYSTEMS. Nothing would have stopped them from starting work on the portable at exactly the same time as work on the desktop. The desktop is easier, it came out first.

No you obviously didn't read any of my others posts. My point about chipset development was that if they did indeed work on a PowerBook design along side the PowerMac design why would they wait after the major buying season is over before releasing it? Or announce it.
If a matter of 2 months makes or breaks the completion of a chipset there's a problem there. Chipsets, at least with my experience with AMD and Intel, are completed well before a shipping date. Explain to me what Apple's thinking would be to not announce a G5 to allow people to preorder them prior to the school season rush.
This does not make sense. Esp since the stock of PowerBooks are already depleted. There is no obvious reason to hold back the announcement.

In any case we will see who is right come Tuesday. Its a win, win for me because if you are right I'm off to the Apple store to order myself a G5 PowerBook. Pref a 17”. :D
 
Originally posted by pigwin32
So those widely discussed visits by SJ to Mot, maybe that was just to stand outside and give them the bird? No, it would seem that Steve still wants something from Mot and presumably in large quantities. That would be the 7457 then. And what does he need it so urgently for? That would be the new PowerBooks.

I was thinking about this and one reasonable scenario if Stevie put G5's in the 15inchers would be to use the 7457's in the 12inchers. 12 in are hot now. The 7457 will be lower power and higher speed = better 12 in. 15 and 17 could go G5, which would single out a specific market for the 12.

Or there could be no G5's in anything. not trying to start a fight, just a possibility.
 
it certainly will be a challenge to a get a G5 into a 12" that is cooler then the 7455 now, which i've heard is an oven, but they've overcome greater obstacles in the past, they'll do it again, if not promptly
 
The G5 doesn't work in the Powerbook

In this thread, lots have been asserting this idea it would be possible to put a G5 into a Powerbook. Some are pointing out the current specs have DDR RAM but the processor cannot take advantage of it, so putting a G5 in instead would be a better idea and other such stupidity.

The reason this is stupidity is because the G5 cannot be put into the current Powerbook design, period.

The G5 is not compatable with Motorola's MaxBus architecture! This is why you will never see a G5 upgrade for G4 towers. Even if you could shoehorn a G5 onto the current Powerbook motherboard, would you expect it to perform any better than a G4 Powerbook? The anemic bus has been the bane of G4 performance for a couple years now.

To adapt a G5 to the MaxBus would require a chip of such complexity and expense it would not make any financial sense to produce it. That's not my opinion. It's paraphrased from the Ars Technica articles about the 970 and Hypertransport. Apparenty a lot of people here never bothered to read them proior to the G5's announcement.

Also, regardless of whether a G5 can be underclocked to produce little enough heat to work in a slim Powerbook case, as someone pointed out in another thread, the system controller is a hot runner and its heat dissapation would also have to be taken into account.

In short, the move from a G4 in the Powerbooks to a G5 would be more then a simple change of chip like some here suggest. It would require a complete redesign of the motherboard to Hypertransport.


Also, someone else has implied that people who are in the "no G5's" camp may be that way because they have a financial interest in Motorola. What a load of crap! :mad: Almost everyone here has been dogging on Motorola and their inability to do anything right (except make filp-phones) and said we need to get away from them completely. Does that sound like something MOTO investors would say?

The "yea-G5" group has been doing little more then just saying "OOOoooo! I hope they're G5's!" They have offered little evidence a G5 Powerbook technically is possible at this time, let alone actually going into the updates Tues. They have some figures a G5 processor could run cool if it was underclocked, but other than that I have yet to see anything by them or anyone to show this path is what will happen.

If the "no G5" camp seems a little pessimisstic, perhaps it's because the other half seems to be wearing rose colored glasses with no frames. We're suppoting our view with marketing theory, logic, past upgrade experience, and sometimes charts and photos. I don't think there has been a single rumor on any rumor site suggesting the new Powerbooks would be G5's for the last three months, except MacOS Rumors. Yet, there is this idea the Powerbooks will be G5's, and it is largely unsupported by, well, anything.

Thank you. <stepping off soap box>
 
Re: Not too hot...

Originally posted by daveschroeder
Wrong. This is an incorrect statement that, for some reason, keeps getting repeated. As with all incorrect statements, saying it over and over again doesn't make it true.

...

Power dissipation (typical) per MHz:

PowerPC 7455: 0.0355W
PowerPC 970 (1.1v): 0.0158W
PowerPC 970 (1.3v): 0.0233W

It's easy to see that, clock for clock, the PowerPC 970 consumes much less power - and therefore dissipates less heat - than the PowerPC 74xx. The current 1.8 GHz G5 numbers aren't significantly higher than a 1.0 GHz G4...it's therefore not hard to imagine the G5 making its debut in a portable machine in the future.

...

I'm just realizing this thread is 13 pages long and I ain't got time to read it all, but I will add this for the people who care:

If you'd stop jumping up and down about CPU power and think about a system you'd go to someplace like Micron and look at RAM power numbers:

For one 512Mbit chip using the current 15" PB PC133 memory---
Full speed burst access power: 120mA x 3.3V=396mW
Continuous refresh power: 5.5mA x 3.3V=18mW

For one 512Mbit chip using the current G5 PC3200 memory--
Full speed burst access power: 450mA x 2.6V=1170mW
Continuous refresh power: 11mA x 2.6V=29mW

Multiply by the bit width of the memory bus divided by 4 (the typical bus width for a single RAM chip on a module).

These numbers are with the outputs disconnected. Now connect these higher toggle rate outputs through module traces, connectors, motherboard traces and chipset pins and your looking at a significant amount of I/O power.

Now think about the much faster system bus coming off the G5, also toggling traces.

Now think about the system controller chip, and the fact that it also has to work at these speeds.

Now remember that the G5 has no L3 cache and therefore if you slow the memory down compared to the core clock, you're going to starve it.

Are there possibly lower power memories out there rather than Micron's? Possibly. Are there ways around the memory power problems? Probably.

Will the power come down if you use slower memory connected to a slower G5? Certainly. But to bring the power in line with the current G4 lineup you'll have to slow it down a heck of a lot.

Can it be done? Certainly. Would it make a good product, I don't know but I doubt it at this point.

So please, people, start looking at the whole system and stop raving about CPU consumption like that answers all the questions.
 
I have this fresh news from france to share with you guys. I just got off the phone with a friend of mine who works at the expo. Seems that they're going to be a G5 powerbook afterall, at least one. He told me that there was a big rolled up set of posters that haven't yet been exposed. He got to take one home and there was a big G5 written on it with a fine print that reads "the first 64bit personal laptop in the world". Wait, Ok, maybe I am mistaken. I begin to doubt this... I don't understand French. Who the hell was that on the phone? Did it even ring? Maybe not. Wait a minute... If I figure this out before I fall asleep, I will tell you all about it. Yeah man, I have this fresh news from France to share with you guys, nice stuff. Strange man, it's like a dejavu all of a sudden. Where was I? At home .. never been to France. Ok. Let's see. I need some sleep and a powerbook.
 
bah i gave up on powerbook updates back in july. Now im waiting for my sager 5680 to arrive (shud be here tomorrow). i wish apple got the updates out sooner so that i could go back to using an apple. i hope i dont miss much on the update ;[
 
Originally posted by plinkoman
it certainly will be a challenge to a get a G5 into a 12" that is cooler then the 7455 now, which i've heard is an oven, but they've overcome greater obstacles in the past, they'll do it again, if not promptly

It makes zero difference anyway, what ever they release people will buy - but back on the 12" issue, if Apple could just sort out a back lit keyboard, USB 2, FW 800 and a 1.25 G4, I'd be over the moon - with regard to the 15 and 17" G5 would be great for marketing, but in reality, it'd make little difference to performance (http://www.hardmac.com/niouzcontenu.php?date=2003-09-14#588)
 
Re: The G5 doesn't work in the Powerbook

Originally posted by SeaFox
In short, the move from a G4 in the Powerbooks to a G5 would be more then a simple change of chip like some here suggest. It would require a complete redesign of the motherboard to Hypertransport.

Uhhh...so? Apple has had ample opportunity to do just that.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.