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Samsung Launches Galaxy Note 20, Galaxy Z Fold 2, and Galaxy Buds to Compete With Apple's iPhones and AirPods Pro

farewelwilliams

macrumors 68040
Jun 18, 2014
3,661
14,795
Ya Samsung is suppppper struggling. Their business model must the reason. /s :rolleyes:

I made 0 mention of their business model. You're failing to understand the UX perspective.

And you continue to put words in my mouth as I made no mention of their Note products and made no mention of their business model but you accuse me of saying otherwise. So I'm going to end it here. Not going to read anymore from you.
 
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Rogifan

macrumors Core
Nov 14, 2011
22,083
27,662
Don't believe anything he says. Remember Apple Watch Edition made of 18-karat gold and how they tried to advertize it? Remember these?
How is that competing with high end mechanical watches? The gold Apple Watch (which lasted all of one year) existed because Ive is a chemistry nerd and wanted to play around with real gold (or was just bored working with aluminum). Remember the 3 videos he narrated about the manufacturing processes for aluminum, silver and gold? Tim Cook and Jeff Williams threw him a bone with the gold Watch. When the Watch first came out most of the health features weren’t ready yet so Apple pushed the fashion angle instead.
 
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DeepIn2U

macrumors 604
May 30, 2002
7,751
2,715
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
The issue is , with rounded apple watch..people, who indeed has real mechanical watches will always compare and will never buy this...the look of an rounded digital watch it will always look cheap compared to the mechanical...thats why Apple is an almost 2 tril $ company, because they talk with the right people...until apple watch, they talked with the CEO of companies like Rolex, Audemar Piguet etc....so...smart people, talk with those who did watches for decades with centuries of history....others...just pretend and try to copy, like samsung in this case, the big watches manufactures

well said.

More critically even using an updated TIzen OS, The Galaxy Watch 3 UI (activities, health etc) looks like Google Gear OS ... specifically the horrible colour choices. Looks too, I don't know, rudimentary? Just like a Grade 2 kids colour book with crayons smooth edges and all with the fonts but the colour itself and the UI layout looks far too basic, inviting for continual use. This its key point and I see so many tech reviewers or people around my city that use an Android/Tizen Smartwatch not actually use it at all. maybe just a few minutes doesn't warrant it's use, but at times over 4hr or 9 hr workshift a few colleagues NEVER once touched his/her watches. I asked if theirs was charged and all answered yes. I asked how come you don't ever use it, and they just shrugged.

Beyond that its the use case of the features. Samsung's TM talks the talk, but their software, presentation and features just doesn't Walk the Walk.

1. Fitness features. Only Yoonie showed off using jogging tracking or ECG or remote controlling her Note with Netflix playback controls on the Galaxy Watch 3. She showed launching a workout .. yet noticed as soon as she engaged it the camera for viewers zoomed so far out?! Why??
- were they afraid to show users just how it works?

2. Listening to Music & AirPods.
- For me this works seamlessly ... taking public transit anywhere, yet specifically to the gym. I leave my iPhone in the locker, locked, and begin my music for my workout playlist on Apple Watch and boom AirPods Pro immediately connects and playback begins. I launch Strong! fitness app and BOOM I'm doing my weight training workout: tracking Sets, Reps, Weights, and rest timing. I can get audible notification when rest is over or a light taps on my wrist - very discreet.
- If an iMessage/SMS comes in I can reply voice to text instantly and music playback will resume without me touching anything. More critically is voice to text works just about PERFECTLY on the watch yet in iOS it's nowhere close to being as accurate (LMAO makes me laugh). even with gesture writing I'm pretty quick for short sentences - I don't limit my normal kind of replies that I do on iPhone vs the Watch either.
- Workout is done its sync'd to the app on my phone and in Health records. More critically is I can take note of my heart health as well. the integration of Health with MyFitnessPal, Strong! Sleeping, Breathing workouts is just TOO DAMN AWESOME for me to even look elsewhere beyond a few minutes and know - I'm NOT going to get that synergistic flow, beautiful and inviting UI and quality elsewhere.

3. Samsung with Microsoft seems to have beating Apple with smartphone apps on a desktop OS. I have a feeling they've just ended in that vision. I have a feeling with Xcode updated and with developers ... our iPadOS and iOS apps will have full blown feature and UI's on macOS BigSur later this year.

4. Rounded Smart Watches = Dead in the water.
- Simple reason .... lots of wasted space around the circular edges. A circular watch was designed based on the sundial and our ideal of telling time for centuries was formed from that. We've evolved and showing and navigating data in and with apps there is just too much wasted space, wasted opportunities with this design ethos that cannot be solved with current approach. If you square off the central area and leave complications or notification icons away from a central area, you limit the view of data and interactivity of the user with the watch.

5. Galaxy Buds Live - NOBODY showed us HOW to use these via controls. ONLY showed us sound sharing from the tablet to another Buds Live owner. Nobody dared to touch the headphones at all.
- WHY?! this is a HUGE fail for me since the presentation in this area was going so well, and clearly the best! Xbox XCloud gamer guy gets a nod with his speech flow, but man those hip words and lingo - he was trying FAR TOO HARD it came across so FAKE of real personality. Cringe.

I used to complain and loathe Apple's front 3 row WWDC cheerleaders of applause and 1 word shout-outs ... but this Zoom video and rushed pre-recorded and spliced box opening of the Z Fold 2 with BTS just looked and felt so awkward. Like they were forced at gun point.

Most of what TM mentioned on stage I could understand, a BIG improvement above former Samsung executive presenters of the past. Pushing too hard for English language isn't always a good thing for foreign countries outside of US, UK, Canada, Ireland, Scotland and many other primarily English countries. It's worse when trying to use a western world idiom as the pronunciation is tough. No doubt learning another language is tough (I'm finding that out myself 'Yo soy estudiante Espanol" don't punish me for accents I'm not using Spanish kb enabled in macOS). I blame TM's language and presenter training crew because - it may have been much easier and better if he used a traditional Korean idiom and then translate it in English for us. I'd have valued that MUCH more because it shows he's welcoming us to his culture and teaching us at the same time. Shows genuine part of 'his' personality, I value that.

Lastly ... who in the Western world takes a picture of someone you just meet to remember them? Maybe it's a girl thing with selfies but just sounds really creepy to me. 'Hi I'm Jim, how are you? I work IT, what's your name? Hows your day going. Have a great day, wait can I take a picture of you so I can remember you?' Creepy no??!
 
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jaworskimatt

macrumors regular
Sep 3, 2019
236
309
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Since Apple products are theoretically supported for so long, why would one care about a high resale value?

Because I like to change my devices every 1-2 years and it’s nice that they will work for another 4-6 years for whoever gets it after me. I’m more likely to buy an iPad or MacBook knowing that when I upgrade to a new model, the old one will still be perfectly fine to pass to someone else. I give my old Apple devices to family and friends, and Android devices are generally useless after 2-3 years if not sooner.
 
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4jasontv

macrumors 68040
Jul 31, 2011
3,421
3,539
5. Galaxy Buds Live - NOBODY showed us HOW to use these via controls. ONLY showed us sound sharing from the tablet to another Buds Live owner. Nobody dared to touch the headphones at all.
- WHY?! this is a HUGE fail for me since the presentation in this area was going so well, and clearly the best! Xbox XCloud gamer guy gets a nod with his speech flow, but man those hip words and lingo - he was trying FAR TOO HARD it came across so FAKE of real personality. Cringe.

Their demo of sound sharing made me wonder if they understood why that feature was added.
 
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thealkimist

macrumors regular
Oct 30, 2011
151
211
Following the blueprint for success to the letter. The only exception is the fold, the success of which I have major doubt.

Yes, a very expensive part for a very vulnerable mechanism. We’ll see if at least a decent amount are willing. I’m not.
 
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DNichter

macrumors G3
Apr 27, 2015
9,086
10,282
Philadelphia, PA
I think you are a little behind the times and need to do a bit more research to realize how far off you are with these comments

In what way? Apple chips have always performed better. Privacy and security are obvious, compared to Android. Apple’s ecosystem is consistent across all of their platforms and they have a very profitable 3rd party accessory market. App quality isn’t even close, plus Android tablet apps barely exist. In regards to build quality, Apple wouldn’t release a product as flawed as the Fold. No company is perfect, but the quality generally is better. Lastly, 5 years of software updates, phone support, and in their in store experience is the best in the industry. Samsung can get you by and isn’t complete junk or anything, but there’s a still a clear difference between them and Apple.
 
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Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
13,533
11,960
Singapore
Ya Samsung is suppppper struggling. Their business model must the reason. /s :rolleyes:

Their phone sales has dropped off a cliff. Samsung is losing premium users to Apple and budget users to cheaper Chinese brands, so they are practically getting squeezed on both ends.

They know they missed the boat on wearables and have little hope of competing with Apple in this regard, and have thus chosen to double down on smartphones, resulting in rather questionable product releases like folding phones.

Of course Samsung is a long way from being doomed but the way I see it, they simply have no idea what’s next. At Apple product events, the takeaways often end up being related more to how Apple is setting the stage for the future. Certain announcements and features make much more sense when thinking about what Apple will likely unveil the following year. At Samsung events, it's the opposite. There's just no coherent vision when it comes to the future as far as I can see.
 
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Professor Rucy

macrumors regular
Jan 29, 2020
154
271
Tyler, Texas, USA
Because I like to change my devices every 1-2 years and it’s nice that they will work for another 4-6 years for whoever gets it after me. I’m more likely to buy an iPad or MacBook knowing that when I upgrade to a new model, the old one will still be perfectly fine to pass to someone else. I give my old Apple devices to family and friends, and Android devices are generally useless after 2-3 years if not sooner.

I agree. And your “reply” to my post is a great example of how context is lost in these forums when the comments aren’t threaded.
 
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Xiroteus

macrumors 65816
Mar 31, 2012
1,296
75
The Note line would be almost perfect if they would stop the screen flaw of putting a hole in it. At this point I have to avoid at least three generations of flagship phones because of notches and holes put in the screen. (I will know it's there, I hate it and it's the biggest design flaw of current cellphones and in the future will be seen as a "what where they thinking")

And ear beans (first thing I thought of as am sure many others have)
 
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Relentless Power

macrumors Nehalem
Jul 12, 2016
34,654
36,095
So I am an Apple Avid fan, but it’s so easy to knock Samsung products on a site like this.It’s just easy for others to knock their designs, Keynote presentation, hardware standards, etc. But I think Samsung has Some of the leading edge design and technology in the ‘tech sector‘ right now. Sure, not everything that they make is affordable for the average consumer, but no one here can slam their products given they have some fairly cool innovation with a smart watch, the new buds, fold, ect.
 
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Professor Rucy

macrumors regular
Jan 29, 2020
154
271
Tyler, Texas, USA
So I am in Apple Avid fan, but it’s so easy to knock Samsung products on a site like this.It’s just easy for others to knock their designs, Keynote presentation, hardware standards, etc. But I think Samsung has Some of the leading edge design and technology in the ‘tech sector‘ right now. Sure, not everything that they make is affordable for the average consumer, but no one here can slam their products given they have some fairly cool innovation with a smart watch, the new buds, fold, ect.

I agree, but give it more time.
 
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Daum

macrumors regular
Apr 18, 2015
110
89
That Note 20 Ultra is beautiful! I want to upgrade from my Note 10+ just for the design refinements.

And the Buds Live look almost as ridiculous as Airpods stems.

Fold 2 is a nice improvement, but I'll wait till they can incorporate the S Pen.
 
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MayaTlab

macrumors regular
Dec 12, 2007
199
176
Fold 2 is a nice improvement, but I'll wait till they can incorporate the S Pen.

You'll be waiting for a very, very long time :
flexible displays, even partially made of a very thin sheet of glass as Samsung likes to pretend, may not overcome deformation problems for years.
 
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The Game 161

macrumors Core
Dec 15, 2010
23,769
12,953
UK
Oh so 120hz on flagship phones in 2020 isn't very new?!

And oh no! My phone has been terrible because of its 60hz screen! Oh the outrage!

Who said it’s terrible? 60hz will still get the job done but just at a clearly slower rate. Still no excuse that a potential £1200 iPhone 12 pro max will still be running 60hz into 2021. There’s also rumours we may still see only 2x optical zoom as well which would certainly be a year or two behind. I hope at least we see 3x optical on the pros this year
 
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votdfak

macrumors 6502
Mar 15, 2011
393
243
You'll be waiting for a very, very long time :
flexible displays, even partially made of a very thin sheet of glass as Samsung likes to pretend, may not overcome deformation problems for years.


Jerry is just brute hillbilly.

Fold 2 is so tempting, not 2k tempting but still.
 
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Kabeyun

macrumors 68030
Mar 27, 2004
2,820
5,289
Eastern USA
There's just no coherent vision when it comes to the future as far as I can see.
Because they never had one. They imitate and modify. SD trays and a bezel obsession don’t count as a vision. Apple created a planet where everyone has an iPhone in their pocket, or something that looks like one from 10 feet away.
 
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agffth

macrumors member
Jan 25, 2014
93
207
Honestly, I think this copper is a lot nicer and will weather time much better than Apple's Gold or Rose Gold ever did.
I'm not a fan of the gold or rose gold either. But that bronze is just awful. Who colors anything bronze other than a 3rd place medal? I will say I like that green shown in the pictures.
 
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jwar1976

macrumors regular
Jan 29, 2019
153
60
Norwich
The new Galaxy Watch had so much potential with the improved health functions, however Samsung have missed the boat with their trip detection. Unlike Apple’s Fall Detection, Samsung only acknowledges a fall if you were in motion before hand. Having been a Note user for a number of years the latest reveal has confirmed me to jump ship back to Apple.
 
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pratikindia

macrumors 6502
Apr 7, 2014
418
412
The iPhone 11 Pro Max was better a year ago than the Note 20 Plus is now.
The Apple Watch Series 5 a year ago is better than that new Galaxy Watch 3 now.
The iPad Pro is light years ahead of the S7+.
The Galaxy Buds Live seem like they might give Apple a run for its money on headphones but the design is polarizing.

The event releases are standard and not threatening with the notable exception of the Fold 2, which is (to obvious indicators and not counting patents which may never come to market) years ahead of Apple’s efforts. Deeply flawed though Gen 1 was, if Samsung is able to perfect the reliability to the degree they have perfected the design, Apple will be behind the curve on the market for foldable on a significant basis. At least it adds some ooh and aah to the event, I hope Apple isn’t as boring this year as the awkward “end iPhone event almost thirty minutes early with no one more thing” event they did last September...
I have met many people who own these Note phones and they refuse to move to iPhone. It's like Note addiction.
 
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thealkimist

macrumors regular
Oct 30, 2011
151
211
Who said it’s terrible? 60hz will still get the job done but just at a clearly slower rate. Still no excuse that a potential £1200 iPhone 12 pro max will still be running 60hz into 2021. There’s also rumours we may still see only 2x optical zoom as well which would certainly be a year or two behind. I hope at least we see 3x optical on the pros this year

So what would be the vital use case for having a 120hz refresh rate for a phone?

Because I can tell you why they put it in the iPad 3 years ago.
 
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jwar1976

macrumors regular
Jan 29, 2019
153
60
Norwich
I have met many people who own these Note phones and they refuse to move to iPhone. It's like Note addiction.

I used to be one of these people that had the Note addiction and can tell you the addiction is very real, even when Samsung released the Note 7 with the dodgy battery, and while I wasn’t impressed having to use a S7 Edge for 2 years due to the recall, I still stuck by Samsung and the Note series, as when it came to upgrade day on my contract, I went right out and got a Note 9, then a few months later the Galaxy Watch.

As from yesterday, I am officially able to upgrade my phone again but this year for the first time in years, well since the Note 2 back in 2012, I will not be rushing out for the Samsung S20 or the upcoming Note 20 / Fold 2, but instead will be holding out for the official reveal of the iphone 12 & Apple Watch 6.
 
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SteveJUAE

macrumors 68040
Aug 14, 2015
3,527
3,612
Land of Smiles
In what way? Apple chips have always performed better. Privacy and security are obvious, compared to Android. Apple’s ecosystem is consistent across all of their platforms and they have a very profitable 3rd party accessory market. App quality isn’t even close, plus Android tablet apps barely exist. In regards to build quality, Apple wouldn’t release a product as flawed as the Fold. No company is perfect, but the quality generally is better. Lastly, 5 years of software updates, phone support, and in their in store experience is the best in the industry. Samsung can get you by and isn’t complete junk or anything, but there’s a still a clear difference between them and Apple.
Let me steer you in the right direction so you can study a bit more :)

Yes the Apple chips are very powerful on paper but are spinning their nuts off in neutral due to OS limitations your barely getting mutli tasking let alone other functionality that should come with such raw processing power that is simply bragging rights most of the time and only emerges to show some strengths in benchmarks mostly and other than a few games or apps, IRL for most its irrelevant.

I agree Apple has strong polices on privacy but there is nothing to disprove Samsung is not equally safe, I think you are getting mixed up with Google activities that are the sporing ground of comments for the tin hat brigade, that both IOS and Android are vulnerable too, maybe at differing rates of leaks. As we can see even on MR Apple is only safe with their native apps and items on their servers anything else carries a risk even from the App store. Interestingly Samsung Knox and the secure area provided on Samsung phones is a great safer area for extra sensitive data and dual apps etc.

Apple Eco is not consistent as you may think and the obvious one is you must have an IPhone to have an AW not a LTE Ipad and an LTE watch combo will not work as you cannot update your AW but I am sure their are many other trivial inconsistencies that are inconsequential. The key points of Apple ECO advantage are long gone and we are down to simply niceties and preferences now and Samsung with MS are expanding in areas Apple are lagging in.

Apple released many flawed products that have taken class actions to resolve and years of heartache for many owners. The major vulnerability of the 1st Fold was fixed before any of the public got to buy them. No good reviewers note any differences in build quality of Samsung Flagships vs Apple those days are long gone along with available screen area comments. Although I am sure some will have fun with the plastic rear of the smaller Note20, but that's not quality construction its just less premium material.

Yes Apple do support their OS updates for 5 years but we have seen how they treated some customers and again taken legal action to resolve this. I agree its a good point but it's not like your Samsung phone stops working on the 25th month LOL and most receive security updates for another year or 2 in some cases.

As for support many seem not to realize that millions of Apple owners who pay the same prices or more than US/UK/AUS/ETC and do not get the same level of support or warranty. Many countries all you get is a lemon policy 1 year mail in and 90 days phone support. Forget about we like all our customers to be satisfied line and you can return it in 14 days or pop down the road and exchange it, nope nothing for those good Apple customers worldwide.

Yes there are differences but it's largely personal preferences centered around OS or for many entrapment due to staged ECO devices/purchases. Either OEM's flagship devices are good phones just embrace the differences as it's always good to have choices :)
 
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The Game 161

macrumors Core
Dec 15, 2010
23,769
12,953
UK
So what would be the vital use case for having a 120hz refresh rate for a phone?

Because I can tell you why they put it in the iPad 3 years ago.

For a smooth scrolling experience in day to day use and for those who do like to game. It’s got to a point where android phones now are smoother than iPhones and refresh rate is why. It’s a fair smoother experience using a phone with 120hz. At the end of the day when you are spending over 1k for a phone this should be the expection going forward.

120hz is likely a big reason why my iPad is my favourite and most used product.

The people who don’t care about refresh rate aren’ the ones who will be buying iPhones over 1k anyway so those people will enjoy the 5.4 inch iphone and the max version.
 
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