eventually?? EVENTUALLY?? oh come on you were a dinosaur 2 years ago, the funny thing is im looking forward to see reasons against ssds when they become cheaper - its the exact same thing (cd/dvd - usb) dont you think?
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eventually?? EVENTUALLY?? oh come on you were a dinosaur 2 years ago, the funny thing is im looking forward to see reasons against ssds when they become cheaper - its the exact same thing (cd/dvd - usb) dont you think?
The only reasons against SSDs when they become cheaper will be slower write speeds and performance/reliability degradation, both of which are expected to improve right around the time they are due to become cheaper, so you probably won't see too many complaints, if any about SSDs at that time. That said, we're not there yet. Until we are, hard drives make the most sense.
Similarly, DVDs (which is still the dominant format for purchased movies, and the dominant format for software distribution for things over 2GB, mind you) are still used to install software and playback movies, especially in areas where high-speed internet isn't available. Also there are times when you don't have Internet and you need to install software, or do things like reload the entire OS. Yes, Apple has the MacBook Air restore on a thumb drive, but to date that's the only piece of software available on that medium. The Mac App Store is nice and all, but it limits a lot of software. Point being that people like me will always gripe about needing an optical drive as long as situations exist where an optical drive is the best solution for that situation. As for the argument to have an external optical drive, it's much more inconvenient to have an extra accessory, especially when the MacBook Pros have a 7-8 hour battery life (thereby eliminating the need to always cart around a MagSafe adapter). The whole point of it being a "Pro" laptop is that it has everything I could possibly need. Sure, very few use the optical drive every day, but I'm sure everyone is glad it's there when they finally do need to use it.
I cite things like the iPad, the Motorola Xoom (let alone any Honeycomb tablet), and the HP TouchPad, because those all employ platforms and OSes that were designed from their inception to (more or less) not utilize removable media. Such isn't true of desktop Mac OS X. Again, when it is (and I'm not ruling out that it will be), I'll say that the optical is prime for removal. Until then, it really only makes sense on something ultraportable like the MacBook Air, or something server-like like the Mac mini Server.
have you read the other thing i wrote? i dont know how to multiquote or smth
no, ssd/hdd combo makes the most sense right know - see the difference between us? people have the tendency to think something is better if its cheaper - english is not my main language so a cant tell you what i mean but il try... you said hdd makes the most sense but thats not right - ssd makes the most sense in EVERY aspect, price is something else, you either have the money for it or dont. like cars, what car should you buy, it makes sense to buy the car that drives the best, with best handling looks interior etc. it makes the most sense to buy that car, but price - you either have the money and buy it, or don't and have to satisfy with something not so good, get it?
no, ssd/hdd combo makes the most sense right know - see the difference between us? people have the tendency to think something is better if its cheaper - english is not my main language so a cant tell you what i mean but il try... you said hdd makes the most sense but thats not right - ssd makes the most sense in EVERY aspect, price is something else, you either have the money for it or dont. like cars, what car should you buy, it makes sense to buy the car that drives the best, with best handling looks interior etc. it makes the most sense to buy that car, but price - you either have the money and buy it, or don't and have to satisfy with something not so good, get it?
its not my fault that the software industry evolves so slow - its yours! you and your cds and dvds, i could have all my programs, everything i could possibly need on thumb drives that are 1/20 the size of a cd or a cd case but no you have to have your cds and dvds
the only valid argument i was expecting from you is audio cd, unfortunately i didnt get it, but that also has a solution
oh come on who has a 2500 $ laptop and doesnt have broadband? definitely <10% so not important
if you need optical drive once in a week at most, pure logic tells you that it shouldnt be inside, im sure you use it far less often
the only valid argument i was expecting from you is audio cd, unfortunately i didnt get it, but that also has a solution
oh come on who has a 2500 $ laptop and doesnt have broadband? definitely <10% so not important
if you need optical drive once in a week at most, pure logic tells you that it shouldnt be inside, im sure you use it far less often
I don't think SSD doesn't make sense because it costs so much. I think so because while it costs so much, it's also a very young technology, and as is the case with all technologies throughout the course of human civilization, they need to be fine tuned before they are optimal enough to be adopted absolutely everywhere. I don't think SSD is there yet. It's both expensive and is marred by slow write speeds, as well as performance and reliability degradation caused by re-writes over time. As soon as these hurdles are (inevitably) overcome, it'll replace hard drives easily. For the time being, if you are the type of person that can (a) afford a 128GB-256GB SSD and only have that much worth of OS and App data, having both that and a hard drive makes perfect sense today. I won't deny that. I will deny its cost effectiveness in a MacBook Pro that already is costing $2500. But it can totally be engineered, with or without an optical drive (as evidenced by the MacBook Air's Blade-style SSDs).
How do you figure that?
That's how they're sold in stores. Not my fault that's how media has been sold in the last 20 years.
I only buy audio CDs when I like an entire album from start to finish. Sadly that doesn't happen often, so as a result I only have a handful of audio CDs and the rest of my music is either on AAC or MP3 files.
You'd be surprised. But more importantly, while you might have broadband at your house, (a) you can't download and install a 6GB program faster than it takes to simply insert the DVD and run the installer, and (b) you might be taking your laptop to a place that doesn't have broadband. This happens more frequently than you realize.
I think most people would rather it be integrated. I certainly would rather have one less separate thing to tow around all the time and I know I'm not alone in that. Also, it costs $100 extra to have it be external. Charging me $100 for a feature I had previously and with the added inconvenience of having to carry around something separate? No thanks. If I am to have useful things that I wont be using all that often like an Ethernet port, a Thunderbolt/MiniDisplayPort and a FireWire 800 port, then it only makes sense to lump in an optical drive for the exact same reason. I might not need it every day, but it's there at no extra charge or inconvenience if I do. And again, don't fool yourself, Apple won't do anything useful with that space. Most people assume that the cavity used for the optical drive can be used for a slew of useful things, but really the only thing that could realistically go there is a second drive (you can't put a better GPU, CPU, or cooling in that space), and if they use MacBook Air blade SSDs, then they can achieve that goal without removing anything.
Really, if you want the thing gone so bad, why don't you just get a MacBook Air? Soon they will have Sandy Bridge and the performance gap between them and a current 13" MBP will be much smaller once again.
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slow write speeds? do we read the same reviews or im missing smth? slow write as opposed to hdd or? even if they degrade they are still faster than hdd
for people that need more storage theres ssd/hdd combo, thats why i mentioned it earlier
cost effectiveness in a laptop worth 2500$? are people collecting their allowance money to buy it or what? if youre buying such expensive laptop it really should have an ssd, its a must, and apple will make ssd/hdd combo in the next iteration mark my words because in probably one of the most expensive laptops in the world there needs to be an ssd and apple knows that
i figure that because people still use cd and dvd after 20 years
so you dont need cd for audio, what do you need it for then? movies?
software should be on usbs and it will be if they start removing odds
so youre ok with towing around cd box but separate odd is a problem?
i completely agree with you if they dont use the extra space for smth useful than it should stay, but apple knows how and can and have surprised us in the past i dont see the reason they wont in the future, if we knew what they can do with that space we'd be in different position right now if you know what i mean
and if i wants 17inch screen, descrete gpu what then? where do i go?
you know how should 17 inch macbook look like in my opinion? - 2 usb ports on every side positioned verticaly, and 1 thunderbolt port on every side, and audio in/out thats it, and of course handful of adapters standard, without the odd
and one more thing, they need to reinvent cooling, maybe liquid cooling? one thing they could use that extra space for
for people that need more storage theres ssd/hdd combo, thats why i mentioned it earlier
cost effectiveness in a laptop worth 2500$? are people collecting their allowance money to buy it or what? if youre buying such expensive laptop it really should have an ssd, its a must, and apple will make ssd/hdd combo in the next iteration mark my words because in probably one of the most expensive laptops in the world there needs to be an ssd and apple knows that
i figure that because people still use cd and dvd after 20 years
so you dont need cd for audio, what do you need it for then? movies?
software should be on usbs and it will be if they start removing odds
so youre ok with towing around cd box but separate odd is a problem?
i completely agree with you if they dont use the extra space for smth useful than it should stay, but apple knows how and can and have surprised us in the past i dont see the reason they wont in the future, if we knew what they can do with that space we'd be in different position right now if you know what i mean
and if i wants 17inch screen, descrete gpu what then? where do i go?
you know how should 17 inch macbook look like in my opinion? - 2 usb ports on every side positioned verticaly, and 1 thunderbolt port on every side, and audio in/out thats it, and of course handful of adapters standard, without the odd
and one more thing, they need to reinvent cooling, maybe liquid cooling? one thing they could use that extra space for
No dude, definitely a fact. The strength of SSDs is in the read speeds; they have way faster read speeds than hard drives and they have way slower write speeds than hard drives. Hence why most people with one of each are using the SSD for the OS and apps, and the hard drive for data. I imagine that this will inevitably improve to the point where SSDs replace hard drives altogether; that is the natural evolution of the technology, but we're not there yet and we're definitely not there today.
Right, and I'm not saying that it's a bad idea. I'm saying it's expensive and very few people will be willing to fork out that much money for it.
I've been saving for over a year. The economy sucks and money is tight. Not everyone can afford to just drop that kind of money on a computer, like it's nothing..
It's called Apple Tax. Though even without it, SSD costs are roughly $2 per GB, and that's not worth it in a machine that is currently only configured to have one drive (despite the ability to have two via SSD blades).
People said the Early 2011 MacBook Pros would have SSD and HDD, but it didn't. I don't doubt that they can do it, but whether or not they actually do it is another matter entirely. In the meantime, Apple offers a laptop with one or the other and for most people, that's just fine.
I take my laptop to my girlfriend's house and we watch movies that are at her house on my laptop, as an example. Or I take my laptop to the public library, check out a DVD, watch it there. Or I go to a Motel, rent a movie at the nearby local video rental place, and watch a movie there. I could go on with more examples if you'd like. Software should be on USB sticks, but if DVDs are already the dominant movie watching medium, might as well put 'em on disc.
Apple doesn't work that way. They think that all of their customers care about thinness, and to them, it is almost worth sacrificing for. The MacBook Pro is not that kind of product. It's designed to get work done, not to be a thin computer. Look at the iPod touch for example; does that product need to be thinner? Yet they keep making it thinner for what purpose? They could put in a much better built-in speaker if it were only thicker. The same applies here. They won't use that extra space for anything on your wishlist; that's not how they operate.
You buy a 17" MacBook Pro. And yes, it comes with an optical drive, but it also comes with little used space-sucking things like the ExpressCard slot, because guess what? The whole point of that machine is to have everything at your disposal.
Cute idea, but no, laptops don't need liquid cooling. You can't improve the cooling much beyond having the entire chassis function as a giant heatsink. Doesn't work like that. You are only going to get better cooling by making it thicker and using CPUs/GPUs that run cooler. End o' story.
i still dont understand what you are talking about... vertex 3 has a write speed of about 200 mbs (small 4k random) and hdds? i could find only 150 mbs write dont know whats it for...
believe me, i dont know a single person that goes to rental video store, i went there a lot before maybe 4-5 years, but then i discovered internet, for me its way better to wait half an hour for movie to download then to take a walk to the rental place, i go there only for smokes and booze, and guess what they are selling their dvd collection for dollar a piece it appears nobody rents movies anymore...
i dont understand how can you be so unpractical? renting movies? who does that anymore? there a lot of other ways - you even have an option to pay or not to pay - you should really think about it its much better believe me
where do you live? in Vietnam?
hell, make it even thinner, i dont need smth i dont need INSIDE my laptop
you can't improve cooling? well, could you improve mobile phones beyond nokia n80? guess who did
believe me, i dont know a single person that goes to rental video store, i went there a lot before maybe 4-5 years, but then i discovered internet, for me its way better to wait half an hour for movie to download then to take a walk to the rental place, i go there only for smokes and booze, and guess what they are selling their dvd collection for dollar a piece it appears nobody rents movies anymore...
i dont understand how can you be so unpractical? renting movies? who does that anymore? there a lot of other ways - you even have an option to pay or not to pay - you should really think about it its much better believe me
where do you live? in Vietnam?
hell, make it even thinner, i dont need smth i dont need INSIDE my laptop
you can't improve cooling? well, could you improve mobile phones beyond nokia n80? guess who did
I have yet to see an SSD with a FASTER write speed than that of a hard drive. I figure when that day comes, we'll all rejoice the death of the hard drive. I have yet to hear such rejoicing. What does that tell you?
I know no one selling their DVD collection. People do download their movies online, but I know no one who does it exclusively.
It's called Redbox. It's called Netflix. Tell those highly successful businesses that no one rents movies and they'll laugh in your face.
No, but I'm sure there are Mac users that do. The world, let alone the Mac world doesn't revolve around you, y'know.
Luckily, you aren't Apple's only customer. There are enough people who disagree with you to clearly prevent them from doing that, otherwise they already would've.
Unfair comparison. Nice try though. That's like me saying the U.S. got a man on the moon, so why aren't they curing cancer?
No. You are not funny.
De gustibus non disputandum est
Personally, I like black. The current Dell Latitudes with the black brushed magnesium and aluminum chassis are very nice, and the ThinkPads are classics.
The Apple "pro" laptops haven't changed their basic styling since the Titanium PowerBook G4 in January 2001 - it's old, stale and above all boring. Tacky white plastic MacBooks - forget about them.
That's my opinion, and you cannot dispute it.
you aint saying any numbers here and i want to hear the numbers, according to my numbers ssds are FASTER in every way
why would people sell their dvd collection? i aint selling mine. just need to store it in digital form and thats it, and for about 3-5 years when i see i havent touched them for about 3-5 years ill throw them in garbage, and yes my only source of any kind of entertainment is from online sources, and its only because i find it more practical and easy than any other way
you just dont seem to see what i have been meaning to say, do you find it easier to do a couple of mouse clicks and watch a movie or go to the dvd rental and grab a movie, or go to the place where you keep your dvd collection, find a movie open the case put the dvd into the odd and then watch a move?
well your sure aint you? ok lets wait while everybody get flat broadband internet and then a few years more when they get bored of their precious dvd collections then we can get rid of the odd
unfair comparison? well it a valid comparison which implies that apple has surprised us with something no one see it coming dont you agree? get it now? apple knows how their laptops can get hot, thats probably the most discussed topic on these forums, and i can say for certain that they are trying to do something about it, they are not just waiting for cooler processors like you say.
and yes, theres NO WAY they can improve cooling. you have a degree in smth relevant or?
De gustibus non disputandum est
Personally, I like black. The current Dell Latitudes with the black brushed magnesium and aluminum chassis are very nice, and the ThinkPads are classics.
The Apple "pro" laptops haven't changed their basic styling since the Titanium PowerBook G4 in January 2001 - it's old, stale and above all boring. Tacky white plastic MacBooks - forget about them.
That's my opinion, and you cannot dispute it.
one name: justin bieber
and what do they know, its been 2000 years
De gustibus non disputandum est
Personally, I like black. The current Dell Latitudes with the black brushed magnesium and aluminum chassis are very nice, and the ThinkPads are classics.
The Apple "pro" laptops haven't changed their basic styling since the Titanium PowerBook G4 in January 2001 - it's old, stale and above all boring. Tacky white plastic MacBooks - forget about them.
That's my opinion, and you cannot dispute it.
what?
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Don't do that....
If you dump the discs, you won't have proof that you can claim Fair Play rights to those ISOs on your hard drive.
And you won't have backups for those ISOs.
And, if you transcoded them, you won't be able to re-rip them when a better format comes around.
If you dump the discs, you won't have proof that you can claim Fair Play rights to those ISOs on your hard drive.
And you won't have backups for those ISOs.
And, if you transcoded them, you won't be able to re-rip them when a better format comes around.
De gustibus non disputandum est
Personally, I like black. The current Dell Latitudes with the black brushed magnesium and aluminum chassis are very nice, and the ThinkPads are classics.
The Apple "pro" laptops haven't changed their basic styling since the Titanium PowerBook G4 in January 2001 - it's old, stale and above all boring. Tacky white plastic MacBooks - forget about them.
That's my opinion, and you cannot dispute it.
Just so you know, Dell has changed the design on the Latitudes. We've already started to deploy them at my company. The new design is...not as aesthetically pleasing as the old, but supposedly more rugged.
That's interesting, I hadn't looked at Dell in ages. Just went to their site to see what they look like, and I'd say they're not bad.
What's your take, pros and cons?
Thanks
That's interesting, I hadn't looked at Dell in ages. Just went to their site to see what they look like, and I'd say they're not bad.
What's your take, pros and cons?
Thanks
So far so good. Typing on an E6420 right now. No problems with the keyboard redesign. It may be mental, but I find that typing is easier and faster on the new models. Compared to my E6410, this E6420 is heavier, larger, and of course faster with the second generation Sandy Bridge processor. I can't comment on the battery life, because this is my secondary tester machine. I primarily use the E6410 at work and the E6420 at home.
Yebubbleman, please have a look at the SSD reviews by Anandtech (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4316/ocz-vertex-3-240gb-review/2).
There just is not ground for your claims that HDDs are faster in writing than SSDs. If I am wrong, please refer to some tests.
Regarding the future revision of macbook pro, I am in favor of dropping ODD, glossy screens, huge bezel and some weight.
There just is not ground for your claims that HDDs are faster in writing than SSDs. If I am wrong, please refer to some tests.
Regarding the future revision of macbook pro, I am in favor of dropping ODD, glossy screens, huge bezel and some weight.
no way. glossy FTW. Plasmas have it right.
If you are a serious pro photog, I can see maybe wanting a matte, but otherwise glossy rules.