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'Palm Pre' Smartphone Announced: WebOS, Wireless Charging, App Store

The Man said:
Looking at the presentation video, it sure looks like Rubenstein took the liberty to copy a lot of key iPhone UI innovations.
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After watching the CES Palm Pre debut video I was floored by webOS. At one point during his demo Rubenstein says In today's mobile market you need to have a great phone, and you need to have the right platform. One that's forward looking, not based on yesterday's operating system. I guarantee you he wasn't talking about Palm's old OS. I think that's the first time I ever heard anyone even insinuate that OS X is yesterday's operating system :eek:
 
Cooknn said:
I think that's the first time I ever heard anyone even insinuate that OS X is yesterday's operating system :eek:
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Well, OSX is based on concepts that date back at least 35 years. So he's right. Just about any OS could be called "yesterday's OS". :) Or maybe he's just trying to emulate Jobs' way of speaking. In any case, Rubenstein is in a position to know better than most.
 
Good luck palm

So palm finally got rid of that "classic" OS of theirs... smart move... too bad they are just a few years, two iphones, and a whole generation of blackberries too late. Not only are they going to have to compete with apples stunning iphone, they are going to compete with those little devices called blackberries. Sure, if they load a blackberry client, configure their untested email client,and spend enough time on the phone with their IT department, they can get puch email. But hey, 20 seconds is all it takes to do it with the iphone. Also, one would think that palm would learn something from vista and make their new OS compatible with older palm programs. That's just a slap in the face to loyal palm users. But hey, there's a reason they are called treonauts, they apparently live on cloud nine!:)
 
Bwell1983 said:
So palm finally got rid of that "classic" OS of theirs... smart move... too bad they are just a few years, two iphones, and a whole generation of blackberries too late. Not only are they going to have to compete with apples stunning iphone, they are going to compete with those little devices called blackberries. Sure, if they load a blackberry client, configure their untested email client,and spend enough time on the phone with their IT department, they can get puch email. But hey, 20 seconds is all it takes to do it with the iphone. Also, one would think that palm would learn something from vista and make their new OS compatible with older palm programs. That's just a slap in the face to loyal palm users. But hey, there's a reason they are called treonauts, they apparently live on cloud nine!:)
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This is such a newbie fanboy response. :rolleyes:

You failed to read any of the reviews and blogs about the Pre and why Palm left behind the older Palm software, or comprehend that WebOS is new from the ground up.

So new in fact that EVERY tech blog around that is either unbiased or just slightly biased toward the iPhone says that the iPhone is going to need to catch up, and that Apple should learn something from Palm on this one.

The only thing really missing from the Pre is the ability to sync with iTunes and Mobile Me.
 
Kind of a newbie

Digital Skunk said:
This is such a newbie fanboy response. :rolleyes:

You failed to read any of the reviews and blogs about the Pre and why Palm left behind the older Palm software, or comprehend that WebOS is new from the ground up.

So new in fact that EVERY tech blog around that is either unbiased or just slightly biased toward the iPhone says that the iPhone is going to need to catch up, and that Apple should learn something from Palm on this one.

The only thing really missing from the Pre is the ability to sync with iTunes and Mobile Me.
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I am not totally a newbie... I have a macbook (original core duo), maxed the ram, threw in a 500GB drive. I had an imac g4 snow globe before that. I also had a treo 700p, and currently have a blackberry curve (need verizon for work). However, u are correct, that it has features that apple does not yet have. To be fair though, these new features in this new palm haven't been tested. Palm users were so excited for the 755p, and in actuality all it did was get rid of the antenna. I would like to see how this palm interfaces with outlook, or mac address book, or even how it handles on its respective wireless carrier (i am assuming that verizon will get its hands on it, cripple the gps, wifi, and bluetooth). My point was that palm is repeating the same mistakes that MS has. How many OS X upgrades came out before vista did, and boy was that a winner!!! Also, how do u add the mac specs and stuff to ur posts? I Thought I did that in my profile settings. Thanks for the feedback, no hard feelings.
 
Bwell1983 said:
I am not totally a newbie... I have a macbook (original core duo), maxed the ram, threw in a 500GB drive. I had an imac g4 snow globe before that. I also had a treo 700p, and currently have a blackberry curve (need verizon for work). However, u are correct, that it has features that apple does not yet have. To be fair though, these new features in this new palm haven't been tested. Palm users were so excited for the 755p, and in actuality all it did was get rid of the antenna. I would like to see how this palm interfaces with outlook, or mac address book, or even how it handles on its respective wireless carrier (i am assuming that verizon will get its hands on it, cripple the gps, wifi, and bluetooth). My point was that palm is repeating the same mistakes that MS has. How many OS X upgrades came out before vista did, and boy was that a winner!!! Also, how do u add the mac specs and stuff to ur posts? I Thought I did that in my profile settings. Thanks for the feedback, no hard feelings.
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Not a total newb, but still a fanboy, got it.:p

You can add your computer specs to your signature and it will show up in your posts.


Lethal
 
The Palm Pre is not in the market yet so it´s hard to make realistic points about it. What concerns about Pre and the WebOS is the very concept of the device: the smartphone is a small low-powered device so it should run ´basic code´ apps. I don´t like this. Ok, u´ll have 10 apps running at the same time, but so what? Why would I need that? One great thing the iphone introduced in the smartphone market was the idea that these devices should run desktop-class applications instead of ´basic-code´ or ´baby´ apps. How is the Pre going to run heavy games or even heavy apps like an atlas of surgery I have on my iphone if it only accepts ´web-code´ because the OS is mobile and ´light´. Bringing the power of mac os x to a phone (same kernel, same graphics engine, etc) was a GOOD thing. These things are replacing notebooks and sorry palm but web-code-only just won´t cut it. The WebOS seems like a ´Safari´ OS to me, even switching between windows is done the same way. The problem is apple released the SDK last year and killed the web apps, something palm probably wasn´t expecting. Of course the palm pre does things the iphone doesn´t do but that´s hardly a point first because the iphone is an older device, second because the iphone has always lacked a couple of functions and people still buy it because of the things it can do great. If you want mms or copy/paste u can get a nokia or a bb now. The only thing really new about webos is Sinergy, besides that it´s just the same functionality with a new iphone-like interface.
 
When is this phone due out? Are there any predictions yet? I was about to get an iPhone, then saw this phone debuted at the CES. Sprint offers me some very aggressive corporate discounts, which will save me ~$25 per month over AT&T's service. I also really like the Qwerty keyboard, which is something else that has held me back from the iPhone.
 
SloopJohnB said:
The Palm Pre is not in the market yet so it´s hard to make realistic points about it. What concerns about Pre and the WebOS is the very concept of the device: the smartphone is a small low-powered device so it should run ´basic code´ apps. I don´t like this. Ok, u´ll have 10 apps running at the same time, but so what? Why would I need that?
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The question isn't what you need, the question is what does Palm perceive the needs of its target demographic to be? I'm sure not everyone places playing Super Monkey Ball higher on their priority list than running multiple apps at the same time.

Of course the palm pre does things the iphone doesn´t do but that´s hardly a point first because the iphone is an older device, second because the iphone has always lacked a couple of functions and people still buy it because of the things it can do great.
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Ah, the "iPhone doesn't lack features, it just gets rid of functionality nobody wants" defense. Overused, but it still brings a smile to my face. ;)


Lethal
 
LethalWolfe said:
The question isn't what you need, the question is what does Palm perceive the needs of its target demographic to be? I'm sure not everyone places playing Super Monkey Ball higher on their priority list than running multiple apps at the same time.


Ah, the "iPhone doesn't lack features, it just gets rid of functionality nobody wants" defense. Overused, but it still brings a smile to my face. ;)


Lethal
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Where did I say the iphone didn´t lack features? Or that it got rid of things nobody wants? I sayed it has always lacked features but still people buy it for other reasons. That´s not an opinion, it´s a fact. It´s relevant in this discussion because the Pre is obviously going to compete against the iphone and ´having more functions´ is not enough to beat apple´s phone. It needs to target the things that make people buy the iphone.


I´m sure palm thinks Pre is well adressed to its goal market but i´m free to speak my mind and i´m also a customer so my opinion also matters. If there´s something apple´s sucess in recent years has shown is that ´meeting market needs´ isn´t necessarily the best way. It´s also good to surprise the customer with something he couldn´t have guessed. Palm´s interface while not as straighforward as the iphone, it´s richer and the device will probably have better hardware once it comes out which is another plus. My worries concern software. 3D games, navigation apps, heavy medical apps are just few examples of apps I don´t see being well written on web-code. Everybody needs those apps? I don´t know, but I do.
 
SloopJohnB said:
Where did I say the iphone didn´t lack features? Or that it got rid of things nobody wants? I sayed it has always lacked features but still people buy it for other reasons. That´s not an opinion, it´s a fact. It´s relevant in this discussion because the Pre is obviously going to compete against the iphone and ´having more functions´ is not enough to beat apple´s phone. It needs to target the things that make people buy the iphone.
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Easy there tiger. I just think it's funny how quickly people dismiss advantages other phones have over the iPhone like Apple can do no wrong in a market place they just entered. You say who cares about running apps in the background or MMS? Obviously the people that want that functionality care so why try to dismiss that kind of criticism? Don't you want Apple to make a better iPhone?

I´m sure palm thinks Pre is well adressed to its goal market but i´m free to speak my mind and i´m also a customer so my opinion also matters.
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My worries concern software. 3D games, navigation apps, heavy medical apps are just few examples of apps I don´t see being well written on web-code. Everybody needs those apps? I don´t know, but I do.
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I would like to be able to multitask on my phone. I'd like turn-by-turn voice navigation, MMS, and voice dialing (w/o any 'training') as well (these last three I have on my current 2.5yr old flip phone). The current iteration of the iPhone doesn't meet my needs. For the price tag it's not good enough, IMO. Does that mean it's a poor product? No, it just means it doesn't offer what I'm looking for at a price I'm willing to pay. Hopefully a new iPhone and the Pre will be out this summer and I'll be able to compare them side by side (well, not literally as they aren't sold in the same store, but you know what I mean).

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but not everyone has the same needs.


Lethal
 
LethalWolfe said:
Easy there tiger. I just think it's funny how quickly people dismiss advantages other phones have over the iPhone like Apple can do no wrong in a market place they just entered. You say who cares about running apps in the background or MMS? Obviously the people that want that functionality care so why try to dismiss that kind of criticism? Don't you want Apple to make a better iPhone?


I would like to be able to multitask on my phone. I'd like turn-by-turn voice navigation, MMS, and voice dialing (w/o any 'training') as well (these last three I have on my current 2.5yr old flip phone). The current iteration of the iPhone doesn't meet my needs. For the price tag it's not good enough, IMO. Does that mean it's a poor product? No, it just means it doesn't offer what I'm looking for at a price I'm willing to pay. Hopefully a new iPhone and the Pre will be out this summer and I'll be able to compare them side by side (well, not literally as they aren't sold in the same store, but you know what I mean).

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but not everyone has the same needs.


Lethal
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I wasn´t dismissing any criticism, I think it´s a positive thing. I was only aiming the conversation towards what I believe to be more relevant, in this case, not what the iphone doesn´t have but what it has and what make people buy it over other phones that offer more. But that´s my opinion, of course anyone is free to say anything here.
About the: ´You say who cares about running apps in the background or MMS?´, I never said that. I know the iphone has flaws, everybody knows that. The thing is that there are hundreds of phones nowadays that do both and still most people are buying iphones. I´m not saying these aren´t relevant features but we were discussing pre x iphone. Pre will only be an iphone killer if it surpasses the iphone in its core features (imo). I was only trying to guide things to a new point for the sake of conversation, i wasn´t dismissing anything or diminishing other people´s opinions, it was never my intention.
 
Bwell1983 said:
....
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No problem. Glad you explained it better. You are right about Palms gross mistakes during the past four years for sure.

And ever since the Foleo I think they got a clue and worked on the one thing that made their phones desirable for some Mac users. I think WebOS will do fine, even if not tested and so forth and so on. I just hope Sprint doesn't make any mistakes on their network options for the phone. Pulling an AT&T/Apple wouldn't be a good move for either company.

The specs are what is hopped for, but I may just rip out my optical and stick in another HDD in the mean time.
 
I really thought Palm was done!

They took so long to develop their new OS. That is why I bought iPhone. I am looking forward to moving back to a Palm device once my AT&T contract is up! Unless Apple keeps up the innovations they have brought with the iPhone.
 
For many of us, seeing a viable competition to the iPhone is a GOOD thing. Hey, you can still keep your iPhone you know, if you want it to play games and being an internet tablet with Wifi!.

For me the Pre offers a physical keyboard which I was craving for. My Treo 650 still had fond memories, Disk mode and more importantly A2DP which the current iPhone will not provide. :apple: Hey, if Apple wants to release a good V3 of iPhone, I will give it a shot too. But if Pre serves me better, then I shall ditvh the iPhone for sure. There is no loyalty in dated technology, sorry.

But from an Apps perspective, we need to give Palm about 6 months to ramp up both the updates and Apps SDK. It has a long way to go still. All those takes time but in the meantime, to be able to drap any MP3 from any machine without iTunes is something that the iPhone prevents me from doing. And the onscreen keyboard is driving me crazy by the day ... arrrgh:(
 
SloopJohnB said:
I wasn´t dismissing any criticism, I think it´s a positive thing. I was only aiming the conversation towards what I believe to be more relevant, in this case, not what the iphone doesn´t have but what it has and what make people buy it over other phones that offer more.
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Thanks for clarifying. A couple of things you said I think I just took the wrong way.


Lethal
 
Fugly but it might stir concern at Apple

I don't know if Apple is being stupid or they just don't give a crap. :confused:
We've been begging for Copy and Paste for 18 months now and they just don't care. :mad:
Any crappy-ass $19 phone can MMS. Why in the world can't the iPhone???
It is the perfect phone for it with it's gorgeous screen and 3G connection.

I know as soon as Apple finds a way to make money off of MMS, they will launch the App... :rolleyes:
 
Apple doesn´t care about MMS but of all the iphone´s shortcomings this is the least important imo. MMS has really bad quality plus it´s cheaper to just email the photo. Now, copy&paste is much more important imo.
 
BryanHarig said:
Just mid year, with a GSM version for the EU following later.
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Thanks ! :D


I am kind of excited about this product and look forward to actually holding one and seeing how it handles. I personally like the iphone, despite talking "smack" about it all the time. Hopefully this phone will operate with the ease and simplicity that is found in an iphone. I feel iphone users get a bit spoiled with the relative ease and reliability of the phone. I was messing around with an HTC smartphone (WM6- no touch flo) and what a pain in the a** it was just to do simple functions like navigate and PIE has got to be the worst way to navigate the internet. Not knocking WM6 phones per se...just I find it easier to multi-task/ navigate on the iphone. Hopefully the pre will be similar


:)
 
I just want a keyboard again! I've had my iPhone since their release, and i'm still not used to typing on it. I use my phone mainly for text/email, so the iPhone is a huge problem for me. I can even do without the MMS.
 
Yesterday, my fiancee and I were working on our wedding guest list in Numbers.

She wanted to see what we had so far and make some changes so I exported an Excel file and:

1) Used Bluetooth to send it to her Treo
2) Watched her open it up on her phone and make edits and changes
3) Watched her save the file to her phone on her SD card
4) Watched her use Bluetooth to send the edited file back to me

These are 4 things the iPhone can't do, but my fiancee's fugly, old, fat, boring, useless, "place iPhone fanboy/girl insult here" Treo can do, and has been doing for years.

I am sure someone will tell us all how she could have just carried a MacBook Air with her instead. :rolleyes:

p.s. I am sure the Pre will keep to the Palm tradition of making phones for people that don't just d!ck around with their machines.
 
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