I don’t think you understood me. I wasn’t wondering if Apple makes medical grade devices. They can still have improperly used Masimo IP even if the two companies make two different kinds of devices.
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Pulse Ox Company Masimo Accuses Apple of Delaying Legal Battle to Sell More Apple Watches
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If there is a license, then it's fair use. Let's wait and see what Masimo says regarding their IP. So far, all they have said is "Apple wants to beat us in the device race."
You may want to actually pay attention to the article 🙄
"Back in January, medical device company Masimo levied a lawsuit against Apple, accusing the company of stealing trade secrets and improperly using Masimo inventions related to health monitoring in the Apple Watch.”
You apparently didn't read. Masimo is accusing of creating an advantage of portable medical devices. Apple doesn't market medical devices.
Hi SiChris_ThenThat, I can't let you say something like that.
Do you really know Masimo Technology and what they sell?
There are a lot of very greedy companies but Masimo Technology is not one of them.
Masimo Technology shares real human values, they know what it means to save lives and they consider every employee as important even the one who supplies coffee as the Barillo.
In the medical field, doctors all recognize their expertise, their honesty, Masimo even accepts to work with universities and gives access to their algorithms.
During the COVID phase, they have accelerated the products deployment in resuscitation to prevent doctors and nurses from being contaminated.
And Apple?
The Apple Watch could have been used to detect people with VIDOC through the measurement of blood pressure, oxygen saturation, but here's the problem: Apple was unable to provide the analysis because it did not master this technology.
In the field of health care we can say that the measurement of oxygen saturation is more complex than the measurement of heart rate.
Therefore, it requires not only engineers, expert physicians, health institutions and agreement with research in anesthesia.
Why I think the facts against Apple are very serious.
We're not only talking about patent theft, we're talking about a research manager at Masimo who left by stealing documents but also Patient data.
How can you develop a medical device without having the data to validate the technology?
To develop a medical device it takes at least 4 years at least.
Don't forget that the constraints in the health field are similar to those in the aerospace field in the sense that people's lives are at stake ....
Apple thinks that it can do anything, buy anything, no matter what the means, even if it means stealing.
I don't see how it's commendable for someone to steal an object and then sell it and say it's for the good of society.
A thief is still a thief even if he wears a nice suit.
Masimos accusations of stealing are pointless.
Apple hired Masimo chief medical officer Michael O’Reilly and Marcelo Lamego, chief technology officer at Cercacor (Masimo subsidiary). I don’t think they are so dumb to use Masimo’s trade secrets at Apple. Hiring competitors personnel is not illegal.
Masimo is competing with Apple on consumer space with MightySat pulse oximeter, Masimo Sleep and Radius T Continuous Thermometer. So I think this more about competition than stealing trade secrets.
Masimo has been very aggressive with lawsuits against competitors. They have Masimo SET, which is a way better technology on pulse oximetry than what other companies have.
for example:
- A federal jury on Wednesday said Philips Electronics NA should pay $466.8 million to Masimo Corp for having infringed two patents for technology used to help measure blood oxygen and track pulse rates.
Hello Omenies,
I think we can agree on a number of facts that you will find irrefutable.
Are you an engineer in medical devices or biostatisticians or doctor?
The reason why this type of material is very expensive is that you have to perform many tests so you need to have
The tests can represent up to 60 to 70% of your research costs.
A 5% change in oxygen saturation is referred to as the vital prognosis of a committed patient.
To develop tools of this level, a minimum of 5 years is required.
Data sets are vital and take even longer.
How can you produce an algorithm if you don't have the data set.
Apple is not a company that makes medical devices, they don't have the teams, doctors, and scientists.
You also have to produce scientific publications.
If you take the trouble to look for Apple's collaborations with healthcare institutions, you will only see them appearing since 2019. Apple is the cult of secrecy. But in medicine it doesn't work.
It took only 2 years for Apple to delivery an Apple Watch with these technology
It's impossible unless you have already done all the work, the tests, the algorithms.
This is exactly the case Anthony Levandowski.
Why Apple proposed to multiply the salaries of Massimo's engineers by 10 to come to Apple ?
Let’s check what Marcelo Lamego did at Apple (source LinkedIn)
“R&D
Apple, Jan 2014 - Jul 2014 (7 months)
Worked in the Apple Watch project. Activities included:
(1) Produced key intellectual property related to bio-sensing under the form of several issued patents (US9723997, US9952095, US10078052, US10219754, US10247670, US10524671);
(2) Defined required resources for current and future bio-sensing functionalities;
(3) Selected and hired scientists and engineers;
(4) Proposed and reviewed hardware and algorithm architectures, and advised team regarding bio-sensing functionalities;
(5) Negotiated and signed contract with large local university for data collection on human subjects to model the interaction between the subjects' physiology and bio-sensing technology.”
So, why didn’t Masimo sue him? Oh, did he forgot to mention taking trade secrets with him and bringing them to Apple?
I bet those patents are assigned to him, not to Masimo.
Apple did jump start development by hiring talent when they not have expertise on the subject.
“R&D
Apple, Jan 2014 - Jul 2014 (7 months)
Worked in the Apple Watch project. Activities included:
(1) Produced key intellectual property related to bio-sensing under the form of several issued patents (US9723997, US9952095, US10078052, US10219754, US10247670, US10524671);
(2) Defined required resources for current and future bio-sensing functionalities;
(3) Selected and hired scientists and engineers;
(4) Proposed and reviewed hardware and algorithm architectures, and advised team regarding bio-sensing functionalities;
(5) Negotiated and signed contract with large local university for data collection on human subjects to model the interaction between the subjects' physiology and bio-sensing technology.”
So, why didn’t Masimo sue him? Oh, did he forgot to mention taking trade secrets with him and bringing them to Apple?
I bet those patents are assigned to him, not to Masimo.
Apple did jump start development by hiring talent when they not have expertise on the subject.