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No More IE for Mac
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I know we all have problems with M$, but I think it's reasonable to see in the course of history in this matter a hint that our friends in the MBU at M$ gave Apple a big heads-up that this was coming and gave Apple plenty of time to develop their own product before the IE cancellation was announced.
Can you imagine the volume of the "Apple is Dead" crowd if the end of development IE for Mac had been announced before Safari was introduced? Apple's stock would have dropped 10 percent in a day.
The folks who put together IE for Mac have done what they could under the conditions. Remember how special we felt when we could change the color of our IE color scheme to match our iMac color?
Hate M$, but don't hide all your love from the MBU folks. They probably saved Apple's butt with a heads-up on this one.
Can you imagine the volume of the "Apple is Dead" crowd if the end of development IE for Mac had been announced before Safari was introduced? Apple's stock would have dropped 10 percent in a day.
The folks who put together IE for Mac have done what they could under the conditions. Remember how special we felt when we could change the color of our IE color scheme to match our iMac color?
Hate M$, but don't hide all your love from the MBU folks. They probably saved Apple's butt with a heads-up on this one.
has anybody considered...
Microsoft may be abandoning IE because now they can build a brand new browser and do only half the work. Apple will be bundling WebCore.framework into the OS so any browser will be able to use it. I have a strange feeling we haven't looked at all possibilities. Microsoft has the resources to throw together a new browser from scratch and compete head-to-head with Safari. However, personally, I doubt this will happen.
P.S. those of you using v74, can you log into Hotmail? I used to be able to to, but v74 doesn't seem to let me.
Microsoft may be abandoning IE because now they can build a brand new browser and do only half the work. Apple will be bundling WebCore.framework into the OS so any browser will be able to use it. I have a strange feeling we haven't looked at all possibilities. Microsoft has the resources to throw together a new browser from scratch and compete head-to-head with Safari. However, personally, I doubt this will happen.
P.S. those of you using v74, can you log into Hotmail? I used to be able to to, but v74 doesn't seem to let me.
no one will switch to apple for safari so i think apple should go ahead and release safari for windows, really steal some thunder. the only problem that could arouse from that is if microsoft stopped office, which would stop apple in its place, lose lots of business sales and potentially many consumer sales.
iJon
iJon
The bandaid
Oh my my my,
The poor souls stuck in windows are losing thier snake oil. In the days before I used Macs the general fix-all in Windows was to re-install Internet Explorer. I know it sounds weird but indeed it does (temporarily) fix many-o-problems.
I think I have used IE once in OSX and it was most likely a mistake...
I say farewell Internet Exploder, not sure you will be missed.
Oh my my my,
The poor souls stuck in windows are losing thier snake oil. In the days before I used Macs the general fix-all in Windows was to re-install Internet Explorer. I know it sounds weird but indeed it does (temporarily) fix many-o-problems.
I think I have used IE once in OSX and it was most likely a mistake...
I say farewell Internet Exploder, not sure you will be missed.
Maybe M$ will *borrow Opera technology.
*Acquiring them against their will, using nothing but the latest in Microsoft theft technology.
*Acquiring them against their will, using nothing but the latest in Microsoft theft technology.
Re: this is not entirely good
I'm sorry but this is no issue especially for someoen at a web developement company as you should be testing in VPC or on a pc as well not just IE for mac. IE for mac is more picky then IE for windows no doubt, but between Safari and IE in VPC and IE 5.2, I really don't see a problem for anyone for a few years. By then, Safari will rock.
I'm sorry but this is no issue especially for someoen at a web developement company as you should be testing in VPC or on a pc as well not just IE for mac. IE for mac is more picky then IE for windows no doubt, but between Safari and IE in VPC and IE 5.2, I really don't see a problem for anyone for a few years. By then, Safari will rock.
heh!
That's pretty funny, since Microsoft announced that they will still develop IE for mac and their MBU was making huge progress in IE 6 for mac, and had no plans of discontinuing it, when Apple released Safari. Yet another case of Microsoft not keeping their word.
Oh well, regardless, IE for OS X sucked anyways, so no big loss. OS X still has 6 or so browsers available.
That's pretty funny, since Microsoft announced that they will still develop IE for mac and their MBU was making huge progress in IE 6 for mac, and had no plans of discontinuing it, when Apple released Safari. Yet another case of Microsoft not keeping their word.
Oh well, regardless, IE for OS X sucked anyways, so no big loss. OS X still has 6 or so browsers available.
How?!?!
Remember:
Never ever ever was there a time when the Windows version of Internet Explorer rendered the same way as the Mac version of Internet Explorer. They both were totally different code bases and rendered things their own way. Win supported 'xxy' okay but Mac didn't... Mac supported 'yyx' okay but Win didn't...
MSIE for the Mac was just one more 'less than perfect web browser' (note: no web browser is perfect they all have 'issues') that web developers either chose to test against or not.
A web developer that never chose to test his/her designs and code against the Mac version of IE will still choose NOT to test designs against Safari. A web developer that DID choose to test against the Mac version of MSIE will now test against Safari (and stop testing against MSIE since it's not being developed any longer). No harm no foul near as I can tell... Oh and maybe it's PLUS since web developers and users don't have to 'choose' Safari or MSIE for OS X... Thus Safari gets more Market share by default and more web designers WILL test against it if the numbers grow.
Anyway... This is just like Microsoft... they don't like competition... They are either 'the only game in town' or they buy / destroy the other games so they become 'the only game in town' ... if they can't do that they take their ball and run home.
Good riddens to bad rubbish...
Dave
Microsoft Internet Explorer is one of the first things that I delete from a new Mac. I keep a copy of Mozilla or Safari on disk so that I don't have to touch MSIE and "agree" to the Microsoft license. Deleting MSIE recovers about 24 MB of disk space and eliminates the security problems inherent in using Microsoft software.
From the MSIE EULA:
"Without prejudice to any other rights, Microsoft may terminate this EULA if you fail to comply with the terms and conditions of this EULA. In such event, you must destroy all copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT."
No, Microsoft, you can't. I will have already destroyed the software by the time I close the window containing the license.
I hope that Apple will dump Microsoft Office next.
From the MSIE EULA:
"Without prejudice to any other rights, Microsoft may terminate this EULA if you fail to comply with the terms and conditions of this EULA. In such event, you must destroy all copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT."
No, Microsoft, you can't. I will have already destroyed the software by the time I close the window containing the license.
I hope that Apple will dump Microsoft Office next.
Yea, but its not like web sites that only worked in windows IE some how also worked only in IE mac, mostly they didn't...more than anything, MS's proprietary Java (not included with IE mac) is what causes the incompatibility...that and WinDOS Media Player 9.
Missing the point
I believe most of the posters here are missing the point.
This is just the final phase of Microsoft's classic "accept, extend, kill-of-non-MS-Windows-versions".
After a few fits and starts, Microsoft came out with a browser equal to Netscape Navigator. Because it was not clearly and obviously better than Navigator, they embedded it into the Windows OS so the default would be IE. Easily 90% of the Windows users switched to IE when they (or their company) upgraded to the newer versions of Windows. MS was convicted of illegally extending their monopoly in part because of this. (Their punishment? They had to promise to never do it again. Just as it was with the first "consent decree" they signed.)
The next step was to extend the capabilities of IE with MS proprietary stuff. The most recent levels of this are deep within the .Net programming that many companies are slowly moving to in their newest web enabled front ends to everything from corporate data base access to online sales. Only browsers that support the extended capabilities will be able to be used to view these sites.
Then MS kills of all non MS Windows versions of IE. There is nothing which requires MS to publish all the non-standard, MS extensions for Internet use of .Net and IE. MS does not have to publish changes to non-standard, MS specific extensions each time they put out a patch set for .Net developers or IE.
Thus all other browser developers are simply a step or two behind these MS specific extensions. The result is Apple, and others, must find out from users, "Oh, Safari does not work with this site any more. We need to find out what happened, what's changed."
Businesses are not going to go with any browser that puts them in a position to not be able to access what they need to access. A multi-day (or maybe even a multi-week) lag between MS making changes and Apple making changes to Safari to keep up will not be tolerated by most businesses.
Thus more and more users/companies will be forced to migrate to Windows. Just another example of the abuse of a monopoly position.
What will their punishment be this time? Probably no different than the last two times!
I believe most of the posters here are missing the point.
This is just the final phase of Microsoft's classic "accept, extend, kill-of-non-MS-Windows-versions".
After a few fits and starts, Microsoft came out with a browser equal to Netscape Navigator. Because it was not clearly and obviously better than Navigator, they embedded it into the Windows OS so the default would be IE. Easily 90% of the Windows users switched to IE when they (or their company) upgraded to the newer versions of Windows. MS was convicted of illegally extending their monopoly in part because of this. (Their punishment? They had to promise to never do it again. Just as it was with the first "consent decree" they signed.)
The next step was to extend the capabilities of IE with MS proprietary stuff. The most recent levels of this are deep within the .Net programming that many companies are slowly moving to in their newest web enabled front ends to everything from corporate data base access to online sales. Only browsers that support the extended capabilities will be able to be used to view these sites.
Then MS kills of all non MS Windows versions of IE. There is nothing which requires MS to publish all the non-standard, MS extensions for Internet use of .Net and IE. MS does not have to publish changes to non-standard, MS specific extensions each time they put out a patch set for .Net developers or IE.
Thus all other browser developers are simply a step or two behind these MS specific extensions. The result is Apple, and others, must find out from users, "Oh, Safari does not work with this site any more. We need to find out what happened, what's changed."
Businesses are not going to go with any browser that puts them in a position to not be able to access what they need to access. A multi-day (or maybe even a multi-week) lag between MS making changes and Apple making changes to Safari to keep up will not be tolerated by most businesses.
Thus more and more users/companies will be forced to migrate to Windows. Just another example of the abuse of a monopoly position.
What will their punishment be this time? Probably no different than the last two times!
Not good news for mac users
As much as I hate IE, I still have to use it on occasion. Yes, some web pages only seem to work properly for IE. Like it or not, it's become a standard of sorts. With M$ abandoning it entirely, this is not good news at all. How long until they abandon Office? Also makes me question what we'll really see out of VPC now that they own it.
This was their plan all along. Kill all browser competetition. Make it so you have to have IE, which you can only get by buying windows. Same old anticompetetive BS they always do. And now the Justice Department just looks the other way, even though they have been ruled an abusive monopoly. We all know the current administration loves a good monopoly.
As much as I hate IE, I still have to use it on occasion. Yes, some web pages only seem to work properly for IE. Like it or not, it's become a standard of sorts. With M$ abandoning it entirely, this is not good news at all. How long until they abandon Office? Also makes me question what we'll really see out of VPC now that they own it.
This was their plan all along. Kill all browser competetition. Make it so you have to have IE, which you can only get by buying windows. Same old anticompetetive BS they always do. And now the Justice Department just looks the other way, even though they have been ruled an abusive monopoly. We all know the current administration loves a good monopoly.
This could be bad. Many web designers take the easy way out and check for browser "x", not if your browser is compatible, the banking industry is notorious for this. So if we don't have IE, and a site only looks for IE, no matter how good your browser is you're out of luck. I've always found the fact that there is so much difference in how all the browsers display pages completely against all logic... there are html code standards after all... but then again MS has never really followed established standards have they.
From the info on MSN8:
User Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; PPC Mac OS X 10.2.6; Tasman 0.9; MSN 8.0; MSN Explorer 2.0; MSNbMSN; MSNmen-us; MSNc11)
I normally don't use IE or MSN8 to surf the web (MSN8 came packaged with my DSL and was cheapest). I like Camino and Safari but until web coders start adhering to the web standards (and not just IE "standards") there will always be problems using non-IE browsers. Perhaps this will be the push to make them true standards.
Makes me wonder if M$ had this planned as a way to force windoze users to upgrade to fix bugs.
bye bye
The less MS software I have on my computer the better.
I still have IE on my HD just in case I can get nothing else to work.. Haven't used it for like a year though. Safari is the way to go.
The less MS software I have on my computer the better.
I still have IE on my HD just in case I can get nothing else to work.. Haven't used it for like a year though. Safari is the way to go.
Wooohooooo! Party at my house to celebrate!
How does it make it less compatible? I'm a little confused about that.
How does it make it less compatible? I'm a little confused about that.
I seem to be able to interest potential Switchers into buying Macs after they hear that they don't need to spend so much money on Microsoft software. Once OpenOffice.org comes out of Beta, Microsoft Office really will be an expensive and unnecessary piece of junk. The removal of the cost of Microsoft software is enough for some people to justify the higher Apple prices.