New PowerMac 1.8GHz Released

[mymemory]

Apple needs a low end powermac that can be configured for the customer, this is a much better machine then a imac in my view and could be considered a gamers mac. Add the videocard of your choice and you are in.FX5200 not included. I have allways wished that apple would sell its fastest single cpu in a powermac. On another note i dont think if sales were rocketing they would have brought back the single G5 machine. Must have some tower cases to get rid of why else bring back the single cpu machine? good for the consumer but so odd the games apple plays with configurations. I have allways felt when it comes to Macs its about what apple wants not what the consumer wants.

No dude, you do not see the picture clearly... that is Apple strategy to keep the price high. The single processor is actually an empty egg sheel, it would be a real deal to find the lower end dual at that price.

Unfortunatly this new machine just works to keep the price of the rest ones up and to sell and "empty" egg shell at a very high price because there is not sense in having such big enclosure with such lack of features at that price. That computer only works for Apple.

 

[cube]

What sucks more?

Today's releases or the last PowerMac G4 release?

"Rise of the crappy Macs"

 

[-hh]

Absolutely right.

As a SP 1.8 Rev A owner, I'm really surprised they crippled the FSB on this. The Rev A 1.8 is still the fastest and most expandible SP G5 Powermac... go figure.

Including the Rev A's ability to take in up to 8GB of RAM.

This offering does help out with the "Starting as Low As" marketing hype, but any consumer who's smart enough to mathmatically rub two sticks together will know that this is a "Trailing Edge of Technology" machine that's going to have a shorter useful lifespan than the other PM's. This new configuration will be obsolete before the year-older Rev A 1.8's because of those elements where it was lobotomized, for reasons only known to Apple.

For what I paid for my Rev A 1.8, I had some buyers remorse over the Rev B feature-to-price points. But this product doesn't make me jealous. If anything, it tempts me to sell my Rev A 1.8 now while I can get a better-than-last-week's price for it.


-hh

 

[Duane Martin]

I laugh. I cry.

When the speculation about this machine was posted yesterday, I said it would never happen. No market for such a beast. OH, the howling and gnashing of teeth. The users who swore to high heaven this is what they have been waiting for. Now, the exact machine, as advertised, is released and the board is howling and gnashing their teeth that it is too slow (compared to what, a dual G5?) or crippled (600FSB vs. my G4?) or too expensive. Reality check time. Am I now in an alternate universe?

Okay, I too want a dual G5 built to my exact specifications (as they happen to be this week) for as close to nothing as I can get it. I want it now, I want it my way, I don't care if it makes any logical sense whatsoever from a business point of view because I want it!!!

Well, at least I am able to recognize my inner five-year-old for what it is.

 

[takao]

Both Thumbs up Apple for this update... it will give a nice computer for those who have a screen ,already and want to upgrade

sadly it's 200 € out of my maximum price range (here it costs 1550€ with edu discount) when i put in bluetooth,airport and and adaptor etc

but with the 110€ + airport ibook price drop (which i didn't excpected) i guess i dicided which will be my first apple....

 

[inkswamp]

If you want to split hairs

You can actually get it for slightly less by customizing it and dropping the built-in modem and downgrading the Superdrive to a Combo. If you do that, you get:

• 256MB DDR400 SDRAM (PC3200) - 2x128
• 80GB Serial ATA - 7200rpm
• Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 Ultra w/64MB DDR SDRAM
• Combo (CD-RW/DVD-ROM)
• Apple Keyboard & Apple Mouse - U.S. English
• Mac OS X - U.S. English

Subtotal $1,370.00

 

[maya]

That's really funny, but sadly true. There's no way that I could convince someone to switch to a low-end Powermac when Apple makes decisions like this.

So much for "new and improved." This is more like "old and degenerate."

Okay I will give this new abomination that its more expandable than a cube. Granted one for Apple.

However with that step forwards they took a couple backwards. FSB, Since when did Mac users begin over-clocking, the over-clocking sounds like a nitch thing and only few people on the Mac side even consider it. Besides it not 100% safe.

Here is Apple's thinking we will offer last years technology, call it new, cripple the FSB, pop in a crap GPU and charge $1500 USD for it.

The lest they should be offering is a 2.0GHz to separate it from the iMac G5. What are these people on, I think this is targeted towards people who don't know how to transport an iMac G5.

Either IBM and Apple have too many 1.8GHz G5 chips or they are having a lot and I mean a lot of trouble with 2.0 and 2.5GHz chips.

This is not good at all. This is stagnating the market, with crap.

 

[maya]

All this is, is an expandable iMac G5 minus the LCD screen. At $1,200 USD without a crippled FSB and 4gig ram slots it would have been a steal.

Add a $600 USD LCD screen and you have a decent machine. This $1,500 USD price should be for a 2.0GHz G5 with 8 gigs of ram slots.

Well there is always next year.

 

[maya]

You can actually get it for slightly less by customizing it and dropping the built-in modem and downgrading the Superdrive to a Combo. If you do that, you get:

• 256MB DDR400 SDRAM (PC3200) - 2x128
• 80GB Serial ATA - 7200rpm
• Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 Ultra w/64MB DDR SDRAM
• Combo (CD-RW/DVD-ROM)
• Apple Keyboard & Apple Mouse - U.S. English
• Mac OS X - U.S. English

Subtotal $1,370.00

The options you are quoting above are BELOW standards compared to the rest of the PC world in this price range.

Apple really seems to have quite a few problems on its hands.

 

[dejo]

I still don't understand people's logic that a 600MHz FSB is "crippled". Can someone please explain this to me? Does that mean that the 1.6GHz iMac G5 with 533MHz FSB is also crippled? In fact, even more crippled. I would claim the low amount of RAM is more crippling than the FSB speed. And I'm wary of using that phrasing anyways. "Less powerful" perhaps.

 

[Rod Rod]

I still don't understand people's logic that a 600MHz FSB is "crippled". Can someone please explain this to me? Does that mean that the 1.6GHz iMac G5 with 533MHz FSB is also crippled? I would claim the low amount of RAM is more crippling than the FSB speed.

the idea is this: it's understandable that the G5 iMac has lower frontside bus speeds because of the heat / power budget. the Power Mac doesn't have the same restraints as the iMac. the logic, as I see it, is the motherboards are identical parts (600MHz & 900MHz) except for a couple of rearranged resistors.

you're right, the RAM as it ships is worse than the FSB speed. the difference is that you can upgrade your RAM without voiding the warranty.

for the person who contended that the lower FSB was necessary due to lower quality chips, well that doesn't make sense. the higher the ratio between processor and motherboard, the more stability problems you may run into. I am inferring this from the eMac 800MHz - 1.4GHz thread on these forums. the rest of the PM line, with the 2:1 ratio, is by comparison way more stable.

 

[takao]

The options you are quoting above are BELOW standards compared to the rest of the PC world in this price range.

well i wouldn't really mind if it was below standard, but better than my _current_ computer
i want bluetooth,wireless ,better graphics-card than today,more HD space,DVD burner and at least the same amount of ram for my next _desktop_

for laptops i'm saving up money for my additional ibook already

i guess my desktop has to live another 1.5-2 years ...

EDIT:like said before it's still a good _addition_ to the current line ..and i think it's good that it keeps the same case (that saves apple money) BTW and at this price point there is still lots of room for future upgrades/price drops

 

[maya]

I still don't understand people's logic that a 600MHz FSB is "crippled". Can someone please explain this to me? Does that mean that the 1.6GHz iMac G5 with 533MHz FSB is also crippled? In fact, even more crippled. I would claim the low amount of RAM is more crippling than the FSB speed. And I'm wary of using that phrasing anyways. "Less powerful" perhaps.

The iMac G5 is a pro-sumer machine it is expected to be crippled to some extent when compared to the high-end macs.

However there is not reason to cripple the FSB on the single chip 1.8Ghz G5. At this price what are you really paying for expandability (which is added cost). You have to add an lcd or crt if you have one great then again is it ADC or DVI (if it supports both great). This is supposed to make me want a PM over an iMac G5.

Let's Apply cost they seem to be using the same mobo technology since last year. using the same FSB controller as the iMac G5 to cripple this otherwise fine machine. Using the Same G5 case, and the still are asking for $1,500 USD. That looks like a large profit margin on these machines.

I would have no problems if this machine's FSB was not crippled and offered a 2.0GHz instead of an imac g5, that way it fits right in as an upgrade to an imac and a starter to the PM line. Only Apple can cripple its own development.

Why does Apple always cripple they good hardware, I will never get it. They can do so much to have an edge however what do they do cripple it and say it's better.

The duals are neat and are a different story.

 

[MacsRgr8]

IMHO this Mac is the perfect replacement for those G4 Tower owners who already have an ADC display, PCI-SCSI card (or other PCI cards) but weren't ready to pay $ 2000,-

Stick more RAM in and a Radeon 9600 and you got yourself the perfect upgrade.

Also I am really interested in benchmarks between the Rev A Single G5 (900 MHz FSB) and this one (600 MHz FSB). I truly wonder WHEN having the extra 300 MHz FSB really counts.

Maybe, just maybe... the FSB MHz myth has just started....

 

[maya]

well i wouldn't really mind if it was below standard, but better than my _current_ computer
i want bluetooth,wireless ,better graphics-card than today,more HD space,DVD burner and at least the same amount of ram for my next _desktop_

for laptops i'm saving up money for my additional ibook already

i guess my desktop has to live another 1.5-2 years ...

EDIT:like said before it's still a good _addition_ to the current line ..and i think it's good that it keeps the same case (that saves apple money) BTW and at this price point there is still lots of room for future upgrades/price drops

Notebooks are a different story if they cripple the FSB for heat and battery life reasons. Understandable.

This on the other hand I mean come on Apple, the iMac G5 has a 1.8Ghz top end with the rev.B iMac G5 the 1.8GHz will be low end, that means your single chip 1.8 GHz G5 will not even be worth it. At least give us a single 2.0GHz G5 in this offering. Keep the 1.8GHz for the iMac and PM duals.

I don't think they fired BOZO the clown yet from Apple, unless all his relatives work there as well.

Great we can look forward to the rev.B of this single G5 PM that will offer guess what 2.0GHz

BTW if seems that IBM has more luck by either over-clocking the 2.0GHz chips to 2.3Ghz or clocking down the 2.5Ghz chips to 2.3GHz. That is what I gather from the whole Virginia Tech 2.3GHz cluster. So why not offer a 2.0 - 2.4 - 2.5GHz PM line up.

 

[aliasfox]

If you can buy Apple EDU, you can squeeze a full system (including CRT, decent graphics card, and speakers) in for under $2,000. I have it configured this way:

1 gig RAM
160 gig HD
9600XT
Mitsubishi 17" CRT
Klipsch Promedia GMX 5.1
no modem
no Superdrive

Wow. A credibly speedy single processor machine from Apple that has a replaceable screen, graphics, 5.1 sound, and easy upgradeability for $1,988. Granted, it's Educational pricing, uses a CRT (better for games?), and lacks a modem, but those are things many "gamers" out there can overlook, I'd imagine (many gamers probably have someone in their family- or a friend- that goes to school). They'd also likely drop the expensive speakers for some headphones and boost the graphics card to a 9800XT.

Conversely

With a single processor and cooler FSB (not to mention relatively cool stock GPU), this thing should run rather quietly- perhaps quiet enough to use in a recording studio?

 

[maya]

If you can buy Apple EDU, you can squeeze a full system (including CRT, decent graphics card, and speakers) in for under $2,000. I have it configured this way:

1 gig RAM
160 gig HD
9600XT
Mitsubishi 17" CRT
Klipsch Promedia GMX 5.1
no modem
no Superdrive

Wow. A credibly speedy single processor machine from Apple that has a replaceable screen, graphics, 5.1 sound, and easy upgradeability for $1,988. Granted, it's Educational pricing, uses a CRT (better for games?), and lacks a modem, but those are things many "gamers" out there can overlook, I'd imagine (many gamers probably have someone in their family- or a friend- that goes to school). They'd also likely drop the expensive speakers for some headphones and boost the graphics card to a 9800XT.

no SuperDrive

What are you smoking? a DVD or combo drive is now standard, Apple is just looking at the profit rather than thinking of being competitive on this ground. Apple buys these parts cheap, since they buy in bulk, all I see is them being greedy on this offering.

And a CRT screen, so it would seem we are moving backwards. Well in this case lets just say that the eMac screen is better than the Apple LCD lineup

 

[xgsrpg]

What I want to see is a single processor Power Mac G5 2.5GHz. Or at least a single proc 2.0. But we know that won't happen since it will probably take some of the dual proc's territory since many apps like games don't support the second proc.

 

[Rod Rod]

Remember the Yikes?

Remember last year when people declared early on that the Power Mac G5 1.6GHz single was the Yikes! of the lineup? It was because of PCI (not PCI-X) and 4 RAM slots (not 8). I figured that PCI and 4 RAM slot business couldn't last very long in the latest and greatest Power Mac.

The PM G5 Yikes! lineup has expanded and now it has both single and dual processor versions. The single has been improved to a 600MHz fsb.

It's okay though, because these PCI G5s fill a niche... at least as paper tigers (pun intended)... because, of course, they're externally identical to the dual 2.5GHz monsters.

 

[stevehaslip]

I have a single processor 1.8Ghz G5 Rev a. I don't feel bad about the new single processor G5's because although they are $600 cheaper, I have had my computer for over a year, the fronside bus is larger and i have more ram slots. Now you may say that you'll never put 8 gigs of ram in there but having 8 slots means that i can put in lots of 512 over time and eventually have 4gig of ram. which if you ask me is more than you would need for graphic design!

My G5 does what i need pretty quick, its still faster than everyones powerbooks and emacs and imacs for that matter.

I won't feel bad until my computer stops working or apple release a 4.5ghz processor!

do i wish i hadn't spent so much money? no sir, you have to spend money to make money! lol!

 

[chanoc]

Priced Right For a Student!

Summary:

• 256MB DDR400 SDRAM (PC3200) - 2x128
• 160GB Serial ATA - 7200rpm
• ATI Radeon 9600 XT w/128MB DDR SDRAM
• Apple Cinema Display (20" flat panel)
• 56k V.92 modem.
• 8x Super Drive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
• Apple Keyboard & Apple Mouse - U.S. English
• Mac OS X - U.S. English


Subtotal $2,653.00
Estimated Ship:
3-5 business days

Now if only I had a permanent residence and 2,653.00!

 

[paxtonandrew]

Finally Apple, us Aussies have a better deal than some other countries... The new SP G5 is AU$5,000 less than the top spec iMac, and i have believed the iMac to be underpriced. For an expandable and fast computer, this almost fills a niche for Apple, and I may buy one, but i will have to BTO it, as there is a crappy graphics card, and a 3rd party ram specialist will be visited too.

A decent computer for the price, and way less than the top spec iMac, which is a plus in itself.

 

[JasonElise1983]

This is my last HooRah on this issue. After this i give up on this one. You people will really never be pleased. Look at it this way. Let's say i need a new computer (which i do) and i happen to like CRT monitors better than LCD one's. It is true that the color, depth, and refresh rates are all better on these monitiors. So, with apple that give me two options. I can get an eMac which is $999 for the Superdrive model. It has a 1.25Ghz G4, a 167Mhz FSB, 32Mb 9200, 256Mb DDR333, and an 80Gb HD. Now for lets say $600 more dollars (that inclueds a 17" CRT monitor of the same quality as the eMacs) i can get a PowerMac G5 with a 1.8Ghz G5, 600Mhz FSB, 64Mb fx5200, 256Mb DDR400, and an 80Gb HD. It also features things like optical audio, and EXPANDIBLILTY and CHOICES. I'm sorry but performance alone makes this one worth it. Not only does it make it worth it, i would buy two! I love the iMac, but i would never buy one over this computer. Sure for $500 more i could have a dual, but i don't have $500 more. And i am sure that there are plenty of people out there that feel the same. Anyway, all you people who think this is a bad decision by apple, why don't you go start your own computer company, Build into a great comptuer company, run it into the ground, and then revive it and bring it back to life, and then try to tell Apple where they went wrong. Also, are any of you people out there who are dissing this computer really planning on buying one? because if not, it is really shaddy to try to talk might be switchers out of buying this great computer.

 

[Detlev_73]

Uh...

Now if only I had a permanent residence and 2,653.00!

If you qualify for Stafford Loans, you can use that money to pay for a NICE Dual 2.0 GHz G5, and a 20" Cinema display.

Or do you ACTUALLY use that money for credit hours, books, etc?

Then, go to your local Apple Store, present your student ID from any state university system, and pay for the darn system WITH an EDU discount.

I'm hoping you see this as well.

 

[nagromme]

This seems to be the mountains from molehills topic... people getting REALLY aggravated over the details of a minor addition to the lineup--one that SOME people want to buy, and are glad because last week they couldn't

Nobody buys a Mac for a gaming machine. Period. If you do you're delusional. Macs have their streignths. A lot of them actually. Gaming is NOT one of them.

Not to stray too far O/T, but yes some people do. People who are already convinced that the Mac platform is for them, but want to play games. Or people who are sick of dealing with Windows, and want to play games. Or people who want the benefits of a Mac for other tasks, and don't want to own two machines. Yes, in SOME ways a PC is a better gaming machine (you can build speed cheap if you have the knowledge and time, you have more than just a few hundred games to choose from, and you can enjoy the early buggy releases that the late Mac releases skip). So is a console if you accept no mouse control, no free downloadable demos, limited online multiplayer, no add-on communities, and low-res TV graphics. But in SOME ways a Mac IS the better game box. Many Mac benefits--like being easier to keep a Mac secure, or being quiet, or being easy to service--are benefits for everyone, and that includes gamers. So "nobody" is an overstatement. Nobody with YOUR priories would choose a Mac for a gaming machine. I would--and I have. So have friends of mine.

My next computer will be a PowerMac, and it WILL be for gaming--specifically--because that's the only thing my PowerBook won't still do just fine. I'll be as happy as I always have been with the games available, and I won't devote any time to patching or securing Windows.

no SuperDrive
What are you smoking?

SuperDrives are great, but there are lots of compact external devices that can backup or transfer more data faster. That leaves iDVD--a great app, but not everyone needs it.

Neither myself nor ANYONE else I know with a Superdrive has ever actually burned a DVD! So saving money BTO by going with a combo DVD/CD-RW actually makes plenty of sense for many people. In fact, I think Apple might have done well to knock $100 off the single-1.8's standard price and make the Superdrive a BTO addition instead of standard.