Phil Schiller Goes on Offensive Against Android and Samsung

[samcraig]

Agreed. As I've said before...integration, integration, integration. It's all about the integration and seamlessness you get with the Apple ecosystem. Android just doesn't have that.

Such as? What does an iPhone integrate with that Android doesn't. I'm genuinely curious what you mean by this.

 

[Dave.UK]

here you go buddy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fragmentation_(programming)

TL;DR:

So it's not about "having flyover or not", it's about the way it would behave if all versions of iOS would include it, which you cannot anticipation the greater the number of device+OS version combinations is.

the fact is that you cannot rely on the compatibility of all those ROMs with your software, just like you must expect problems when you jailbreak and install 100 tweaks that don't care what another tweak changed in the OS. I understand that many are just skins and not too much under the hood stuff, but that is not correct for all.

Of course it is. Theres certain apps I cant run on older versions of Android and theres certain apps that cant run on older versions of ios.

Both platforms suffer from fragmentation.

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Does it also do tablets and Samsung laptops?

Ive got it on my Galaxy Tab 10.1. Cant speak for Samsung laptops as I dont have one.

 

[craftytony]

Go Schilla' Go Schilla' it's yo birthday!

 

[typeadam]

How do you backup and restore your note 2? You rebought all of your apps for android? What are you using instead of Photostream, iWork, iCloud, Garageband, iPhoto, Find my phone, Find my Friends, etc. etc.

Sorry, but you're not fooling anyone.

I have an iPhone and I don't use any of those things (except for Garageband), soooo....... Just sayin..

 

[Chupa Chupa]

You are missing the point. Apple is wildly successful because they make great products. Apple could make an iPhone that costs 200 bucks and literally dominate every single market over night. They could also license OS X and rack in billions a year. But they choose not to.

All those things you listed and Steve listed are merely a side-effect of having a great product. It isn't a destination or a target. I agree with you that since iPhones are their cash cow, losing that would be a problem for Apple. But by the time that happens, Apple would have moved on to the next big thing.

If that were true then Macs would have kicked PC's ass and never looked back and Apple would have never have been nearing bankruptcy on several occasions in the 90s and very early 00s prior to the iPod... literally getting bailed out by Microsoft on one. But it wound up the other way around -- the clunky PC beat the Mac in sales #s and profit. No, I'm not missing the point. Great products CAN result in great earnings, but as I pointed out in a previous post, it's no guarantee. Plenty of great products lost out to lesser products for a host a marketing or cost reasons.

And my point about the Stevenotes was to illustrated that Apple does care about marketshare. It's not making art for art's sake. It's doing so to make lots and lots and lots of money and to be the market leader.

 

[SeniorGato1]

Thats a lot of phones for the small time Android has been readily available on the market not to mention those phone models themselves are not very old. Why do you change so much? Not happy with your experience I would imagine or you just love cycling through junk phones.

I've owned my S3 far longer than my iphone 5 due to many ios shortcomings. For instance, I can't use both audio & video on Verizon iPhone, but I can on Verizon S3. That makes it tough to see a webex presentation on the go!

 

[Winni]

Just speaking the truth

Strangely enough, I find the Android experience vastly superior to the experiences that I had with the overly restricted iOS platform. But I care more about the forthcoming Ubuntu Phone platform than I care about either Android or iOS.

 

[Zeldain]

Yes and thats why your getting your ass kicked by Android.

I have owned the S3, Nexus 4 and the Note 2 and i can tell you fragmentation hasnt hurt my experience one bit.

PC's are fragmented to hell and they dont suffer. In fact OSX cant perform a single benchmark better than PC in any games.

Dont tell consumers its for their benefit you make the hardware and software. Its for your profit only

Of course it has, you just don't realize what a non-fragmented experience is.

Also, games matter.

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Strangely enough, I find the Android experience vastly superior to the experiences that I had with the overly restricted iOS platform. But I care more about the forthcoming Ubuntu Phone platform than I care about either Android or iOS.

And you are a fringe case - not the target of iOS or Android. Invalid opinion.

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I've owned my S3 far longer than my iphone 5 due to many ios shortcomings. For instance, I can't use both audio & video on Verizon iPhone, but I can on Verizon S3. That makes it tough to see a webex presentation on the go!

And exactly how many WebEx presentations "on the go" do you do in a day?

 

[Winni]

Agreed. As I've said before...integration, integration, integration. It's all about the integration and seamlessness you get with the Apple ecosystem. Android just doesn't have that.

Sorry, but what you call integration actually is incarceration. You get locked in a clever digital prison, that's all that Apple's "seamless integration" is.

 

[Tiger8]

How do you backup and restore your note 2? You rebought all of your apps for android? What are you using instead of Photostream, iWork, iCloud, Garageband, iPhoto, Find my phone, Find my Friends, etc. etc.

Sorry, but you're not fooling anyone.

You are making the assumption that s/he is using those apps.

Apple benefits from vertical integration (i.e. sservices and software that work accross all Apple products), but as third party options are available, people are becoming less platform dependent and more and more 'horizontally' integrated

iTunes --> Spolify, Amazon Cloud Player, Pandora, etc..
iTunes TV Episode Movies --> Netflix, Vudu, Hulu, Amazon, etc..

 

[MacMan1620]

Why are there so many Pro-Samsung people on this forum? Does Samsung not have their own forum or did they simple steal this idea as well

 

[samcraig]

Of course it has, you just don't realize what a non-fragmented experience is.

Also, games matter.

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And you are a fringe case - not the target of iOS or Android. Invalid opinion.

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And exactly how many WebEx presentations "on the go" do you do in a day?

So your opinion is the only one that matters?

Perhaps fragmentation doesn't matter as much as YOU think it does.
Stating a poster's opinion is invalid is silly. His opinion is just as valid as anyone else's. That's why it's called an opinion.
And what kind of question is that - even if it's just ONE - it's an important feature to him.

Newsflash: Everyone has a different use case. Not everyone is YOU.

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Sorry, but what you call integration actually is incarceration. You get locked in a clever digital prison, that's all that Apple's "seamless integration" is.

I'd just love to know what he meant that Android doesn't have integration. What is he referring to?

 

[RenoG]

Why are there so many Pro-Samsung people on this forum? Does Samsung not have their own forum or did they simple steal this idea as well

I was thinking the same thing, my word where are we, a sub-Samsung forum?...27 pages of this maddness..

 

[wovel]

If the competitive company wasn't Apple, you might have a point.

Apple don't pay a fair rate of tax. They claim to pay something like 9% globally per year (and even that is likely inflated from the actual cash that changes hands).

Apple makes tens of billions of dollars (like $30-40Bn) in profit and pays less than $4bn a year cash taxes (globally - so that 4bn is split between the US, EU, China, etc). The United States gets pathetic small amounts of revenue from Apple being here.

Apple do employ people in the US, but so do Samsung. They have a huge fabrication and design facility in Austin, for example.

Apple are a stateless company. Don't start calling them American.

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As for Schiller's statement, it's obvious why this is happening (GS4 event tomorrow).

Not only that, but the other story of the week is how successful Samsung's marketing has been. They out-spent Apple and successfully managed to change perceptions about their brand. People now consider their phones as being as good (if not better) than iPhones. I'm not talking Android-fanboys here, I'm talking regular Mums & Dads.

As head of Apple's marketing, Phil is to some extent accountable for letting that happen and totally responsible for fixing it.

Personally I think Samsung's marketing has been horrifically bad - I cringed at the obvious product-placement that was thrust in your face everywhere during the Olympics, for example. What do smartphones have to do with sport anyway? It's sad that tacky stuff like over-pushing your product in totally unrelated big events has any effect, but it seems to.

You do realize th primary output of Samsung's Austin Fab is Apple CPUs, right? It is really irrelevant, but your one example only exists to serve Apple.

 

[samcraig]

I was thinking the same thing, my word where are we, a sub-Samsung forum?...27 pages of this maddness..

Because those who have Apple products can't be critical of Phil's comments?

 

[Born Again]

This is pretty simple for anyone to get..

If this were about palm or windows phone Phil - this pompous person - would not even lift a finger to respond.

He's worried.

 

[r.harris1]

650+ comments. Wow. You'd think Phil was making comments about your mothers rather than about comparatively silly productivity devices.

 

[RenoG]

This is pretty simple for anyone to get..

If this were about palm or windows phone Phil - this pompous person - would not even lift a finger to respond.

He's worried.

I suppose if you look at the numbers, he has reason to be...I mean just look at the level of support android gets on a forum specific for apple products..

 

[viskon]

Why are there so many Pro-Samsung people on this forum? Does Samsung not have their own forum or did they simple steal this idea as well

Well, not everyone here drinks the Apple Cool-aid. In addition to Apple devices, we have other devices as well and develop opinions unbiased by marketing spin.

On Topic- Paul Schiller 's comments sound like that of a religious headman desperately trying to keep his flock together. Sounds really desperate.

iOS is almost as fragmented as Android, given that newer apps don't run on old hardware ; ecosystem integration is as good on Android as on Apple ; Android just needs one login to Google while setting up, unlike iOS, which needs two ( including iTunes)... where do I stop? Misinformation must be Apple' s latest innovation.

 

[iDento]

Seriously? Someone actually uses Find my friends? And iWork? You must be joking.

I don't use Find My Friends.
I can't live without iWork.

 

[KPOM]

There's a sort of conflict Apple has. They have the attitude of being a premier device but yet their phones are sold just about anywhere (walmart, Staples, etc) and against other phones which are the same price and/or cheaper.

While the industry has matured quite a bit in the last 5-6 years since the iPhone was introduced - Apple's model hasn't. They were able to lead and in many cases still are. But in other areas - they are "following" so to speak. The iPad Mini is a perfect example. Starting to increase their screen size. They are responding to the marketplace. Any argument to the contrary seems dis-genuine. That's why it seems easier to believe that now, Apple is considering lower priced devices. Time will tell.

"Choosing not to" might have worked when the competition wasn't as great. Choosing not to might not work in the future.

They are making less expensive products, and may yet make a less expensive iPhone, but I don't see them ever making "cheap" products. Even the iPad mini is $329. I think Apple would rather have the top 25-40% of a market than the bottom 60-75%. A $99 or even $149 iPad mini and a $249 unsubsidized iPhone might grab lots of market share, but at a hit to margins and brand image that is just too risky.

Everyone crows about Samsung's market share, which is 50% larger than Apple's, but their profit margins are less than half of Apple's. The Galaxy S3 was outsold by the iPhone 4S last quarter. They are relying on the S3 and the upcoming S4 to drive their profits.

 

[Dave.UK]

Why are there so many Pro-Samsung people on this forum? Does Samsung not have their own forum or did they simple steal this idea as well

I love it when this pops up

This site is called MacRumors and covers iMacs, MacBooks, iPhones, iPads and iPods.

As such its possible to own:

iMac & Android phone
Macbook & Android phone
iPad & Android phone
iPod & Android phone
and believe it or not, theres even people on here that own iPhone & Android phone!

Just because someone is on an Apple based site, dosent mean they have to be pro all their products.

Hope that helps

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I was thinking the same thing, my word where are we, a sub-Samsung forum?...27 pages of this maddness..

Please see above

 

[KPOM]

Its ironic (nay, insulting to peoples intelligence) Schiller talking about Android users running older operating systems when I myself am still running IOS 5.1.1 because I didn’t want to loose Google Maps in favour of Apples sub-standard offering!What Schiller and Apple need to do is stop bashing (and suing!) the competition, pull their heads out their backsides and deliver a comparable product (hardware and IOS) … and when I say hardware, I mean in style before all you Apple sheep start bleating about plastic versus (easy to scratch!) aluminium! They also need to stop their blatant ripping off and include micro SD storage because whereas I can live without a replaceable battery, I don’t see why I should have to pay Apple an extra £100 per 16MB when most competitors give me the option to upgrade myself cheaply.

As an Apple user and fan for the past 12 years, I have to say I’m beginning to loath Apple as I once did Microsoft – because I’m fed up with them resting on their laurels with old boring products with no vision, their relentless quest for style (eg iMac thickness) over substance (eg no optical drives and SD slots on the back!!!!!!), their constant berating of other brands, worshipping of the bully that was Jobs and now Jonny Ive (anyone can design a good looking unit – but respect should go to the people that actually build these dreams!)

I guess the public will vote with their wallets tomorrow – whatever Schiller, Ive, the ghost of Jobs and the rest of Apple would like us to think!

Uh, you can download Google Maps for iOS. It's even better than the Android version. As for ditching optical drives, making the machine non-upgradable, and being obsessed with design and thinness, those started in the Jobs era. They are also permeating throughout the rest of the industry. How upgradable is the Microsoft Surface Pro? What about most Ultrabooks? Where's the optical drive in Samsung's Series 9?

 

[andy9l]

Take for example how on Android you want to find where you are on a map. So you go to "Maps" and it displays your location. Say that now you want to get turn by turn navigation to get somewhere else, well you have to quit the app and go into the "Navigation" app, and you have to retype your destination. Last time, my friend didn't realize that those two apps were separate and don't know about each other, and didn't retype the destination (she just typed it in to Maps and then switched to Navigation) and it navigated us to a completely different location, and only in the middle of the journey did she realize that it was going to some place she typed in last time she used Navigation, not the one she just entered in Maps. This kind of thing should not happen today.

This is simply incorrect. I've literally just sat here and got turn-by-turn directions to a nearby Nando's within about 5 seconds, via Maps.

1. Open Maps
2. Click the directions button
3. Type "nan" and click the suggestion

3D, turn-by-turn directions on my screen right now.

Alternatively I just say "Navigate to Nando's" to my phone and it does it for me. Same as Siri, I have no doubt.

I don't have much to say in the argument between Android and iOS - I personally moved from 4 years of iOS to an S3 last year, and to be honest...I barely noticed the difference. It simply boils down to a more customisable iPhone, in my workflow. The argument is ridiculous. Android is arguably slightly rougher around the edges than iOS, but when it comes to real-world stuff...they do the same.

 

[Mr.damien]

Yes and thats why your getting your ass kicked by Android.

I have owned the S3, Nexus 4 and the Note 2 and i can tell you fragmentation hasnt hurt my experience one bit.

PC's are fragmented to hell and they dont suffer. In fact OSX cant perform a single benchmark better than PC in any games.

Dont tell consumers its for their benefit you make the hardware and software. Its for your profit only

The fact your benchmarks are only based on games proove that you mustn't work that much with your devices and laptops. That's why you will never understand the apple world.

my 2 cents.