OS X Mountain Lion Drops Support for Many 2006-2008 Macs with Integrated Graphics

[Rodimus Prime]

Unethical ? 4 years for EOS is pretty standard in the consumer industry. It's not like it will stop working anyway, it will go on working fine with Lion.

No but Apple stops updating it and pushing out security updates for the older OS so it could also be said by not updating your computer becomes less and less secure.

Like I have said before it is not the fact that Apple is not supporting older hardware on the new OS but the fact that Apple pretty much drops near all major support as soon as the newer OS comes out. This include security updates and the fact that software is pushed to really only run on the newer OS.

Take for example iTunes. It works great on an OS from 2001 for windows but it requires an OS from 2007 for OSX. This lack of support also means that people can not use their iPod or other Apple products with out updating. How long until iTunes will require 10.6 and be Intel only (my guess is not long after ML.

 

[Anic297]

Unlike Microsoft, who tries to dumb their OS down to the lowest common denominator, Apple strive to progress their products towards a better experience. Windows will still run 20 year old software and install on hardware that is embarrassing (or just old). Is that better for the consumer than what apple is doing by requiring better hardware for the best experience rather than to try an appease everyone? I don't think so.

And for the planet which it's urgent to take care, which is better?
Unless you don't care, of course…

 

[bpaluzzi]

Why I agree with everything else that you wrote, I completely disagree with that assessment. Apples does not make its billions with selling hardware. Their content supply chain is their real cash cow. Apple generates a lot of turnover with hardware sales, but those hardware also costs a lot in R&D and production. Of course, their hardware business is extraordinarily profitable. But I don't think that Apple really is mainly a hardware company. It seems so at the first glance, but once they've sold you the car, you see that they make even more money with fuel and the service around the car.

If you're implying that Apple makes more money from their App Store / iTunes store, you're RIDICULOUSLY out of touch with reality. Like, several orders of magnitude out of touch.

Apple constantly asserts that they make their money selling hardware, period. They also claim that most of the money they make selling services goes into running the service itself (very little profit).

Whether or not that is true only they know.

They're a public company, and those earnings breakdowns are an FCC requirement. They're accurate.

You're right. I forgot about Apple's 33% take on all those apps for iOS...apps they had NOTHING to do with making, but scam 1/3 the profit for anyway. That probably is their biggest money maker now and selling more iPhones in one year than Macs in the past 28 means MEGA money per app on average.

Not even CLOSE. Seriously, how can you think that? Have you read ANYTHING about Apple's profits? Ever? (and, BTW, it's 30%, and that's a lot lower than selling it in a physical store, and comparable [price-wise] to selling it on your own online shop [but with a lot more exposure], but hey, why start letting reality creep into your arguments now?)

 

[MacBH928]

Wait...I can't believe this.
My late 2008 macbook(which I bought 1st quarter in 2009) , 2GHZ core 2 duo, GeForce 9400M will NOT be able to run Mountain Lion?
What the HELL??

Come on, who has machine obsolete to run an OS 4 years in time difference?
My 2002 lamp iMac lasted from 2002 up to 2009!!!
My current laptop still feels lightening fast! not to mention I have seen my friends buying latest macbook models, and I really don't see any significant difference. They operate just as good as my machine does! Where is the problem?

I am currently running Lion with no issues at all, and Mountain Lion seems like its Lion with few features updates. Its not like the jump from OS9 to OSX

 

[Anic297]

2)If these are free updates, do you think that Apple will prevent users from the ability to downgrade the OS?

They'll have to add some chip on the motherboard for that (else, anyone could reformat the hard disk and start over). But a Mac can usually be open easily, both in hardware and in software, so once someone found how to remove/disable that chip, it'd be too much effort for nothing, in my opinion.

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Just looking at OS X:
Public Beta Kodiak, September 13, 2000
10.0 Cheetah, March 24, 2001
10.1 Puma, July 18, 2001
10.2 Jaguar, May 6, 2002
10.3 Panther, June 23, 2003
10.4 Tiger, May 4, 2004
10.5 Leopard, June 26, 2006
10.6 Snow Leopard, June 9, 2008
10.7 Lion, October 20, 2010
10.8 Mountain Lion, February 16, 2012

I bought a PowerMac 6100 in 1994. So in the seven years from that machine running 7.5 to Mac OS X 10.0 in 2001, Apple released 21 OS updates. That's three updates a year!

You're comparing major versions of Mac OS X (10.0 to 10.8) with minor versions of Mac OS “classic” (from 7.5 to 9.2.2), so it seems logical to me it takes one year per major update and a couple of months per minor update... or I'm just missing the obvious?

 

[blackhand1001]

Unlike Microsoft, who tries to dumb their OS down to the lowest common denominator, Apple strive to progress their products towards a better experience. Windows will still run 20 year old software and install on hardware that is embarrassing (or just old). Is that better for the consumer than what apple is doing by requiring better hardware for the best experience rather than to try an appease everyone? I don't think so.

Apple just wants to ensure that as they move their platforms forward, people who use them are getting the best experience they can with the hardware they have. If that means culling the playing field substantially, they're ok with that.

Lucky for me, both of my macs will be upgradable to 10.8, but somewhere down the line, I'll be forced to buy a new machine to get whatever the latest version is, and I don't see that as a problem. I'd rather have a great experience instead of hating my computer because they allowed inferior spec'd machines to run the latest version.

Windows 7 runs better on just about any new machine than Mac OS X lion does. Windows certainly runs better on my macbook than Mac does now at the moment. Vista and Windows 7 are hugely superior to XP in take advantage of new hardware. At the same time they run exceptionally well on older hardware as well like pentium 4 systems. I hardly consider supporting directx 11 and the latest opengl dumbing down the system. Apple doesn't even support the latest opengl and half the systems don't/can't even run 64bit kernels yet, something windows has done for years now.

 

[jdiamond]

What about an external touchpad?

Not surprising. I put Lion on my late '07 MacBook, and while the OS works fine and the speed is decent, the lack of multitouch really kills the experience. Its just kind of awkward since features like Launchpad and Mission Control are really multitouch focused. It still works great as an email and web browsing machine though, and it doesn't really need big OS updates if that's all it does.

I have a similar MBP, albeit mid-2007. I was wondering if buying the Apple external touchpad for Mac Pros would make ML usable on older MBPs?

 

[blackhand1001]

I have a similar MBP, albeit mid-2007. I was wondering if buying the Apple external touchpad for Mac Pros would make ML usable on older MBPs?

Apple needs to make better ways to do some of these actions without gestures. There are people with mac minis who don't have/want the magic trackpad/mouse. I want a decent mouse and the magic mouse is terrible, and I don't want a touchpad. Windows 7's taskbar does wonderfully at task switching with a keyboard, mouse, touchpad, and any other input you would like to use with it. On the other hand, mission control is terrible for keyboard's and regular mice. In fact even with a multitouch trackpad, I largely prefer the taskbar over the dock/mission control. I know a ton of less savy people that have been using macs for a few years who didn't even know mission control/expose existed. In contrast on windows the taskbar is rather obvious on how it works. There is no visual cue on the screen to use mission control to switch windows.

 

[Eric S.]

I don't recall ANY Mac of any kind that did NOT get to upgrade to 2 more OS major releases since OSX Debuted.

Surely there were G5s released with Tiger that were obsoleted with Snow Leopard?

Ah, for the days when OSX improvements were real and tangible and the OS got faster and faster each version (i.e. right up through Tiger). Now they remove features instead (of adding new ones) like dumping Rosetta support (for older games and software), dumping X11 (so much for the whole play nice with other Unix flavors thing) while adding things like the "Gatekeeper" to make it harder for you to get 3rd party software that hasn't paid their 33% Apple Tax.

I agree with you, but Apple has also been removing features for a while. My pet peeve: Classic mode was dropped from Leopard for absolutely no good technical reason; it could have been carried over for PPC users with minimal effort.

Frankly, I don't mind staying with older OS versions, but traditionally, software support gets dropped for those versions all too quickly (particularly when Apple dumps support for the hardware in XCode, making it a royal PITA to support older systems even if the developers want to without jumping through hoops).

Exactly.

 

[dscuber9000]

Mid-2009 MBP. Right on the cusp...

 

[JordanNZ]

and half the systems don't/can't even run 64bit kernels yet, something windows has done for years now.

That doesn't make any sense at all......

 

[Val-kyrie]

Dropping support for my X3100-based Macbook purchased less than 4years ago verges on the unethical. Especially so given the putative emphasis of Mountain Lion on security. They could simply exclude some older machines from graphics-intensive features, if there are any.

... Unethical ? 4 years for EOS is pretty standard in the consumer industry. It's not like it will stop working anyway, it will go on working fine with Lion.

No but Apple stops updating it and pushing out security updates for the older OS so it could also be said by not updating your computer becomes less and less secure.

Like I have said before it is not the fact that Apple is not supporting older hardware on the new OS but the fact that Apple pretty much drops near all major support as soon as the newer OS comes out. This include security updates and the fact that software is pushed to really only run on the newer OS....

I can understand limited hardware support (e.g., AppleCare is limited to three years max.), but I would think software support (specifically security updates) for five years is reasonable. The BlackBook I bought will barely eek out four years of support (July, 2008-July 2012, when 10.8 is introduced). Look at the policy of MS; once official support of the OS is ended, security updates continue for five years thereafter. I am only suggesting five years total.

I also think Apple's software upgrade cycle or naming is botched. From a consumer's perspective (I am not a programmer), Leopard appears to have been a major OS upgrade while Snow Leopard was a nice refinement and worked smoother and faster, at least for me. Similarly, it appears Lion is a major upgrade while Mountain Lion is a refinement. From this naming perspective, it seems illogical to support some hardware for a major upgrade (10.5, 10.7) and then cut off that same hardware when the refinement to the OS is made (10.6, 10.8).

For what it's worth, it appeared that the memory requirements to run Fusion 4 and 10.7 were too much for my BlackBook when Lion was released (4GB + 2GB, respectively). The handwriting was on the wall then, but I am still less than pleased.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

I can understand limited hardware support (e.g., AppleCare is limited to three years max.), but I would think software support (specifically security updates) for five years is reasonable. The BlackBook I bought will barely eek out four years of support (July, 2008-July 2012, when 10.8 is introduced). Look at the policy of MS; once official support of the OS is ended, security updates continue for five years thereafter. I am only suggesting five years total.

I also think Apple's software upgrade cycle or naming is botched. From a consumer's perspective (I am not a programmer), Leopard appears to have been a major OS upgrade while Snow Leopard was a nice refinement and worked smoother and faster, at least for me. Similarly, it appears Lion is a major upgrade while Mountain Lion is a refinement. From this naming perspective, it seems illogical to support some hardware for a major upgrade (10.5, 10.7) and then cut off that same hardware when the refinement to the OS is made (10.6, 10.8).

For what it's worth, it appeared that the memory requirements to run Fusion 4 and 10.7 were too much for my BlackBook when Lion was released (4GB + 2GB, respectively). The handwriting was on the wall then, but I am still less than pleased.

But Apple stops even security updates with in a few months of the next OS being released. That is a problem. None of the versions have made it to 5 years from release date. much less from when it was no longer being sold.

 

[planetdom]

Widgets

I agree, but given I was already tricked into getting Lion, I may as well go forward with Mountain Lion.

Oh, and missing from your list:
Widgets and Spaces.

Seriously, what the heck were they thinking when they decided to change how those worked? I vastly preferred the old system of having 2x2 spaces with a layer of widgets on top of them all. I could access any space or widget with just one gesture. Now if I want to get to my widget from space 4, I have to cross space 3, 2, and 1, and then go all the way back to get back to them.

Or go into that mess known as system control.

Bleh!

... maybe I can benefit from Apple's lack of including obvious features again and just write a little app that adds them in

If you go into system preferences then go into mission control and then tick show dash board as a space then it will be like snow leopard's dashboard

----------

I agree, but given I was already tricked into getting Lion, I may as well go forward with Mountain Lion.

Oh, and missing from your list:
Widgets and Spaces.

Seriously, what the heck were they thinking when they decided to change how those worked? I vastly preferred the old system of having 2x2 spaces with a layer of widgets on top of them all. I could access any space or widget with just one gesture. Now if I want to get to my widget from space 4, I have to cross space 3, 2, and 1, and then go all the way back to get back to them.

Or go into that mess known as system control.

Bleh!

... maybe I can benefit from Apple's lack of including obvious features again and just write a little app that adds them in?

If you go into system preferences then go into mission control and then tick show dash board as a space then it will be like snow leopard's dashboard

 

[KnightWRX]

But Apple stops even security updates with in a few months of the next OS being released. That is a problem.

Remember guys, OS X and Apple are consumer oriented. If you want LTS, get a real support contract from a real vendor. Of course, you'll pay a lot more for it.

In the end, there is no problem. If you want your hardware to get a 2nd life after Apple, just go with an open source OS. The current version of Arch Linux with the latest kernel runs just dandy on my old Pentium II machine.

 

[KnightWRX]

Now if I want to get to my widget from space 4, I have to cross space 3, 2, and 1, and then go all the way back to get back to them.

Or go into that mess known as system control.

No you don't.



Why is it most of these complaints often just ignore the option starring them right in the face ?

 

[planetdom]

I agree, but given I was already tricked into getting Lion, I may as well go forward with Mountain Lion.

Oh, and missing from your list:
Widgets and Spaces.

Seriously, what the heck were they thinking when they decided to change how those worked? I vastly preferred the old system of having 2x2 spaces with a layer of widgets on top of them all. I could access any space or widget with just one gesture. Now if I want to get to my widget from space 4, I have to cross space 3, 2, and 1, and then go all the way back to get back to them.

Or go into that mess known as system control.

Bleh!

... maybe I can benefit from Apple's lack of including obvious features again and just write a little app that adds them in?

If you go into system preferences then go into mission control and then tick show dash board as a space then it will be like snow leopard's dashboard...

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Remember guys, OS X and Apple are consumer oriented. If you want LTS, get a real support contract from a real vendor. Of course, you'll pay a lot more for it.

In the end, there is no problem. If you want your hardware to get a 2nd life after Apple, just go with an open source OS. The current version of Arch Linux with the latest kernel runs just dandy on my old Pentium II machine.

even consumer grade Apple should provide longer support because that is how you get the Zombie computer created is threw those holes.

 

[KnightWRX]

even consumer grade Apple should provide longer support because that is how you get the Zombie computer created is threw those holes.

Not the problem of a proprietary OS vendor unfortunately. That's what you get when you choose proprietary over open.

 

[djdirect]

Is this going to be an upgrade to Lion. Or will this cost another $29.99?

 

[Val-kyrie]

But Apple stops even security updates with in a few months of the next OS being released. That is a problem. None of the versions have made it to 5 years from release date. much less from when it was no longer being sold.

Not sure I understand you. E.g., SL security updates have continued even with the release of Lion. If you count the 18 months or so from the time SL was initially released and the 18 months or so during which Lion will be used before the release of Mountain Lion, then there are at least 36 months of support.

I realize none of the versions of OS X have had five years of support from the release date, but I think this is an issue Apple needs to revisit in light of its surging popularity--at the very least for security fixes.

EDIT:

Remember guys, OS X and Apple are consumer oriented. If you want LTS, get a real support contract from a real vendor. Of course, you'll pay a lot more for it.

In the end, there is no problem. If you want your hardware to get a 2nd life after Apple, just go with an open source OS. The current version of Arch Linux with the latest kernel runs just dandy on my old Pentium II machine.

That's a nice thought unless your software is Mac-only. My software won't run on Linux. Sorry.

 

[nicklad]

I have a similar MBP, albeit mid-2007. I was wondering if buying the Apple external touchpad for Mac Pros would make ML usable on older MBPs?

I changed the topcase on the Mid 2007 A1228 MBP I still have for the Early 2008 A1260 part to get multi-touch. It was seriously easy to do.

As the trackpad drives the keyboard, the keyboard should be replaced too with the A1260 part as the F keys have different mappings and there is no longer a number pad.

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Wait...I can't believe this.
My late 2008 macbook(which I bought 1st quarter in 2009) , 2GHZ core 2 duo, GeForce 9400M will NOT be able to run Mountain Lion?
What the HELL??

Come on, who has machine obsolete to run an OS 4 years in time difference?
My 2002 lamp iMac lasted from 2002 up to 2009!!!
My current laptop still feels lightening fast! not to mention I have seen my friends buying latest macbook models, and I really don't see any significant difference. They operate just as good as my machine does! Where is the problem?

I am currently running Lion with no issues at all, and Mountain Lion seems like its Lion with few features updates. Its not like the jump from OS9 to OSX

Eh, if your machine has the 9400M, it's supported...

 

[rubberneckin]

I have a Macbook Pro early 2008 with multi touch, upgraded HDD to Momentus® XT Solid State Hybrid Drives with Lion, runs faster then my latest i7 Laptop with Win 7, can't wait for ML.

 

[Santabean2000]

Mid-2009 MBP. Right on the cusp...

I hear ya. Tinkering on the brink here too. Bought in at the right time; no crappy Intel graphics here, thanks.

Ah well, should be ready for an upgrade come mid 2013.

 

[KnightWRX]

That's a nice thought unless your software is Mac-only. My software won't run on Linux. Sorry.

That's what you get for being locked into a single vendor. Always make sure you have an exit strategy.

And since we're talking old hardware here (the Linux comment was to give 2nd life to hardware that is obsoleted and EOS'd by vendors), well then just keep running the vendor's old software then. It's not Apple's fault you don't migrate to newer platforms, they can't keep support going forever.

And as a consumer company, they move quite faster than an enterprise vendor, so buyer beware.