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I really hope Safari 5 will see some improvement in "memory leaks" - my Safari hogs up to 700-800 MB of RAM when I have lots of tabs open for a long time and even if I close those tabs, it will still take up about 500 MB. Simply unacceptable!
 
Just a few points.

Presumably if iTunes music streaming is coming, there'll be a new version of iTunes coming, probably iTunes X. Hopefully, they'll move it over to Cocoa and bring 64-bit versions. Maybe a 64-bit rewrite would also bring performance improvements to the Windows versions.
ITunes could use some beefing up and a modern UI. However I don't think a new version will come right away. Mainly because this is a developers meeting and the fall iPod deal is the place to update iTunes.
It would be nice if Safari 5 brings 64-bit versions for Windows along with the ability to use the 32-bit Flash plugin as in Snow Leopard. Certainly a 64-bit Safari 5 for Windows with hardware acceleration and support for existing 32-bit plugins would be very attractive compared to IE, Firefox or Chrome and may help grow marketshare on Windows.
At work the PCs are so old and slow that I don't really care. Given that I would suspect that there has to be some sort of OS support to do this.
In terms of Safari hardware acceleration in OS X, I believe it's implemented using Quartz Extreme, Core Image, and Core Animation for the vector and animation stuff and the Video Acceleration Decode framework for HTML5 video.
That is pretty much my understanding but you did mis WebGL and it's use og Open GL. I haven't checked to see if OpenCL is used directly anywhere.
Only the video decode acceleration is limited to the 9400M, 320M, and GT330M. Safari vector and animation acceleration should be compatible with any GPU that supports Core Image and Core Animation which is basically any DX9 class GPU and up and I believe is already supported in both Leopard and Snow Leopard in Safari 4 although probably not as extensively as Safari 5 will. Tiger support will probably be dropped for Safari 5 since Core Animation isn't available there.
Actually some things are better supported in Snow Leopard than Leopard. Don't ask me what those things are I just recall that SL did some things better than Leopard.

That makes sense because one of the things SL was suppose to do is fix many low level parts of the system and move a lot of stuff to 64 bit. With each patch release of SL they have been addressing the low level stuff, like drivers, to fix glitches and improve performance. The fixes to Open GL are just part of what was worked on in SL.
Safari hardware acceleration in Windows for vector and animation is probably done with Direct2D as IE9 does. Video acceleration will likely be done through DXVA 2.0. These are both Vista and Windows 7 only so it'll be interesting to see whether Windows XP support will be dropped especially given that Windows XP is still the most popular OS in the world.


Yay blue loading bar. :)

They didn't implement tabs on top again did they? I didn't like that.

I'm not sure why this isn't a user choice. This is just one example of something that should be easy to configure.

All in all I kinda like Safari and hope 5.0 is a stable and speedy as the current version. I'm not sure if they are ready for a transition to WebKit2 but that would make for a very interesting Safari on multiprocessor machines. Of course people will try to deny that webKit2 will leverage multi processors far better.

Dave
 
Hooray! I can't wait to use Bing as my search engine! [/sarcasm]
Bing sucks. I don't know why they're including it. Ah well, I ain't being forced to use it (hopefully!).

I hope they include Full Screen and possibly skins.
 
Hooray! I can't wait to use Bing as my search engine! [/sarcasm]
Bing sucks.
What's so bad about Bing? I've tried it out, and while it's no Scroogle it's pretty damn good at what it does.
I don't know why they're including it. Ah well, I ain't being forced to use it (hopefully!).
Of course you won't be forced to use it. You're not even forced to use Safari.

I hope they include Full Screen and possibly skins.
Full screen? That's so Microsoft.
Skins are for people who don't use Macs.
:rolleyes:
 
Maybe this is a Mac question and not a Safari question. I mostly use Windows but since I have an iPhone and iPad I am trying to get use to a Mac (got a mini to play with). My biggest complaint so far is not being able to go full screen (or max screen). On Windows I just double click the top bar and my Windows use maximun screen area (any window including the browser like Safari). Am I missing something or is this just not posible on the Mac? On a Mac are all Windows manually sized and you can't just say use all available space (but not overlaying the bottom line).

RightZoom does this for free (works on everything except iTunes and Google Chrome :-s). Ignore what other people tell you - my life is multi-tasking enough without needing the "random window resize" button labelled 'zoom'

Hopefully 10.6.4 will fix the graphics switching problem on the 2010 MBP (GfxCardStatus is the hack to fix that).
 
I just said that the iMac is not responsible for the USB take-off, and that I was already hearing about USB way before the iMac and Apple took the plunge.
Where? There weren't any commercially successful USB devices before the iMac. Show me a USB 1.0 product that went anywhere.
It was being discussed everywhere in the PC World
As a solution looking for a problem, or as a standard that wasn't going anywhere, or as Apple's folly of a choice for their iMac. Your selective memory is failing you.
shipped with Windows 95
No, it didn't. It shipped in partial form in late 1997 for OEM integration, as a partial implementation of USB 1.0, which no one used in the consumer space. Microsoft's own developer documentation talks about the poor support in Windows 95 and the original release of Windows 98 due to a lack of hardware to test with. It was 98SE/ME, both post-iMac products, that actually made USB usable on the PC, and only after that became the case did sales in volume begin to occur, by which time the number of Mac peripherals and devices already had a substantial lead.

The fact that Apple was irrelevant then has lead you astray into believing that USB on Windows got anywhere first or even tied with MacOS. It's simply not true. Mac printers went USB in 1998. USB printers on Windows didn't overtake parallel printers until 2002. USB 2.0 was the first truly successful version on Windows, and the major game-changer. Apple was not at the forefront of USB 2.0 adoption. It seems to me that that is what you are recalling.
, and was a major marketing point for Windows 98.
It was a major marketing point for Windows 98SE. Windows 98 shipped without USB 1.1 support. The idea that there were any commercially successful USB 1.0 devices is false.

You have yet to provide one.
In the PC world, no one cares about Apple circa 1998-2000. We got USB and devices that were USB because USB was simply the superior choice.
And therein lies your problem. You think that the array of USB devices that appeared in 2000 were an inevitability, while ignoring that it was the Mac peripherals that started shipping in 1998 that set the stage for them. Without the fact that USB peripherals had to be developed for Apple and that Apple users had to pay for them, USB probably wouldn't have gone anywhere at all until USB 2.0, which itself might not have happened if USB had continued to fail in PC adoption.
My 1998 PC had USB ports on it.
And it was what, exactly? While I've talked about a litany of devices, you've not identified a single one by name.

USB controllers existed for a long time without OS support and without devices. I've provided a long list of examples of the failure of USB 1.1 to reach critical mass.
Devices that weren't better off as USB didn't go USB until it became the superior choice (which took USB 2.0 for many type of high bandwidth devices).
And here we have it. "Devices that weren't better off as USB".

You're defending your lack of accurate memory and the lack of PC devices with a convenient handwave. What you are remembering as the buzz and the adoption of USB in the PC world was USB 2.0--which was a rapid success on PCs. USB 1.1 was not. It all started with Mac peripherals, whether you pretend otherwise or not.
 
Where? There weren't any commercially successful USB devices before the iMac. Show me a USB 1.0 product that went anywhere.

I had USB mice and keyboard and joysticks before the iMac. You're confusing iMac release with Windows 98 release.

No, it didn't. It shipped in partial form in late 1997 for OEM integration, as a partial implementation of USB 1.0...

Commonly known as Windows 95 OSRC, I said so earlier, didn't think I'd need to type it up again...


And it was what, exactly? While I've talked about a litany of devices, you've not identified a single one by name.

My '98 PC was a Asus LX based motherboard. They all had USB because the LX chipset supported USB. Heck, the early Pentium II and Pentium Pro FX based boards supported USB.

You're defending your lack of accurate memory and the lack of PC devices with a convenient handwave. What you are remembering as the buzz and the adoption of USB in the PC world was USB 2.0--which was a rapid success on PCs. USB 1.1 was not. It all started with Mac peripherals, whether you pretend otherwise or not.

And I keep telling you, outside Mac circles, no one cared about Macs. PCs had a very wide selection of HID USB devices in the 1.0 and 1.1 days. This came about because Windows 98 shipped with the OS support for it. Not because of some obscure candy coated screen. And USB printers were the norm before 2002. I was installing them on Windows 98 PCs early on already. Maybe you just didn't know where to look.

You may claim my memory is faulty, I'll claim yours is delusional. The Mac didn't bring about USB. USB came solving a problem and it did. That you want to claim that because there were no USB hard drives in 1998 is the reason for why it's thanks to Apple that we have USB is your own fallacy. The reason there were no USB hard drives in 1998 is called 11 mbps shared bandwith.

Want to move on to MP3 players next ? So we can argue wether the iPod created the buzz for the damn things or if Apple simply saw the buzz around them and went in ? I'll put my chips on "already a huge seller that Apple decided to jump on". You just have to go back to the keynote introducing the iPod to see even Steve knows he's not first, since he points out the many kinds of MP3 players already on the market.
 
Just my two cents on what will come out today, and getting my predictions date/time-stamped here for kicks. Nothing here that probably hasn't been discussed elsewhere.

- new iPhone exactly as revealed by Gizmodo (no differences from that model at all); will be faster than that new Droid that's coming out
- OS4.0 - apps in background; grouping of apps into folders (they will let you choose between a folder of your naming/creation, but they will also offer you cutesy folders with their names and art, such as "Games" with game-y looking art); will be streaming-friendly (see below)
- "the cloud"/mobileme will be big thing, and reach into different platforms today; mobileme will be revamped - prices will be lowered in some respect, with the current $99 model giving participants up to 50 gigs of cloud storage for music and movies; this storage will be largely used for iTunes/iPhone/Apple TV content and it will be streamed; today will mark the day that Apple takes a strong step in the streaming direction with iTunes/iPods/iPads/Apple TV and "computers" generally; Apple's purchase of Lala will make more sense today, as they announce that anything in your catalogue currently (perhaps iTunes store purchases only) is accessible to you from Lala's "cloud", though they won't say it's Lala's cloud, but that it's Apple's cloud, an "iTunes cloud" or something
- the speech will start with showing off the sales stats as always, with the emphasis today on the iPad sales stats - trying to set the stage for the iPad being an actual "computer"
- new tiny Apple TV rolled out; form-factor consistent with iPhone, but it is essentially a devoted streaming device (from the cloud) that has just enough room for the Apple TV OS
- back to OS4.0 - Apple is going to intimate that it will ultimately be focusing on that operating system, and that most users will find it does what they need it to do (e.g. the iPad with its OS and a keyboard will become the "new computer" for most people)
- Beatles catalogue will be announced, and Paul/Ringo will perform at end ;)

Even though this is a developer conference, Apple knows that of equal value to talking to developers today is the "free" press of talking/advertising to the world, and you are going to see this speech speak more to consumers - as opposed to developers - than normal. Apple/Jobs knows that they must hit a homerun today because of Google and what its doing with Droid and such. Whereas they chose to hold back a bit in recent announcement speeches so that they could always keep something else in their pocket, they won't do that today. They will come out blazing. It'll be their biggest announcement speech since the January 2007.

Keep calm and carry on.

EDIT: I believe they will announce iTunes 10 to accommodate the new streaming component of iTunes, perhaps segregating your library between media that you actually have on your drive locally, and media you have in the cloud.

EDIT 2: Assuming my brilliant assumptions are correct about the new cloud and streaming system, I am betting they will re-brand the terms "stream" and "cloud" to something more Apple-esque.
 
Want to move on to MP3 players next ? So we can argue wether the iPod created the buzz for the damn things or if Apple simply saw the buzz around them and went in ? I'll put my chips on "already a huge seller that Apple decided to jump on". You just have to go back to the keynote introducing the iPod to see even Steve knows he's not first, since he points out the many kinds of MP3 players already on the market.

The real genius around the iPod is how Jobs managed to persuade the record companies into allowing him to sell their music electronically - without the record companies demanding at least a piece of the store. That's almost on par with IBM leasing DOS without obtaining the rights back in the day.

Of course, Apple's attitude towards design is no small part of it. If only they knew how to design programming languages :)
 
Intel DG41MJ to name just one recent one.

Serial and VGA outputs are still common and still have their uses, but that's exactly the point. They're still legacy ports--cheap LCD monitors until just a few years ago shipped only with VGA connectors. The reason that these connectors are included, even on products with a space premium, is that people still use them, which shows that manufacturers haven't fully embraced USB even today.

USB 1.1, which is the first version that went anywhere, was introduced in September 1998--after the iMac, which was introduced with a draft version of the standard. Windows 98, introduced in May 1998--about two months before the iMac, was the first version of Windows available at retail with close to complete support for USB 1.0.

USB ports were introduced in 1996, but nobody used them. You'd have an extremely hard time finding (a) a USB 1.0 device that was sold commercially in volume and (b) a Windows USB printer, scanner, external drive, keyboard, mouse, or game controller that was introduced before 1999.

Then you weren't paying attention. The first USB printers, scanners, Zip drives, keyboards, and mice were all introduced for Macs, because starting with the 1998 iMac and PowerBook, Macs were all-USB. It certainly wasn't overnight, but it absolutely was Mac-centric.

Manufacturers haven't completely embraced USB? I think it's more likely that customers haven't. We still have a parallel printer that works fine and thus there is no need to replace it. I haven't seen a non-USB device in ages, apart from keyboards which are usually old ones.

VGA ports you are correct, however I believe this is down to the small differences in picture quality between DVI and VGA on anything but the most expensive monitors. Unless you are a professional user there is little benefit to DVI and thus VGA has persisted. Therefore flatscreen TVs more commonly support VGA than DVI because that is a more widely available connector.

Again, just because Macs were first doesn't mean that they popularised USB. A handful of devices for Apple products does not equal a revolution. It is more likely that Windows 98 and a slow trickle of hardware including it and USB devices lead to USB being more popular.
 
Manufacturers haven't completely embraced USB? I think it's more likely that customers haven't. We still have a parallel printer that works fine and thus there is no need to replace it. I haven't seen a non-USB device in ages, apart from keyboards which are usually old ones.

Not to mention things like Serial ports are still in use today. All our Sun and Cisco equipement still use serial consoles and for good reasons. Why would I need 400 mbps of bandwidth for a serial connection that runs at 9600 bps ?
 
I had USB mice and keyboard and joysticks before the iMac.
No, you didn't. Name one model of those that you owned that was USB 1.0.

Microsoft themselves admits that they were unable to find sufficient 1.0 hardware to test against. USB 1.1 didn't come out until after the iMac, and Windows didn't fully support it until 98SE brought updated USB drivers. Your pretending otherwise does nothing to change that.
You're confusing iMac release with Windows 98 release.
Not in the slightest.
And I keep telling you, outside Mac circles, no one cared about Macs. PCs had a very wide selection of HID USB devices in the 1.0 and 1.1 days. This came about because Windows 98 shipped with the OS support for it.
Utterly false on all accounts.
The Mac didn't bring about USB.
I didn't say it did.
That you want to claim that because there were no USB hard drives in 1998 is the reason for why it's thanks to Apple that we have USB is your own fallacy.
It's your own fabrication that hard drives are the turning point here, just like you're pretending that there was a "wide selection" of devices in early 1998 for a standard that didn't exist yet.
Want to move on to MP3 players next ?
Who's talking about that?
You just have to go back to the keynote introducing the iPod to see even Steve knows he's not first, since he points out the many kinds of MP3 players already on the market.
Who said they were first? Who's talking about iPods?

I say, with historically accurate reasons, that pretending that Apple had a minimal to nonexistent role in the acceleration of USB adoption is idiotic revisionism. You are running out of straw men to chuck about.

Windows 98 did not ship with USB 1.1 support. You did not have the peripherals you claim to have used prior to the release of the iMac. You have provided not one example of any such device. Microsoft themselves admitted that they didn't have proper USB support until 98SE/ME.
Manufacturers haven't completely embraced USB? I think it's more likely that customers haven't.
The point is that you can't have one without the other. By forcing device manufacturers to make USB models for going after the Mac market, which included the very first USB printers and scanners, they were able to do a lot of work that had secondary effects allowing them to sell PC versions--the legacy versions were cheaper to make and had many times the potential market. It was nothing more than a niche on the PC until the modern wave of devices and USB 2.0 (by which time Mac users already had fully embraced USB) in the early 2000s.

The absolutely terrible puck mouse, for example, was the subject of an article in PC World or PC Magazine that included a memorable line to the effect of "If this is what USB input devices are going to be, I'll pass"--that stupid mouse was one of the first high volume consumer USB input devices on the market.
Again, just because Macs were first doesn't mean that they popularised USB.
They weren't first. They were the first to force it, and that had massive spillover effects, because the R&D costs could be dumped on Mac users, and it provided a smaller target to work with for product development. They then slowly started adding models, based on the Mac-proven products, to the general marketplace once Windows got its act together and implemented USB 1.1 support (but not the mass storage class) in 1999.

Eventually, USB started to displace legacy ports on the PC, but in large part because the floodgates had been opened already by a test pool. The claim that Windows 98 shipped with full USB 1.1 support is false (Windows 98 never had full 1.1 support, as the mass storage class was never implemented natively), as is the claim that such devices were on the market well before the release of the iMac. Those are purely revisionist claims.

The point is simple and fully evident for anyone who was actually around at the time: Apple played a significant role in bringing USB to the mainstream. Twisting that argument into some distorted "Apple did it completely by themselves and nobody else deserves any credit" claim or handwaving over the timeline is proof positive that you can't make a case against that. The people who in 1998 laughed at the iMac for the fact that there was almost nothing to plug into it at launch except some third party mice are now claiming that there was a wide variety of advanced USB devices and that PC users had been using them for a long time. It was a bad example to cite. Just accept it and move on.
 
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