Serious Question...Has Apple already won the tablet war?

[Kyotoma]

Referring to the Tablet War - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388776,00.asp

Referring to Apple's command of the supply chain - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388591,00.asp

 

[kdoug]

Referring to the Tablet War - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388776,00.asp

Referring to Apple's command of the supply chain - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388591,00.asp

My favorite part from the top link,

"However, in my opinion, even bigger and better things are on the horizon for Apple. I think it's on its way to pulling off the biggest rout in tech history"

 

[spiderman0616]

Referring to the Tablet War - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388776,00.asp

Referring to Apple's command of the supply chain - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2388591,00.asp

both very awesome links. go apple.

 

[MrWillie]

The other joker is Windows 8. As far as I'm concerned, it's nothing more than vaporware. I'm not going to place bets on vaporware, simple as that. But, Windows 8 is still an unknown factor.

Do you not think that Apple has an answer for that in the works ? (roumored Sep release iPad?) Yes, I think that mobile OS tablet days are numbered. Then we will have the Apple vs Microsoft OS wars again, with a thousand companies making Win tablets vs Apple.

They are winning so far, but as long as others are trying, the war isn't won or over yet. I've read things about a couple "supposed" quad core tablets coming out before next summer that should be good competition.

Until the others give in and stop trying, it's not over.

By before next summer, do you mean after the next generation iPads hit the market ?

 

[Yamcha]

Apple is the market leader with tablets so I don't think they have anything to worry..

In all honestly I haven't seen any real competition against the iPad.. I think apart from iOS what interests me personally is the Blackberry Playbook & HP Touchpad, the WebOS experience is very good especially with Multi-Tasking.. But then again the lack of Applications/Games is the issue..

Still I think Apple needs a better implementation of multi-tasking and then It'd probably in my opinion be the best tablet..

 

[radiogoober]

Still I think Apple needs a better implementation of multi-tasking and then It'd probably in my opinion be the best tablet..

And what part of Apple's current multitasking implementation do you not like? The process of switching between apps, or the way it handles backgrounded apps? And how would you improve it?

 

[tstarks33]

And what part of Apple's current multitasking implementation do you not like? The process of switching between apps, or the way it handles backgrounded apps? And how would you improve it?

WebOS, for example, does it far better.

 

[tmarks11]

Muktitasking where I could put two screens side by side would be sweet. Of course, nobody has implemented that level of multitasking. That is where the concept becomes useful.

I do like webos version of task switcher; iOS is cumbersome... If I want to kill apps (which I frequently do, since iOS doesn't seem to do a good job of memory management, especially wrt safari) it requires double tap home, hold the icon down until they start to wiggle, kill each app inidividually...and if my 5yo has been a my ipad, that is a lot of apps to kill. Webos flick the card to kill it is much quicker and more elegant.

 

[kdoug]

Muktitasking where I could put two screens side by side would be sweet. Of course, nobody has implemented that level of multitasking. That is where the concept becomes useful.

I do like webos version of task switcher; iOS is cumbersome... If I want to kill apps (which I frequently do, since iOS doesn't seem to do a good job of memory management, especially wrt safari) it requires double tap home, hold the icon down until they start to wiggle, kill each app inidividually...and if my 5yo has been a my ipad, that is a lot of apps to kill. Webos flick the card to kill it is much quicker and more elegant.

Thanks! I had no idea how to kill the running apps on my iPhone. That's probably why I was charging my battery every day.

 

[trsblader]

By before next summer, do you mean after the next generation iPads hit the market ?

The last article I read did not specify a date, just said by summer 2012. I haven't dug around looking for dates on a project that far off, since it is very likely to change and/or be complete rumor at this point.

By those criteria, winning a war in a marketplace strikes me as impossible, so the question and discussion about whether or not Apple has achieved impossible (or at least unrealistic) goals is silly.

That is exactly why I said it's not over in my initial post. Not sure what you're getting at here.

 

[Carouser]

That is exactly why I said it's not over in my initial post. Not sure what you're getting at here.

Your criteria for 'the tablet war being over' are 'both sides agree on a truce' or 'one side gives up and surrenders'. Since these criteria are virtually impossible to satisfy in a free market then the OP's question is nonsensical, because it basically asks "has a situation which is impossible by definition come about yet?"

 

[aneftp]

Er no.

see http://www.bgr.com/2011/07/21/andro...arket-windows-tablets-outsold-playbook-in-q2/

Apples tablet share down from 94% to 61.3% and Android up from 2.9% to 30% in the second quarter 2011. Now I always assume that research numbers like these are suspect but even if they are out by 50% then what you've got is the smartphone market experience now making its way into the tablet market. Android will continue to gain market (for lots of reasons) and the ipad will reduce in market share.

So no Apple hasn't won (hate calling it a "war"!) but was first there with a very good product and now the others are catching up. Where we will end up I don't know.

Here's the real article. Read it closely. It said tablets "shipped" by Android. Not "sold"
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-31747_...shipments-fell-in-second-quarter-says-report/

We all know Apple can barely keep up with iPad demand. Only within last weeks can you walk into store and buy one easily.

Lots of Android tablets have "shipped". Thousands just sitting there. Motorola "shipped" 500k the first quarter. Cough cough. How many zooms did they sell...less than 100k.

 

[trsblader]

because it basically asks "has a situation which is impossible by definition come about yet?"

It is possible, yet extremely unlikely, therefore, no it hasn't happened yet.

Seriously, who cares? Point is, in x amount of years (you choose), you will see there are still multiple tablets competing and getting market share. The war is not over, just like I originally said. Put whatever twist on it you want, there will still be multiple tablet makers.

 

[4DThinker]

War isn't the best analogy. The tablet market can easily support several winners, much like the automobile market does. Any company that makes a tablet that sells for profit and meets their own goals has won for that sales period at least. Consumers win when there are choices. The Car analogy works as they come in at different price points, with different capabilities, and in several styles hoping at least one of those properties will appeal to a car buyer. Tablets will end up the same way, as the big PC companies are in the game for the long haul like apple is. We already have Asus and Acer and Toshiba and so on making a living on netbooks and laptops and desktops, and willing to make a little money off tablets as well. Apple has an impressive lead, and growing sales. Yet their total sold is a smaller percentage of the tablet market each year. That's because not every consumer can afford a Jaguar. Some just want a Toyota or a dodge minivan.

 

[radiogoober]

Thanks! I had no idea how to kill the running apps on my iPhone. That's probably why I was charging my battery every day.

You probably have to charge your battery daily because you use the phone or apps a lot. It has absolutely nothing to do with how many apps are "running" on the phone.

Apple's multitasking is sophisticated. When most apps are "backgrounded" (ie, you open another app and the current app goes away), the app is essentially put into "suspended animation." It doesn't sit there and run and wait for input. There's no reason for it to, because the screen is currently dedicated to another app! The app does take up RAM, but it doesn't use any extra battery power.

Some apps, the ones that are specifically programmed to act that way, do run in the background. Ie, Pandora can keep streaming music while it's backgrounded. These apps will use battery life as long as they are running. For these apps, obviously you'd want to pause them or make sure they aren't doing anything when you background them.

As far as tstarks' comment about having to close out apps to free up memory, that's not really necessary. iOS automatically closes out apps as needed to free up memory. If you load an app that needs a crapload of memory, iOS will close apps that are using memory in order to allocate it to the primary application. There may be a slight sluggish feeling at first when the app loads and iOS automatically closes out other apps, or perhaps if the app is trying to allocate a large chunk of memory and iOS needs to close out apps to free up memory.

(tstarks - your anecdote about your kid playing with your iPad is a mix of placebo effect and your generally crappy attitude towards everything iOS)

iOS's multitasking is truly beautiful. It doesn't let most apps just sit there running (and doing nothing!) in the background. It only lets them run in the background if they are specifically needing to do so. It also automatically manages memory (as described above.) It's really great. That's why iOS doesn't need stupid memory managers.

. Apple has an impressive lead, and growing sales. Yet their total sold is a smaller percentage of the tablet market each year.

Have you read any of the tech news released in the last week? The iPad is killing everything else.

 

[Carouser]

It is possible, yet extremely unlikely, therefore, no it hasn't happened yet.

Seriously, who cares? Point is, in x amount of years (you choose), you will see there are still multiple tablets competing and getting market share. The war is not over, just like I originally said. Put whatever twist on it you want, there will still be multiple tablet makers.

If it is extremely unlikely that Apple will ever be the sole producer of tablets (which I agree with) then your point that there will always be competitors in the market is trivially true. However, by any non-trivial definition of 'winning the tablet war', then Apple has currently won. I don't care if this is good or bad, but it's true. I also don't care that this might change in the future, because that's also trivially true and has nothing to do with Apple's current domination of the market.

 

[jsh1120]

Those were mere battles.
Wintel won the PC war when Windows 3 arrived and when 95 became ubiquitous, which coincided with Jobs not being at Apple.
The difference today, is that the average consumer Mindshare Wars have also been won already, which is more than half the battle.
Just look at the iPhone - over a year old, and despite rivals trouncing it in specs and features during that year, it's still selling like hot cakes and the clamour for the next one will send it into the stratosphere.

<sigh> Oh, yeah...If only St. Steve had been at Apple when Windows 3 arrived. Never mind...

Sorry, but the "average consumer" hasn't yet made up his/her mind. It may be that all your friends either have or are planning to purchase a tablet, but that says far more about your limited circle of friends than about consumers as a whole. The iPad has been a huge success. And about 95% of the potential market hasn't yet purchased a tablet. As Android (and Windows) tablets mature, the "war" will be more than a set of preliminary skirmishes.

The history of technology over the last half century is littered with products so dominant they could not possibly be replaced that were gone (and often forgotten) in a couple of years. And that's a good thing.

 

[jsh1120]

If it is extremely unlikely that Apple will ever be the sole producer of tablets (which I agree with) then your point that there will always be competitors in the market is trivially true. However, by any non-trivial definition of 'winning the tablet war', then Apple has currently won. I don't care if this is good or bad, but it's true. I also don't care that this might change in the future, because that's also trivially true and has nothing to do with Apple's current domination of the market.

It's June 1941. Germany has "currently won" WWII. Winners of "wars" aren't declared when they've barely begun. What is "trivially true" is that Apple has a significant head start in sales of tablet computers.

 

[deeddawg]

It's June 1941. Germany has "currently won" WWII. Winners of "wars" aren't declared when they've barely begun. What is "trivially true" is that Apple has a significant head start in sales of tablet computers.

Bingo. "Won" requires something to be over.

Once upon a time, Palm owned the PDA market. Then something better came along.

RIM owned the smartphone market at one point, it was inconceivable that they'd do anything but continue to dominate. Then something better came along.

The war is never ending, battles might be won. Every year, every new hardware generation brings a new battle. The incumbent if they get complacent risks losing out to the upstart.


and let's be serious here; say someone else takes over the tablet space (or whatever it becomes). It'd be because they offered something better.

I'm not so immature as to tie my identity to some company. I use the products that best fulfill my needs, regardless of what the brand logo might be. No company today gives a darn about anything other than your wallet. Any incentives they give towards supposedly loyalty is to retain your wallet, not because they want to invite you over for dinner.

 

[radiogoober]

Bingo. "Won" requires something to be over.

Once upon a time, Palm owned the PDA market. Then something better came along.

RIM owned the smartphone market at one point, it was inconceivable that they'd do anything but continue to dominate. Then something better came along.

The war is never ending, battles might be won. Every year, every new hardware generation brings a new battle. The incumbent if they get complacent risks losing out to the upstart.


and let's be serious here; say someone else takes over the tablet space (or whatever it becomes). It'd be because they offered something better.

I'm not so immature as to tie my identity to some company. I use the products that best fulfill my needs, regardless of what the brand logo might be. No company today gives a darn about anything other than your wallet. Any incentives they give towards supposedly loyalty is to retain your wallet, not because they want to invite you over for dinner.

True. Something may one day beat the iPad. Certainly whatever that may be is not yet on the market. Nothing currently out nor on the horizon can come close.

 

[tstarks33]

As far as tstarks' comment about having to close out apps to free up memory, that's not really necessary. iOS automatically closes out apps as needed to free up memory. If you load an app that needs a crapload of memory, iOS will close apps that are using memory in order to allocate it to the primary application. There may be a slight sluggish feeling at first when the app loads and iOS automatically closes out other apps, or perhaps if the app is trying to allocate a large chunk of memory and iOS needs to close out apps to free up memory.

(tstarks - your anecdote about your kid playing with your iPad is a mix of placebo effect and your generally crappy attitude towards everything iOS)

I was talking about closing apps to free up memory? I was talking about my kid (I have a kid?!) playing with my ipad? Are you just making all this up as you go?

Anyway, talking about winning the tablet war is stupid, because Sony's tablet is going to dominate.

 

[lsvtecjohn3]

Er no.

see http://www.bgr.com/2011/07/21/andro...arket-windows-tablets-outsold-playbook-in-q2/

Apples tablet share down from 94% to 61.3% and Android up from 2.9% to 30% in the second quarter 2011. Now I always assume that research numbers like these are suspect but even if they are out by 50% then what you've got is the smartphone market experience now making its way into the tablet market. Android will continue to gain market (for lots of reasons) and the ipad will reduce in market share.

So no Apple hasn't won (hate calling it a "war"!) but was first there with a very good product and now the others are catching up. Where we will end up I don't know.

Yeah that's article is about shipped tablets not sold tablets. The iPads market share is 90% plus of the sold tablets. I keep telling peope the iPad is going to be the king of the tablets just like the iPod is the king to the MP3 players.

The only reason Android tool off the way it did on phones is because Carriers were able to offer BOGOF deals or free on two year contracts. That won't work with tablets.

 

[thelookingglass]

The only reason Android tool off the way it did on phones is because Carriers were able to offer BOGOF deals or free on two year contracts. That won't work with tablets.

exactly. Some people don't seem to recognize that Android is popular because it's so widely available on a device that almost everyone has. The tablet market is completely different. In fact, in terms of distribution the iPad is probably in a much better position than any of the other tablets.

 

[radiogoober]

I was talking about closing apps to free up memory? I was talking about my kid (I have a kid?!) playing with my ipad? Are you just making all this up as you go?

Sorry. The guys named was "tmarks". My fault.

----

Related to topic at hand: Gruber, uber Apple apologist/blogger, has comments about devices shipped vs sold: http://daringfireball.net/2011/07/ipad_dominance

The only reason Android tool off the way it did on phones is because Carriers were able to offer BOGOF deals or free on two year contracts. That won't work with tablets.

I've always maintained that Android only has the market share that it does because of the reason you posted and that Android was essentially spammed onto so many dang phones by different manufacturers. I'm going to make up some numbers here, but I'd bet they are not too far off: at least 90% of iPhone owners know they have an iPhone. At least 90% of Android users have no idea they have an Android device. People buy the iPhone because "it's an iPhone". They buy an Android device because they need something cheap or don't care about having a nice phone (which is fine - my grandparents could never use an iPhone). Very few people buy an Android device because they think it's better than an iPhone. Thats by far the minority.

(Yes, I pulled all of that out of my ass, and I do believe its reasonably accurate)

 

[blackNBUK]

As far as tstarks' comment about having to close out apps to free up memory, that's not really necessary. iOS automatically closes out apps as needed to free up memory. If you load an app that needs a crapload of memory, iOS will close apps that are using memory in order to allocate it to the primary application. There may be a slight sluggish feeling at first when the app loads and iOS automatically closes out other apps, or perhaps if the app is trying to allocate a large chunk of memory and iOS needs to close out apps to free up memory.

I like iOS's multitasking a lot and I think that automatic multitasking (i.e. iOS or Android) is where everything will end up eventually. OSX Lion is taking a significant step in that direction already. However there is something odd with the way that Safari interacts with other Apps. I ended up jail-breaking so I could take a closer look. What appears to be happening is that when you load pages in Safari iOS will only completely kick out large Apps. Smaller Apps are told to reduce in size but aren't kicked out. Therefore if you have a number of smaller Apps in memory Safari wouldn't have as much memory available and therefore will have to reload pages instead of keeping them in memory.

I'm not sure why Apple designed things like this though I would imagine they thought it was more important that Apps were quick to swap between. I've heard that iOS 5 is much better with reloading pages so maybe they changed their minds. Quitting Apps manually is a workaround. However you don't have to quit them all. On my iPad 1 it's rare for anything beyond the first page of the "Recently Used" list to still be loaded into memory.