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[/QUOTE]Agreed. Steve knew that customers did not know what they want. He got rid of all superflous products that Apple used to sell back in 1998/9. He kept one of everything. Tim wants to give everyone everything they ask. Bigger screen? Two iPhones, three iPads. To me, the success of the iPhone was in the fact that there was 1 model with 3 storage capacities. iPads? Get rid of anything bigger than the original one. .[/QUOTE]

Had apple not increased the screen size they would have already been irrelevant.
 
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Wow, it's been 10 years! Tim Cook must feel pretty... emojinal right now!
 
Well he more than made up for it in prior years as apple was catapulted to the most valuable company.

Gaaaah. No one here cares if Apple has a quarter trillion in the bank, if they're not making the Macs and other devices that people here need or desire.

Sure, Apple will continue to sell lots of iPhones to folks like teenage girls who don't care about those other things, but this is not a forum full of such users.

(Although, like I've said, my teen daughter and her friends are avoiding the iPhone 7 because it has no headphone jack. So perhaps even that easy-to-sell-to group is going away.)

It really was. Also, having those SMS as an IM application was unheard of. You pretty much had to look for the correct SMS in an assumed order. Something we now take for granted,

Not to take away from your post at all, but just a note that the 2004 Palm and then WinMo had threaded SMS apps available.

2004 Palm Treo:

2004_palm-treo-chat.jpg


Windows Mobile:

sms-threader.jpg
 
While Facebook has started something out of what Jobs started, I don't see it happening. Social networks come and go, and Facebook is no different. For now, FB is a force, but later? Not so much. Many of the people that started Facebook are quiting because it has become a sesspool of what it once was (or rather its initial promise).

I don't see FB as a cesspool. The current version has a great interface on most of the phones and tablets along with the brilliant web app that made it a success. A lot of the controversy has been about the political correctness and "unlucky" algorithms, but there are smaller social media for porn (tumblr), breastfeeding (womens forum) and nude portraits (google image search). Snapchat is pretty free from censorship, so if you need to indulge in that you may. You are your own enabler.

Every year I see reports trying to attack the platform, but I believe that all good will be attacked. If you look at the numbers of new users, everything looks healthy. It has become the guilty pleasure we all do, but don't talk about. The real life social virality of FaceBook is gone, but young people doesn't opt out, they have just stopped talking about "the hype".

FaceBook is replacing how Gen X socially handled daytime television, in the way that most people has spent time watching television for hours during the day, but nobody wants to openly admit it. It has replaced the aspect of comparison that we used to have with television stars and now we use the media made by our friends to influence us. From my own experience, alot of my friends are easier to get a hold of on FaceBook than on any other communication interface.

Last point. Does any app from Apple have a bigger audience penetration / monthly minutes than FaceBook? I think even Google+ have more usage than any of the in-house apps on your iOS device.

screen-shot-2016-03-30-at-9-12-44-am.0.png
 
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I believe that the overall user experience with the iPhone is unmatched. the simplicity and ease of use/performance and stability of iOS is much better than that any other platform.
I think Schiller may be right if he is talking about that.
 
That's like saying to Microsoft, if you remove Windows from the profits for analysis, what's left? So then what percentage of total table sales is ipad vs the rest? While I don't justify price increases everything in my life as increased in price lately.
Windows wont drop to zero as its got 90% market share and an almost monopoly over the sector.Linux needs a crap ton of google searching commands to do functions Windows does in an instant while a Mac gets you a 5400RPM hard drive and a Intel Iris graphics at 1500 bucks which is a ripoff.Windows has nothing to fear

Tim's biggest break through is the apple pencil, finally. Maybe it will work with future versions of iphones.
You mean the stylus which has been around since 2005

Timmy is following what jobs started, we can debate about this point (and have been doing so), until the cows come home. Is history repeating?
Yup its repeating.When Stevie wasnt around Apple had too many products and was getting bankrupts.Enter Jobs

https://www.fastcompany.com/1693832/steve-jobss-strategy-get-rid-crappy-stuff

Jobs shouts "Get rid of all the crappy stuff

10 products.Comes out with iPhone,iPod and iPad.Instantly creates a product line which contributes to 65% of revenue and a near universal adoption.Enter Timmy.Once again on the road to too many products.Mac languishing.iPad sales tank.iPhone sales starting to tank.Lowest op margin since 7 years.An embarassing 15% pay cut and a 10% production cut.How am I supposed to intrpret this?


Steve, imo, left it like that in 2011. So now you realize the short-sightness of jobs with larger form factors?
No Steve handed Timmy a cash cow.Timmy should be thankful otherwise he would have been another Nadella


This started in 2010?
Sales tanked since Jobs died


Under Tim, IOS has had much more innovation, starting with 64 bit and the 5S.
Is that why iOS bricked devices 3 times a year.I dont think even Android broke that record


Forestall was on his way out anyway, brilliant doesn't cut it if you don't get along with the team.
The quality you just described is a hallmark of Jobs.iOS was created because he created an internal competition between Tony and Forstall.If his hallmark didnt cut it,well Apple wouldnt exist as it would be bankrupt decades ago[/QUOTE]
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I believe that the overall user experience with the iPhone is unmatched. the simplicity and ease of use/performance and stability of iOS is much better than that any other platform.
I think Schiller may be right if he is talking about that.
On the contrary,iOS supposedly crashes more than Android

http://fortune.com/2016/08/25/apple-ios-failure-rate/
 
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64 bit, like it matters, since no iPhone has more than 4GB of memory to address. The 5S was a great iPhone because of the CPU. The design wasn't anything defining. It was the speed alone that made the phone great, not any changes to the software released by Apple. Spotify Connect handled how audio was supposed to be, freeing up the phone to do calls and other stuff, rather than just streaming it's entire sound output to a device. This happened in 2013.

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/123...s-of-speakers-to-support-new-streaming-option

My B&O has both and I prefer Spotify Connect over any other audio solution. AirPlay is like a first generation product that was a forerunner, but it makes the phone a hostage. You have to be in range, as the receiver has to fetch the audio from the phone rather than going to the source itself and making your device independent from the speaker. It's also cross platform. I can use any brand and operating system to connect.

I would appreciate the ability for apps with audio output to have a similar standard defined by Apple rather than being closed to a single app like Spotify. Apple became more dependent on outside innovation in the Tim era, and slowly competition started making their own closed gardens that worked better than the one with Apples in it. In other words, the phone isn't so much part of an ecosystem anymore. It's more or less down to choice. All the free music on YouTube along with the share button on FB makes the Chromecast a more universal choice for consumers.
 
Blackberry had an outsized reputation in the business world. Their sales never lit the world on fire. In 2007 BB wasn't even a 200lb Gorilla, it had just cracked the Top 10 phone vendors, along with Apple. Nokia was the 800lb Gorilla.
http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/612207

What's strange about that is, I didn't know anyone with a Nokia phone in the business sector. Everyone had a Palm or Blackberry. Weird.
 
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What's strange about that is, I didn't know anyone with a Nokia phone in the business sector. Everyone had a Palm or Blackberry. Weird.
Yep, that's the strange thing about perception and reality. They're often not even close. Even stranger, our own confirmation biases strongly influence the perception. Ever bought car and suddenly start seeing that brand everywhere when only days before you never even noticed them on the road.?
 
What's strange about that is, I didn't know anyone with a Nokia phone in the business sector. Everyone had a Palm or Blackberry. Weird.

Palm or BlackBerry never was a big thing in Scandinavia and probably Europe as well. Nokia was the way to go. Palm meant you were a administrator or IT guy, and Blackberry certainly made you american.
 
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Yep, that's the strange thing about perception and reality. They're often not even close. Even stranger, our own confirmation biases strongly influence the perception. Ever bought car and suddenly start seeing that brand everywhere when only days before you never even noticed them on the road.?

I think in my case it's because my sales teams and all the engineers I had as customers at the time were "gadget guys". Always had to have the latest thing to play with.

Back then, Nokia was the Camry or Taurus, and everyone I knew were all getting the latest Maserati because we thought it was fun. It's beginning to come back to me now with some of the photos people are posting in another thread.
 
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Windows wont drop to zero as its got 90% market share and an almost monopoly over the sector.
In playing the "what if" game anything in the universe can happen.

You mean the stylus which has been around since 2005
Or the cell phone with apps that has been around since very th 1990s?

Yup its repeating.When Stevie wasnt around Apple had too many products and was getting bankrupts.
This is 2016 not 2006. New generation of customers, no one know if Apple would have flopped had Steve lived.

10 products.Comes out with iPhone,iPod and iPad.Instantly creates a product line which contributes to 65% of revenue and a near universal adoption.Enter Timmy.Once again on the road to too many products.Mac languishing.iPad sales tank.iPhone sales starting to tank.Lowest op margin since 7 years.An embarassing 15% pay cut and a 10% production cut.How am I supposed to intrpret this?
Under Timmy Apple grew to most valuable company, released innovations and had record earnings quarter after quarter. You can interpret "this any way you want".

No Steve handed Timmy a cash cow.
Timmy made his own pile of cash.

Is that why iOS bricked devices 3 times a year.I dont think even Android broke that record
I've lost hard drives due to Microsoft errors.

The quality you just described is a hallmark of Jobs.iOS was created because he created an internal competition between Tony and Forstall.If his hallmark didnt cut it,well Apple wouldnt exist as it would be bankrupt decades ago.
So it was great under jobs, but not so much under Timmy. Moving my goalposts and all of that.
 
Gaaaah. No one here cares if Apple has a quarter trillion in the bank, if they're not making the Macs and other devices that people here need or desire.

Sure, Apple will continue to sell lots of iPhones to folks like teenage girls who don't care about those other things, but this is not a forum full of such users.

(Although, like I've said, my teen daughter and her friends are avoiding the iPhone 7 because it has no headphone jack. So perhaps even that easy-to-sell-to group is going away.)
When one is talking about Apple going downhill a counter is the record breaking revenues since 2011. It's just a talking point like everything else. You dont get revenues without customers and customers buy products. Seems simple.

Seems like the iPhone 7+ is the new standard in my circle. People are buying Apple still made $46B.
 
Just to celebrate the anniversary, I went back to browse some macrumors threads from around the time iPhone was first announced and shortly thereafter. The volume was much less (fewer people posting), but boy, macrumors was a place for bellyaching and negativity back then, too. (Though maybe not with quite the same intensity. You need lots of people posting to truly pile on in a game of one-upsmanship of spiraling sourness.) People were cranky that the original iPhone was exclusive to Cingular/AT&T. The onscreen keyboard was going to be too small for people's giant fingers. PalmOS was better. Some Prada phone was better looking. Oh, and this one's good if you don't remember it: Apple's emphasis on releasing the iPhone meant that the release of OSX Leopard would be delayed! That's right! That jerk Steve Jobs was sacrificing attention to the Mac for the benefit of the iPhone! Then there was the gawdawful six-month gap between the time Jobs announced the iPhone (which we now know was held together with duct-tape and spit) and when it would actually be available! What? It's only 8GB? Wait. You can't swap out the battery? EDGE data speed? Really? etc.

But do go on. What was that you were saying about how crappy Apple has become? The delays in Mac releases? No innovations since the halcyon days when Steve made one announcement after another (in rapid succession) of fantastic, unheard-of products, followed by massive sales and instant successes?
 
To keep the debate fresh I am using the copy+paste function.
https://9to5mac.com/2016/10/25/apple-q4-earnings-2016/

and another deliberate evolution called screenshot.
vTlx9rY.png
Apple (AAPL) remains a drag on the sector's growth pace in Q4 with its expected -6.4% decline in total earnings on essentially flat revenues (revenues are expected to be up+0.3%). Excluding the Apple drag, total Technology sector earnings would up a relatively respectable +7.8% from the year-earlier period on +5.3% higher revenues.

Read more: http://www.nasdaq.com/article/previewing-the-q4-earnings-season-cm731325#ixzz4VOvYWR10
 
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