Samsung's VP for Design Offended by Apple's Allegations of Copying

[danielchow]

riiiiiight

 

[tjmPollex]

This is just ridiculous. I guess samsung is supposed to make a triangular phone so that people don't go around saying they copied the iPhone. Dont get me wrong I like the iPhone that is why I own one, but I find this ridiculous. I know everybody is going to down vote this since nobody can't criticize apple here without getting down voted to hell but it is the truth.

 

[3dflyboy1]

You people will believe anything that Apple pulls out of it's posterior. Nobody copied the iPhone.

 

[brdeveloper]

Samsung's VP is full of crap. The Koreans have been copying everything for decades. From sneakers to helicopters. They copied the hardware and Google copied the OS. What retards.

So koreans of Samsung are retarded because they copy everything, on the contrary of Google, that supposedly copied iOS; Microsoft, that supposedly copied Macintosh OS; and Apple, that supposedly copied Xerox GUI design. Ooops... except Samsung, the others are american companies.

 

[sha4000]

Difference is Braun isn't competing against Apple in the same market and isn't one of Apple's suppliers.

It still looks like a copy. Im wondering if they have some type of agreement.

 

[old-school]

I held a samsung galaxy II for the first time last week, and could not believe how similar it is to the iPhone.

 

[rjohnstone]

I held a samsung galaxy II for the first time last week, and could not believe how similar it is to the iPhone.

Are you effin serious?
Short of the general shape, they look nothing alike.
The SGS2 has a bigger screen, thinner profile and doesn't have a giant metal band around it.

http://phone-size.com/?s=84,1,83

 

[kdarling]

You could argue because Rams design were decades old they would not be relevant in modern times. Ive sees it all very differently...

The whole point of Rams' designs was that they were meant to be timeless.

Of course, a downside of using such minimalist shapes is that it becomes much harder to defend them because they're mostly made up of functional choices. The law in the US, for instance, only protects non-functional design elements.

Do you think that when Apple design iPod they researched all the design and like Rams work so they copied it?

Is that a trick question? We already KNOW from Ives that he is a big fan of Dieter Rams and used his works for inspiration (not just his design philosophy).

Rams even commented that the famous French designer Philippe Starck once came up to him at a party and indignantly declared "Apple is copying you!"

The difference between Apple-Samsung and Rams-Ives is that Rams felt complimented rather than betrayed. But then, Jobs seems to have felt betrayed by almost everyone at some time or another.

Or they're talk about the the size, the weight, the function, how would you navigate the music and when they get all that, and the designer that respect the same design principle as Ram, they then proceed to design the iPod? Which one is you think closer to what actually happened?

I agree that if two designers come up with similar efforts to solve similar problems, then it does not automatically mean they must have copied each other.

However, I've already said in a previous post that I think Samsung deliberately came as close to having the same look as the iPhone as legally possible... something which is much harder to do than outright copying.

For example, some of the icons evoke thoughts of the iPhone, but do not IMO violate Apple's trademarks on their version.

So you can copy someone as long as its not in direct competition? Copying is copying as far as I am concerned and everyone in the industry does it. Including Apple.

My point is that it's not an exact copy (or even really that close) when you look at both prior art and the trademarks involved.

It's up to the courts to determine if Apple's design patents with a black front glass will be upheld. If they are, then Samsung is probably infringing. If they are invalidated, then Samsung is clear.

Normal people as in people who would not put up with those so called "web browsers" on those so called smartphones before the iPhone came along.

You're definitely right that the stock browsers were terrible. (Well, except for IE4 on WinCE enterprise devices around 2001. That was really nice.) Opera and Netfront, and the Picsel browsers were pretty good third party solutions, though.

 

[vito]

There was something...
Gizmodo: 1960s Braun Products Hold the Secrets to Apple’s Future

Please read the rest of the thread this has already been discussed at length.

Ive admired Rams as a fellow designer and someone he obviously looked up to, very different from blatant outright copying which is what Samsung is doing.

Braun did not and does not produce mobile devices, tablets, etc etc

 

[Rodimus Prime]

Are you effin serious?
Short of the general shape, they look nothing alike.
The SGS2 has a bigger screen, thinner profile and doesn't have a giant metal band around it.

http://phone-size.com/?s=84,1,83

well come on the GS2 is a black slab touch screen phone. Anyone who makes a slab touch screen only phone is copying the iPhone. Now go excuse me while I go throw up for having to channel an Apple fanboy line of thought.

 

[SockRolid]

The black glass is actually the only thing that the US District Court has commented might make Samsung infringe. [yadda yadda yadda]

One out of three ain't bad. Fix it, Sammy.

Odd that the other Android handset makers (you know, the me-too no-hopers that Samsung is crushing) aren't suing Samsung as well. They have a lot more to lose. Unless, of course, Windows Phone starts to actually sell well. And Microsoft doesn't start to favor Nokia excessively. And the no-hopers' Windows Phone handsets start to sell well too. That's a lot of if-s.

What isn't odd is that the Samsung phones are, in fact, crushing all other Android handset makers. Could it be, I dunno, because Samsung's phones look the most like iPhones? Or is it just a random coincidence?

 

[Rogifan]

Samsung had been making one button designs on their mp3 players before the iPhone came out.

Iphone 4 vs. LG Prada

Image

Layout is similar and the icons are near identical. Prada first shown Sept 2006, iPhone Jan 2007.

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Apple design cues from Braun

Image

I don't doubt that Jony Ive is a student of Ram's 10 principles of design. But I'm curious which Apple product would be mistaken for a Braun product? As far as the Prada comparisons all those photos show me is Apple knows how to make drool worthy high end phone and LG does not. I don't care that they called it Prada.

 

[SandynJosh]

If it looks like a pig and acts like a pig, it must be a pig.

"I've made thousands of sketches and hundreds of prototype products (for the Galaxy). Does that mean I was putting on a mock show for so long, pretending to be designing?"

Methinks he doth protest too much....

 

[cmwade77]

Hmm...well, I could almost believe him, except for the following facts:

• All packaging looks similar in design.
• The unboxing process is very similar to the iPhone
• The cable connection is similar to the iPhone, even though the industry standard is moving to Micro USB connections.
• The AC adapter looks similar.

To me the entire setup looks like a rip off of the iPhone, so I don't see how he can claim it was not inspired by the iPhone.

That being said, I don't think companies should be allowed to patent the look of packaging or the fact that the device is square, after all how many form factors can you have for a phone.

 

[Rogifan]

I've noticed that in this thread, posts bashing Samsung are massively upvoted, while posts saying otherwise are downvoted. Stay classy.

You do realize this is a pro Apple site. Do they even allow pro Apple comments on fandroid sites?

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Please read the rest of the thread this has already been discussed at length.

Ive admired Rams as a fellow designer and someone he obviously looked up to, very different from blatant outright copying which is what Samsung is doing.

Braun did not and does not produce mobile devices, tablets, etc etc

Samsung and all the MacBook Pro/Air wannabees.

 

[Consultant]

Copycat denies being copycat.

Big surprise there.

At least Steve Jobs never denied getting inspiration from an unsuccessful product at Xerox.

Apple paid for an unfinished product, finished it, and improved it:
http://obamapacman.com/2010/03/myth-copyright-theft-apple-stole-gui-from-xerox-parc-alto/

 

[lilcosco08]

You do realize this is a pro Apple site. Do they even allow pro Apple comments on fandroid sites?

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Samsung and all the MacBook Pro/Air wannabees.

Just because this is a pro apple site, doesn't mean discussions should be automatically ruled out.

 

[askiboot]

Image

Woah guys, they moved the camera. They clearly didn't copy... I'm sure there are thousands of sketches that prove how they centered the camera.

 

[tosehee]

Just wondering..

how many variations of phone style can you have?

Circular? Where should you put the buttons at? At the center or top?

As much as I think that Samsung copied the design concept from Apple, I also don't see how many design concepts you can get from there..

Any rational designers will come up with the similar design concept for phone depends on their types.. (touch screen).

If you plan to patent every shape and design as your own, maybe these company better come up with circularly phone, triangular phone, and etc, etc, just to protect themselves from copy infringement lawsuits in the future..

This phone design copying seems BS in my opinion..

 

[Astroturf777]

Sorry if you ever bought a Samsung product but...

We'll make an iconic product one day...

I bet their marketing guys dropped jaws when they read this.

 

[Gasu E.]

Given that he is a Korean speaker, he was probably misquoted. What he probably really said was "Ive created a completely original design."

 

[Vanton]

I held a samsung galaxy II for the first time last week, and could not believe how similar it is to the iPhone.

That's not what journalists and academians around the world seem to think as in the Mobile World Congress who voted the S2 Best Smartphone and Samsung the Best Manufacturer. The only ones calling Samsung copycat are fanboys.

What isn't odd is that the Samsung phones are, in fact, crushing all other Android handset makers. Could it be, I dunno, because Samsung's phones look the most like iPhones?

LOL Thanks for the good laugh, that's the funniest thing I've heard all week.

 

[kalsta]

One can't simultaneously espouse that smartphone designs are limited (thus resulting in very similar phones all around) and that one individual design is something very original (when it isn't).

Good point!

To be fair, I can imagine designers having a hard time trying to make their phones look different after Apple came out with such a simple and yet functional design with the original iPhone. Didn't Steve Jobs say it himself at the very first unveiling in 2007, as he congratulated his team—that one day all phones will be like this, and they will be able to look back and see how big an impact they had? Anyone else remember that quote?

I mean, this is the nature of progress and design… Every designer throughout history has copied elements of someone else's work. Steve Jobs himself famously said:

'Picasso had a saying—"good artists copy, great artists steal"—and we have always been shameless about stealing great ideas.'​

However, it's also human nature to get upset when you see other people stealing your ideas! And we saw Steve Jobs demonstrating that to good effect too.

So all designers copy, or 'steal' if you like. The difference between a good designer and a mediocre one, is that the good designer takes what's been done before, and then builds on it, improves it. People can rightly point out that Apple copied ideas from Xerox with the original Mac GUI, but what they don't always understand is how much further Apple took those ideas. This truly was great design, and what's great to see is Apple continuing that tradition of great design even today. They've also had some missteps along the way of course—that's just part of being human.

 

[sodimm11]

Wirelessly posted

watch steve jobs iphone announcement from 2007 one more time where he shows the 3 predominant smartphones before introducing the completely different iphone. it was a paradigm shift. even some humor then as first he showed the iphone as an ipod with a dial no way anyone could compare what was on the market then with the new iphone. also watch steve ballmer's reaction: $500 for a PHONE??!! he mocked. if they quit making iphones I would have to settle for an imitation. I'm glad I haven't had to.

 

[Cactii]

I mean what's he gonna say with all the lawsuits going back and forth. "YES I copied it." However, by saying he is not as good as Jonathan Ive he pretty much blew his cover.