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PowerPC Linux support to continue in Debian Ports
- Thread starter swamprock
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Is this Linux distribution useable as a daily driver for a PowerMac G5 (browsing, YouTube and listening to local stored music)?
iMac G5 Rev.A
------------
CPU: G5 aka PPC970FX @ 1,6Ghz
RAM: PC3200 DDR 1,5GB
HDD: Hitachi 1TB SATA-I
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 Ultra 64 MB (AGP)
I would have made it one in a heartbeat. If only my system could resolve the repositories and actually sleep...
Had it been able to, it would have been superior to OS X.
I can't speak of issues with Nvidia GPUs, as I've got limited experience with them. I did install this port on my 12" Powerbook G4 with the 5200 GO GPU and it seemed to be OK, but I had other issues (DE crashing to login screen, stuttering performance) that I couldn't resolve, that made me wipe the drive and go back to Leopard. My PM G5 DP 2.0 had similar issues with stuttering, but I think my 9600 Pro GPU doesn't play nice with Debian flavors (including MATE) for some reason.
I should test it on my Dual Core 2.0 G5 with the Geforce 6600, as MATE runs fine on that machine. I'm still waiting for the GVFS issues to be resolved before I go and do that...
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No, its not nvidia's fault, couple of Linux forums says : these bugs are in ppc64 only. Firefox is bugged for ppc64 (and SPARC 64 ) since 2016 . Are you running a 32-bit kernel on g5 ?
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Nope. 64 bit. I've got MATE running on my Dual Core 2.0 G5 but haven't tested it that extensively, especially since I can stream 720p video from browsers within Leopard on that machine...
So did you try download a picture with Firefox? ...
Okay, must be a iMac G5 related issue only... I dont expect they will fix it anytime soon, but I understand that a iMac G5 is rarely used these days...
For HD vid in browser. I use a AMD ryzen and rx 480 currently.
I agree, Leopard is more suitable for daily tasks, Linux is still trying
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I agree, Leopard is more suitable for daily tasks, Linux is still trying
Unfortunately.
So did you try download a picture with Firefox? ...
Okay, must be a iMac G5 related issue only... I dont expect they will fix it anytime soon, but I understand that a iMac G5 is rarely used these days...
For HD vid in browser. I use a AMD ryzen and rx 480 currently.
I agree, Leopard is more suitable for daily tasks, Linux is still trying
I'll fire up my G5 and give it a try...
Not for the faint of heart, but there are ppc64 packages in Incoming. There may be a chance that there's something there that'll solve issues with processing pictures and other media.
http://incoming.ports.debian.org/
http://incoming.ports.debian.org/
I haven't tested Firefox on ppc64 yet, but will tomorrow.
However, I have fixed the gvfs issue. gvfs-common was updated and added to the Ports repository without updating the rest of gvfs, breaking network shares mounting. I found the previous package, gvfs-common_1.36.1-1_all.deb and installed it. Once this package is installed, installing the entirety of gvfs will work just fine (apt install gvfs), and apt will hold back the newer gvfs-common when doing apt upgrade. If you have installed the 1.36.1-2 version of gvfs-common, purge it before installing this package.
You can find the older version at http://mirror.amberit.com.bd/parrotsec/pool/main/g/gvfs/gvfs-common_1.36.1-1_all.deb
It's a different distro of linux, but the package works just fine.
However, I have fixed the gvfs issue. gvfs-common was updated and added to the Ports repository without updating the rest of gvfs, breaking network shares mounting. I found the previous package, gvfs-common_1.36.1-1_all.deb and installed it. Once this package is installed, installing the entirety of gvfs will work just fine (apt install gvfs), and apt will hold back the newer gvfs-common when doing apt upgrade. If you have installed the 1.36.1-2 version of gvfs-common, purge it before installing this package.
You can find the older version at http://mirror.amberit.com.bd/parrotsec/pool/main/g/gvfs/gvfs-common_1.36.1-1_all.deb
It's a different distro of linux, but the package works just fine.
There is a repo https://repo.powerprogress.org/ with fixed packages for ppc64 systems like my G5
Im unlucky at installing, maybe you guys are more successful
Im unlucky at installing, maybe you guys are more successful
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After following their instructions, it's giving me issues with the public keys.
Though gnupgp was not installed at the beginning, as debian-ports didn't have it.
Debian-ports have gnupg for all architecture. I was able to install it via apt-get install on my G5
http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/pool/main/g/gnupg2/
is your sources.list correct?
if everything is setup afterwards, apt-cache policy is very good to see if prioritize works. It also shows firefox-esr has two entries now, one provided via debian-ports, the other by powerprogres repo. priority 1001 = always take that packages, even if its older.
When I install debian via powerpc iso and boot ppc64 kernel, I get a hybrid install and can install stuff like mplayer and vlc from debian-ports. But not from powerprogress, due they are ppc64 only, but my multilib powerpc/ppc64 install always favours powerpc packages over ppc64, therefore I can't install anything from powerprogress repo while running hybrid install.
When I install debian via ppc64 iso & boot ppc64 kernel, I get a stock system, no multilib stuff, only ppc64 packages. When I try to install vlc or mplayer now, no matter what repo, I get unresolved dependencies error.
http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/pool/main/g/gnupg2/
is your sources.list correct?
if everything is setup afterwards, apt-cache policy is very good to see if prioritize works. It also shows firefox-esr has two entries now, one provided via debian-ports, the other by powerprogres repo. priority 1001 = always take that packages, even if its older.
When I install debian via powerpc iso and boot ppc64 kernel, I get a hybrid install and can install stuff like mplayer and vlc from debian-ports. But not from powerprogress, due they are ppc64 only, but my multilib powerpc/ppc64 install always favours powerpc packages over ppc64, therefore I can't install anything from powerprogress repo while running hybrid install.
When I install debian via ppc64 iso & boot ppc64 kernel, I get a stock system, no multilib stuff, only ppc64 packages. When I try to install vlc or mplayer now, no matter what repo, I get unresolved dependencies error.
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Debian-ports have gnupg for all architecture. I was able to install it via apt-get install on my G5
http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/pool/main/g/gnupg2/
is your sources.list correct?
if everything is setup afterwards, apt-cache policy is very good to see if prioritize works. It also shows firefox-esr has two entries now, one provided via debian-ports, the other by powerprogres repo. priority 1001 = always take that packages, even if its older.
When I install debian via powerpc iso and boot ppc64 kernel, I get a hybrid install and can install stuff like mplayer and vlc from debian-ports. But not from powerprogress, due they are ppc64 only, but my multilib powerpc/ppc64 install always favours powerpc packages over ppc64, therefore I can't install anything from powerprogress repo while running hybrid install.
When I install debian via ppc64 iso & boot ppc64 kernel, I get a stock system, no multilib stuff, only ppc64 packages. When I try to install vlc or mplayer now, no matter what repo, I get unresolved dependencies error.
Try deb-multimedia.org. Also, disable the debian-ports repos when installing from powerprogress and see if that fixes your dependency issues. You may want to pin the packages from powerprogress as well, before re-enabling the debian-ports repos. I can't guarantee that this will fix anything, but with all things unstable, there are some hoops to jump through.
I did some testing of web browsers that are available in the repos, and the only three that work with any sort of functionality are Midori, Lua-Kit and Firefox-ESR. Midori is much more stable (and speedy), although it will crash if you go to youtube.com with the ad blocker enabled. Firefox-ESR is a bit unstable at times, but does work. Lua-Kit (which I had to build from source; not in the repo) works fine, although it bogs tremendously if you enable the Adblock module. Epiphany (Gnome-Web) only shows garbage on any page you load, and everything else is way outdated. Midori can be easily installed by adding the jessie-backports repo to your sources.list. Install the browser, then disable the repo when done to avoid any issues (although you have to explicitly select backports to install anything from that particular repo).
I am now installing on my 1.5ghz 12" Powerbook with the Go5200 and SSD. A preliminary install, a couple of weeks ago, went fine with some minor issues that I didn't try to fix, so I'm going for a more comprehensive install, especially with the gvfs issue resolved (see post 37 above).
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Its very interesting that they have kodi builds for powerpc. I didn't knew newer kodi runs on powerpc
http://deb-multimedia.org/dists/unstable/main/binary-powerpc/package/kodi-bin
Thanks for your tests with browsers, did you test with G4 or G5 CPU?
Edit:
Okay it really starts getting confusing for me... Still trying to install mplayer, vlc or even firefox-esr, midori, whatever.
What did I try already:
- I added deb-multimedia.org with proper keyring
- Edited sources.list deb-multimedia.org entries so they just take 'all' and 'powerpc' packages
- Edited sources.list poweerprogress entries so they just take 'all' and 'powerpc' packages
- Forced mplayer : powerpc install instead of ppc64
- Setup proper apt pinning for that repos and check it via apt-cache policy
- Tried to install firefox-esr, but getting error 404 file not found at repo.powerprogress.org
- removed debian-ports from sources.list, cleared cache, updated apt.tried again to install mplayer,vlc,firefox-esr
- removed debian non-free repo from sources.list, cleared cache, updated apt.tried again to install mplayer,vlc,firefox-esr
- add & remove arch strings
- I tried it with pure ppc64 installs of SID, as well as hybrid powerpc/ppc64 installs
It always errors with unmet dependencies (or 404 for firefox-esr) no matter what I tried
My Installation:
- PPC64 SID install on iMac G5
- Sources.list contains following:
# Binary Default
deb [arch=powerpc,ppc64] http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/ unstable main
deb [arch=powerpc,ppc64] http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/ unreleased main
# Package Security Source
deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian unstable main
# Non-Free Repo
deb [arch=all] http://ftp.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
# PowerProgress repo
deb [arch=ppc64] https://repo.powerprogress.org/debian sid main
# Deb-Multimedia germany
deb http://ftp.uni-kl.de/debian-multimedia/ unstable main
deb-src http://ftp.uni-kl.de/debian-multimedia/ unstable main
Debian.....cmon.... run...
http://deb-multimedia.org/dists/unstable/main/binary-powerpc/package/kodi-bin
Thanks for your tests with browsers, did you test with G4 or G5 CPU?
Edit:
Okay it really starts getting confusing for me... Still trying to install mplayer, vlc or even firefox-esr, midori, whatever.
What did I try already:
- I added deb-multimedia.org with proper keyring
- Edited sources.list deb-multimedia.org entries so they just take 'all' and 'powerpc' packages
- Edited sources.list poweerprogress entries so they just take 'all' and 'powerpc' packages
- Forced mplayer : powerpc install instead of ppc64
- Setup proper apt pinning for that repos and check it via apt-cache policy
- Tried to install firefox-esr, but getting error 404 file not found at repo.powerprogress.org
- removed debian-ports from sources.list, cleared cache, updated apt.tried again to install mplayer,vlc,firefox-esr
- removed debian non-free repo from sources.list, cleared cache, updated apt.tried again to install mplayer,vlc,firefox-esr
- add & remove arch strings
- I tried it with pure ppc64 installs of SID, as well as hybrid powerpc/ppc64 installs
It always errors with unmet dependencies (or 404 for firefox-esr) no matter what I tried
My Installation:
- PPC64 SID install on iMac G5
- Sources.list contains following:
# Binary Default
deb [arch=powerpc,ppc64] http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/ unstable main
deb [arch=powerpc,ppc64] http://ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports/ unreleased main
# Package Security Source
deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian unstable main
# Non-Free Repo
deb [arch=all] http://ftp.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
# PowerProgress repo
deb [arch=ppc64] https://repo.powerprogress.org/debian sid main
# Deb-Multimedia germany
deb http://ftp.uni-kl.de/debian-multimedia/ unstable main
deb-src http://ftp.uni-kl.de/debian-multimedia/ unstable main
Debian.....cmon.... run...
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Looks like there will be a wait for a complete ppc64 port.
Install on my 12" Powerbook is a no-go. libinput is horrendous on that hardware (choppy trackpad and much less configurable than synaptics), and synaptics doesn't work- no keyboard or trackpad when it's installed. I thought the Nvidia GPU would handle video better, but it's actually worse than the Radeon on my iBook G4, and I get high CPU usage even running a file manager. After spending the better part of my free time yesterday before and after work trying to sort the issues, I finally threw in the towel. Back to Leopard on that one.
My 15" 1.5ghz Powerbook G4 A1095 runs everything fine, but the trackpad doesn't work with synaptics, so you're stuck with a standard trackpad with no gestures or two-finger scrolling. Fortunately, it doesn't have the same trackpad issues as the 12" has with libinput. A bit of an inconvenience, but not a deal breaker.
The final 12" iBook G4 (A1133), as I've mentioned before and what I'm posting this message from with Midori, seems to be the sweet spot for ppc Buster/sid. I've had few issues with my install, and have solved many of the problems that have cropped up. I've even got a working battery indicator in the top panel by modifying a perl script that someone else built a few years ago. I'll post it here as soon as I fix my xarchiver problem (will extract but won't compress for some reason).
Next target is the A1025 TiBook. I expect it to run as well as the A1095, albeit a bit slower, and with the same trackpad deficiencies (due to its obvious age-related limitations), as long as I can get past any GPU issues.
Latest screenshots, themed similar to Elementary OS:
Install on my 12" Powerbook is a no-go. libinput is horrendous on that hardware (choppy trackpad and much less configurable than synaptics), and synaptics doesn't work- no keyboard or trackpad when it's installed. I thought the Nvidia GPU would handle video better, but it's actually worse than the Radeon on my iBook G4, and I get high CPU usage even running a file manager. After spending the better part of my free time yesterday before and after work trying to sort the issues, I finally threw in the towel. Back to Leopard on that one.
My 15" 1.5ghz Powerbook G4 A1095 runs everything fine, but the trackpad doesn't work with synaptics, so you're stuck with a standard trackpad with no gestures or two-finger scrolling. Fortunately, it doesn't have the same trackpad issues as the 12" has with libinput. A bit of an inconvenience, but not a deal breaker.
The final 12" iBook G4 (A1133), as I've mentioned before and what I'm posting this message from with Midori, seems to be the sweet spot for ppc Buster/sid. I've had few issues with my install, and have solved many of the problems that have cropped up. I've even got a working battery indicator in the top panel by modifying a perl script that someone else built a few years ago. I'll post it here as soon as I fix my xarchiver problem (will extract but won't compress for some reason).
Next target is the A1025 TiBook. I expect it to run as well as the A1095, albeit a bit slower, and with the same trackpad deficiencies (due to its obvious age-related limitations), as long as I can get past any GPU issues.
Latest screenshots, themed similar to Elementary OS:
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Swamp, that looks lovely mate.
how useable is that on the G4? as in speed wise? looking for a new OS for my 1.5ghz 15" PB.
how useable is that on the G4? as in speed wise? looking for a new OS for my 1.5ghz 15" PB.
Swamp, that looks lovely mate.
how useable is that on the G4? as in speed wise? looking for a new OS for my 1.5ghz 15" PB.
With Midori, browsing is quite speedy. Firefox is a bit buggy and some sites will suck up 100% of your CPU and freeze everything for a bit. Other than that, everything is pretty snappy, for lack of a better description, and would even be better with an SSD (my iBook has an old 5400rpm spinner). There are issues with video in browsers, though. They exhibit the wrong colors, with everything having a bluish hue. You can also see this hue issue when running a graphical boot/shutdown screen with Plymouth. This is due to an old big endian bug with mesa that has been around for ages, and hopefully will be fixed this time around. The workaround is to install youtube-dl and youtube-dl-gui and download 360p video (everything above will run choppy without some command line foo). If video is your benchmark for a new OS, I'd stick with Leopard, as it'll run 720p video smoothly and 1080p video with some artifacting in Coreplayer, and up to 480p (when available) smoothly in Leopard Webkit on 1.33ghz and 1.5ghz machines (and possibly lower, but I haven't tested that yet).
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I've joined the Debian Ports list and got an update from Adrian, who is largely maintaining the PPC port:
Code:
Thanks for your work. This encourages us to keep working on the port.
FWIW, I am currently trying to fix the Rust compiler on 32-bit PowerPC so that we will
eventually be able to use Firefox and Thunderbird on PowerPC again. Oh, and I am
going to build fresh installation images this week so you guys will have something
to test. I have vacation for two weeks now and therefore enough time for that.
> Thanks to all involved with maintaining this port.
You're welcome. Please join us on #debian-ports on OFTC on IRC if you would
like to get into contact. New help is always welcome.
AdrianBecause Debian is not working well for me on G5 (ppc64) I bought a (PM G4 867 DP MDD). OC to 1Ghz with ATi FireGL X3 soon
Is it possible to cross-compile for PowerPC under x86 ? [ I have very powerful x86 here (up to 24 cores) ]
I'm no authority on the subject, but I can almost guarantee that this can be done. It'll definitely take some research. I'm sure that when Debian stable supported PowerPC and other 'niche' machines that packages were built for many different architectures at once, on one machine. I also think that this would require that the developer of any said package use another layer of abstraction such as python, vala, lua, perl, etc. that isn't architecture-specific.
[doublepost=1534182829][/doublepost]
Thanks Bud, appreciate the honesty
I forgot to add that loading the i2c-dev module for keyboard backlighting causes some issues as well. I found that it spikes the CPU on occasion, causing stuttering and slow-down. I ended up removing the module and everything returned to normal, but no keyboard backlighting.
[doublepost=1534183930][/doublepost]Here is the modded PowerPC battery applet for GTK2 panels. I just removed a check for specific distros and got it working with xfce4 panel specifically, but it should work with all panels in build-your-own configurations. Just read the instructions (and install the dependancies; I think perl is all that is needed) to install.
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