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PowerMacs, iMacs and eMacs

Originally posted by Postal
1.43 GHz sounds a bit odd when you check the math: you'd only get to that number if the FSB was clocked at 168 MHz, which isn't entirely unfeasible but is also not 167 MHz either.

I'd heard a couple months back or so that the first 2003 PowerMacs might have a 200 MHz FSB on at least one of the higher-end models, which (if true) would make 1.5 GHz more likely for the top-end system.

Either way, I hope that these are the 'legendary' 0.13-micron G4s with the doubled L2 cache! G4s are very dependent on access to memory, so going to 512K could feel like a breath of fresh air. A proper DDR bus would be nice, but I'm a bit skeptical regarding that. Motorola is disturbingly well-known for dragging its heels.
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That's probably because it won't be 1.43 GHz. Running on a 166.67 MHz memory bus, the multiplier/clock frequencies work out like this:

7.0: 1.166 GHz
7.5: 1.25 GHz
8.0: 1.33 GHz
8.5: 1.416 GHz
9.0: 1.5 GHz

Even if you carried out the 8.5 multiplier to 100 digits it wouldn't be enough to round it up to 1.43 GHz. So, take your pick for the next speed bump- 1.33, 1.416 (probably would be called 1.42), or 1.5.
 
Re: Firewire 800

Originally posted by bbarnhart
I suspect that upgraded eMacs and iBooks will not have a Firewire 800 port, just a Firewire 400 port. The upgraded iMac may have a Firewire 800 port.

Upgraded PowerMacs would have a Firewire 800 port.

So, I'm thinking, the 12" Powerbook won't be totally left behind.
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I'm not sure about this. Apple put USB on all product lines to push the standard. The PC world had it but no one was using it.
Apple put Firewire on all the products (eventually) because Apple was driving the developement of FW peripherals.
USB-2 took off on the momentum of USB-1. The PC world is driving USB2 so Apple doesn't need to.

Apple does need to drive the development FW2. I think it would be in their best interest to release it as many machines as possible.
 
Re: G4 7457

Originally posted by NicoMan
Are we absolutely sure that the 2 new powerBooks (or at least the 17") are not using the 7457 ??
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Well here's the Apple System Profiler for the 17" taken from MWSF...if you can understand it, cool.
DSCF0360.JPG
 
Re: Re: when?

Originally posted by ffakr
I doubt you'll see this option.
Apple does have a history of offering the last low-end model to education for steep discount though. If they continue this year long+ trend, The dual 867MHz should be available to educational buyers for somewhere around $1200 US.
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The problem here is that I _am_ a student, but in Austria/Europe there is no "old powermac model for 1280$" option for students, at least from what I know. :(
 
Re: Re: Re: when?

Originally posted by xype


The problem here is that I _am_ a student, but in Austria/Europe there is no "old powermac model for 1280$" option for students, at least from what I know. :(
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Must be a US thing. Sorry.

side note.. the laptops don't appear to have a 7457... they only show 256K l2 cache in the system profiler.
 
Dual 867 MHz performance

I have a Dual 867 with a 2 Gigs of Ram
I run my Cadd programs, Photoshop Web Browsers, InDesign etc.
I never feel a need for more speed.
The machine runs everything very smoothly and usually waits for me.
I recommend that you max out your ram before you condemn your Mac's performance.
 
Originally posted by OSeXy!
the A12 is left on its own in the 'Power' category without it (...) If FW800 appears on eMacs and iMacs, the A12 is going to look long in the tooth before it's a month old!
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Personally I don't think they will implement FW800 on eMacs and iMacs at the next revision (in a few weeks?). I think they will market FW800 being a purely PRO(read exclusive) technology and only the Powermacs and the 15" PowerBook (when it integrates the Aluminium range) will get it in the coming updates. So the Al12" will not be that isolated. Besides, this model is in a niche of its own: it doesn't really fit the multimedia-professional-machine bill and it is not really a consumer machine. So it not having FW800 for the moment is sort of OK I think (remember that this is definitely a price-sensitive product).
If the 7457 is just around the corner, then the Ti15 should get it in its next revision (or metamorphosis if it is reborn in Aluminium). In that instance, it will far out-perform the A17 in memory bandwidth, CPU speed and battery life - again making a 'new' product look less buyable.
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I doubt the PB15" (or Al15") will get the 7457 in its next revision (I can see the 7455 finishing its life in eMacs/iMacs/PBooks until we get the PPC970 or the 7457RM and then the 7457 will make its way into those machines). But then again I could be well wrong.

NicoMan
 
Re: Re: G4 7457

Originally posted by Over Achiever

Well here's the Apple System Profiler for the 17" taken from MWSF...if you can understand it, cool.
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot for that but I don't have a clue what that picture means:(.

NicoMan
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: when?

Originally posted by ffakr


Must be a US thing. Sorry.

side note.. the laptops don't appear to have a 7457... they only show 256K l2 cache in the system profiler.
Click to expand...
Is the 7457 supposed to get more L2 cache ?

NicoMan
 
I would be very surprised if Moto delivers a processor to Apple at 0.13 micron and a 200Mhz or faster bus speed.

If they do find a way to get the current G4 to 1430Mhz, with a 167Mhz bus speed, there won't be much of a performance increase.

Even at 1Ghz, a PPC970 with a 900Mhz bus would be faster.
 
Originally posted by NicoMan

Personally I don't think they will implement FW800 on eMacs and iMacs at the next revision (in a few weeks?). I think they will market FW800 being a purely PRO(read exclusive) technology and only the Powermacs and the 15" PowerBook (when it integrates the Aluminium range) will get it in the coming updates. So the Al12" will not be that isolated. Besides, this model is in a niche of its own: it doesn't really fit the multimedia-professional-machine bill and it is not really a consumer machine. So it not having FW800 for the moment is sort of OK I think (remember that this is definitely a price-sensitive product).

NicoMan
Click to expand...

While I agree that it is unlikely that the 12" AlBook will be getting FW800 simply for the fact that if it were to get it it would have it already. But I don't buy the 12" not being a professional machine for a minute. I know a number of professional photographers that are diing to get there hands on a laptop of this power and size because of portability. These people want to take them with them everywhere along with there $10,000+ digital cameras so they may do editing in the field. In the past they have used the 15" TiBooks and others but they were simply to big to carry in a back pack everywhere they went along with there other equipment.
 
But if Apple comes out with more Digital Lifestyle Devices they will want to use FW800 - why not smoke USB2 if you can?
But the only way this can happen is if it becomes standard on Apple hardware.
 
Originally posted by MacBandit

But I don't buy the 12" not being a professional machine for a minute. I know a number of professional photographers that are diing to get there hands on a laptop of this power and size because of portability.
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I agree with you on both counts.
But the Al12" is being billed as a subnotebook, a fully featured one, but a subnotebook nonetheless. I don't think it is billed as a desktop replacement machine. If you want a desktop replacement machine, you go for the 15" or 17". Now I agree that those photographers will love it, but they are not carrying a full editing studio with them, i.e. no big screen, memory 'limited' to 640MB etc... Also I feel that FW800 is going to be used by new types of storage solutions needing high bandwidth, and I am not so sure that digital cameras (even pro ones) will sport FW800 connections. So the interest of FW800 in the field would be somewhat limited. But this is a conjecture. I can't really say for sure.

NicoMan
 
Re: Firewire 800

Originally posted by bbarnhart
I suspect that upgraded eMacs and iBooks will not have a Firewire 800 port, just a Firewire 400 port. The upgraded iMac may have a Firewire 800 port.

Upgraded PowerMacs would have a Firewire 800 port.

So, I'm thinking, the 12" Powerbook won't be totally left behind.
Click to expand...

Not to split hairs or anything, but you guys are forgetting the Titaniums, which don't have FireWire 800.

So, really, the 17" is the orphan right now. It's the only one that has FireWire 800.

The 12" certainly won't be on its own...
 
Originally posted by Shrek
Hmmm. A 1GHz iMac. Why not just go ahead and overclock the thing to 1.25 GHz like they did with the 1GHz PowerMacs? :D
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while this is a common misconception. The 1.25ghz G4's are not overclocked. They are rated at 1.25ghz.

arn
 
Originally posted by IndyGopher

August to February is hardly a few weeks.. or even a few months. As for the computer being obsolete, there are two ways to look at it... A) your machine is never obsolete as long as it runs the software you need Or, B) you can be technosnob and say that any machine is obsolete by the time you open the box.

Either way, the dual 867 was never the top of the line, so you avoided the premium associated with that, and you got it for the student price, so I can't imagine what you're complaining about.
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What I meant was in a few weeks or months from now, not from when I bought it. True it wasn't top of the line it was just entry so I could afford it and upgrade in the future, as for the price, I shall complain because I worked my arse off all summer at my s*** job paying minimum wage just to buy it, getting little sleep every night. Im only 16.

While I do see your points, what I was trying to convey in my post was it is very humbling for me to work so hard for one computer, then see even better ones come out so soon. I thought it's generation would last as long as the previous quicksilver generation.
 
When?!?

But the big question is when? When are they going to update the iMacs. I was going to buy one the day of MacWorld (because I hoped they would update them there), but they didn't. And I really want to get one. But I don't want to buy one in the next day or so and a week or two later they release an update. Anyone have any clue?
 
eMac and iMac upgrades

What do you think of these specs for posible new mac's

eMac: BASE UNIT
256mb DDR 2100 (max 1024mb)
60gb 7200rpm
Combo Drive
Bluetooth Built-in
Airport Extream ready
nVidia Geforce4 mx 440 32mb DDR
Max Rez on monitor 1280x1024
FireWire 400 only

eMac: TOP END
512mb DDR 2100 (max 1024mb)
80gb 7200rpm
Super Drive
Bluetooth Built-in
Airport Extream Installed
nVidia Geforce4 mx 460 32mb DDR
Max Rez on monitor 1280x1024
FireWire 400 only

Same bio for the iMacs but with diffrent HD sizes and LCD screens

FireWire 800 will only be on the pro units
 
One great thing about macs is they hold their value quite well. I have a G3 400 that is 5 years old, but I can't find one for under $400.00 on the web. You don't see any PC's holding their value like that.

I'd love to see new PowerMac's. I was sure they would come out at Macworld, but I was obviously wrong and I know two people that work at Apple. Guess they were yanking my chain NBD

I would like to see the next PowerMacs include:
  • Full DDR Support w/200Mhz fsb
  • 8x AGP or AGP Pro Slot with ATI 9700 Pro
  • ATA 133 & Serial ATA connectors
  • Built in Bluetooth
  • Wireless Mouse and Keyboard
  • 5.1 Surround Sound
  • Two 80 GB HD standard.
  • Two Optical Drives Standard One SD
  • Firewire 800 - Expected
  • 17" monitor included
  • For Less than 3K - unexpected.
I'm sure I can think of other things, but this is a good start.
 
Re: When?!?

Originally posted by macphisto
But the big question is when? When are they going to update the iMacs. I was going to buy one the day of MacWorld (because I hoped they would update them there), but they didn't. And I really want to get one. But I don't want to buy one in the next day or so and a week or two later they release an update. Anyone have any clue?
Click to expand...

Exactly my question. I'm ready to shell out for a new 17" iMac, but I've no interest in being one of the last Firewire400 buyers.

I'd also like to see my new machine come with Superdrive DVD-RW (not Superdrive DVD-R as promoted on apple.com).

Meanwhile, I think if a new iMac line were close to release, it would have been part of the MacWorld announcements. So I've got a history question for everyone. What's the shortest amount of time after a MacWorld that Apple has announced a new product upgrade (of the magnitude that new iMacs would be)??
 
fw 800

the importance of fw 800 is not that big in the moment. most drives doesn't even fill the fw 400 bandwith! especially in digital lifestyle devices like the ipod, is fw 800 totally useless!!
 
I, too, was ready to buy a 17" iMac this week.

As for timing between announcements - didn't the speed-bumped powermacs show up in late Jan last year (Jan 25th?), only a couple of weeks post MW?


Fish
 
Originally posted by AssassinOfGates
New powermacs? its still hard for me to believe that after buying my dual 867 3 days after the release, and paying $1785 for it being a student, it already is going to be obsolete in a few weeks / months. If only they had the lifespan of a car....
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I think obsolete is a bit extreme - that baby will be performing as well as it is all its life, it doesn't start performing worse th moment new ones come out. It's all relative - I think we're all a bit spoilt these days. Last I heard my old IIFX was still doing service at my first workplace as an ISDN machine and file server... 11 years on!
 
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