Samsung's Galaxy S23 Ultra With 200MP Camera Rumored to Launch Months After iPhone 14 Pro With 48MP Camera

[Hodar1]

200 MP of crap, is not comparable to 12 MP of accurate data.

Photons do not mysteriously have greater activation energies, just because they land on the CCD on a Samsung lens, rather than an Apple Lens. You now have far greater "noise".

 

[MayaUser]

cant wait for S25 Ultra With 500MP

 

[Freeangel1]

WOW. looks like I may be upgrading to Samsung S23 from an S20 Ultra.

I was gonna get an iPhone 14 Max .

I'll have to see the reviews for the final choice.

 

[toph2toast]

Are cameras the biggest selling point for high end phones? I feel like its the majority of what’s talked about for these devices.

Not sure if that's what consumers look at the most, but since it's something that's quantifiable, i'm sure it's easier to market than other specs.

 

[fluentinsix]

More MP isn't always an advantage, but in bright conditions you'd end up with a phone capable of either shooting incredibly high resolution images, or saving lower resolution images with a very high crop (and therefore zoom) level.

TBH the main tradeoff you're probably making is how fast you can shoot rather than overall noise (assuming you're happy to bin down for low light situations).

 

[TVreporter]

200MP... to produce photos which will be overly compressed when posted to sites like Instagram, Twitter and Facebook.

 

[TheBigDog]

Apple really need to up their game

 

[EugW]

Not sure if that's what consumers look at the most, but since it's something that's quantifiable, i'm sure it's easier to market than other specs.

Thanks for bringing this back on topic. To relate it to my previous posts... Ultimately, camera phone images, even top notch ones, aren't super great quality compared to dedicated cameras, but they are constantly improving.

At this point I don't want a higher resolution or brighter or bigger screen. I don't want faster cell data. I don't want more storage. I don't want a faster SoC. I'm not even that concerned about battery life anymore (although I know some might be).

That leaves the camera. The camera still has room for improvement... which is one reason I don't complain too much about the camera bump.

 

[Halfsnap]

On a 1TB microSD card which costs a fraction of what Apple would charge for storage?

Touche'!

 

[Jimmy_Banks]

delete

 

[EugW]

And now you are moving goal posts and changing your argument. At least you aren't bringing up the fact that Samsung sells lots of camera sensors in their phones anymore. You evidently don't know what you are talking about so yes, we can leave it there, and you can go educate yourself.

Nope, wrong again. I was talking about pixel binning right from the start. That was in my very first response to you, and in fact it was the main point of the post, but you chose to ignore it. Here's the quote of that part of my post (which comprised the bulk of the post actually):

Obviously, they're not going to be building a phone with a 35 mm sensor, so that's not really a meaningful discussion. The solution has to come from somewhere else. One possibility is that instead of using a camera with a 12 MP sensor, they would use a 48 MP sensor with a similar size, and incorporate pixel binning.

The incorporation of a 48 MP sensor in an iPhone, up from 12 MP, isn't about a megapixel race. It's about trying to improve image quality when there are sensor size restrictions.

The sad part about your subsequent response is you even quoted the above, but chose to completely ignore it.

 

[headlessmike]

More MP isn't always an advantage, but in bright conditions you'd end up with a phone capable of either shooting incredibly high resolution images, or saving lower resolution images with a very high crop (and therefore zoom) level.

TBH the main tradeoff you're probably making is how fast you can shoot rather than overall noise (assuming you're happy to bin down for low light situations).

The main limiting factor for such a small sensor will no doubt be the diffraction limit. In that case you won't gain anything by cropping beyond a certain point regardless of the number of pixels.

 

[Jimmy_Banks]

That was in my very first response to you, and in fact it was the main point of the post, but you chose to ignore it. Here's the quote of that part of my post:

I deleted my post as I incorrectly thought you brought it up in your second reply, my mistake.

Regardless, your claim was that Samsung sells lots of phone camera sensors, making them know more about photography than Sony, Nikon, and Canon, and that's all I needed to know about your opinion from the start.

 

[fluentinsix]

I'm sure you're correct, but if they're making a 200mp lens then I'd imagine they haven't hit a physical limit (otherwise why bother?)

 

[RalfTheDog]

A 48 MP sensor binned down to a 12 MP sensor will never produce as good an image as a native 12 MP sensor. There is always unused space between the pixels that don't absorb light.

 

[RalfTheDog]

I'm sure you're correct, but if they're making a 200mp lens then I'd imagine they haven't hit a physical limit (otherwise why bother?)

Marketing. "We have bigger numbers, so we win!"

 

[Mousse]

Not sure if that's what consumers look at the most, but since it's something that's quantifiable, i'm sure it's easier to market than other specs.

Aye. Marketing mumbo-jumbo. It's the old If you can't count what is important, make what you can count important non-sense. Y'all want better pictures, get a bigger sensor and better glass. Gather moar light...moar, Moar, MOAR.

 

[RalfTheDog]

Aye. Marketing mumbo-jumbo. It's the old If you can't count what is important, make what you can count important non-sense. Y'all want better pictures, get a bigger sensor and better glass. Gather moar light...moar, Moar, MOAR.

Actually, bigger sensors and better glass are the things that are most likely to result in better pictures. Just ask any serious astronomical telescope.

 

[fluentinsix]

If it was literally just that they'd do a 13mp sensor.

 

[toph2toast]

Thanks for bringing this back on topic. To relate it to my previous posts... Ultimately, camera phone images, even top notch ones, aren't super great quality compared to dedicated cameras, but they are constantly improving.

At this point I don't want a higher resolution or brighter or bigger screen. I don't want faster cell data. I don't want more storage. I don't want a faster SoC. I'm not even that concerned about battery life anymore (although I know some might be).

That leaves the camera. The camera still has room for improvement... which is one reason I don't complain too much about the camera bump.

Completely agree, I just wish there was a better way to quantify camera capabilities beyond MP's, because it doesn't tell the whole story.

I actually switched to a galaxy phone a couple years back because of the camera because the low light images where leaps and bounds above the iPhone at that point. Ironically, the camera app kept crashing, which defeated the purpose of buying the phone, so I switched back. iPhones are closing the gap though, and I'd rather have an iphone with a camera that is pretty darn good and works 100% of the time, than a galaxy phone with an amazing camera that works some of the time.

That being said, I'm struggling to understand the point of a 200mp camera if that image will never leave your phone.

 

[Taipan]

Oh no, my next iPhone might not have the maximum number of MP on the market. I consider even 48 MP unnecessary and expect iPhone 14 to prove that.

 

[EugW]

A 48 MP sensor binned down to a 12 MP sensor will never produce as good an image as a native 12 MP sensor. There is always unused space between the pixels that don't absorb light.

This is not always true, but regardless, the other point to remember is when they upgrade the camera sensor to a super high resolution to take advantage of pixel binning, they often upgrade the sensor size too. I don't know about the Samsung, but the 48 MP sensor rumoured for the iPhone 14 Pro is supposed to be significantly larger than the 12 MP sensor in the iPhone 13 Pro.

BTW, it again is supposed to be a Sony part.

 

[cocky jeremy]

Very misleading.
Megapixels do matter, but hey if you're only looking at pictures on a screen it doesn't matter. Guess we should go back to the early 2000s with 2MP cameras and live with 5x7 printouts huh?

They don't not matter at all, but for a phone, no, they don't matter. Let the iPhone keep 12 MP forever, I don't care. It doesn't affect anything I use it for... or anyone else.

 

[toph2toast]

Actually, bigger sensors and better glass are the things that are most likely to result in better pictures. Just ask any serious astronomical telescope.

I think that was the point Mousse was making. However companies try to slam these tiny cameras onto the phones and market them in a way that people think it actually makes a difference.

 

[RalfTheDog]

This is not always true, but regardless, the other point to remember is when they upgrade the camera sensor to a super high resolution to take advantage of pixel binning, they often upgrade the sensor size too. I don't know about the Samsung, but the 48 MP sensor rumoured for the iPhone 14 Pro is supposed to be significantly larger than the 12 MP sensor in the iPhone 13 Pro.

That would be nice, if they could pull it off. The light pipe for a large sensor on such a small device gets complicated quickly. Even with a periscope lens, you will be making some serious design compromises.