Runners beware WatchOS 10 Beta 4

[Jana_CZ]

Ok so today’s training with this week’s Beta:
▪️2.5 km Open Run: no gps issues
▪️17.2 km Custom Run (tempo/recovery intervals): two tiny gps gaps but without a significant impact on the pace
▪️2.7 km Open Run: two tiny gps gaps, not 100% sure about the pace impact (it was a slow cool-down run, wasn’t really keeping a steady pace) but nothing out of the ordinary

AW 7, carrying my iPhone with me, clear skies.

Not jumping to conclusions just yet but so far it looks ok.

 

[xDKP]

Ok so today’s training with this week’s Beta:
▪️2.5 km Open Run: no gps issues
▪️17.2 km Custom Run (tempo/recovery intervals): two tiny gps gaps but without a significant impact on the pace
▪️2.7 km Open Run: two tiny gps gaps, not 100% sure about the pace impact (it was a slow cool-down run, wasn’t really keeping a steady pace) but nothing out of the ordinary

AW 7, carrying my iPhone with me, clear skies.

Not jumping to conclusions just yet but so far it looks ok.

Well done with a half marathon mid week!

The GPS when carrying your phone means it uses the iPhone antenna. Might have an impact

 

[Jana_CZ]

Well done with a half marathon mid week!

The GPS when carrying your phone means it uses the iPhone antenna. Might have an impact

Thanks - had to get up super early to make it before work… as I needed ~3 hrs of daylight and the sunset is earlier and earlier - BIG mug of coffee was required 😃

About the phone - I carry it with me almost always. Not that much for the GPS (or calling… I could use the Watch if needed), but well, Strava pics… 🙈😂 anyway - I might try and keep the phone off for my planned long weekend run, to see if it makes any difference.

 

[xDKP]

Thanks - had to get up super early to make it before work… as I needed ~3 hrs of daylight and the sunset is earlier and earlier - BIG mug of coffee was required 😃

About the phone - I carry it with me almost always. Not that much for the GPS (or calling… I could use the Watch if needed), but well, Strava pics… 🙈😂 anyway - I might try and keep the phone off for my planned long weekend run, to see if it makes any difference.

Maybe try airplane mode to see if it’s different.

Now you just need another HM to test it out 🤣

DM me your Strava so we can support with some Kudos 👏🏼👏🏼

 

[Jana_CZ]

Maybe try airplane mode to see if it’s different.

Adding to the to-do list 👍

Now you just need another HM to test it out 🤣

Err… 1.5k warmup & 10+10 tempo planned for Saturday 🫣 increasing the volume in a hope I could finally make a full marathon mid October!

DM me your Strava so we can support with some Kudos 👏🏼👏🏼

Sent 😃

 

[Akrapovic]

6.7km yesterday open run, no problems.

I feel like it's getting better, but it's still there.

 

[Psdn]

My Thursday session was warm up, 7x1k @ HMP, 100s jog @EASY, 3k MP, in total 16.2k. My Garmin seems to be more accurat, alsways missing a few hundred meters on my AWU.

 

[Jana_CZ]

So I was told here that I need to run another HM to test stuff, so… okay 😂

Seriously though: My today’s run was focused on pace consistency, meaning it is easy to spot any fluctuations. (Custom run - 10k in defined pace + 10 mins recovery, x 2)

There were no huge gps gaps as those we saw before, but there’s these tiny ones that don’t really affect the overall pace (or at least not noticeably) - still, are driving me nuts: despite of a relatively stable pace, the watch tells you you’re slowing down (red), then the small gap happens (dotted line), and then the pace goes crazy for a bit (green part) till it settles again. Note, from the aerial view it may seem that the trees obstruct the skies, but not really, it’s an open area (and the glitch didn’t happen when I ran through that place in the opposite direction anyway).

Personally I’m relying on the pace indicator a LOT as I don’t have a very good sense of pace myself (especially during a longer run), and this glitch can get me out of balance easily… - Anyway, I still don’t know how to reproduce it, it’s random as hell, so I’ll just summarize what I know in the beta feedback.

 

[manieek]

Today run 3x2km break 2 min. No workout upload after the workout.
I can't see it either on the watch or on my phone. I reset the watch did not help.

Latest beta.

 

[xDKP]

So I was told here that I need to run another HM to test stuff, so… okay 😂

Seriously though: My today’s run was focused on pace consistency, meaning it is easy to spot any fluctuations. (Custom run - 10k in defined pace + 10 mins recovery, x 2)

There were no huge gps gaps as those we saw before, but there’s these tiny ones that don’t really affect the overall pace (or at least not noticeably) - still, are driving me nuts: despite of a relatively stable pace, the watch tells you you’re slowing down (red), then the small gap happens (dotted line), and then the pace goes crazy for a bit (green part) till it settles again. Note, from the aerial view it may seem that the trees obstruct the skies, but not really, it’s an open area (and the glitch didn’t happen when I ran through that place in the opposite direction anyway).

Personally I’m relying on the pace indicator a LOT as I don’t have a very good sense of pace myself (especially during a longer run), and this glitch can get me out of balance easily… - Anyway, I still don’t know how to reproduce it, it’s random as hell, so I’ll just summarize what I know in the beta feedback.

View attachment 2254166

Well I told you to run another HM so couldn’t let you do it alone - did a 25K custom run and on my last interval it had exactly the same pattern as your run. We had a 2K speed interval so to suddenly look down and see pace go down and distance stalled pretty annoying

 

[Akrapovic]

17km yesterday. About a 50m gap (grey dotted line).

 

[Akrapovic]

Well done with a half marathon mid week!

The GPS when carrying your phone means it uses the iPhone antenna. Might have an impact

So I verified this today - whilst it used to be the case that the GPS used the phone antenna when a phone was present, it is not the case anymore.

I was on a run and the watch GPS was spot on. I took out my phone to check a map, and the GPS was miles off for 5 seconds whilst it found me again. The watch, however, was undisturbed.

On WatchOS10 on the Apple Watch Ultra, it is 100% using the watch GPS over phone, regardless if a phone is present or not.

 

[Duffman19]

So I verified this today - whilst it used to be the case that the GPS used the phone antenna when a phone was present, it is not the case anymore.

I was on a run and the watch GPS was spot on. I took out my phone to check a map, and the GPS was miles off for 5 seconds whilst it found me again. The watch, however, was undisturbed.

On WatchOS10 on the Apple Watch Ultra, it is 100% using the watch GPS over phone, regardless if a phone is present or not.

This is a known feature as stated by Apple starting with Series 8, SE2, and Ultra. This is model specific and not related to the OS. Series 7 and earlier will use the phone’s gps if connected.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/fundamental-shift-ultra-s8-se2-all-use-watch-internal-gps-even-if-you-bring-your-connected-iphone.2358832/

 

[Jana_CZ]

I’m beyond pi**ed. Pardon my French… 😐

Series 7, absolutely clear skies, Custom run 10 x 1 km / 3’ recovery. Total mess both during and after the run / in the run record.

• Custom Run created as 1 km work & 3 minutes recovery, repeat 10 times
• Intended pace range 5:15-5:20/km; okay, we know that it’s too much to ask to really set the pace we need, so I’ve set the range to 5:10-5:20/km
• Already during the run, I was getting completely weird pace information: when realistically running around 5:00-5:15/km, the Watch was showing something like 6:30
• Also when checking the interval pace somewhere in the last third of one of the intervals, in which I was safely within or above the range all the time, it was showing the interval average below the range, like 5:25
• The route is pretty much a straight line with minimal curves; at one point you run under a bridge (highway) but that’s NOT where the glitches were happening
• And after checking the outcome record, I’ve realized that one of the laps wasn’t even marked as such… 🙄
• The pace data in the recording is yet funnier than what I’ve noticed already during the run, such as a small segment where I supposedly ran at 1:57/km 😂

I’m attaching a particularly funny part of the run map, enjoy.

 

[NME42]

I’m beyond pi**ed. Pardon my French… 😐

Very weird. And not too promising when the final release is about one week away.

Did you carry your iPhone with you?

 

[Jana_CZ]

Very weird. And not too promising when the final release is about one week away.

Did you carry your iPhone with you?

I did, and needed to keep it online this morning. But the coach torments me with intervals every now and then so there will be another opportunity soon. 🙂

Regarding the upcoming release… you know what, if the bug makes it to the regular release, the uproar will at least force Apple to actually have a look into it. (My Feedback submitted a week ago still says “Recent Similar Reports: None” and “Resolution: Open”, so it seems like it wasn’t even reviewed. I’ve updated it with latest data today, just in case they actually do check it.)

 

[xDKP]

Argh the same again today on the longest run of the build - list signal briefly and caught up again.
Also it went okay with the intervals on the watch during the run but shows them weirdly on the iPhone after

 

[NME42]

View attachment 2257372
Argh the same again today on the longest run of the build - list signal briefly and caught up again.
Also it went okay with the intervals on the watch during the run but shows them weirdly on the iPhone after

You ran with an Ultra? Cellular enabled?

I have a bad suspicion. Strange issues with AW5 and watchOS 6 (or 5) with cellular enabled. Filled an entire thread here until it was fixed one year later. No issue when cellular was off or iPhone not connected.

 

[Jana_CZ]

You ran with an Ultra? Cellular enabled?

I have a bad suspicion. Strange issues with AW5 and watchOS 6 (or 5) with cellular enabled. Filled an entire thread here until it was fixed one year later. No issue when cellular was off or iPhone not connected.

Okay I do have cellular on. 🤔 So that would match, but still, I hope that either it’s not it, or at least it won’t take a year to fix it… - anyway, I’m curious what others say!

 

[xDKP]

You ran with an Ultra? Cellular enabled?

I have a bad suspicion. Strange issues with AW5 and watchOS 6 (or 5) with cellular enabled. Filled an entire thread here until it was fixed one year later. No issue when cellular was off or iPhone not connected.

Yes ultra with LTE - but have had that the entire time for watchOS 9 and okay might just be me, but I haven’t really seen this issue back then?

 

[NME42]

Yes ultra with LTE - but have had that the entire time for watchOS 9 and okay might just be me, but I haven’t really seen this issue back then?

Could well be. Big might have been reintroduced in watchOS 10.
Maybe you try your next run with LTE disabled?

 

[NME42]

Okay I do have cellular on. 🤔 So that would match, but still, I hope that either it’s not it, or at least it won’t take a year to fix it… - anyway, I’m curious what others say!

Try your next run please without iPhone connected and LTE off.
If there are no issues we at least have an idea.

 

[xDKP]

Could well be. Big might have been reintroduced in watchOS 10.
Maybe you try your next run with LTE disabled?

Yeah might do the trick - can try to turn it off, but will need a custom run to simulate the same - happened the two last interval sessions

 

[NME42]

Yeah might do the trick - can try to turn it off, but will need a custom run to simulate the same - happened the two last interval sessions

Maybe just create a dummy interval run: repeat 1km intervals with no pace goals.

 

[xDKP]

I have spotted another weird thing with custom runs now with the current PB

On my (very) long run the Saturday it was fine on the watch with segments and recovery etc. but afterwards the last training segment is gone and my cool down longer than it was? Then interval training today - the warm up not showing? What is going on?