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New PowerBooks on Tuesday.

Re: Re: Re: Not too hot...

Originally posted by ae86_16v
IBM mass produces the 1.2 - 2.0 GHz PPC 970 (G5) processors.
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This is simply not true. There is no evidence that IBM is currently producing 970s at any speeds other than those used by Apple.

Of course, I'm sure they could, but they'd have to charge less, and since they are currently working flat out to sell the more expensive 1.6 to 2.0s, why bother?
 
Just to distract a little bit from the very intense G4/G5 PB discussion, here are my two cents:

On tuesday we will see – besides the PB updates – a new microphone for the iPod together with a firmware upgrade to add recording capability... iMic anyone? :)
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Not too hot...

Originally posted by jouster
This is simply not true. There is no evidence that IBM is currently producing 970s at any speeds other than those used by Apple.

Of course, I'm sure they could, but they'd have to charge less, and since they are currently working flat out to sell the more expensive 1.6 to 2.0s, why bother?
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All G5s cost the same to produce, since there is only the one process used to create them.

(edit: although obviously there's a higher markup on the higher-rated products. But if there's a significant percentage of yield which is rated lower, being able to sell these on is also good)

It'd be interesting to track down some figures on the yields at different clock ratings. As I noted earlier, chip fabs do not produce processors at X or Y GHz. You churn the chips out, test, and sell them at whatever speed they work at.

The only difference between a 1.2 GHz and a 2.0 GHz G5 is the quality and tolerance of the final product.

It all depends on how predictable the fab plant's output is. AFAIK, Apple are the only company building 970-based systems. If IBM have a certain amount of cores unable to reach 1.6 GHz, but run fine at 1.2, they may be an option.

Anyone know of a breakdown of 970 production, broken down by clock-speed and percentage of yield?
 
Originally posted by Freg3000
Mathematically, you are correct. However, I do remember someone on these boards saying that although you could get the total ram up to 1152 MB, the motherboard inside the 12" PB can only handle a gig. I am not sure who that person was, and even if he/she is correct. I do know that the system profiler sees both chips, but I am unsure if the PowerBook can use all of the ram to its maximum potential.
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Actually, I believe if you read the developer's notes for the 12" PB, it will actually handle 4 gigs of RAM. Of course, by the time a 4 gig chip is available for a reasonable price, odds are no one will be using the current 12" PB anymore.
 
Originally posted by utilizer

Just to humor some people, here are some more highlights in Apple expo history:
MWNY 2001 - The G4 Cube is introduced!
MWSF 2002 - New G4 towers, Cube is discontinued; TiPB upgrades.
MWNY 2002 - BY FAR -- The worst of the worst expos EVER: iDVD released.
MWSF 2003: PowerBooks 12 and 17 models released! An entire slew of stuff for everyone to enjoy.
WWDC 2003: G5s! 'Nuff said.
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how could you leave the G4 iMac out of MWSF 2002?!?! that was pretty major (and a pleasant design surprise). btw you are so right about MWNY 2002. . . that was my first keynote, and it almost put me off. but i kept watching them and have been rewarded. sometimes they are fun just for Steve's sense of humor. for example I loved iChat AV's introduction, and the shot of the bull in the pasture when referring to our "competitors" during this past keynote (i hope i got that right)





p.s. minor update is coming. i say this because I want my BigAlbook to stay fresher longer
 
Originally posted by XnavxeMiyyep
If the G5 truly is cooler than the G4 at those clock speeds, then I don't see why they wouldn't put it into at least the 15" and 17".
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It's a G5.
It also comes with a 110v 15,000 rpm ducted fan housing that straps on your back like a HomeLite blower/vac to cool the chip.
Honestly, why clockdown a G5 when you have G4's that are plenty fast and tested tough?
If it is a G5, I'll send a picture of me eating my new(est) 15" that just shipped.
 
I really can't imagine Apple dropping G5 powerbooks tuesday - they are not hyping the Paris expo whatsoever.

They let people know that something was going to happen with the release of the gen 2 ipod, and similarly, Apple themselves were generating some hype with WWDC this year.

They are reallly just not putting out any word regarding the Paris expo, so I really wouldn't expect anything beyond a speedbump.

I would love it though if the 12" were brought into parity with the 17" and 15" and also given a thinner enclosure.
 
Originally posted by petey
I really hope tuesday is the day. I have been hoping to become a new Mac user since WWDc, but I told myself to wait for the updates. My fingers are crossed.
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Right there with you skilly.
 
It is obvious what will happen. The $1999 to $2999 prices are correct. The 15" PowerBook isn't the only computer that dying for a revision. What about the iBook? If they update the iBook, the 12" PowerBook won't be much of a PowerBook if it's as good as the iBooks. The solution? Drop the 12" PowerBook from the PowerBook Line, put a white case on it, Put a 1.1GHz PowerPC 750GX G3 (GOBI) in it and brand it "The New iBook. So now the $1999 to $2999 prices make sense. They are for 15" and 17" PowerBooks. Remember that ThinkSecret article here: http://www.thinksecret.com/news/augustpowerbooks.html "The hardware projects, known internally as Q16 and Q41, consist of upgrades to the the 15-inch and 17-inch PowerBook G4. The projects were scheduled to complete in the first part of August. There was no new codename for any 12" PowerBook at all. Apple will release new iBooks at the same time to reduce demand on the new PowerBooks.
 
My take on this is, expect Apple to disappoint. They usually do. Even when they do something decent, like the G5 announcement and the 17" powerbook or the FP iMac, they ship in quantity months later, usually 1-3 months later than they originally said, so that by the time they come out, Wintels have gained another 300 MHz and dropped $200 more so the macs that were good when announced once again become so-so deals at best.
 
Originally posted by wood_e
Look at it this way. the powerbooks have DDR (except for the 15") right now, but can the G4 take advantage of DDR ram? NO it can't, and since theres DDR channels already on the boards how hard would it be to put a DDR aware CPU on, new controlers andan ATA bus? Not very in my oppinion.
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That's not how it works at all. The G5 will require a totally redesigned motherboard, because:

1) It uses a different type of bus (to the system controller aka northbridge). Therefore:
2) You need a different controller. In the case of Apple's G5 architecture, it looks like that's the U3, which has a different interface (HyperTransport) to the I/O controller. Therefore:
3) You need a different I/O controller. In this case it looks like that's K2, which may or may not have a PCI bus (you need one for the PC Card slot). Therefore:
4) You may need a PCI controller. Whether this would be the same one (of unknown make and model) as on the 1.6 GHz PMG5 or a totally different one, we don't know. (The 1.8 and 2x2.0 G5's use an AMD-made controller that probably wouldn't be suitable for a PowerBook.)

WM

edit: D'OH!!! Just double-checked, K2 does have a PCI bus, and it would be suitable for a CardBus slot (AFAICT). So strike #4 above. But my point still stands: you can't just pop the G5 onto the existing motherboard. It would need to be totally redesigned.
 
At best buy I was looking through the sku's and found a brand new sku for a 15" powerbook. That is all it said it did not say G4 or G5. The price was $1999 and its instock date was 9-16-03 and its out stock was 3-16-04.

Macaddict16
 
Originally posted by Les Kern
It's a G5.
It also comes with a 110v 15,000 rpm ducted fan housing that straps on your back like a HomeLite blower/vac to cool the chip.
Honestly, why clockdown a G5 when you have G4's that are plenty fast and tested tough?
If it is a G5, I'll send a picture of me eating my new(est) 15" that just shipped.
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A picture you ask? For those who missed it in someone elses post earlier:

http://chris.reemergemedia.com/images/pbg5.jpg
 
Originally posted by s10
I cannot remember... did they update the G3 Powerbooks after the introduction of the G4 Desktops?
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G4 desktops: September 1999.

Pismo G3 PowerBooks (400/500 MHz): January 2000.

HTH
WM
 
Originally posted by macmanmk
Uh...no. I said the source in Cupertino. You know...the other coast. Open up a map sometime.
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The thread I responded to had no location. So it was the Janitor there instead?
 
Re: Tablet Mac?

Originally posted by nick.hill
Would apple be going down the tablec PC kinda route anytime soon? If at all....
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Bleh, I hope not. Tablet PCs suck. Tablet PCs are the realisation of an attempt to solve the ePaper problem without having to do the tricky paper bit.

Till ePaper comes around, you'll need a decent PDA and a decent Powerbook. After ePaper, you'll need all three! yay!

Oh just to stir the pot a bit... I'm still very keen for the 17" to go Quad G5. ;-)

Regarding those who say: "Who'd buy a G4 now?" Answer: I would.. I'm using my 1GHz TiBook 15"... had it for 8 gruelling months... awesome beast, very happy... but it makes sense to update it for me. Keep bleeding edge and sell this one off.
 
Originally posted by bentmywookie
I really can't imagine Apple dropping G5 powerbooks tuesday - they are not hyping the Paris expo whatsoever.
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Apple usually doesn't hype keynotes very much.
Originally posted by bradz_id
It is obvious what will happen. The $1999 to $2999 prices are correct. The 15" PowerBook isn't the only computer that dying for a revision. What about the iBook? If they update the iBook, the 12" PowerBook won't be much of a PowerBook if it's as good as the iBooks. The solution? Drop the 12" PowerBook from the PowerBook Line, put a white case on it, Put a 1.1GHz PowerPC 750GX G3 (GOBI) in it and brand it "The New iBook.
Click to expand...
That's not obvious at all, or likely. The 12" Powerbook is doing very well. There's no reason to discontinue it.
 
Originally posted by utilizer
Nope...The Pismos were the last in the series of G3 PowerBooks, released during the summer.
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No. To repeat my post of a few minutes ago, they were introduced in January 2000.
Then in September of 2000, G4s were announced.
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No. To repeat myself again, it was 1999.
MWSF 2001 brought the Titanium PowerBook G4 at 400 Mhz and 500 Mhz.
I have a Pismo 400 mhz and bought one shortly before the G4s were marketed.

Just to humor some people, here are some more highlights in Apple expo history:
MWNY 2001 - The G4 Cube is introduced!
Click to expand...
No. It was 2000.
MWSF 2002 - New G4 towers, Cube is discontinued; TiPB upgrades.
Click to expand...
No, no, and no. The G4s were upgraded to 800, 933, and 2x1000 MHz about three weeks after the expo. The Cube was discontinued in about June 2001. There were TiBook updates in October 2001 (550/667), December 2001 (combo drive available for the first time, with available upgrade for people who'd bought PBs in the previous two months), and April 2002 (667/800).
MWNY 2002 - BY FAR -- The worst of the worst expos EVER: iDVD released.
Click to expand...

No. Someone else addressed this above. I'll add that iDVD was introduced at MWSF 2001, along with new Power Macs (466, 533, 667, and 733 MHz, with available SuperDrive for the first time).
MWSF 2003: PowerBooks 12 and 17 models released! An entire slew of stuff for everyone to enjoy.
WWDC 2003: G5s! 'Nuff said.
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Yes, finally.

No offense intended, just making sure the truth is out there...

WM
 
Originally posted by petey
I really hope tuesday is the day. I have been hoping to become a new Mac user since WWDc, but I told myself to wait for the updates. My fingers are crossed.
Click to expand...

My fingers are crossed too because it feels liek we've been waiting since WWII for PB updates.

-p
 
one thing with G5's in a laptop.

the G5 processors in the New PowerMacs are desktop processors you cant just plug one into a laptop and expect it to work..

also the packaging of the g5 chip is too large to fit in a laptop
and IBM would need to develop a paper thin packing setup just made to notebooks/laptops.

i havent heard of any reports stating that IBM is working on adapting the G5 to a thin packaging system..

so i dont expect g5 laptops for a while.

but IBM could have developed one and not disclosed the info until the new Powerbooks are out.

we shall See!
 
Originally posted by JSRockit
That is exactly how I see it. If they brought their desktop machines up to par...then the pro laptop needs to be brought up to par as well. The iMac is a consumer model, so we cannot use that for any indication of what will happen to the pro level laptops.
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Actually, the G4 iMac has been an OK predictor of what will happen with the PowerBooks, and vice versa. When 800 MHz iMacs came out in January '02, they were quite a bit better than the PBs, which were then at 667 MHz. Three months later, the PBs went to 800 MHz (as well as getting DVI, a better video "card", a higher-resolution screen, etc.). In November '02, the PowerBooks went to 1 GHz for the first time. In January '03, they got DDR RAM for the first time. Three or four weeks after that, the iMacs hit 1 GHz and got DDR (on the 17" model) for the first time. Those last two introductions (12" and 17" PBs and 1 GHz iMacs) also brought us the Intrepid system controller, along with internal Bluetooth and AirPort Extreme.

I may have forgotten something in there, but I think I remembered enough to make my point: the PowerBooks and iMacs (and the eMacs too, I suppose) have much more in common than the PowerBooks and the Power Macs when it comes to adding features and the like. There are exceptions, of course, like FW800, but still...

HTH
WM
 
First post on these boards, and i must say we got a good G4/G5 discussion going on here.

Here is everything that I'd like to see happen at the Expo on Tuesday @ 3am Eastern.

--------------------------------------------------
I currently own a 12"- Superdrive which I payed 1999 for 7 months ago.

This thing DOES get EXTREMELY Hot! There were red marks on my leg the other day from resting this on it.

so that brings me to #1:

An Updated 12" with significant cooling upgrades. A bit faster and a bit thinner would be nice as well. but leave them at the same price they are now 1599 and 1799.

#2:
I really want a 15" so bad that I put this 12" up on Ebay tonight, in hopes of a 15" getting a MAJOR update on Tuesday. I really want a backlit keyboard, and the larger screen.

#3: Either having Panther released or a release date within the next few weeks of that OS.

#4: A recording Device for the iPod which would be superior to CD quality sound, this is long overdue. and possibly some type of FM radio transmitter for the iPod. I'm honestly surprised Apple of all people hasn't released these devices earlier.

---------------------------------------------

This is what I hope will happen on Tuesday. I'm gunna take a nap monday afternoon, so I can be up at 3am to see what's going on over in Paris.

If anything i said above is indeed correct, I will have my Apple Loan Account Number Ready to buy something new from Apple!
 
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