Original Apple Pencil vs. Apple Pencil 2

[tromboneaholic]

My question to all Photoshop users: Why are you still using the predatory Adobe app and not Affinity Photo...?

Adobe Premiere Pro and After Effects are really what I'm paying for at this point. I'm not going to argue the benefits of Photoshop, but I've been using it since 1996, so I'll try something new when it fits into my workflow. That's why I haven't really embraced DaVinci Resolve, since using it for grading isn't as seamless as Lumetri even though it's superior.

 

[jonnysods]

Glad they changed the charging method for the pencil! The lightning connector in the previous model was laughable!

 

[mixel]

My question to all Photoshop users: Why are you still using the predatory Adobe app and not Affinity Photo...?

Why do you keep asking this, you know the answer? Many pros *need* full a full editable PSD workflow. If they're going to be sending work to others who are also using Adobe software. Others are used to PS, like it's brushes etc. There are so many valid reasons for using Adobe apps.

I'm not an adobe user (anymore)! I switched to Affinity/Procreate/ComicDraw - and my design work for clients is totally Adobe-free - even saying that - there have been a couple of occasions where not being able to export from Affinity to PSD with editable text* layers and layer effects intact was a huge pain in the ass.

And Lightroom is great! A lot of people have Photoshop/Lightroom photography bundle. There is no sense in knocking Adobe. Yes they're slow. Yes, arguably Serif are doing better in the tablet space and have a better relationship with their customers, but Photoshop is great and people have decades of experience with it.. Why question what people want and like to use? It doesn't make people want to use Affinity instead.

*Edited for clarity

 

[tromboneaholic]

Why do you keep asking this, you know the answer? Many pros *need* full a full editable PSD workflow. If they're going to be sending work to others who are also using Adobe software. Others are used to PS, like it's brushes etc. There are so many valid reasons for using Adobe apps.

I'm not an adobe user (anymore)! I switched to Affinity/Procreate/ComicDraw - and my design work for clients is totally Adobe-free - even saying that - there have been a couple of occasions where not being able to export from Affinity to PSD with editable layers and layer effects intact was a huge pain in the ass.

And Lightroom is great! A lot of people have Photoshop/Lightroom photography bundle. There is no sense in knocking Adobe. Yes they're slow. Yes, arguably Serif are doing better in the tablet space and have a better relationship with their customers, but Photoshop is great and people have decades of experience with it.. Why question what people want and like to use? It doesn't make people want to use Affinity instead.

Yes, but why do so many Formula 1 drivers drive Formula 1 cars?

 

[Perene]

I tried this experiment today. If you leave the pencil alone for about 10 minutes it goes to sleep without draining the battery much. Any motion though it wakes up. I left it alone on the desk all day and checked the battery widget until it disappeared took roughly 10 minutes. As soon as I picked it up it activated and was ready to use no connecting it to the iPad to wake it. The odd thing though is last I looked at it was at 88% charge before it went to sleep without connecting it to the iPad, 9 or 10 hours later it was showing 94% charge. So not sure what Apple’s battery algorithm is but something seems off. I dunno what to say seems to be working as intended, wish Apple would release some documentation on it.

This post suggests that after a few minutes the Pencil enters into sleep mode. An information that isn't available ANYWHERE. I discovered right now something interesting:

Yeah my gen 1 always drains a little. But I think to some extent that’s just the nature of lithium battery devices. 21% over 48 hours seems high though. Not sure mine has ever been that bad. But turning it off (via turning off Bluetooth) sure saves way more battery than leaving it on.

Speaking of battery, once the 1st gen Pencil it's attached to the charging adapter and a lightning to USB cable it keeps trying to broadcast a signal. So even if I turn bluetooth 100% off this will happen.

Could this be due to this Pencil trying to broadcast to the iPAD's widget the current battery levels? Since there's no off switch I find odd that only recharging would make it emit RF radiation. The act of recharging shouldn't trigger this.

I recorded a video a few minutes ago which show the Pencil is broadcasting no matter what (see above). I have removed it from the cable and charging adapter, and also told the IPP 10.5 to unpair...

Should I wait for the Cornet meter to stop picking a signal? I hope this happens otherwise it's the reason why the battery decreased 21% in 2 days while in my drawer and bluetooth has been totally disabled in the iPAD.

The fact there's no off switch in it and it keeps on 24/7 broadcasting a signal is a stupid design. With the Airpods I believe they continue to broadcast once are outside their charger case, but that was explained by Apple in this message:

This is an engineering tradeoff. If we were to stop all paging and advertising while the buds are sitting idle on your desk, any time you picked them up and placed them in your ear, we’d take a few seconds to connect. We prioritize the more often seen user situation in which the user leaves the buds out only when they intend to use them relatively soon after.

Edit: it's been at least 1 hour since I recorded this video and the 1st gen Pencil is still broadcasting from my drawer.

Update: I discovered how to stop with the broadcasting: I activated bluetooth and paired minutes ago. Then used with Notability. After I disabled bluetooth from iOS settings the meter stopped picking a signal while close to it. So apparently if we disable twice it stops wasting battery in idle? It seems once wasn't enough.

I wonder how that works with the 2nd gen.

2nd update: now it's going into sleep mode (no broadcast) after I disable BT just once, even after it's being plugged into the adapter and cable to be recharged. This was probably a temporary error. I am sure it's a flaw in it that will waste battery even when idle.

This was probably corrected in the new Pencil.

 

[Black Tiger]

I love Apple products and have been using them since I was at college in '89 but I'm in a real bind! It's getting to the point where they are just pricing me out the market. I make a reasonably good salary, I don't have any kids so have no outgoings to consider from that respect and would say I have a pretty good disposable income compared to those with children.

I have spent a small fortune over the years on Apple products and probably owned a good 90% of the stuff they have brought out but I have concluded that I can no longer sustain at the current price levels. I understand that prices go up over the years but in the last few years, it's no longer about inflation just significant price increases by Apple themselves.

The MacBook Pro 15" for example, which is always my main machine, now costs £2700 (512GB is non negotiable, 256GB just doesn't cut it in this day and age)...we're knocking on the £3K mark and that's a huge amount of cash.

Sigh....I have to agree with many others that I think Apple is now getting greedy and I really do believe that it's going to come back and bite them hard in the next few years.

And yet more affordable, adjusted for inflation, than the old PowerBooks were. By a wide margin. The original titanium PowerBook g4 sold for $3500 usd in 2001.

 

[subjonas]

This post suggests that after a few minutes the Pencil enters into sleep mode. An information that isn't available ANYWHERE. I discovered right now something interesting:

Speaking of battery, once the 1st gen Pencil it's attached to the charging adapter and a lightning to USB cable it keeps trying to broadcast a signal. So even if I turn bluetooth 100% off this will happen.

Could this be due to this Pencil trying to broadcast to the iPAD's widget the current battery levels? Since there's no off switch I find odd that only recharging would make it emit RF radiation. The act of recharging shouldn't trigger this.

I recorded a video a few minutes ago which show the Pencil is broadcasting no matter what (see above). I have removed it from the cable and charging adapter, and also told the IPP 10.5 to unpair...

Should I wait for the Cornet meter to stop picking a signal? I hope this happens otherwise it's the reason why the battery decreased 21% in 2 days while in my drawer and bluetooth has been totally disabled in the iPAD.

The fact there's no off switch in it and it keeps on 24/7 broadcasting a signal is a stupid design. With the Airpods I believe they continue to broadcast once are outside their charger case, but that was explained by Apple in this message:

This is an engineering tradeoff. If we were to stop all paging and advertising while the buds are sitting idle on your desk, any time you picked them up and placed them in your ear, we’d take a few seconds to connect. We prioritize the more often seen user situation in which the user leaves the buds out only when they intend to use them relatively soon after.

Edit: it's been at least 1 hour since I recorded this video and the 1st gen Pencil is still broadcasting from my drawer.

Update: I discovered how to stop with the broadcasting: I activated bluetooth and paired minutes ago. Then used with Notability. After I disabled bluetooth from iOS settings the meter stopped picking a signal while close to it. So apparently if we disable twice it stops wasting battery in idle? It seems once wasn't enough.

I wonder how that works with the 2nd gen.

2nd update: now it's going into sleep mode (no broadcast) after I disable BT just once, even after it's being plugged into the adapter and cable to be recharged. This was probably a temporary error. I am sure it's a flaw in it that will waste battery even when idle.

This was probably corrected in the new Pencil.

All this absurdity could be so easily avoided with an on/off switch.
It looks like the new pencil has something close though. On the website for the new Apple Pencil it lists a “tap to wake” feature. I take it to mean with a single touch/tap on the pencil it wakes up from low power mode. That would work for me as it would most likely stay in low power mode while being carried around in my bag, unlike the gen 1 pencil. What I’m curious about though is how long the pencil battery lasts in low power mode as opposed to being turned off completely (assuming you can turn it off completely by turning off Bluetooth).

 

[richinaus]

And yet more affordable, adjusted for inflation, than the old PowerBooks were. By a wide margin. The original titanium PowerBook g4 sold for $3500 usd in 2001.

yes I had the TI and it cost me a fortune - way more expensive than the current MBP as you say.
Plus it bent like a banana at the CD drive..........

Those who complain on here maybe have not been living Apple for the last 20 years.

Anyway, back on point with the pencil [intended], I was in store on the weekend [still deciding on size to get] and noticed that the pencil was a lot nicer to draw with than my 10.5 one. It seemed to have slightly better resistance and just felt more natural.

 

[brofkand]

My question to all Photoshop users: Why are you still using the predatory Adobe app and not Affinity Photo...?

Some people call Apple predatory with the way they are raising prices - so why are you still using macOS?

Same answer on both sides I'm sure: the ecosystem. PSD's are the gold standard, and nothing works with PSD's as well as Photoshop.

 

[Tech198]

I guess you've already shelled out enough for a new iPad anyway, the extra price of the pencil 2, while it deep price for some,,, you've already bough the new model, so you may as well spend the extra $$ and get it over with.

If the new features matter that much that is... If not, then don't bother.

Really, no different than figuring out weather the new Touch ID on MBA is worth paying for either

 

[Scubaman]

I wouldn't say "prone." Although cylindrical, Pencil 1 is weighted on one side to help prevent that from occurring. Clever design.

I thought pencil 1 was slightly curved to prevent rolling???

 

[mixel]

I thought pencil 1 was slightly curved to prevent rolling???

No? Pencil1 is just cylindrical and totally straight. The weighted side only stops it from rolling on a very level surface though.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Apple began the downhill slide when they jettisoned the floppy disc....

I’m still thinking it was a HUGE mistake when they dropped the Apple II.

 

[slashlos]

Eraser? As on 53's eraser, and real pencils, it's just not for removing content but for blending, smudging, etc.

I think the charging change is a good one, but until the pencil reaches universality, like a mouse - other platforms etc, I'm not a fan.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

the fact that my older Apple products still work fine for my needs.

I think this is one reason why Apple is fine with the rapid transitions. Someone who bought an iPad Pro and Pencil even as recent as last year doesn’t NEED this year’s model. They may want it, but that iPad and Pencil will last them for a LOT of years... there’s little value in trying to sell an upgraded version of something that’s already working fine. Same with the computers. Sure, you can try to sell ever incrementally faster versions of the same old thing to the same old folks, BUT where the future REALLY lies, is in getting people who’ve never bought anything (or, even bettter, initially bought your competitors thing) to buy.

I believe Apple used to be really focused on making the same small group of folks (when you compare against Windows users) content year over year even when many of those folks weren’t buying a new computer every year. With every company that expands their reach beyond what’s perceived as their “core customers”, they find themselves in conflict between folks who are coming with no history and expectations and those who have CARTLOADS of expectations... and the smart money is always on growing your user base.

Today, the majority of Macs sold are to people who don’t know about magsafe, round mice, any ports other than USB-C or Thunderbolt AND every year, that percentage is going to grow. It comes down to:

1. Folks that like the product they have will be able to continue using it for years.
2. Folks that want a lateral upgrade to a new system with 100% feature parity with the system they have MAY be ok, depending on how old it is. Either way, it’s just a want, not a NEED.
3. Folks that NEED a lateral upgrade to a new system (like, a dead system OR they NEED to be able to work faster) with 100% feature parity with the system they have, depending on how old it is, are going to have to accept some compromises.
[doublepost=1542635378][/doublepost]

charging case for the AirPods... like the AirPod case... And like the AirPod case...

AirPods are not inductive. There’s two metal physical pins that connect with the metal tip around the microphone. There are no metal connecting points on the new Apple Pencil.
[doublepost=1542635828][/doublepost]

Ever seen AirPods inductively charging via the case?

No one has. Because that’s not a thing. AirPods don’t inductively charge.

 

[Marcel_CH]

I would also add that being in the Apple ecosystem has incredible value in terms of things like privacy and security, by far the industry leading support system (I could bring my iMac into any Apple store today and they would check it out for free !) especially with out of warranty support, seamless integration, Continuity, etc.

Thank you. This is one very strong reason for me to stick with Apple. There is stuff I dislike about decisions Apple makes, but I have a choice here. Buy Apple stuff or don't.

It is strange to read stuff in this forum that are often based on so much misinformation.

One example is the 1 gen Pencil. I have one alongside an iPad Pro 1 gen.

I plug my pencil directly in the iPad either to:

- re-pair it (cause my son uses it to draw on his iPad)
- emergency charge it for a min or so

Other than that, I use the small adapter to charge it via cable.

Why is that bad design? How could they have done it better? Should they have limited the charging, so you could only charge it with a cable?

True, I am not an artist using the Pencil, so the way I see this is irrelevant.

 

[sakabaro]

Any benchmark on the latency?

 

[jgdeschamps]

i feel exactly the same way. i try to keep telling myself. will this cost really make a difference when i hit retirement age

Well, to many eyes they are trying to get rid of the Mac line... only little by little so you get used to the idea. Why? Because iPads and iPhones are their main income and have larger revenue margins, even if they keep telling themselves to tell ourselves that the Mac line is the heart and soul of Apple. Guys, you know it, they know it. Macs are not their thing anymore.
In the end, if you just read magazines, books, check e-mails and consume music and movies, the regular iPad/iPhone combo will be for you, and it has kept close to its original price (even cheaper sometimes.) If you are gonna be using Logic, Final Cut Pro, XCode, PS, etc., iPad Pro will be for you (hint: USB-C on iPad Pro for better outboard hardware expansions compatibility.) No Macs.
All of this is a transition period and they are making you sick with extremely high prices for their "classic" desktop and laptop hardware while escalating iPad Pro prices, so one day they'll say "Guess what? iPad Pro is such an extremely powerful platform that we are doing everything in it!" and Apple will have a keynote staging a funeral with laptops and desktops inside a casket. Sorry for the ones expecting Ax chips in macOS... think about it, what's cheaper? Porting applications to iOS, or rewriting a whole OS to work on iPad chips? Clue: full blown Photoshop on iOS coming out in the next few months...

 

[tromboneaholic]

Clue: full blown Photoshop on iOS coming out in the next few months...

The other way to look at that is Photoshop code that will run on an ARM-powered Mac.

 

[saxofunk]

Plus it bent like a banana at the CD drive..........

Every laptop Apple made with a slot-loading optical disc drive bent at the opening. The unibody design helped, but didn't cure the problem. I'm sure an unconscious and collective sigh of relief was (un)heard around the repair community when the optical drive was removed from Apple's ecosystem. (Though, I do miss the extra SATA bus.)

 

[tromboneaholic]

Every laptop Apple made with a slot-loading optical disc drive bent at the opening.

Do you want me to post a photo of my unbent 2011 15 inch MacBook pro?

 

[brofkand]

Do you want me to post a photo of my unbent 2011 15 inch MacBook pro?

Every one of them was capable of bending, whether or not yours bent depended on how you treated it.

 

[paulcons]

I was all giddy about how cool the new iPad is, I EVEN contemplated getting one... but not being able to use my current pencil AND them jacking the price 30% (THIRTY FREAKING PERCENT) said "hold onto what ya got."

Guys we gotta vote with our wallets, period.

And yes, I also very much foresee our desktops going away. Phines and tablets won't cut it, an actual file system is not even hinted or rumored.

 

[Greenmeenie]

My question is...how long will Apple keep making the old Apple Pencil? It seems so un-Apple like, and the new design is so much better. I don’t see Apple continuing the old one.

But then what about the next regular iPad update? And possibly iPad mini update with pencil support? Will Apple keep producing TWO different Apple pencils? It seems odd for Apple.

And If not, will Apple then update the regular iPad & possibly next iPad mini with the same flat edged design with slimmer bezels as the pros so they can charge the new Apple Pencil? Makes sense.

And if so, will the 9.7” keep the same size screen but just shrink it’s overall size like the new 12.9” did? And will the new iPad mini stay the same physical size but increase it’s screen size from 7.9” to 8.5” like the 11” Pro did?

Or will Apple combine them into one new device? Or...Lol...will Apple keep them the same sizes and leave the bezels, but give them flat edges to charge the new pencil? So they look different then the pros but can still charge the new Apple Pencil? I assume both still won’t get Pro motion to differentiate them from the pros.

But I think the pencil is key. I don’t see Apple continuing to produce 2 types of Apple pencils for long. But would that mean the regular iPad & new mini would get usb-c too? Or maybe Apple will wait until 2020(the 10th anniversary of the regular iPad) until they update the regular iPad & possibly mini with the new flat edge design, usb-c and new Apple Pencil. By then MicroLED will be ready for the iPad pros...so that might be enough of a difference between the two. So many questions! Lol

 

[brofkand]

My question is...how long will Apple keep making the old Apple Pencil? It seems so un-Apple like, and the new design is so much better. I don’t see Apple continuing the old one.

But then what about the next regular iPad update? And possibly iPad mini update with pencil support? Will Apple keep producing TWO different Apple pencils? It seems odd for Apple.

And If not, will Apple then update the regular iPad & possibly next iPad mini with the same flat edged design with slimmer bezels as the pros so they can charge the new Apple Pencil? Makes sense.

And if so, will the 9.7” keep the same size screen but just shrink it’s overall size like the new 12.9” did? And will the new iPad mini stay the same physical size but increase it’s screen size from 7.9” to 8.5” like the 11” Pro did?

Or will Apple combine them into one new device? Or...Lol...will Apple keep them the same sizes and leave the bezels, but give them flat edges to charge the new pencil? So they look different then the pros but can still charge the new Apple Pencil? I assume both still won’t get Pro motion to differentiate them from the pros.

But I think the pencil is key. I don’t see Apple continuing to produce 2 types of Apple pencils for long. But would that mean the regular iPad & new mini would get usb-c too? Or maybe Apple will wait until 2020(the 10th anniversary of the regular iPad) until they update the regular iPad & possibly mini with the new flat edge design, usb-c and new Apple Pencil. By then MicroLED will be ready for the iPad pros...so that might be enough of a difference between the two. So many questions! Lol

Don't try to figure out Apple's product line anymore. Here we are over two years later, and you still can't plug an iPhone into a MacBook without an extra purchase.

I doubt they'll touch the iPad mini again, and the non Pro iPad is the new plastic unibody MacBook from 2009 or the 2015 MacBook Air - it will live on, without hardware updates, for years - school systems need that kind of stability.