Safari 1.2 Released

[frankly]

Originally posted by zync
To your first statement. No, we shouldn't be mad...that's absolutely great. What isn't great is what you said about ME and XP. ME was total crap and to go from it to XP (I'm talking about the Pro or Corporate edition, BTW) was monumental! That's like the difference between 95 and 98! Have you used a windows operating system? XP kept me from switching to linux or Mac OS sooner! First of all the kernels are completely different and XP is built from NT. XP is actually stable. This is like going from OS 8 to Jaguar or Panther (I'm not counting 10.1 as it was practically beta). Still, I'll be using my mac thank you! It's nice when everyone was complaining about that stupid new windows virus the other day and I proposed a solution: Use a mac. 😀

No, my statement was correct because I said features. First of all ME isn't different enough from 98 to even both counting it in the evolutionary ladder. The difference between the core of 98/ME and XP is huge but please tell me, what were the plethora of features and interface enhancements that Microsoft has added in that same time???

That is what I am talking about. XP is much more stable than ME. But let's be honest here, I use both 2000 and XP and they are NOT as stable as OS X. They aren't even close in my book. Now, having said that I will ask again, what FEATURES have been added over the past six years that compare to the amount of FEATURES added in the past two years to OS X???

I'm sorry but OS X is so damn nice that it still has Windows people going oooooohhhh and aaaahhhhhh every time I open my PowerBook. XP is just a more cartoonish version of 98/ME.

Later, Frank

 

[frankly]

Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by zync
He did have a valid point, although the way he presented it wasn't exactly nice 🙂 Apple has it set that as long as you have 10.x you get all the updates for 10.x until it becomes 10.y. That's just how it's worked with OSX...I

I really don't care one way or the other because I update my system every time a new version comes out. However, your statement is completely inaccurate and it is the same reason that people like ipoddin keep getting blasted.

Safari is not a 10.x or 10.y update. It is a Safari update and that is NOT the way it's worked with OS X. Almost ALL of Apple's applications still work with 10.2. In fact, iChat AV and Safari are the ONLY ones that I know of that require 10.3 so I will ask again....

What are you people talking about that keep saying that 10.2 is no longer supported???? One app that is not part of the OS does not mean that your system is not supported.

Later, Frank

 

[frankly]

Originally posted by Poff
Btw. how hard could it be to make a web-browser not work on both versions of an OS? I mean, add to it a couple of megabytes, where it checks which OS you use, and install some different files depending on your OS. Safari maybe had to rely on Panther to speed it up, but strange how Camino and other browsers are faster than Safari.. With a bit better programming it could have worked nice on both versions of OS X.


Sometimes I miss the Windows world, where someone would have come up with a crack by now (or soon) that would make it possible to use Safari 1.2 on 10.2... 🙁 makes me want to learn to do some programming myself..

Yes, perhaps you should "learn to do some programming" before you make yourself look like a fool next time......

 

[Ambrose Chapel]

Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by frankly
In fact, iChat AV and Safari are the ONLY ones that I know of that require 10.3

iChat AV requires 10.2.5

 

[frankly]

Re: Panther upgrade pre-requisite

Originally posted by BagelTycoon
It's not that Panther's a pre-req for any Safari 1.2 upgrade that bugs me; it's that Apple blew it by being not being up-front that it only works with Panther, but not Jaguar.

I only found this out after going to the Safari download page. The software requirements are only listed after the 'download Safari' button. Why make folks click first, only to find out later that it won't work on 10.2.x?

There's nothing on the main Safari page that even hints at pre-reqs.

It's a rather bass-ackwards way of doing things.

That might seem insidious if all of their software pages weren't the same. Try looking at some of the other software pages and you will see that you have to click a link to find out the system requirements of most of them, if not all (I just haven't checked every single one).

Later, Frank

 

[NicoMan]

Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by frankly
Safari is not a 10.x or 10.y update. It is a Safari update and that is NOT the way it's worked with OS X. Almost ALL of Apple's applications still work with 10.2. In fact, iChat AV and Safari are the ONLY ones that I know of that require 10.3

I agree with you but Safari is not just an app: it is the center of the HTML-rendering engine for the whole system. I think it is a lot more closely linked with lower levels of the OS than, say, iTunes or iMovie. Which makes it more likely for Apple to have to make evolutionary decisions like this one. I personally don't understand what the fuss is about...

My 2 cents.

 

[frankly]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by Ambrose Chapel
iChat AV requires 10.2.5

You know what, you are right. 10.2 users just have to pay for $29 if they want to use it now. I forgot about that. I just remembered that the beta version expired and forgot about the option to pay for it.

Thanks,

Frank

 

[dudeami]

Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by frankly
I really don't care one way or the other because I update my system every time a new version comes out. However, your statement is completely inaccurate and it is the same reason that people like ipoddin keep getting blasted.

Safari is not a 10.x or 10.y update. It is a Safari update and that is NOT the way it's worked with OS X. Almost ALL of Apple's applications still work with 10.2. In fact, iChat AV and Safari are the ONLY ones that I know of that require 10.3 so I will ask again....

What are you people talking about that keep saying that 10.2 is no longer supported???? One app that is not part of the OS does not mean that your system is not supported.

Later, Frank

What about AirPort software 3.2 and 3.3? One featute of these updates is that they allow you to use WPA to encrypt your wireless network. First 3.2 only supported WPA for Airport Extreme, later 3.3 adds support for WPA to the AirPort and continues support for the AirPort Extreme, however both of these are only available for OS 10.3.

 

[crees!]

Originally posted by 7on
I can't believe noone has mentioned that Safari now prints better. aka smaller margins. Still cuts images in half if it spans 2 pages though...

I'm going to have to take a look at this. I have pages I print where the text is small but when I print via Safari the text is huge.

 

[fartheststar]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by frankly
You know what, you are right. 10.2 users just have to pay for $29 if they want to use it now. I forgot about that. I just remembered that the beta version expired and forgot about the option to pay for it.

Thanks,

Frank

I wouldn't mind payint $29 for Safari on Jaguar. Not $129 for panther, which as previous posters say gives me a bunch of things I don't want, including broken apps.

 

[crees!]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by fartheststar
I wouldn't mind payint $29 for Safari on Jaguar. Not $129 for panther, which as previous posters say gives me a bunch of things I don't want, including broken apps.

If I were you I would get in touch with the vendors that make your "broken apps" and see what the hold up is.

 

[janey]

Originally posted by frankly
I am not one of those that has been bashing Apple but your arguments here don't help our cause. You are attacking people with lame arguments and name calling while claiming to be an ubergeek yourself. OS X versions have not been so dramatically different that apps need to be rewritten to work with each version. Look at Office, IE, BBEdit, Appleworks, Watson, Limewire, GraphicConverter, etc. etc. etc. What you should have said was that applications that depend heavily on the OS may be hard to rewrite. Even then however it may not be hard. Look at RBrowser, Toast, etc. Safari may depend much more heavily on the OS and that may be the reason why there is not a Jaguar version.

Neither do your arguments help. I'm not attacking people, I'm just trying to get all the people who do not understand to understand. It's that simple. Name calling? What's so bad about calling someone a n00b? Yeesh.
Oooh when did I call myself an übergeek? That might be my username on the forums, but that doesnt mean I am one.
I'm not saying Safari has to be rewritten, my point is that it will be difficult for Apple to modify the existing code for people who use older operating systems. Its not that easy.
You're comparing software that DOES NOT USE specific updates in an OS. Safari requires 10.3 for a reason, and all you people are forgetting it. By the way, Toast required an update for Panther. Version 5 and below refused to work with 10.3, and version 6 was released to fix that problem. Roxio did it because lots of customers still use both platforms. Apple on the other hand, they dont have to release software they've been releasing for free. Nowhere does it say Apple must give you a jaguar compatible version of Safari. This isnt the first jag-incompatible release either. I dont know why you people are all freaking out about it. Nevertheless you are right, and I wish almost everyone else reading this thread realized the fact that thats the reason why theere is not a jag version.

However, we don't know this for a fact. Maybe Apple just didn't want to release a version for Jaguar and maybe it really was too hard. We can only speculate.

Write some software for Panther, and build it for Panther, using things in Panther that Jag doesnt have. Then run the same program in Jaguar. Then come back and say that about Apple, knowing that its either possible or impossible for Safari to work on both 10.2 and 10.3 with little or no modification.

Now, as far as you bashing people for saying that Safari doesn't work, that is just wrong. I am one of those that had a problem. After the upgrade Safari would not load applets. I did not post this to complain but instead to find someone that might have a solution. I am about as far from a noob as anyone can be. I have been using a Mac since the SE in 1988, currently own 3 Macs, have been running OS X every day since 10.1, and I am working on my Master's degree in Computer Science. Far from a noob and it rubs me the wrong way that instead of offering help you choose to bash those asking for help.

I dont think I was talking about your applet problem. I've been having them too. The people I was specifically talking to are the people who insist they've reinstalled Safari and they cant open the app, etc. They dont know enough to do the usual deleting prefs and stuff...there are hundreds of threads here on MacRumors that have the solution, they couldh ave at least searched befors asking.

I found a solution to my problem on www.macfixit.com It seems the problem was with the Java 1.4.2 update and the problem was fixed by deleting some files and running the standalone installer.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Doctor Q]

Here's something to ponder. Suppose we make a list of the new and changed features of Safari. Which of them are technically tied to Panther's internals and which are only part of the Safari code? The latter could presumably be provided in an updated Safari under Jaguar without a gargantuan effort by Apple.

• improved compatibility with websites and web applications by providing increased support for standards
• support for personal certificate authentication
• works with Java 1.4.2 to enable websites that rely on LiveConnect for communication between JavaScript and Java applets
• improved application stability
• full keyboard access for navigating web pages
• ability to resume interrupted downloads
• new options to open links in tabs vs. windows
• new icon for reload button
• new preference settings
• ...the other stuff I forgot in include...

Which are tied to Panther?

 

[Krizoitz]

Originally posted by Doctor Q

• improved compatibility with websites and web applications by providing increased support for standards
• support for personal certificate authentication
• works with Java 1.4.2 to enable websites that rely on LiveConnect for communication between JavaScript and Java applets
• improved application stability
• full keyboard access for navigating web pages
• ability to resume interrupted downloads
• new options to open links in tabs vs. windows
• new icon for reload button
• new preference settings
• ...the other stuff I forgot in include...

Which are tied to Panther?

Some, most, a few? It doesn't matter if the core application iteslef relies on new technologies. Otherwise what you are asking them to do is produce TWO Safari's.

 

[Krizoitz]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by NicoMan
I personally don't understand what the fuss is about...

It's quite simple. Apple was giving people something for free. They are still giving it out for free, but they have a newer one for free too. The newer one just doesn't work on pre-Panther, so rather than thanking Apple for giving them a free browser, they moan and complain that Apple isn't giving them more free stuff. Next they will be wanting free laptops.

 

[crees!]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by Krizoitz
It's quite simple. Apple was giving people something for free. They are still giving it out for free, but they have a newer one for free too. The newer one just doesn't work on pre-Panther, so rather than thanking Apple for giving them a free browser, they moan and complain that Apple isn't giving them more free stuff. Next they will be wanting free laptops.

Ahh, the perks of having the latest and greatest OS.

 

[billyboy]

Gimme gimme gimme

Until the day before yesterday the whole Mac world was one happy little itty bitty Safari user, with Camino, Firebird, Omniweb and whatever else all around too. 48 hours is obviously a long time in Mac land and only one teeny part of the landscape has changed. Good job OS X doesnt get as easily and quite honestly, sadly upset as some of its users.

 

[kenohki]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by Krizoitz
It's quite simple. Apple was giving people something for free. They are still giving it out for free, but they have a newer one for free too. The newer one just doesn't work on pre-Panther, so rather than thanking Apple for giving them a free browser, they moan and complain that Apple isn't giving them more free stuff. Next they will be wanting free laptops.

No one wants free laptops. We want free desktops. 😉 My beef with Apple is more out of principle. No other respectable OS/software/solution provider would force you to upgrade your OS to get a bug fix for an application that ran just fine and was supported only months ago in a previous version of their OS.

I understand that most people here use Macs probably in a consumer, artistic, or SOHO environment. So the economics and logistics of the beast are quite different. However, this sort of thing in an enterprise with hundreds to tens of thousands deployments is not good. Corporations want to upgrade their OS when THEY want to and not when a vendor tells them it's time. (Look at how Licensing 6 or the extended Win98 support for examples.)

In all seriousness, unless an enterprise network is set up with NetBoot or something of the like, an OS rollout is a massive undertaking. And IT staffs would not want to undertake an OS rollout in order to get some browser bug fixes. This is why this sort of thing gets me rialed up. Apple can't expect to be taken seriously when the do stuff like this. And I'd like nothing more than for them to be taken seriously. (And contrary to what anyone says, Safari IS an important app for Apple, now that they're making it their "IE".)

On a side note, everyone here talks a lot about new OS features in Panther that Safari is taking advantage of. I can understand if there are some new calls that Apple is taking advantage of. But IMHO, they should have thought about how they were going to architect the frameworks and the application before they rolled them out with Safari 1.0.

This whole bit of changing the frameworks whenever we like is kind of silly. OpenStep was fairly stable before OS X. And now Apple changes it whenever they see fit (not to mention how many iterations of aqua widgets and interface skins and finders we'll be forced to sit through.)

Anyway, if I sound like I'm harping on Apple, maybe I am a little. But hell, I've been a customer of theirs for long enough that I don't feel too bad harping a bit. *grin* (I was a Newton user if that counts for anything.) I also want to see them make progress. I'd love to see OS X do well and gain some marketshare. However, it's time to get with the program, do a little planning, and stop twiddling the nobs just because we can. (Oh, and a roadmap would be nice too.)

 

[mdriftmeyer]

This is a heads-up to people wanting to know more about why Safari 1.2 and later is Panther only and not Jaguar.

Apple uses GCC and is a major contributor to GCC since 1989 when NeXT speerheaded the ObjC language branch of GCC.

Here is an excerpt of the GCC 3.4 release that is soon to be FCS.

http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html

...
Objective-C

The Objective-C front end has been updated to include the numerous bug fixes and enhancements previously available only in Apple's version of GCC. These include:
Structured exception (@try... @catch... @finally, @throw) and synchronization (@synchronized) support. These are accessible via the -fobjc-exceptions switch; as of this writing, they may only be used in conjunction with -fnext-runtime on Mac OS X 10.3 and later. See Options Controlling Objective-C Dialect for more information.
An overhaul of @encode logic. The C99 _Bool and C++ bool type may now be encoded as 'B'. In addition, the back-end/codegen dependencies have been removed.
An overhaul of message dispatch construction, ensuring that the various receiver types (and casts thereof) are handled properly, and that correct diagnostics are issued.
Support for "Zero-Link" (-fzero-link) and "Fix-and-Continue" (-freplace-objc-classes) debugging modes, currently available on Mac OS X 10.3 and later. See Options Controlling Objective-C Dialect for more information.
Access to optimized runtime entry points (-fno-nil-receivers ) on the assumption that message receivers are never nil. This is currently available on Mac OS X 10.3 and later. See Options Controlling Objective-C Dialect for more information.

What you see here is everything that Xcode utilizes, by GPL Apple is now giving back to GCC and for folks like myself that want to use GNUStep as well this is good news.

Might explain recent rumors of Linux app ports possibilites.

I don't hold much stock in that rumor other than it makes folks writing GNUStep applications accordingly to the Openstep Spec, etc., an easy port to Cocoa/OS X.

It does make it easy for Apple to port to Linux so long as folks running Linux have the GNUStep base, gui and make systems installed.

This also explains what version of GCC the latest releases of Panther applications were developed in, within Xcode.

 

[WM.]

This thread is long since dead, or at least I hope it is, but I did want to clarify a couple things for posterity...

Originally posted by kenohki
Those are CLASS ACTION lawsuits. That means that users of their products (who probably happily shelled out their hard earned cash believing the marketing spin) are bringing litigation against them. This Safari thing is just one more drop in the bucket. You've got the lawsuit about Mac OS X not running right on older machines,

Fixed (in 10.1.5) and settled with a full or partial refund available (depending on whether you want to stop using OS X).

the PowerBook paint problems,

Yes, that was a design flaw (albeit a cosmetic one), but at least now you can get $700 for your old PowerBook, even if you have the paint problems, when you buy a new one. I think Apple was sporadically fixing these paint problems (giving users new cases) under warranty, as well.

Also, I don't believe there was a lawsuit over this one.

the iBook logic board and display problems,

Mostly fixed with a pretty generous extension program (including proactive repair refunds!). Apparently there have been problems outside of the range covered under this program; if that does prove to be true I hope Apple fixes it.

the iPod battery problem,

All batteries wear out. When they do you can pay Apple $99 to replace them or buy one for $49 and replace it yourself. Or you can spend $59 (?) at/shortly after purchase for AppleCare and get it done for free if the battery dies in the first two years.

the G4 fan problems,

Fixed for $19.95. That program ended about six months ago, so you're out of luck by now, but my impression is that it pretty much fixed the problem.

I don't think this involved a suit either.

And let's not get started on all the Windows users machines that were screwed up by the original iTunes installer.

Haven't heard about that one. My impression is that Windows iTunes was remarkably bug-free for what basically amounted to a 1.0.

Apple NEEDS to do some better planning, testing, and rollout of their products.

Agreed. But so does almost any big company. And Apple has generally fixed major problems. We can certainly continue to put pressure on them, though.

But I don't think this is too applicable to the debate about Safari. 🙂

WM

 

[kenohki]

Originally posted by WM.
This thread is long since dead, or at least I hope it is, but I did want to clarify a couple things for posterity...

But I don't think this is too applicable to the debate about Safari. 🙂

WM

Yeah, I was just getting at the fact that they don't need to do anything more to possibly upset consumers.

 

[zync]

Re: Re: Re: Re: For you ESL students

Originally posted by frankly
I really don't care one way or the other because I update my system every time a new version comes out. However, your statement is completely inaccurate and it is the same reason that people like ipoddin keep getting blasted.

Safari is not a 10.x or 10.y update. It is a Safari update and that is NOT the way it's worked with OS X. Almost ALL of Apple's applications still work with 10.2. In fact, iChat AV and Safari are the ONLY ones that I know of that require 10.3 so I will ask again....

What are you people talking about that keep saying that 10.2 is no longer supported???? One app that is not part of the OS does not mean that your system is not supported.

Later, Frank

You obviously don't pay attention to what I'm talking about. First off I wasn't simply talking about Safari. Obviously, this is like an iTunes update which everyone can get. Secondly, I was one of the people that talked about 10.2 being supported just not upgraded. I explained the difference between upgrade and support in another post. You obviously didn't read it and I'm not going to bother to explain it again.

Originally posted by frankly
No, my statement was correct because I said features. First of all ME isn't different enough from 98 to even both counting it in the evolutionary ladder. The difference between the core of 98/ME and XP is huge but please tell me, what were the plethora of features and interface enhancements that Microsoft has added in that same time???

That is what I am talking about. XP is much more stable than ME. But let's be honest here, I use both 2000 and XP and they are NOT as stable as OS X. They aren't even close in my book. Now, having said that I will ask again, what FEATURES have been added over the past six years that compare to the amount of FEATURES added in the past two years to OS X???

I'm sorry but OS X is so damn nice that it still has Windows people going oooooohhhh and aaaahhhhhh every time I open my PowerBook. XP is just a more cartoonish version of 98/ME.

Later, Frank

Hmm...let's see....a journaling file system, howabout security features like permissions!? These are just things given by the switch to NTFS. I don't think I need to go on, but I shall. It's not technically a feature but start-up time is much, much quicker than OS X. They added transparency. It's skinnable (not that I care but it's a feature). The taskbar was "improved" by allowing you to either group similar items or leave them as seperate items. The new task manager is much improved. Thumbnail views for images and movies were added as well as audio previews. Filmstrip view was added and that made going through images very nice...I wish OS X had that. Let's talk about multiple users for a sec. XP made it much easier to both set up multiple users and administrate them, not to mention the fact that 98 didn't really even have multiple users, just multiple user prefs. Oh and fast user switching has always been a part of XP 🙂. 98 didn't even have a built in firewall. You can report errors anonymously through XP. No longer running on DOS is certainly a freaking feature. There are plenty more...maybe you should look up a few. I'm sorry I don't have more FEATURES for you, these are all I can remember after not running 98 for four years.

XP is pretty much every bit as stable as OS X. In fact certain things are actually easier to fix. Sometimes in IE on my PowerBook I would have problems with certain windows freezing IE and all my windows would be lost when I had to force quit the application. Apple's windows aren't seperate tasks. Windows' windows are. This is very nice if you have a problematic web document and need to close a single window instead of the entire application. There are two problems with this however: 1. it doesn't always work and 2. yes, it makes it slightly slower. But how much time do you gain by not having to lose all your windows?

There are problems with both OSes but just because you happen to like OS X doesn't mean that XP is a complete and total crap and not any bit different from 98. And no it's not simply a more "cartoony" version of 98...besides core enhancements there are things that are there that aren't simply graphical. Hell, MS products getting more graphical might as well be a damn FEATURE!

 

[Poff]

Originally posted by frankly
Yes, perhaps you should "learn to do some programming" before you make yourself look like a fool next time......

C´mon! You honestly can´t say that without backing your accusations. So give me hard facts, theoretical facts, that would do in a university where you would take a master degree on programming relevant for this type of app, of why I made a fool of myself.

If you can come up with this, I´ll bow down and eat your socks.
If you can´t produce this, then stop coming with pointless accusations.

 

[janey]

omg Safari (and especially WebCore) does indeed change (gasp!!)!

from http://developer.apple.com/darwin/projects/webcore/index.html
The WebCore SPIs are fragile, incomplete and bound to change. Apple will soon release a public API based on the WebCore engine. We recommend waiting for this forthcoming API.

http://developer.apple.com/documentation/index-rev-date.html too....all those revised for 10.3 documents!
ooh looky looky 10.3 uses darwin 7 unlike 10.2 which uses darwin 6!!!

Seriously I'm not joking, 10.3 is different from 10.2...hope all of you get it by now. 😱 😎

 

[janey]

Originally posted by Poff
C´mon! You honestly can´t say that without backing your accusations. So give me hard facts, theoretical facts, that would do in a...(snip)

erm that was in reply to your "maybe i should learn to do some programming" comment. You should know that nothing's really that easy.
btw he said master's in CS, not programming. You cant get a masters in programming.
about your post that he sorta criticized...

Btw. how hard could it be to make a web-browser not work on both versions of an OS? I mean, add to it a couple of megabytes, where it checks which OS you use, and install some different files depending on your OS. Safari maybe had to rely on Panther to speed it up, but strange how Camino and other browsers are faster than Safari.. With a bit better programming it could have worked nice on both versions of OS X.

Nothing's that easy. the problem is the fact that Safari doesnt really install files that do not work in 10.2, the files it uses are part of the operating system itself. Safari is one app, not a collection of a zillion others, you cant just randomly change stuff here and there, replace this file with that and still expect to work. Safari doesnt necessarily rely on Panther, Safari probably just uses some new features in Panther not present in older versions of the OS. (btw, Camino is **** on any machine with only a little bit of RAM. Just like any other app, but Camino is, was, and always will be ****ty on my iBook. Most of the time it wants to take a minute to start up :\ That is soo annoying compared to Safari's 2-5 seconds). This also has nothing to do with who is a better programmer than another. This is a matter of whether or not Apple wants to spend the time, money, and programmers to make Safari 1.2 compatible with Jaguar, an OS that is a year and a half old that has already been replaced with a newer version.

Sometimes I miss the Windows world, where someone would have come up with a crack by now (or soon) that would make it possible to use Safari 1.2 on 10.2... makes me want to learn to do some programming myself..

Hey, you find some way to get the new stuff that Safari uses (in Darwin 7.x) to work on Darwin 6 and you got yourself a crack. And if you're so interested why dont you go back to using Windows, finding your own cracks. Ya know, PEOPLE have to discover them, so it might as well be you so you wouldnt have to wait.
So why dont you go learn a new language. I suggest learning C++, then Objective-C (because its a language difficult to learn if you have no prior experience). If you insist on learning C, a good book is kerningham and ritchie's The C Programming Language. Or go and learn Java. I dont know. Go and learn one and find out exactly how hard it is to write quality apps.
Check out the ADC site too @ http://developer.apple.com/