LOL I'm being sarcastic. I'm upset but I'm gonna use my Mac for either xcode or possibly python coding until it won't work anymore
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Pathetic support
- Thread starter techguy15
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I’m starting to wonder if this poster has enough of a grasp of the general realm of technology to be a coder.
That said, I’ve worked IT for years and continue to be amazed by people that can code in their sleep, but can’t seem to figure out what to do when outlook won’t open...so what do I know?
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If you pop that SSD in that machine will be speedy for years to come. I stuck one into a friend’s 2010 13” MBP and it’s actually *faster* today than it ever was before, even with the aging processor.
Apparently they were being sarcastic (see above). Oddly enough I couldn't find any sarcasm in their post, nor do I see much chance they'll cut it as a developer with their way of thinking. Developers embrace challenges, this poster just whines about them.
Eh, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt. He seems young, I’ve seen people take to the logical puzzle aspect of coding who had never shown even a remote interest in tech before. Maybe when he gets his feet wet he’ll jump headfirst and learn the rest of how tech works by osmosis.
I always took my osmosis on the rocks... Or was the Vodka. I spent a lot of my younger years working 16 hours days drunk out my skull sometimes so I rightly can't remember
. It was bad enough keeping up with other coders back then, but as a girl - Mein Gott!, 'twas rough! Those were heady halcyon days though. 
Apple's long term support for Macs is woeful. As it has been said, Windows 10 will run (quite well) on the 2006 devices Apple stoped supporting 7 years ago in 2011. Macs are very expensive computers and given Apple's supposedly environmentally friendly stance, it is very hypocritical of them to end of life 2010 and 2011 machines that would have run Mojave perfectly well if metal wasn't a requirement. Nothing new though - Most of the 2008 and 2009 Macs dropped by Sierra run it perfectly well also when hacked.
I don’t understand why people think a computer running Windows is somehow supported. I have machines that run Windows 7, god knows if something went wrong Asus isn’t going to do a thing for me with a 5 year old machine.
People seem willing to conflate hardware and OS support for some strange reason...
It's simple, really. Microsoft is a software company. They want their OS running on as many devices as possible. They don't really benefit when you buy a new computer (unless it's a Surface but that's a tiny fraction of all the Windows devices out there). So they invest a lot of effort into making Windows work well on old hardware (this wasn't always the case though, as anyone who remembers Vista will know).
Apple is a hardware company. They make money when you buy new hardware, and then that saves them from having to invest resources into maintaining compatibility with older devices (as well as customers who waltz into the Apple store complaining that their 2007 MacBook won't Airdrop to their iPhone).
Apple doesn't profit from your personal data or sell it to others who do. Are we sure that Microsoft can say the same? I mean Windows 10 (even the Pro version) is riddled with advertising.
Apple is a hardware company. They make money when you buy new hardware, and then that saves them from having to invest resources into maintaining compatibility with older devices (as well as customers who waltz into the Apple store complaining that their 2007 MacBook won't Airdrop to their iPhone).
Apple doesn't profit from your personal data or sell it to others who do. Are we sure that Microsoft can say the same? I mean Windows 10 (even the Pro version) is riddled with advertising.
Thank you guys for the encouragement. I usually don't receive this type of positivity in other newbie coding forums. I feel more welcomed here and encouraged that my Mac is gonna be okay for coding ☺️
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Thank you for the encouragement
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Thank you for the encouragement
Just do yourself a favor, don’t bother looking at the latest and greatest updates to coding on a Mac until you’re confident you have the basics down pat.
Start with Playgrounds if you’re completely new, it may seem from the snobbish to be a kids toy, but it actually does a great job of really laying out the fundamentals.
Also, don’t start making any apps unless you personally want to use them. A passion project is a far better source of motivation than the dream of striking it big, the gold rush for individuals in the App Store is long gone.
I use python daily on my 2009. I sync all my projects through iCloud, so I can pick up on whatever machine I have at hand. My latest coding endeavour was a library for asymmetric cryptography, including diffie-helman, RSA and elliptic curve. Python 2.7 on my '09 running El Capitan was more than serviceable despite some iCloud quirks!
I'll often take the programming golf challenges on Stack Exchange (https://codegolf.stackexchange.com) - not to 'golf' the result, but just to sharpen my skills and learn new techniques. It's very rewarding to lay out the logical solution to a puzzle, write it in whatever language you're working in and have it give the correct results first time.
Good luck with your programming career, but please don't ever blame your tools when things go wrong!
I want to add that I'm not trying to be stupid or ignorant. I'm just concerned about my purchase of a Mac and I was ranting yes, but also looking for reassurance that my machine will still be solid for use in coding. I'm still new. I chose Mac since I've had bad luck with PCs. I want to apologize if I've come off childish (I am young) . I was just a bit upset when I saw my particular Mac wasn't included in the new update. That's all. I don't hate Apple and I'm not gonna chuck my Mac in the trash lol. It has, truthfully, worked much better than my Dell... That needed constant repairs
Well, at least you aren't working on 12+ year old hardware. Over in the PowerPC forum, folks do everything they possibly can to squeeze every last drop of life out of their Macs hailing from 1998 to 2006, and many live on them. Hell, the most RAM we could put in our laptops is 2 GB!
And yet, a bunch of people still actively learn to code and develop applications for OS X 10.4 and 10.5, which everyone there is benefiting from. Hey, we have XCode too. One guy is even making applications compatible with 10.4 all the way to 10.13.
What's important is that you acquire the essential knowhow to develop software for Apple hardware, no matter how out of date it is, because the basic principles of OS X / iOS development doesn't usually change - much. Work out your app publication later on. Trick out your MBP and practice now so you can put your best foot forward down the line, maybe even with a newer computer.
But that's just my outlook.
- Flawlessly sent from an Early 2005 PowerBook G4 with a 1.5GHz CPU and 1.25 GB of RAM, soon to be paired with a 32 GB SSD -
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Your machine is hands down one of the best Macs to develop on. Don't worry. If something goes wrong with it, at least you can open it up and take a look. Not so on Apple's latest offerings, however. So hey, it's got some advantages to it.
And yet, a bunch of people still actively learn to code and develop applications for OS X 10.4 and 10.5, which everyone there is benefiting from. Hey, we have XCode too. One guy is even making applications compatible with 10.4 all the way to 10.13.
What's important is that you acquire the essential knowhow to develop software for Apple hardware, no matter how out of date it is, because the basic principles of OS X / iOS development doesn't usually change - much. Work out your app publication later on. Trick out your MBP and practice now so you can put your best foot forward down the line, maybe even with a newer computer.
But that's just my outlook.
- Flawlessly sent from an Early 2005 PowerBook G4 with a 1.5GHz CPU and 1.25 GB of RAM, soon to be paired with a 32 GB SSD -
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Your machine is hands down one of the best Macs to develop on. Don't worry. If something goes wrong with it, at least you can open it up and take a look. Not so on Apple's latest offerings, however. So hey, it's got some advantages to it.
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Don't buy another one then...period. Mad about a 7 year old system not being supported??? Hahaha
From my understanding, Metal runs on the gpu’s of the macs going back to that time. Could it be implemented further back? Maybe, but the diminishing returns on support that far back (laptop gpu’s have progressed staggeringly since then in capability) probably isn’t financially worth the effort and from an engineering standpoint might even make Metal more cumbersome.
Honestly 7 years of support from a Mac user base standpoint makes a ton of sense to me given how much that space has changed in that timeframe.
And keep your eyes on the "unsupported macs" thread in this forum. If there is any way to get Mojave running on your machine, dosdude and the other brilliant minds in there will figure it out... they're working on it as we blather on here in fact.
I paid $2400 for my 2011 which has since been sold. Over 7 years its paid its value off in terms of monetary value.
$2400/(365x7) = 94 cents per day.
I'd say thats pretty good value. If you put your app on the AppStore, all you needed is 1-2 purchases a day and it would have paid itself off.
If you're buying a new Mac now, you would be getting good value out of it if you were to use it for 4-5 years.
$2400/(365x7) = 94 cents per day.
I'd say thats pretty good value. If you put your app on the AppStore, all you needed is 1-2 purchases a day and it would have paid itself off.
If you're buying a new Mac now, you would be getting good value out of it if you were to use it for 4-5 years.
So really, this is a software decision -- Apple's decision to deprecate OpenGL in 10.14. My understanding is OpenGL will remain in the 10.14 libraries, Apple is choosing to no longer code macOS against OpenGL. The hardware itself on the newly unsupported machines would run it just fine if OpenGL were still in the picture.
Do I have that right?
It's not 7 years of support. It's 7 years of OS updates and ~9 years of support. HS will continue to receive security updates. The update/support timeframe is beyond adequate.
Honestly, I was surprised to see my late-2012 mini make the cut. 16 GB RAM w/ an SSD and the thing just as snappy as ever.
Maybe, just maybe... that could be the reason those machines aren't supported in Mojave. Apple is going all in on Metal systemwide, those GPUs are too weak to support Metal. Simple as that.
Remember that 12 years ago, Vista struggled to run on many brand new computers. 13 years ago today, a new PowerPC Mac owner would wake up the next morning to the news that Apple was transitioning to Intel. Only one paid update (not free like today) and four years later, that was the end of the road for major updates for their machine.
Seven years of updates, most of them free, is really quite good in the grand scheme of things.
The only PPC Mac that stood a chance of outperforming even a MacBook Air in 2009 was the most powerful Power Mac G5 Quad. Today, plenty of 2011 quad-core iMacs and MacBook Pros outperform brand new MacBooks in some ways. Faster processors, more ports, and OpenGL graphics performance isn't far off either.
Personal computers are a mature product that simply aren't advancing as fast as they used to be. Older hardware is more viable than it ever was before, whether you bought it new many years ago or used more recently at a significant discount.
I get that Apple would rather not work around certain limitations in otherwise capable hardware, like 32-bit EFI in 2006 Mac Pros or no support for Metal. But let's be honest, they could if they wanted to. There's simply no financial incentive for them to do so, while there is in doing the opposite and forcing users to upgrade.
I suspect this has to do with Metal support. At it seems, the dropped machines have GPUs that lack support for more modern features. Looking at the supported models, the minimal requirement for 10.14 is a DirectX 11.1 or better GPU.