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Should i switch to Apple?

thesaint024 said:
Seriously, what is it about Outlook that everyone hates so much? I cannot discern a difference between the PC and Mac versions at least from a feature set and appearances. What is it that everyone needs so bad from Outlook that the Mac version fails at? After all, it is Outlook, an email and calendar client. It doesn't cure cancer. Am I so technically un-savvy that this is above my head?
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We have Office 365 subscription, so have Outlook on all machines. I love how it works on all machines, except one features one on the mac version.

On windows if you want to search your messages there is a search windows right on top of the list of messages on the left side. On that Mac the search entry is up on the right side a long ways from the list. Who thought having the search entry on the other side of the screen from the list it was searching was a good idea?

Reminds me of those games that have a switch 3 levels back, to open the door you are standing in front of.
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switchornot said:
Well then...Mac (no matter what product) died for me :(
Exchange works so beautiful on my iPhone i thought the same would be for OSX
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Works fine for me. I have Office 365 Pro so all of the email is up on exchange. I can get to it from my PCs, Android phones, Macs, iPads, etc. Changes sync down in a second to every device. Same with One Note
 
OP, I understand what you are saying about the "leaving the pro users out"


It IS annoying that they got rid of SD slots. Its kind of sad that their Macbook Air's are currently more "pro" than the macbook pro.
 
I switched from windows laptop 2 months ago. And I actually see much improved working result. I regret every seconds that I haven't did the switch few years ago.
 
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switchornot said:
I will start with a big overview...what lead me to my current situation.

I am currently a student and will enter the work-force pretty soon. I always liked the design of Apple-Products but i always found them overpriced. But this perspective changed over time. I never was a cheap-skate but i always wanted to get the best product for my money. So when i decided to buy my first notebook it was a close call between a T450s and Macbook Pro 13" (both were almost the same price (150€ difference)) when it was released.

At the time i had an iPhone 6 Plus. Before that i used a Samsung S2, Blackberry Z10. Now i i will be blunt. I got the new iPhone 7 Plus and i only got it over the Pixel XL, because of the Apple Care Plus Package.

Now i am considering to buy other Apple Products. I love their design and support. But there is a catch. There always is to me. I was a silent reader for a couple of days weeks now. And my impression is that most of you agree, that the current line-up isn't worth buying and that Apple is heavly neglecting their Pro-Users. This scared me off quite a lot.

Now the main reason i would wanna get a Mac. Design and Support. But if Apple doesn't value their Pro-Users i cant buy their products. How do you see this?

Sry for my bad english. I am no native speaker and have some troubles with the spelling at times.
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I switched to Apple from Windows in 2011 after years of frustration with Windows. The Apple ecosystem has been good to me, much less irritation with the operating system and able to get all my professional work done using MS Office. And the seamless integration of laptop, desktop and mobile devices has been marvellous.

But I paid the dollar price. I saved no money, and in fact I think I paid much more than had I stayed in Windows. It is a luxury to live in the Apple ecosystem.
 
thesaint024 said:
Technically, you were never in the Mac eco, so it just never was... :) Is to have loved and lost worse than never to have loved at all?


Seriously, what is it about Outlook that everyone hates so much? I cannot discern a difference between the PC and Mac versions at least from a feature set and appearances. What is it that everyone needs so bad from Outlook that the Mac version fails at? After all, it is Outlook, an email and calendar client. It doesn't cure cancer. Am I so technically un-savvy that this is above my head?
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All sorts of missing stuff: examples
My own experience is also that the Mac version has been prone to hanging, crashing and often requires wiping out and restarting from scratch. This is only my experience, but Outlook in particular runs much more smoothly on Windows 10.
 
Well i use Office a lot. I also use a lot of additional Software for Office!

-Efficient Elements (runs only on Windows but i barely use it so a work-around will be there)
-Thinkcell (runs only on Windows but i barely use it so a work-around will be there)
-PoweruserPowerpoint (runs only on Windows but i barely use it)

So yeah it will be a hassle for me. I thought it is the same like on Windows. But after having read that it is still different i started to dig deeper and found out, most software i use, doesnt really work under Mac. So sadly...no i can't use Mac. I will just opt for a Dell XPS or the Surface Book 2.

The thing is...i have a certain work-flow and if Outlook isn't the same as on the Win10 then it is a dealbreaker to me! The shorctus can be different, but they layout is perfect the way it is right now. I want the same layout.

I just hope MSFT will actually dish out a longer warranty with the Next Surface-Book.
 
agaskew said:
All sorts of missing stuff: examples
My own experience is also that the Mac version has been prone to hanging, crashing and often requires wiping out and restarting from scratch. This is only my experience, but Outlook in particular runs much more smoothly on Windows 10.
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I have not experienced any performance issues in Mac Outlook. After all, I use it to send and receive emails. I must not be an Outlook power user. I just send and receive emails. And it syncs between all my devices.
switchornot said:
Well i use Office a lot. I also use a lot of additional Software for Office!

-Efficient Elements (runs only on Windows but i barely use it so a work-around will be there)
-Thinkcell (runs only on Windows but i barely use it so a work-around will be there)
-PoweruserPowerpoint (runs only on Windows but i barely use it)

So yeah it will be a hassle for me. I thought it is the same like on Windows. But after having read that it is still different i started to dig deeper and found out, most software i use, doesnt really work under Mac. So sadly...no i can't use Mac. I will just opt for a Dell XPS or the Surface Book 2.

The thing is...i have a certain work-flow and if Outlook isn't the same as on the Win10 then it is a dealbreaker to me! The shorctus can be different, but they layout is perfect the way it is right now. I want the same layout.

I just hope MSFT will actually dish out a longer warranty with the Next Surface-Book.
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Much like the MBP itself, the add-ons you speak don't apply to majority of users. Office for the masses is fine for most, like the MBP. I've had to use add-ons regularly in the past, but not so much anymore. If these are a regular part of your workflow and they don't offer the same add-ons, then it makes sense to stick with Windows. I've been there and when there is a dealbreaker, there's no option but to stick with Windows.

The rest of these comments about Office being unusable on Mac are stretches. I would call Mac Office unusable 3 years ago, but the 2016 version is pretty dang close. There were common functions that were missing previously, but I struggle to find differences in functionality and even appearance now. If you are actually booting up Windows to do common Office work, you are doing something wrong. I stuck with Windows for many years for Office and another program or two, but the Mac version is finally to the point that it does not slowed me down. I still use Windows Office on occasion when I'm on Windows and only the shortcut keys are different. Otherwise, I can sometimes forget which version I'm using.

I'm not evangelizing for Mac, but I think it's misinformation to say Office is miles apart between the two platforms. It's not for most. MS has made a concerted effort to make them as consistent as possible with Office 365. But one should use whatever they feel best works for them, even if it's simply comfort with the shortcuts. But comfort is quite different from functionality.
 
If you want to run mostly software optimized for Windows, it really makes sense to buy a Windows machine.
 
switchornot said:
So sadly...no i can't use Mac. I will just opt for a Dell XPS or the Surface Book 2.
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I think given your needs, a window's machine is your best bet.

switchornot said:
I just hope MSFT will actually dish out a longer warranty with the Next Surface-Book.
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Like the MBP, it comes with a 1 year warranty and you can purchase an extended warranty, unlike Apple the extended warranty includes accidental damage.
 
maflynn said:
I think given your needs, a window's machine is your best bet.


Like the MBP, it comes with a 1 year warranty and you can purchase an extended warranty, unlike Apple the extended warranty includes accidental damage.
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The extended warrants is just for the first two years...that is quite short
 
Sanpete said:
No, a slot for a soon-to-be outdated piece of hardware is definitely what makes something pro. Pros should replace their MBPs with MBAs ASAP.
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They should remove it when it IS outdated. My Sony camera and dash camera are not outdated one bit and they both use micro SD.
 
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seeforyourself said:
They should remove it when it IS outdated. My Sony camera and dash camera are not outdated one bit and they both use micro SD.
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They should remove it when the benefits for most users are outweighed by the disadvantages, considered over the period of the use of the machine. Given the photos I've seen of the insides, I'm not sure they could fit it in anymore without some redesign or extra size, and of course it costs money to include it. Since it's something people who want it can still use with a small, cheap dongle that will easily fit in a camera bag, and a built-in one wouldn't read the new faster cards more and more pros will be using anyway, it makes sense to leave it off. That's not to say I wouldn't like to have one, but it's a reasonable choice not to include it on a pro machine.
 
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I don't use an SD-Card or USB, but here is the thing. There was absolutly no need to delete the SD-Slot. It doesnt take space! It is just one Slot of 1mm. If Apple can't figure out a way to fit in SD-Card they might not be as innovative as they want to appear.

You can argue how you want, but using dongles is a hassle. It just doesn't make sense. You are again defending a change that is questionable at bests. A SD-Slot fits into every machine. The cost for a good SD-Card-Reader is very very low. There are no arguments to leaving it out.

There is only one logic: Force customres to buy an expensive Dongle directly from Apple with huge margins. And that is not something that should be defended. I personally don't need any exterior dongels or adapter, but that is only because i do everything through the cloud and have no need for exterior equipment. But most ppl do. And Apple did screw a lot of ppl with their change.

Ok let's assume i am take pictures...and i dont like the cloud, i will need the following:

USB-Dongle (for Presentations, not everyone has a SD-Card Reader or a SD-Card)
SD-Card Dongle
HDMI or DP Dongle.

Yeah it is fine to cancel stuff....but why so much at once? A DP was reasonable and an SD-Slot. I can understand the exchange of USB for Thunderbolt. Thunderbolt is superior to USB. But when i work with externals, i can usually just use their Notebook and access the data through the Cloud. But there are many ppl wanting everything on a USB-Stick or SD-Card...so yeah...there is no argument for leaving out SD-Cards!
 
switchornot said:
I don't use an SD-Card or USB, but here is the thing. There was absolutly no need to delete the SD-Slot. It doesnt take space! It is just one Slot of 1mm. If Apple can't figure out a way to fit in SD-Card they might not be as innovative as they want to appear.

You can argue how you want, but using dongles is a hassle. It just doesn't make sense. You are again defending a change that is questionable at bests. A SD-Slot fits into every machine. The cost for a good SD-Card-Reader is very very low. There are no arguments to leaving it out.

There is only one logic: Force customres to buy an expensive Dongle directly from Apple with huge margins. And that is not something that should be defended. I personally don't need any exterior dongels or adapter, but that is only because i do everything through the cloud and have no need for exterior equipment. But most ppl do. And Apple did screw a lot of ppl with their change.

Ok let's assume i am take pictures...and i dont like the cloud, i will need the following:

USB-Dongle (for Presentations, not everyone has a SD-Card Reader or a SD-Card)
SD-Card Dongle
HDMI or DP Dongle.

Yeah it is fine to cancel stuff....but why so much at once? A DP was reasonable and an SD-Slot. I can understand the exchange of USB for Thunderbolt. Thunderbolt is superior to USB. But when i work with externals, i can usually just use their Notebook and access the data through the Cloud. But there are many ppl wanting everything on a USB-Stick or SD-Card...so yeah...there is no argument for leaving out SD-Cards!
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Obviously it does take space, and not just a mm.

Just as obviously, Apple doesn't make an expensive or any other kind of dongle to read SD cards from USB ports, let alone one people would have to buy from Apple. People can use whatever reader they like.

The hair-pulling complaints about the ports are mostly more emotional than logical. You freely make stuff up in your attack on Apple. You simply ignore most of what I said and then declare there are no reasons. But Apple needs to deal in reality, so they can't just ignore stuff or make it up.
 
switchornot said:
I don't use an SD-Card or USB, but here is the thing. There was absolutly no need to delete the SD-Slot. It doesnt take space! It is just one Slot of 1mm. If Apple can't figure out a way to fit in SD-Card they might not be as innovative as they want to appear.

You can argue how you want, but using dongles is a hassle. It just doesn't make sense. You are again defending a change that is questionable at bests. A SD-Slot fits into every machine. The cost for a good SD-Card-Reader is very very low. There are no arguments to leaving it out.

There is only one logic: Force customres to buy an expensive Dongle directly from Apple with huge margins. And that is not something that should be defended. I personally don't need any exterior dongels or adapter, but that is only because i do everything through the cloud and have no need for exterior equipment. But most ppl do. And Apple did screw a lot of ppl with their change.

Ok let's assume i am take pictures...and i dont like the cloud, i will need the following:

USB-Dongle (for Presentations, not everyone has a SD-Card Reader or a SD-Card)
SD-Card Dongle
HDMI or DP Dongle.

Yeah it is fine to cancel stuff....but why so much at once? A DP was reasonable and an SD-Slot. I can understand the exchange of USB for Thunderbolt. Thunderbolt is superior to USB. But when i work with externals, i can usually just use their Notebook and access the data through the Cloud. But there are many ppl wanting everything on a USB-Stick or SD-Card...so yeah...there is no argument for leaving out SD-Cards!
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There IS a good argument for leaving these legacy ports out. They take space, they cost money, they weigh, most importantly, they are not used by all people all the time. I sincerely LOVE the approach now - clean, flexible ports that can do anything. I really like the approach. I am actually benefitting from it everyday. The guy who uses the SD slot everyday, on the go, 5 times a day, he probably doesn't benefit from it. I will make a wild speculation that my case is more common.

Another point is that there have always been dongles in the Mac eco. I rarely saw Macs plugging into projectors without some dongle. Most offices still inexplicably uses VGA for projectors. Macs always had a DP and/or HDMI. Sure some used them on occasion. If you are using them everyday, you are better served at your desk with a dock and a SINGLE cable to connect video, power, usb, etc. My cameras have SD cards. I found myself simply plugging the cable because it was faster for me. I connected to ethernet about 5 times in 5 years. All of those ports were carried around in my MBP at ALL times. When I got up from my desk to the living room, when I had a quick meeting with my computer, etc., etc. That sounds a lot dumber to me than adding one specialized adapter on the rare occasion I need it. Just because that was the way before doesn't make it better.
 
Ok...the MacBook Pro costs like what 2600$...let's make it 2700$. And let's an SD-Reader, and one DP-Module. Now let's calculate the weight it will add...it will be less than 10g. Now the 100$ up-price is wildly over-the-top...i come from the production industry and i know the rough prices of something like that. A good reader won't cost more than 1,5$ for apple! And no it won't be more. The same thing applies to the Display-Port. At most apple would pay 2-5$ for both borts with everything included. So no...there isn't a single argument for leaving them out.

These aren't legacy-standards like the CD. There is no replacement for them currently! In three years WLAN-SD-Cards will be the standard and then and just then will the SD-Card-Slot be legacy. DP-Port's are the best because you can transfer them to dvi, vga, hdmi...and they don't take space. So yeah...it is definetly not legacy. Every professional Monitor has a DP.

So no your reasoning is from Apple's POV. And why does it benefit you leaving them out? The product didn't become cheaper by leaving them out. It became more expensive. The weight isn't really a factor with these two ports...actually when it comes to ports themselves....they weigh close to nothing. The main weight would be on the Motherboard and it would total less than 1% of the total weight.

So pls stop making up arguments that have no basis. It is nice if you find it better looking this way. But never ever should Customer-A defend a company pissing of Customer-B of said company if the change doesn't affect Customer-A but harms Customer-B.

Your argument that it is cheaper is obviously false. That it weights less...is well yeah it is...but by 10g...you won't feel the difference. So why are you defending this decision except for design reasons?
 
switchornot said:
Ok...the MacBook Pro costs like what 2600$...let's make it 2700$. And let's an SD-Reader, and one DP-Module. Now let's calculate the weight it will add...it will be less than 10g. Now the 100$ up-price is wildly over-the-top...i come from the production industry and i know the rough prices of something like that. A good reader won't cost more than 1,5$ for apple! And no it won't be more. The same thing applies to the Display-Port. At most apple would pay 2-5$ for both borts with everything included. So no...there isn't a single argument for leaving them out.

These aren't legacy-standards like the CD. There is no replacement for them currently! In three years WLAN-SD-Cards will be the standard and then and just then will the SD-Card-Slot be legacy. DP-Port's are the best because you can transfer them to dvi, vga, hdmi...and they don't take space. So yeah...it is definetly not legacy. Every professional Monitor has a DP.

So no your reasoning is from Apple's POV. And why does it benefit you leaving them out? The product didn't become cheaper by leaving them out. It became more expensive. The weight isn't really a factor with these two ports...actually when it comes to ports themselves....they weigh close to nothing. The main weight would be on the Motherboard and it would total less than 1% of the total weight.

So pls stop making up arguments that have no basis. It is nice if you find it better looking this way. But never ever should Customer-A defend a company pissing of Customer-B of said company if the change doesn't affect Customer-A but harms Customer-B.

Your argument that it is cheaper is obviously false. That it weights less...is well yeah it is...but by 10g...you won't feel the difference. So why are you defending this decision except for design reasons?
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I really don't care about Apple's POV. I'm saying there actually IS a reason or two for this that goes beyond the lazy "mighty dollar" argument. You continue to state there is "no argument for leaving out SD-Cards!" But somehow the points I made are invalid? My "arguments have no basis". As I said, the guy that plugs in his SD card 5 times a day is probably less common than a guy like me.

To summarize again: SD slot does take up space, it is not just that null space you see in the hole. It does cost and it does weigh. Not sure if you've seen the inside of these things, but every decision on space and weight is precious. I would prefer a usb-a port to a SD slot that most of us don't use. Last point, the SD slot IS obsolete for pro photogs. It's slower than what's available for file transfer. Not saying pros don't use it, but it is already beyond it's peak. Usb-a is NOT. There's a better argument to keep that in the MBP than an obsolete SD card slot.

This MBP doesn't work for you. Get something else. Doesn't work for you does not equal bad design decisions. IDGAF what you buy, but don't call out actual reasons I gave as invalid because they don't affect you. Please continue to enjoy your Windows world and thanks for considering the Mac. Buh bye.
 
You are aware, that i have nothing against Apple and their Port-Strategy, since it doesn't affect me. And guess what the automative Industry has higher standards when it comes to weight and size and so on and yet they manage to implement always more and more features while lowering the weight and size. Other competitors also manage it. So no @thesaint024 your arguments are quite simply wrong. There is enough weight reduction measurements Apple could use:

Using a different kind of aluminium alloy would reduce the weight by so much more than reducing a port. But you see that would actually cost something and it would reduce the margin of Apple or they would have to upgrade the price even further.

They could simply switch from Aluminium to Carbon-fiber-alloy which is also lighter and allows better wifi and will have the same feel but this would also mean a substaintal up-price. So i am sorry to tell you. That the argument of weight is really not the issue and space also isn't one.

As a matter of fact, there are lighter Notebooks with better Equipment at the same price. Why i still considered Apple? I like their design more and their support is the best.

The fact that you started becoming personal shows me only that you got pushed into a corner by arguments and now you resort to a personal attack by using frases like IDGAF and beeing passive aggressive in your last sentence. I will now delete my account. Never has this happened to me on another forum.
 
switchornot said:
You are aware, that i have nothing against Apple and their Port-Strategy, since it doesn't affect me. And guess what the automative Industry has higher standards when it comes to weight and size and so on and yet they manage to implement always more and more features while lowering the weight and size. Other competitors also manage it. So no @thesaint024 your arguments are quite simply wrong. There is enough weight reduction measurements Apple could use:

Using a different kind of aluminium alloy would reduce the weight by so much more than reducing a port. But you see that would actually cost something and it would reduce the margin of Apple or they would have to upgrade the price even further.

They could simply switch from Aluminium to Carbon-fiber-alloy which is also lighter and allows better wifi and will have the same feel but this would also mean a substaintal up-price. So i am sorry to tell you. That the argument of weight is really not the issue and space also isn't one.

As a matter of fact, there are lighter Notebooks with better Equipment at the same price. Why i still considered Apple? I like their design more and their support is the best.

The fact that you started becoming personal shows me only that you got pushed into a corner by arguments and now you resort to a personal attack by using frases like IDGAF and beeing passive aggressive in your last sentence. I will now delete my account. Never has this happened to me on another forum.
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Hallelujah. I will shed a tear and pour a little liquor out for you.

To pre-empt mods, I don't see any personal attacks nor name calling or any other suspension-able transgressions. Thank you.
 
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