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Why would anyone give this news a negative rating?
There are a lot of haters in this forum.

Hell, there are probably some fanboys who are infuriated that this upcoming iPhone doesn't have a 1920x1080 pixel display, a 10-megapixel camera, 4 gigabytes of main memory, 512GB of storage, blah blah blah. Brain-damaged nitwits living in an effin' dreamworld where the laws of physics are suspended and the economics of consumer electronics manufacturing are toss out the door: brats who have never walked the halls of a Russell 2000 corporation. Frustrated virgins.

People like that.
 
Wait...so if we wanna use apps we have the now on our current phones there going to appear blurry/pixelated? And to get a nice sharp crisp lookin app we'll need to buy new apps with the HD title like ipad?
No, the iPad HD titles almost certainly won't work on the iPhone--they'd be entirely too small to use. The extra resolution won't be used to change the physical dimensions of anything on the iPhone, but just to enhance crispness.

If this ends up being the true production spec, expect shortages and screen issues, because this is entirely uncharted territory. No one has ever been able to manufacture in volume a display in this size range at anything close to this pixel density before, and whoever their supplier is has kept this production line totally secret from the industry (likely at the behest of Apple).
I think you'll find that all your old apps look exactly the same as they do now. The screen size didn't change, only the resolution according to this. The pixels you see now will be 4 pixels instead of 1. That means old apps will look exactly the same, while new apps can be made much sharper on this new model.
Exactly right.
so is this 'real' HD? from my understanding 'HD' is a pretty loose term and while it is great that the next iPhone will have 960x640 resolution does that mean it still can't play 720P material?
"HD" is a completely undefined term. ATSC HDTV has a definition, and the iPhone doesn't meet it. It is not an HDTV display.

Whether or not the iPhone ultimately uses the moniker or not (and I think it's a dumb one, but then again I also think 'MacBook' is a dumb name), it won't be breaking any rules.
well it will be able to play 720p i believe just no display all the pixels...

honestly 720p on a 3.5 inch device is a little over kill i won't be able to tell the difference anyway.
Anything above 300dpi is effectively indistinguishable on a computer display. Going above 300 is just for the convenience of app developers to avoid any software scaling.

This is the same reason resolution independence has never taken off on the desktop--there aren't commercially available displays at double a standard dpi (150, 160, 192, 200), and so scaling results in fractional pixels, which result in alignment errors and bugs. You need one pixel to expand perfectly into a grid for it to work (or alternatively, achieve ~280-300dpi so that single-pixel alignment errors are no longer noticeable).
Can someone explain how the iPad at 1024x768 pixel doubles the same as a 960x640 device?
By carving a 960x640 rectangle out of the display's center, while physically enlarging it.

The new iPhone will pixel double without enlargement, which means it won't blur at all. The new iPhone has four pixels in the place where the old iPhones had one, which means all existing iPhone apps will look exactly the same as they do now. Future apps will be able to take advantage of sharper text and smoother curves, but the text and button size will remain the same.

Developers will essentially start developing for the higher resolution, while the iPhone OS will automatically scale it down for older devices. Universal apps will be written based on physical dimensions in a "pocket" size (iPod/iPhone) and a "tablet" size (iPad)--there's no need for any other UI design.
HD is relative to screen size. 960x640 on a screen this size is HD.
ATSC HDTV is not relative to screen size. "HD" as a general term is not relative to anything.
Anyone that claims otherwise may consider what would happen if 1080P was playing back on a 90 foot jumbo tron... 1 inch pixels. But it's High Def, right? Maybe a couple miles away it is.
It is 2" from the surface. The definition of 1080p is 1920x1080 at a specified framerate. It makes no difference what the physical size of the display is. A 23" monitor, a 65" plasma, and a 90 foot jumbotron are subject to the same rules.

That simply illustrates the fallacy of relying on specs without context. 1080p is worthless on almost any display smaller than 40" in a typical living room. At the same time, people who insist on THX ratios (designed for commercial theaters) for living rooms end up with absurd ideas about sitting 4 feet from 55" TVs, again from lack of context. Specs and figures have to be tempered by common sense and practical considerations.
Serious question but does the A4 chip even have the power to play 1280x720 or 1024x768 (ipad native) resolution video?
Absolutely, since that's exactly what's in the iPad and it doesn't break a sweat at video playback at either of those resolutions. Even substantially underclocked, it could handle 720p.
Also there's no extra ram and keeping that resolution in a framebuffer is going to be tricky.
Not really. You overestimate the memory needs of a rendered frame. 1024x768 has been handled by video cards since the mid-90s with 4MB of RAM. The burden of HD video is more the resources involved with decoding it, not displaying it (hence the general and specialized hardware acceleration in modern GPUs).

The iPad is already capable of 720p decoding, and probably 1080p. The 3GS hardware is 720p-capable, but 1080p might be a challenge. The next iPhone will undoubtedly be able to handle 720p as well.
 
I think Apple could make the LCD a little bigger in terms of size. Not like the Dell Streak big, but like may 3.7" or 4" would be nice. I know the convenience behind making the screen size the same but doubling the resolution, namely 4 pixels will be 1 pixel so current iPhone apps won't be blurry, but the reason why I like the iPad so much is because I have a nice 10" screen to work with albeit with less PPI than the new iPhone 4/HD. Anyway, the PPI is still pretty amazing and IPS screens should not suffer from problems like yellow/pink screens.

Steve Jobs should start with a few slides that show what the current competition for smartphones is like. Maybe put a few things like thickness, screen size, screen resolutions, video-chat, camera specs, etc. into the keynote. And then show how the new iPhone 4/HD is better than all of that. That is what he did with the iPad and it's selling like hotcakes at the moment domestically and internationally.
 
Nice, this has more pixels then my Moto Droid, and that thing is SHARP!

I really hope this comes to Verizon so I can upgrade come November when my contract is up!
 
No, not really. OLED is the future, no doubt, but today it's not quite there yet. LCD/IPS ist still the better technology.

OLED in Mobile applications is definitely here already. I've used the Zune HD and its screen destroys IPS. They also kill the power consumption of IPS which is much higher than any other LCD screen. The best LCD's I have found in phones have been S-PVA (mostly samsung phones) screens because they let the most light through so they don't have to have a really bright backlight and they have much better contrast ratios and the blacks don't wash out from angles.
 
Super Cool

I think that the higher resolution is super cool! I think it's a hugely nice surprise.

Maybe it's just me, but it seems like with Steve Jobs back, some of the technologies that have been promised over the past year are finally coming through. The iPhone 3Gs is great with video, speed increases, copy and paste, and universal search, but this new iPhone really looks like a big leap.

I love the potential of it.
 
DPI vs PPI

DPI is a reference to resolution of a printed page, PPI (pixel per inch) refers to screen resolution. :)
 
Wait...so if we wanna use apps we have the now on our current phones there going to appear blurry/pixelated? And to get a nice sharp crisp lookin app we'll need to buy new apps with the HD title like ipad? That sucks! All the developers should be made to update their apps to the proper resolution of thr current iphone and if we decide to buy it then it should be compatible with both iphone/ipad! Its just getting confusing now :( and who wants to pay for two apps which are essentially the same app ? :(

I think older iPhone apps that are locked to a certain pixel map are going to actually be smaller and look like an iPhone app on an iPad. It'll be interesting to see how this will be handled but it is going to be harder to claim that an HD app for the new iPhone will warrant a price increase like they are doing for the iPad when all they may be doing is using a denser text font. I think all apps are going to have to be universal in the future and the same price for all. It's gonna be all good. :)
 
OLED in Mobile applications is definitely here already. I've used the Zune HD and its screen destroys IPS. They also kill the power consumption of IPS which is much higher than any other LCD screen. The best LCD's I have found in phones have been S-PVA (mostly samsung phones) screens because they let the most light through so they don't have to have a really bright backlight and they have much better contrast ratios and the blacks don't wash out from angles.

LCD displays don't wash out completely (100%) in sunlight whereas OLED and AMOLED displays do. LCD isn't as bright or sharp in sunlight relative to indoors but it's somewhat visible, more so than OLED displays. OLED displays don't make sense for mobile phones, which are meant to be used primarily in and outdoors. If the product, like a external monitor or desktop screen, is meant to be used indoors, then OLED would be perfect. It just doesn't make sense outdoors.

IPS isn't that bad, the iPad somehow achieves 10 hours of watching movies with it's 10" IPS. It's not the same comparison granted.
 
I think older iPhone apps that are locked to a certain pixel map are going to actually be smaller and look like an iPhone app on an iPad. It'll be interesting to see how this will be handled but it is going to be harder to claim that an HD app for the new iPhone will warrant a price increase like they are doing for the iPad when all they may be doing is using a denser text font. I think all apps are going to have to be universal in the future and the same price for all. It's gonna be all good. :)

Not really. The iPad was simply doubling an iPhone app in terms of number of pixels vertically and horizontally. But doing so would make it 960x640. That's why iPhone apps with the 2x feature on the iPad looks blurry (size diagonally also increased) and had black boxes (letterboxing) all around, more noticeably on the sides. But the iPhone 4/HD simply makes every 4 pixels to 1 pixel. Since the screen size is the same, it doesn't get blurry at all.
 
Nope. Android fanbois will point to AMOLED and say it's better "just because". The rest of the world will point to iPhone HD and say it's better because it actually is.

It's actually not better. Looking at the pics from the source site, every sub pixel is not the same size. This is done to cut costs, but the overall image will suffer.
 
Led?

The colored pixels are very focused dots, not broad rectangles. Please help me understand, that is not an LCD, isn't the only technology that looks like that under a microscope an OLED?
 
OLED in Mobile applications is definitely here already. I've used the Zune HD and its screen destroys IPS. They also kill the power consumption of IPS which is much higher than any other LCD screen. The best LCD's I have found in phones have been S-PVA (mostly samsung phones) screens because they let the most light through so they don't have to have a really bright backlight and they have much better contrast ratios and the blacks don't wash out from angles.

Your statement is not fact based! I have a nexus one...the oled screen is not as great as many think (most of whom have never even used one in person).
The screen is horrible outside, as we all know...but also, the colors are complerely unrealistic. The sub pixel layout makes the text and images appear much lower resolution than the same res on an LCD screen.
The power consumption on a oled is actually worse than an LCD in most cases...when the picture isn't stationary or when it is bright and not mostly black, oled actually consumes more power.
Those are the facts
 
LCD displays don't wash out completely (100%) in sunlight whereas OLED and AMOLED displays do. LCD isn't as bright or sharp in sunlight relative to indoors but it's somewhat visible, more so than OLED displays. OLED displays don't make sense for mobile phones, which are meant to be used primarily in and outdoors. If the product, like a external monitor or desktop screen, is meant to be used indoors, then OLED would be perfect. It just doesn't make sense outdoors.

IPS isn't that bad, the iPad somehow achieves 10 hours of watching movies with it's 10" IPS. It's not the same comparison granted.

I've had no problem using the zune hd's screen outside. I actually found it to be an improvement over lcd outside as the constrast ratio is better. OLED is black without any charge applied to a pixel. The only screen that wash out in light completely are phospher based screens like CRT's and Plasmas.
 
I'm not even in the market for an iPhone, or any phone, but this is good news coming from Apple. It keeps them a step ahead of the competition.

The HD moniker is being used a bit too much though lately, especially on products that are not really true HD at all. I also think that the iPad is great, but it's not true HD either of course.
 
Serious question but does the A4 chip even have the power to play 1280x720 or 1024x768 (ipad native) resolution video?

I know it's more powerful than the old chip in the iphone 3g / 3gs but that's a mighty high resolution. Also there's no extra ram and keeping that resolution in a framebuffer is going to be tricky.

I'm not really complaining, even if the video had to be re-sampled to 960x640 I'm cool with that - I'm just curious if it could even do it.

Well, here's how I rationalize this ... it won't be the A4 CPU itself that will do the video processing. It will be the onchip video core, which is extremely likely to be the same PowerVR 535GX that's in the iPad. ( Which of course has a hardware H.264 decoder. )

I've read that the PowerVR SGX chip has access to all memory onboard ( 256MB ) this is, of course an insane amount of memory to decode video with. To double buffer 960x480 at 32bit depth (overkill you'll need about 5MB of ram... I know you said 1280x720, so that would grow to about 7.5MB.
if you need to assemble B frames ( or whatever it's called in h.264 speak ) you'll likely need double this for smooth rendering... so... 15MB.

I do have serous doubts about the chipset being able to handle any high bitrates though, unless they've been holding back on us.
However, Apple's iPad specs say this chip complies with Main Profile 3.1 which has an impressive throughput of 13.6Mbit. I am not entirely sure I believe it can really support that. (Why such poor mpeg4 performance then? )

I, for one, hope they come out with a new Dock with HDMI for this model ( hopefully they'll update the ipod touch too! ) , it would rock to be able to put this to the test.

( one other thing to think about is if the AppleTV rumor is true, it's likely also the A4 processor, and if the rumored specs of being aple to do 1080p are true, then we have an argument ( albeit a thin one ) for the iPhone being able to handle 720p

:)




The current iPhone supports 480p output ( 720x480 ), and 960x640 is roughly double that in total pixels ( H x V )
 
If they do end up calling this new phone the "iPhone HD" I'm going to really laugh when everyone around here, predictably, thinks nothing of it, and calls it the best thing ever. Yet, when the "Zune HD" comes out, everyone here laughs at its screen and notes that it isn't HD.

Reality check, 960x640 is very high-res, but it certainly isn't HD. Not even close. I guess I shouldn't be surprised though. The term "HD" is so overused these days, it almost has no true meaning or value as a descriptor. Just tack it on to any item these days, and call it awesome. :rolleyes:

I expect the 2010 iPhone to be called "iPhone HD." Not because of its screen resolution, but because of its video camera. To be called "HD", a display needs at least 720 lines of vertical resolution, which the iPhone only has if you hold it in portrait mode.

But it should be able to shoot HD video in 720p MPEG-4 at the minimum. So technically it would qualify as an HD device just for its video encoding resolution.

And, of course, the internals of the iPhone HD most likely will eventually be put into a smaller, cheaper, simpler, cloud-centric Apple TV. That way, the same hardware and software could be used in everything from iPod Touch to iPhone to iPad to Apple TV. It will help reduce Apple's hardware and software development costs and it could present a unified experience across all non-Mac platforms that Apple sells. Ultimately, even the Mac could migrate away from Intel onto the real PA Semi chip, which Apple probably won't reveal until next year (but that's another story.)

It all seems so inevitable at this point. Anyway, that updated Apple TV (running iPhone OS on an A4 or later chip) should easily be able output 1080p, the holy grail of HDTV.
 
If they do end up calling this new phone the "iPhone HD" I'm going to really laugh when everyone around here, predictably, thinks nothing of it, and calls it the best thing ever. Yet, when the "Zune HD" comes out, everyone here laughs at its screen and notes that it isn't HD.

Reality check, 960x640 is very high-res, but it certainly isn't HD. Not even close. I guess I shouldn't be surprised though. The term "HD" is so overused these days, it almost has no true meaning or value as a descriptor. Just tack it on to any item these days, and call it awesome. :rolleyes:

QFT!
 
I've had no problem using the zune hd's screen outside. I actually found it to be an improvement over lcd outside as the constrast ratio is better. OLED is black without any charge applied to a pixel. The only screen that wash out in light completely are phospher based screens like CRT's and Plasmas.

Who cares what color the screen is when it's off? My friend's Zune HD is Dead HD outside. Yes, I borrowed it one time and I couldn't see ANYTHING outside. Inside, it's a wonder. Outside, it's a wonder how people even use this.
 
in my country , contact lens sellers put HD behind the name of their products. Clearly HD is overused. I don't want it on my next iPhone lest the resolution is 1280 x 720!
 
To be honest, I wouldn't buy an iPhone/iPad with 5MP+ unless they started to roll out controls similar to standard point-and-shoot cameras. It's a REALLY stupid idea to have a GOOD quality camera with no controls whatsoever and expect people to use it instead of their Canons and/or Nikons. It's not just about taking pictures of yourself in the bathroom mirror, it's about being able to push photos to Flickr/videos to YouTube as you're shooting them.
 
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