Has nothing to do with Nvidia. AVX2 was introduced 2013 if I remember correctly, so anything before that will fail in a similar way M1 fails.
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Path of Exile for Mac
- Thread starter Realityck
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I think the fact that they keep saying this is a issue
- Window Resolution/Size is too small when opening the game.
I disagree. Diablo 3 and PoE are very similar - way more similar than you are making them out to be. You’re acting like PoE is a super hard game or something. It’s not. If it were no one would enjoy it. This is not Dark Souls or Battletoads, the fun does not come from difficult mechanics // dying a bunch. All I do is click click click so I guess you must be building your characters wrong if you’re having to do much more than that.Different games really. Diablo is much easier, more for casual players. The leveling system on PoE is much more complex. It's just not possible to play a little here and there and get very far. Diablo is just "clicking" around until the Paragon levels take over. From there on it's playing through rifts and wait for drops. I've found that people who don't have to time or will to dig into PoE always fall back to Diablo.
Can't blame them. They have the support, it's easy to code and in the end, they did what Apple did later and is doing again right now.
Define "MANY". I seriously doubt a large amount of people would move. Diablo has about 9 million players on Playstation alone , PoE about 3 million accounts total. The Diablo players paid for the game, PoE is free. The vast majority of the PoE accounts are dead as confirmed by the devs. People probably just wanted to try it. PoE player numbers are fluctuating wildly. You can look up the statistics yourself, but as far as player numbers go, this really isn't a contest, PoE doesn't stand a chance.
Tough to test? Seriously... how about just set a compiler flag to disable AVX2? We would not want them to write five lines of code or check for compatibility. Confirms what I write above, either they don't care or it's amateur hour on the Mac client front.
No way, who would have though the game would crash on a chip that doesn't support AVX2 when Rosetta can't translate AVX2 and 512 instructions. This could be fixed so easily.
EDIT — I will not be replying to you anymore. It’s clear to me that you’re a very negative person for absolutely no reason. The internet needs less of this.
“Tough to test? Seriously... how about........” you test it for them? Hmm? If you have an infinite amount of resources to purchase many different models of Mac laptops then you test for them. It’s not as if GGG just automatically owns every single piece of hardware Apple has ever made. It’s not as if they’re going to just simply shell out thousands of dollars on eBay trying to find each one to test.
You are saying that the numbers for PoE is dropping but according to the developers themselves via live stream The numbers have been rising and everyone knows this. It doesn’t matter if people play every day or not, no one in the world cares about that statistic for any game. The only stats that matter is if people are playing the game // i.e. coming back and it’s been very apparent that people do come back often for leagues and the number has been growing through the years since 2013. Diablo 3 on the other hand has not been growing, yes it’s sold a ton of copies but that doesn’t mean that the number of players is growing. I own Diablo 3 but I don’t play it And I know many people who are the same way yet they’re all excited for more PoE content. Define many?? How about more than half of the people I have spoken to.
one more thing. Just because a game is free to play does not mean people aren’t paying for things in-game. I have seen people spend more money in PoE than you ever could in Diablo 3 no matter what. The only Blizzard game that can make money like PoE is Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm And neither of those games can even come close to PoE overall quality. You’re acting as if “competing with Diablo 4” means that it has to sell equal amounts or have equal player base. That is very immature and silly to even suggest. Competing with Diablo 4 doesn’t mean it has to have an equal player base it simply means it has to target similar audience and win people over. Which it will especially if Diablo 4 is not available on macOS. PS maybe you can ask people instead of getting me to answer everything for you next time. Go ahead and ask people if they would Boycott Diablo 4 knowing that Blizzard is not making a macOS port. Stop making me find your evidence cause you won’t believe me anyways even if I told you some.
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Clicking around in PoE is something that works very well for early game. But less so for mid- to end-game. Look at the mathematical model behind the leveling and character system and this will become very obvious. Maybe you're playing it wrong.
But what you say certainly works for the casual player not going for end-game or those just replicating others builds.
You're obviously not working in software development. Most of the bugs and especially utilizing GPU and chip specific instructions can easily be tested by tests done in software. You don't require the actual hardware for it. Apple especially with their CI approach is making this somewhat easy, at least in comparison to others. As I said, if this is not utilized during development of a software project, then that's either because it's amateur hour or people do not care.
For me this is especially annoying because, among other things, I'm teaching this at a university. The good students, who end up with their Bachelor or Master degree in Computer Science understand this and can easily do it. The all-knowing script kiddies who think they know what they're doing, but actually know nothing do it exactly like what we're seeing with PoE now and I'm wasting a ton of my time trying to explain to them how it's done properly. That's why I have no respect for such things, especially in the industry field. It's bad enough people in research don't follow "the rules".
I'd be happy to test it for them, just for fun. Computer graphics and games have always been an interest for me since the 1980s when I began to develop games on the C64. For my professional career I went into medical/scientific imaging and video, because there's more money to make at the time. Since that allowed me to retire in my late 20s / early 30s I'd have no problem buying hardware if necessary. In fact, before I sold my company, that's how I handled things. If you need something to get the work done, you buy it. But since retirement is boring I switched to research and teaching at a university. I'm also teaching shader development for games there. So I could even top that and throw in a bunch of students working on it as well, how does that sound? All I need is full source code access and we're all set.
Check the usual sources. Here are numbers for PoE:
Code:
Month Avg. Players Gain % Gain Peak Players
Last 30 Days 10,156.0 -2,541.6 -20.02% 26,580
December 2020 12,697.6 -5,145.3 -28.84% 36,730
November 2020 17,842.9 -20,594.4 -53.58% 37,936
October 2020 38,437.3 +6,387.2 +19.93% 75,814
September 2020 32,050.1 +13,220.6 +70.21% 121,595
August 2020 18,829.5 -16,011.4 -45.96% 38,067
July 2020 34,840.9 +4,761.6 +15.83% 64,732
June 2020 30,079.3 +11,225.0 +59.54% 125,432
May 2020 18,854.3 -20,380.8 -51.95% 39,620
April 2020 39,235.1 -3,097.8 -7.32% 73,985
March 2020 42,332.8 +24,751.2 +140.78% 132,508
February 2020 17,581.7 -22,397.1 -56.02% 41,010
January 2020 39,978.8 -1,709.3 -4.10% 84,600And here a graph showing the past few years.
In contrast, Diablo 3 for PSN only:
One can certainly do a more advanced analysis, for example for D3 the numbers above don't include the PC versions and do not show the monthly comparison in direct relation.
You sound like the typical person on the internet running out of arguments. Make a claim and then tell people to go out and find evidence for it. That's not how science works, sorry. I have no doubt there's an irrelevant number of players out there switching games for whatever reason. Maybe some because they don't like the color of the start button. It doesn't matter for the success of a game because people do it all the time and then come back. Does "if Apple doesn't change it, I will switch to PC/Android" sound familiar?
Also, as per forum rules. You make a claim, you have to back it up with a source. If you don't, you're in violation of the forum rules. Asking around is not a very statistical approach and therefore doesn't tell you much unless you've asked a large enough number of people to make it statistically relevant. If you now go on reddit or the support forum and ask, what do you think how many people would tell you they'd boycott D4 if they don't get a Mac version? The usual response to Mac related questions is usually something like "Mac?!? LOL, get a real computer!!!1111". On the other hand, reddit and support forums might give you a large enough number of participants for a statistical evaluation.
I get where you're coming from, you like your Mac, you like your PoE. Games come and games go all the time. I've started gaming with the Atari VCS, owned every major console including stuff like PC Engine and Neo Geo and went through the whole C64/Amiga/PC era. If something changes or people don't exactly get what they want, the world doesn't end. Would I like to have the Mac client for PoE fixed? Sure. Would I like to see a Mac version of D4? Sure. Does the world end when they're not doing it? No. The solution... I just play it on a Windows PC, no harm done.
As much as people claim Diablo 3 is more casual, it is what you make it to be. Both D3 and PoE are needless grinds to get to a goal. D3's paragon system with a more limited skill tree allow you once you accumulated enough paragon levels to immediately play numerous normal and HC builds from multiple classes you can experiment with.Clicking around in PoE is something that works very well for early game. But less so for mid- to end-game. Look at the mathematical model behind the leveling and character system and this will become very obvious. Maybe you're playing it wrong.
But what you say certainly works for the casual player not going for end-game or those just replicating others builds.
I get where you're coming from, you like your Mac, you like your PoE. Games come and games go all the time. I've started gaming with the Atari VCS, owned every major console including stuff like PC Engine and Neo Geo and went through the whole C64/Amiga/PC era. If something changes or people don't exactly get what they want, the world doesn't end. Would I like to have the Mac client for PoE fixed? Sure. Would I like to see a Mac version of D4? Sure. Does the world end when they're not doing it? No. The solution... I just play it on a Windows PC, no harm done.
POE is not good if you like to play multiple builds because you're forever are having to start a new character through a long process for a given expansion to get to where enough of the accumulated points give the skill tree abilities to go the distance. POE area random generation redraws the map but you're stuck same set of achievements again and again for a given expansion.
I will say I wish D3 was more like PoE and I wish PoE was more like D3. Neither is ideal after so much playing. As far as D4 being on the Macs with how slow the game development is progressing I've written that off until the game gets closer to release instead of this 3 - 5 years of development with no system requirements specified.
When GGG provided a link to the experimental 3.11.2 version there was lack of system requirements. At first we thought it required 10.15 or later since it was using Xcode 12. Then when older Mac laptops running 10.15/x failed, it was assumed it might be that any Mac using Nvidia GPU was unsupported. Thats all. Not that I said AVX2 was related to Nvidia.
It seems that as of the 3.13 update the macOS cursor no longer shows while playing in the PoE client, it now has the correct cursor for PoE.
That made me think that the “error sounds” would stop occurring when pressing esc, tab, return etc... but the error sounds remain. Let us know if you find any other changes MacRumors
EDIT— So it seems the games performance has become very bad now after the update for me on macOS. Seems fine on windows.
That made me think that the “error sounds” would stop occurring when pressing esc, tab, return etc... but the error sounds remain. Let us know if you find any other changes MacRumors
EDIT— So it seems the games performance has become very bad now after the update for me on macOS. Seems fine on windows.
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Your funny, that game is way too limited. Have fun with your 13.59 GB download today.
hey my game is running quite poorly now after the update 3.13.. do you think it’s cause there’s a lot of players right now?? I see streamers playing totally fine but my FPS is very choppy after the update for macOSYour funny, that game is way too limited. Have fun with your 13.59 GB download today.
I got bumped off twice 1/2 hour ago, unexpectantly, so yes a lot of online players. I have my graphics settings lowered to avoid thermal highs, so can't really tell if the FPS was choppy. It was playable. The totem reward areas have a lot of action.
I have all my settings low as well and I am using easyres etc all the workarounds but it seems choppy. I am resetting my Mac to see if that helps.. it seems my RAM usage was high. So I will report back in a bit to tell you all if it’s improved.
EDIT
oops I had my thunderbolt charger plugged into the left side of my MacBook Pro and I have read many articles online saying that this overheats//overthrottles/or whatever the macbook causing it to underperform. I hope this is fixed by now but Idk so I plugged it into the right side now and I hope this also helps. — again I will report later
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I was playing for a hour and suddenly the graphics jerked to the right off the screen, and game quit during a very busy battle. So its gots its own quirks for sure.
So, doesn't seem this is running any better than via Parallels in Windows. PuB isn't working for me, even the most recent version is crashing when planning or importing a build. Managed to get the community version going via Crossover. Bit of a mess I have to say.
I was browsing Reddit and the official forums yesterday and read some comments that they've abandoned the Mac version. All speculation of course. I'll play a few hours tomorrow, see how things go, but from what I've seen so far I'll probably switch to Windows soon as I have a new mainboard coming in that should arrive within the next two weeks.
I was browsing Reddit and the official forums yesterday and read some comments that they've abandoned the Mac version. All speculation of course. I'll play a few hours tomorrow, see how things go, but from what I've seen so far I'll probably switch to Windows soon as I have a new mainboard coming in that should arrive within the next two weeks.
aw I really hope they haven't abandoned the mac port. there's a lot of players playing mac I chat in the global chat and people whisper asking me how to improve their fps etc.. I just tell them the workarounds that have worked best for me but still am hoping for the options to use my dedicated GPU moreso than any other option because it seems, and correct me if I am wrong, but not matter what I do the game will use the integrated graphics in my macbook pro right? because the game cannot detect my dGPU and there's no way for me to make it detect it in the current state of the client, is that correct GrumpyCoder? Thanks for helping
So I've played about four hours with a friend today. Settings mostly on low, still choppy here and there. It doesn't depend on the area, number of enemies, etc. Loading assets is a little slow when entering new areas. But no glitches or crashes. So I'd say lack of GPU utilization is the biggest issue for me. Not sure on where to go from here. I guess I'll still switch to Windows to get better performance/graphics and see how the next version of the Mac client can improve things.
Edit: Yeah, seems correct that there's no way to get dGPU support. I'll dig around a little during the week.
Edit: Yeah, seems correct that there's no way to get dGPU support. I'll dig around a little during the week.
It seems like this patch is a bit of a mess overall, Windows and Mac. The performance dropped in Windows as well, it's just not that obvious because it's much better to begin with.
That being said, dGPU support works. At least it's putting load on the GPU. I'm not sure what I did differently today. I had the MBP hooked up in clamshell mode when I started the game, can't remember if I did it that way yesterday. So it seems like this isn't a problem. That is the GPU built-in the 16" MBP, not an eGPU attached via TB3. It also got noticeably hotter/louder today than yesterday.
That being said, dGPU support works. At least it's putting load on the GPU. I'm not sure what I did differently today. I had the MBP hooked up in clamshell mode when I started the game, can't remember if I did it that way yesterday. So it seems like this isn't a problem. That is the GPU built-in the 16" MBP, not an eGPU attached via TB3. It also got noticeably hotter/louder today than yesterday.
GrumpyCoder wait. Are you saying you somehow got the Dedicated GPU in your macbook to be used while playing PoE on macOS client? You say you’re unsure if it’s using the GPU or Not.. Are you saying that it’s “trying to use it” but it’s not really using it? I.e. is your performance any better? Cause if your performance isn’t any better than I imagine that PoE is not connecting to your GPU? Did you check the activity monitor to see if PoE is utilizing the GPU? That’s usually what I do to see. So far it has said “No” (No GPU) for me but I’ll check later today when I play some PoE. Thanks for the update GCoder
EDIT
GCoder I hope you’ll reply today! I always look forward to your stuff and I’m sorry about being hostile before.
I hope you forgive me.
I would like to know how many people you think play the “standalone“ client of PoE?? Like if there’s say 150K people playing the steam client, how many do you think are playing the other versions of PoE like the Korean servers // Chinese servers // standalone client?? Or do they all count into the “steam numbers” as one big pile? I would imagine there’s more than 150K PoE players but I would like your input because you seem to know a lot about this kind of thing
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First of all, don't worry. This forum is about changing information and opinions. So let's keep doing that.
Tried some stuff again, not sure what exactly is happing here. Could be a bug or a way Big Sur clocks activity.
When I look at the activity monitor, I'm getting a "no" for GPU.
But when I actually run the game, the GPU is utilized.
FPS is all over the place, around 60 but with dips below and up to 140.
After exiting the game, GPU utilization goes back down.
Not sure what's happening there. Could be a bug or just the way Big Sur is checking utilization, I'm not sure why it would be done this way. If I can find time, I'll try to look up the Apple documentation on it. I have a Radeon VII here as well, but the eGPU enclosure is in the office. Would be an option to try that and see what the activity monitor shows. Not sure when I'll go to the office again to pick it up.
About the numbers... they're counted separately between Steam, Stand-Alone Clients and PSN. But it doesn't depend on the system, so no difference between Mac/PC on Steam and Standalone. I'm pretty sure internally, they can tell the difference, but they won't publish the numbers. Numbers for Stand-Alone are global, so including Korea and CN/TW. Now, as to the split between Stand-Alone and Stream, it's hard to say. The official numbers that were once published by GGG where about 80% Steam, rest Stand-Alone. However, the lead devs said about a year ago that numbers are more like a 50/50 split, but they did not back it up with official numbers, so take it with a grain of salt.
That being said, I sure hope GGG isn't having crazy ideas. We know they're working on PoE mobile which includes iOS/iPadOS. We also know it's possible to run iOS apps on macOS lately (if the app supports it)... I sure hope that's not the way they're going... dropping the Mac version and just have people run the mobile version on their Macs.
Tried some stuff again, not sure what exactly is happing here. Could be a bug or a way Big Sur clocks activity.
When I look at the activity monitor, I'm getting a "no" for GPU.
But when I actually run the game, the GPU is utilized.
FPS is all over the place, around 60 but with dips below and up to 140.
After exiting the game, GPU utilization goes back down.
Not sure what's happening there. Could be a bug or just the way Big Sur is checking utilization, I'm not sure why it would be done this way. If I can find time, I'll try to look up the Apple documentation on it. I have a Radeon VII here as well, but the eGPU enclosure is in the office. Would be an option to try that and see what the activity monitor shows. Not sure when I'll go to the office again to pick it up.
About the numbers... they're counted separately between Steam, Stand-Alone Clients and PSN. But it doesn't depend on the system, so no difference between Mac/PC on Steam and Standalone. I'm pretty sure internally, they can tell the difference, but they won't publish the numbers. Numbers for Stand-Alone are global, so including Korea and CN/TW. Now, as to the split between Stand-Alone and Stream, it's hard to say. The official numbers that were once published by GGG where about 80% Steam, rest Stand-Alone. However, the lead devs said about a year ago that numbers are more like a 50/50 split, but they did not back it up with official numbers, so take it with a grain of salt.
That being said, I sure hope GGG isn't having crazy ideas. We know they're working on PoE mobile which includes iOS/iPadOS. We also know it's possible to run iOS apps on macOS lately (if the app supports it)... I sure hope that's not the way they're going... dropping the Mac version and just have people run the mobile version on their Macs.
If I understand, the mobile version wouldn't work my our macs or at least not mine since it's an intel mac?First of all, don't worry. This forum is about changing information and opinions. So let's keep doing that.
Tried some stuff again, not sure what exactly is happing here. Could be a bug or a way Big Sur clocks activity.
When I look at the activity monitor, I'm getting a "no" for GPU.
View attachment 1715818
But when I actually run the game, the GPU is utilized.
FPS is all over the place, around 60 but with dips below and up to 140.
View attachment 1715822
After exiting the game, GPU utilization goes back down.
View attachment 1715823
Not sure what's happening there. Could be a bug or just the way Big Sur is checking utilization, I'm not sure why it would be done this way. If I can find time, I'll try to look up the Apple documentation on it. I have a Radeon VII here as well, but the eGPU enclosure is in the office. Would be an option to try that and see what the activity monitor shows. Not sure when I'll go to the office again to pick it up.
About the numbers... they're counted separately between Steam, Stand-Alone Clients and PSN. But it doesn't depend on the system, so no difference between Mac/PC on Steam and Standalone. I'm pretty sure internally, they can tell the difference, but they won't publish the numbers. Numbers for Stand-Alone are global, so including Korea and CN/TW. Now, as to the split between Stand-Alone and Stream, it's hard to say. The official numbers that were once published by GGG where about 80% Steam, rest Stand-Alone. However, the lead devs said about a year ago that numbers are more like a 50/50 split, but they did not back it up with official numbers, so take it with a grain of salt.
That being said, I sure hope GGG isn't having crazy ideas. We know they're working on PoE mobile which includes iOS/iPadOS. We also know it's possible to run iOS apps on macOS lately (if the app supports it)... I sure hope that's not the way they're going... dropping the Mac version and just have people run the mobile version on their Macs.
Thanks for the reply!
Yes my AMD Radeon Pro 560 also starts "running" if I look at the GPU history in activity monitor nice catch. Was it not doing this before the 3.13.0B patch GCoder?
No, it's a ARM/AS only feature. They could port this to Intel, but I doubt they will. At this point, Intel Macs are dead, so I don't think we'll see much development for these anymore. Software support for the next two years or so, but nothing of the new major features.
It worked just before the latest patch released and with the patch installed. I just noticed it for the first time when I tried it, that's what I found odd. Why would the utilization of the GPU shoot up so high when the game is running and another part of the activity monitor would show that it's not using the GPU... it all seems a little dodgy. I'll have a look at the latest patch notes later and play a little.
My GPU Radeon 560 goes ALL THE WAY to the top of the utilization bar and stays there when I am playing PoE. I play PoE in “low resolution mode” with “easy res app” set to 1440x900 or lower (non-retina) all the settings in PoE are as low as I can make them and everything and no matter what I do, even if I make the PoE window small (windowed) it still uses the full GPU. This would be fine under normal circumstances but the issue is, I really DO NOT think that PoE is actually using our GPU at all Even though it shows utilization.. I don’t think PoE is able to “connect” to our dedicated GPU. Do you agree with this GCoder or do you think PoE is actually using mine and your GPU?