Funny if you would limit the performance of a PC with a 13900k + 4090 at the level of a Mac Studio most likely the PC would output less heat. I would say 125W is enough for the 13900k to beat the M1 Ultra in CPU performance and at that TDP is gets up to 53 degrees Celsius. The 4090 at double M1 Ultra's GPU performance probably wouldn't go above 50 degrees. The PC most definitely would be dead silent at M1 Ultra's performance level.
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Next-Generation MacBook Pro Models With M2 Pro and M2 Max Chips Reportedly 'Delayed Once Again'
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Indeed! If it is still the 5mm chip but you need to move up fron an intel MBP, I would go for the M1... 14/16 when they drop further in price than in today‘s MR amazon article …
What’s the point in comparing the 4090 , which has ridiculous power requirements, to a M1? The M1 probably won’t burn down your house like a 4090 with a faulty power cable.
This is actually what I think is happening, if there is a delay. We already know they had two versions they were working on, one 3nm the other 4/5nm. If they went with 4/5nm there wouldn't be a delay but if they went with 3nm, there would be a delay. Sounds like they have changed their internal plans to go with the bigger but delayed upgrade. This could be because of what others are releasing, which Apple would know ahead of when we would. That is my theory, based on previous info.
Ah! You don't say! I knew that AMD had cranked up the wattage (therefore, heat) with their 7000 desktop chips but I didn't realize they were that close to Intel in regards to temps now. That's surprising that it's an IHS issue though -- I know AMD redesigned them with the 7000 series.
Yeah full tilt at 105W at only 53 degrees isn't bad at all. It's funny how just a small adjustment on those power limits can make such a big difference. I know undervolting nVidia's GPU's make a huge difference, too (I know undervolting isn't the same as power limits but still).
Doubt the shipment adjustments have to do with 'sales' itself - but more since majority of people are delaying upgrades from this overlong recession and increased taxes (consumer per state/province, property taxes - Canada's just got increased as I predicted for 2023, thanks exuberance in pandemic payouts).
Also consider any product manufacturing delays already experienced. So yes this will affect shipping estimates and thus revenues per quarter.
Probably a rumor not based in fact and just boom another way for apple to surprise everyone.
WWDC M2 Pro/Max MBPs will be announced. Shipping July 2023 - 14" 16" late July 2023.
My comments were based on the previous one of comparing an i9 4090, not that we don't need any further hardware.
I couldn't care less what people buy and don't buy.
Personally, I update very often and like the newest and fastest. Go for it if you can afford it is my thing and it is very likely I will be getting the next 16" maxed out, and selling the 14" [mainly due to needing the screen size].
I am a hobbyist music composer and Logic Pro on my 16" M1 Max MBP routinely gets the spinning beach ball and I have to force quit - and that is with maybe 25 tracks -- I have optimized Logic for the M1 Max -- it seems no matter which Mac I get, Logic never seems to fully utilize its power
Stop quoting Mark Gurman. He is “predicting” the obvious!!
Apple's next-generation 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro models with M2 Pro and M2 Max chips were slated to hit the market in "early 2023," but the laptops are now expected to be "delayed once again," according to Taiwanese publication DigiTimes.
The report does not offer a revised launch timeframe for the new MacBook Pros. In his newsletter last weekend, Bloomberg's Mark Gurman said Apple planned to release the laptops in the first half of this year and said they will have the same designs and features as the current models, but with M2 Pro and M2 Max chips. Gurman said those chips will offer only marginal performance improvements over the current M1 Pro and M1 Max.
In late October, Gurman said Apple planned to release the new MacBook Pros in the first quarter of 2023 and had tied the launches to an upcoming macOS 13.3 release, but it's unclear if those plans have changed since then. Based on Gurman's latest timeframe of the first half of 2023, the new MacBook Pros should finally be released by Apple's annual developers conference WWDC in June at the latest, but hopefully sooner.
Apple's chipmaking partner TSMC started mass production of 3nm chips in late December, but reports have conflicted as to whether the M2 Pro and M2 Max chips will be 3nm or remain 5nm like the M1 Pro and M1 Max.
The rest of the report is focused on how MacBook shipments will likely decline 40% to 50% sequentially in the first quarter of 2023, citing unnamed supply chain sources. The report claims that Apple "adjusting its shipment ratios" by adding Wingtech as a MacBook assembler is the primary reason for the substantial decline.
Article Link: Next-Generation MacBook Pro Models With M2 Pro and M2 Max Chips Reportedly 'Delayed Once Again'
LMAO ... right?! I wish Macrumors editors would stop using that terrible picture going forward. At least use something sleek like that AR glasses movie that was on Netflix 4yrs ago - Creative Control
Hmm.
Still chasing the specs alone vs the complete solution?
So .. Windows 11 or Linux and is both software better optimized for Windows 11 (home/Pro/Enterprise/etc) or macOS on ARM?
What will happen in about 4yrs time or even 2yrs when Windows goes fully ARM for CPU's - Microsoft already mentioned that's the end goal sooner or later. Will that kit last that long or will you be seeking yet another Windows PC kit in 2-4yrs, and if so would this current kit you're eyeing give you your money's worth or ???
I don't know any answers to these but I figure its something deeper to consider.
Why Apple may finally be embracing touchscreen laptops
Apple could use a Mac touchscreen to incentivize consumers to upgrade their computers and keep Mac sales momentum growing. Apple, for its part, has softened its stance on Mac touchscreens more recently. When asked at a conference last fall if Apple will add a touchscreen to Macs, Federighi responded: "Who's to say?"
All the x-less 7000 series chips max out at 90 watts power draw. In comparison, Apple M1 Max tends to "max out" at around 60-70 watts but can reach over 100 watts.
So, there's a third higher peak wattage with AMD compared to Apple Silicon. But this is still tiny, considering Intel 13-series chips consume up to 350 watts for the same loads.
But in return for that one third higher wattage with AMD, you get vastly better performance than Apple Silicon:
Cinebench (CPU testing):
R9 7900: single core 1,957, multi core 25,776
R7 7700: single core 1,846, multi core 15,909
R5 7600: single core 1,853, multi core 14,270
M1 Max (my own testing): single core 1,534, multi core 12,374
So, AMD is nearly a quarter faster in single core, and has around twice the multi core performance... All at 90 watts at most, while the Intel M1 Max is probably burning through around 60-70 watts at that point. I think that's almost equivalent power-per-watt. Both leave Intel in the dust.
(Data from Linus Tech Tips video on x-less 7000 series and AnandTech M1 Max review.)
If the M2 Max is merely an iterative improvement then it's likely it still won't match AMD's performance-per-watt figures here. This may well be why the M2 Pro/Max chips are delayed – Apple may be tweaking hardware to push performance more than they originally planned (e.g. pushing voltages, adjusting cooling, and so forth).
Please note, if anybody replies pointing out benchmarks are not representative of reality, then a nuclear missile will be dispatched to their domicile. Please don't point out the bleedin' obvious.
Why would you have expected the release schedule to speed up? Apple already only made an 'x' or 'z' variant every other generation, and iPads are higher volume than the 'Pro' and above Macs. It's only logical that the R&D costs of designing a new chip for only the $2k+ macs need to be spread out over a longer timeframe. Without looking up sales numbers, I would bet Apple sells more 'A' series chips in a month than 'Mx Pro/Max/Ultra' in 2 years. Realistically, it wouldn't shock me if the Pro and above chips only come out every other generation, meaning these MBPs will come out with 3nm chips called "M3 Pro" and skip the "M2 pro" entirely.
Despite real reasons for a slower release cycle for the more expensive, lower volume chips, there's not yet any evidence that things have slowed. For example, the A12 and its variants were in new Apple products from September 2018 to October 2022, over 4 years. That's a mark I'm not sure if the A14/M1 family will even reach, they'd have to be on sale for about 22 more months!
Additionally, there is/was this whole pandemic thing going on. It's absolutely clear that even Apple's supply chain has been all kinds of messed up the last year or so. They did a great job smoothing over and keeping things running until late 2021, but 2022 was clearly a massive struggle to get anything desgined, built, released and shipped. Since the pandemic's affects are far from over, I wouldn't be surprised if it's around 2025 before products regularly release without issue and on schedule again.
Um, the majority of the M1 Max power draw is GPU, like 60+ of the 100 watts it can draw are for the GPU, from your own source, the CPU package for M1 Max only draws ~35 watts running Cinebench.
And that 7600 pulls ~88 watts out of the box in every review I've seen. Which means it's using 2.5x the power to get ~15% more multicore performance. Yikes! Looks like AMD has a LOOOOOONG way to go to match Apple's 2 year old cores.
Things are a little more interesting when you get up to the 7900, which also maxes out at ~88 watts stock, and therefore uses 2.5x the power to do 2x the work. Basically when AMD is forced to run efficient rather than fast, they can manage almost cinebench points per watt, while Apple's 2 year old core can manage 350 points/watt.
Any way you slice it, Apple's cores from 2020 are still holding up remarkably well in performance per watt. The real interesting one might be the 7945HX (16core/32 thread "55 watt" laptop chip) when it gets into production laptops, which might still manage well over 20K in cinebench even if tuned or thermally limited to something like 60watts. Or even the 7940HS (8core/16 thread "35 watt" laptop chip), which may well run at 15k in Cinebench even at about 35 watts of power draw.
But even with the delays, and even if we somehow get "4NM" M2 Pro/Max with A15 based cores, there's still likely a 15%+ performance increase on the same power draw, not to mention we may get 2 more cores. Conservatively, this means the worst possible M2 Max does ~14,230 in cinebech on 35 watts, or ~407 points/watt, still vastly ahead of AMD's best at ~293 points/watt in the 7900.
All of this is to say, those of us who need to see Apple winning in benchmarks have nothing to worry about despite the delays and frustrations.
At this joint it raises the question “will Apple
Skip M2 Pro and Max notebooks altogether?”.
If M3 arrives this fall on 3nm, that might provide a power and efficiency improvement worth waiting for.
Mac Pro might get some sort of
m2 Max and Ultra option while Studio remains M1 Max and Ultra.
If capacity for 3nm can support, then it would be a great time for M3 and variants across the board, including a super-mega Mac Pro with tons of CPU and GPU options.
The flaw with that might be production capacity. If every Mac become outfitted with 3nm, that’s a lot of silicon.
Skip M2 Pro and Max notebooks altogether?”.
If M3 arrives this fall on 3nm, that might provide a power and efficiency improvement worth waiting for.
Mac Pro might get some sort of
m2 Max and Ultra option while Studio remains M1 Max and Ultra.
If capacity for 3nm can support, then it would be a great time for M3 and variants across the board, including a super-mega Mac Pro with tons of CPU and GPU options.
The flaw with that might be production capacity. If every Mac become outfitted with 3nm, that’s a lot of silicon.
7 Months on M1 MBA and I'm down to 92%...I'm right behind you...In one year my MacBook Pro M1 Max battery's capacity has dropped to 85% already.
Nothing wrong at the low end that you purchased. It is those of us wanting high end product that are frustrated by the recent pace.
Some at the low/middle range are frustrated by not having M2 Minis/Studios yet, but that range is not egregious like the high end MBPS and MPs. The low/mid range is well served by existing MBAs/13"MBPs, Minis and Studios. Folks (me) due to upgrade 5-year-old high end boxes do not want to buy into 2-year-old tech.
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We folks "in such a hurry" are not folks who bought M1, duh. We are folks with older high end boxes due to upgrade who do not want to buy 2-year-old tech as we do our ~every-5-years upgrade.
Get over it. Instead take note of how many hours your box gets on battery, which remains darn good.
Yeah I also found my MBP strong when it was two years old. The point is not folks with 2-y-o boxes, it is folks with 5-y-o boxes who do not want to buy 2-y-o tech when they buy a new box.
On top of all of this, it’s been well known for at least the last year that Apple and TSMC expected 3nm to be ready for the A16 and M2 last summer, and it simply just wasn’t and got delayed by about a year.
Things happen, the world keeps spinning.
I actually expect the 3 nm to only come to the iPhone this year, I still think the rest of the M2 line-up will stick to 5NM.
Would love to be proven wrong though.