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They also pushed out a carbon update to AppleWorks, to give a sort-of-working Office Suite.
And to coin the term "bad carbon port". :D

But seriously, I agree with your post, and OS X has come a long way.

I think Snow Leopard is nice. Lots of neat little features added, unquestionably faster, saved quite a bit of disk space, and has lots of potential for when apps start to take advantage of the new technologies avilable. And it only cost $30.
 
Ok, let's get this straight. We have no idea how much has been rewritten.
What we can be pretty sure of: it isn't anywhere near 90% of the OS. It
is probably not anywhere near 10% of the OS. Operating systems develop
gradually over many years, incrementally. You can't easily rewrite a large
proportion of the code because the thing is huge and complex. There are
literally millions of lines of code.

People are getting silly ideas in their heads, perhaps because of this:



That does not mean that 90 percent of the code has been rewritten.
And "Refining" is a very vague word. It could mean absolutely anything.

Well the point of my post wasn't really the percent of the code that has been rewritten, I was merely pointing out that a lot of work was put into it and that its easy for people to say they should have done this or that.

I was using the terms rewriting and bulk loosely. I'm not a programmer, so to me 10% or 90% doesn't matter; I couldn't do any of it.
 
Why would Apple spend over a year rewriting a bulk of an OS and then give it away for free? It may not seem like a lot of work, but a lot of work and $ went into making SL. Apple knew that it wasn't worth $120 for the users now, thats why it was $30. Software companies release paying software all the time with little or no visual changes. Get over it. Don't pay the $30 and stay with Snow Leopard. Thats the point of why people are responding to you and the original OP.

Is Snow Leopard a perfect upgrade? NO. But Apple never claimed it to be.

I don't know what "i work hard for my money" means or has to do with anything.

am sorry but what does IMO mean?, its my opinion, i dont care if apple spend $1000G or ten years on it, its my opinion.. like i said its not worth it for some people, instead bring your almighty ignorant snob self, take it with a grain of salt and move on. so just because the OP and others are disappointed does not give you cause to call them trol or tell them they are wrong,.

personally i dont know about all the improvements, what i dont like is people stomping on other simple because they have a different point of view..

i work hard for my money so if spend it on a upgrade, $9 or $129 it better be worth it.. take it any way you like, bring it, give me some time am going to reinstall SL because i can...:eek:

peace:D
 
am sorry but what does IMO mean?, its my opinion, i dont care if apple spend $1000G or ten years on it, its my opinion.. like i said its not worth it for some people, instead bring your almighty ignorant snob self, take it with a grain of salt and move on. so just because the OP and others are disappointed does not give you cause to call them trol or tell them they are wrong,.

personally i dont know about all the improvements, what i dont like is people stomping on other simple because they have a different point of view..

i work hard for my money so if spend it on a upgrade, $9 or $129 it better be worth it.. take it any way you like, bring it, give me some time am going to reinstall SL because i can...:eek:

peace:D

Snow Leopard is worth more than $30 to me, but I'll happily pay $30 for it!
 
am sorry but what does IMO mean?, its my opinion, i dont care if apple spend $1000G or ten years on it, its my opinion.. like i said its not worth it for some people, instead bring your almighty ignorant snob self, take it with a grain of salt and move on. so just because the OP and others are disappointed does not give you cause to call them trol or tell them they are wrong,.

personally i dont know about all the improvements, what i dont like is people stomping on other simple because they have a different point of view..

i work hard for my money so if spend it on a upgrade, $9 or $129 it better be worth it.. take it any way you like, bring it, give me some time am going to reinstall SL because i can...:eek:

peace:D


I don't know what in my post was "almighty ignorant slob," but its sad that you can't have a discussion on a forum without personally insulting the other individual.

I'm not attacking your opinion and I never called the OP a troll. My only point is that you do not have to spend that $9 or $129. You knew or should have known that there were no visual enhancements. So if it wasn't worth more than $9 or whatever to you, then you shouldn't have spent your hard earned money.

I don't think SL is an amazing new OS, but I knew what I was buying and thought, and still think, it was worth the $29. Of course, I'm an ignorant slob so take what I say with a grain of salt, but really good pretentious, almighty salt.
 
It's a sad day for the human race when we are so influenced by some expectation that is set to us via a business company or even on an online forum.

For me, software is just that. Software. It's a tool that I use, not vice-versa. If MicroSoft were to release an OS tomorrow that I thought would make me work faster, or was better then anything out there on the market, I would happily change. Same goes for any *Nix distro, Solaris, etc etc. Using any kind of platform just because it's what we are used to, it's what we grew up with, out of 'loyalty', is not a logical decision.

For those of us complaining that "Promises were not met, that this product was over-hyped", did you expect Apple to just say "Well, it's not much to look at, so you probably wont enjoy it if your just a visual user"? Apple are a company, and they need to sell, so of course they are going to push any point that they can.

However, this does not stop anyone from doing research and making an independant decision based on their own situation. Making such sweeping statements that "Apple are faltering, Apple dont care", are misleading, but above all redundant. Everyone here is unique, if SL is not for you, dont get it. It is impossible to cater to every single scenario out there: if it was, we would not have an OS war, which I think is the best thing since the transition from floppy to CD drives (ok, slight exaggeration)

SL cost me $29 dollars. That is: less then the price of a hard back book, how much I spend on my montly mobile bill, less then my weekly grocery shopping, less then the price of a console game, about 5-6 Canadian Clubs, what I spend on petrol. I'm pretty sure if I was able to find all the spare change lying around my house along with the toll bridge change in my car, I could have broken even on what I spent. For all of this, I was able to get an entire Operating System.

If the upgrade didnt work for you, or caused you problems, you have my sympathies. There will always be a few (its happened to eveyone at some stage in their life) If you feel unhappy with Apple, you are free to choose to leave this "club". Get a Windows Box, or a Ubuntu. Maybe the Suse flavor of Linux will suit you. Build a system that is entirely tailored to your needs.

The choice, as they say, is yours.
 
am sorry but what does IMO mean?, its my opinion, i dont care if apple spend $1000G or ten years on it, its my opinion.. like i said its not worth it for some people, instead bring your almighty ignorant snob self, take it with a grain of salt and move on. so just because the OP and others are disappointed does not give you cause to call them trol or tell them they are wrong,.

personally i dont know about all the improvements, what i dont like is people stomping on other simple because they have a different point of view..

i work hard for my money so if spend it on a upgrade, $9 or $129 it better be worth it.. take it any way you like, bring it, give me some time am going to reinstall SL because i can...:eek:

peace:D

While YOU were stomping all over that guy for stomping on others you answered your own question. IMO="In my opinion" or your case, "it's my opinion". :p
 
I'm happy with SL and my setup.
Buy what you fancy and enjoy!

Criticism either way is nice to hear. It let's users of see the good and the bad.
 
Personally, I've used windows from 3.1 to XP, and never once had a virus or malware. HOWEVER - there absolutely was a hassle factor to prevention, I had to install several utilities and run scans once a day and do a ton of preventative maintenance (defrag etc.). Really, it was simply a hassle.

To me - and fanbois will scream - probably the #1 benefit of running OSX has been the fact that I don't have to deal with that mess anymore. I save tons of time.

Both OSes have their pluses and minuses. I'm not that impressed with OSX - I found windows more efficient with space and faster to the pro user - while OSX is a bit of a slow dog on even the most up to date MP.

What really however puts me off windows is one thing which doesn't seem to bother anybody else, but is a deal-breaker for me: activation. F**k that sh|t. I bought it legitimately, and I don't want to have to constantly fret that if I change some component or another, window will lock me out with their stupid activation crap. If Apple ever goes that route, I'll be gone in a New York minute - it'll be Linux at that point I guess (hopefully linux will finally be ready for the desktop)

You were lucky. I had Malware, and everything else here. What drove me crazy was how crappy the machines would run after 6 months or so. When my "consultant" suggested we re-build the server 14 months it had last been rebuilt and I replace "ALL" of my machines (2-5 years old) to restabilize the system that was the last straw. My experience with windows focused around always dealing with problems. For me it comes down to this, go windows if you have a certified windows expert available most of the time and you don't mind paying him. Go Mac if you don't want to deal with problems. OS X was a great decision for Apple. It gave them what windows has not had in many years, a stable OS. SL only makes OS X better. Look at MS Office. What has MS done to improve MS Office in the last 8 years? Change for the sake of change is not an improvement.

As to the complaints on the insignificant nature of this upgrade, I disagree. Anytime you carry the OS up to run in 64 that is significant. I for one am very glad they did not change the GUI. The market needs to settle this upgrade before you carry it any further. Now, you can argue it should have been free, but come on $30 bucks? I bet that didn't cover 25% of the development and deployment costs. We may see something very interesting from the user perspective once Windows 7 is released
 
I see. And please tell me where I can purchase a 1TB laptop drive...and for £60.

You are assuming everyone uses a desktop when the fact is laptops are the marketshare champs these days, and have been for a few years. And while 500GB laptop drives are available, the majority of machines have 350GB or less. In fact, if you have an SSD, as is a growing trend, you have less than 160GB. So retrieving an extra 8GB back IS a big deal for many, many users. And the reality is 8GB is really a minimum. I got back twice that on one MBP.

do you seriously not see his point? why are you talking about what hard drive spaces are available for laptops?
 
Which, luckily, is the minority sentiment. Note that the 3GS is outselling the 3G.

Maury

because alot of people thought that going from 2g to 3g wasnt a big jump. SO they held out a little longer to get the next gen iphone... the 3gs

if apple did another speed bump for the current 3gs, do you still think it will outsell the current 3gs?
 
Luck has nothing to do with it. The 3GS is an incrementally better device than the 3G. However, whatever the device, there will always be inexperienced people on the sidelines with unrealistic expectations, which would include those disappointed in the 3GS.

inexperienced people? care to explain?
 
The following words from the post that started this thread make it trolling: "I'm saying it because SL is the final straw for me - I've had enough!"

"Final straw" of what? "Had enough" of what? The OP is making a confrontational, empty threat that Apple is in his opinion, falling down and something better improve soon mister, or else!

Instead of being a level-headed criticism (which with some edits and careful omissions, as you've made in your attempt to defend the troll, it could turn into something more civil), the try at an explosive intro made it a clear effort to put other forum users on the defensive, rather than engage in constructive dialog. Not that there's anything we as forum users can do to directly alter the course of Apple's product strategy (and thus prevent the ominously-threatened "or else!" from happening), but the onus is put on us by the OP to defend Apple anyway.

That is trolling.



You must be reading some other thread.



Actually, he could've said "Hey, I'm getting longer boot times with Snow Leopard. Anyone else notice this? Gee, I wonder what's causing it." Not, "THAT'S IT THIS IS THE LAST STRAW!!!"



See above. There are ways to make the point. He chose a more adversarial method.



Actually, you leave out that he says he was "forced" to by a Macbook. Really? The point has already been made: no one put a gun to his head.

There are more effective ways to tell Apple what you think of a product and how they can improve upon it, or even tell them that you feel they're doing a lousy job. We've all known this, and perhaps if the OP really wants a better product he should've made use of those channels. Instead, he wanted purely to rile people up, and that's what he got.

Maybe we should have thicker skins and be above all that and not feed the troll.. Unfortunately, the mind of a troll is such that a lack of an adversarial retort equals agreement. And so you can never really win.


are you an english teacher by any chance? maybe a politician?

If i read your post correctly, you're saying people should express their opinions in a politically correct manner else they're trolling!

... and we all know... don't feed the trolls... right?
 
because alot of people thought that going from 2g to 3g wasnt a big jump. SO they held out a little longer to get the next gen iphone... the 3gs

if apple did another speed bump for the current 3gs, do you still think it will outsell the current 3gs?

I was one of those individuals that held out on the 3G. So the 3GS was a huge jump from the 2G (2.5G).

I think a lot of people were expecting each revision to be as "new" and exciting as the first iPhone.

Snow Leopard and the 3GS are very similar in that some people wanted something that looked new or different, but there were really only "under the hood" changes.

I think that this just means that when OS 10.7 and the 4th Generation iPhones are released, there will be more major (visual) changes implemented. Keeping in mind that Apple is and probably has been working on both.
 
Damn, you're right. That's pretty harsh......surprised he didn't get instantly banned. :rolleyes:



Guess so.



Again, damn that is some horrid, and I mean HORRID language. His mouth ought to be washed out with soap.....and then he should get banned. :rolleyes:



Care to enlighten me?



I took it more to mean that if you wanted to buy a Macbook, you are forced to get a 'glossy' screen. But, whatever.



More like, some of us should lighten up and get the sticks out of our butts. :D



you crack me up!!
 
If your machines are not booting/operating/waking/shutting down noticeably faster, this may be due to factors involving RAM, 3rd party drivers, software, corrupted preferences, or perhaps a specific issue which needs to be addressed in a future update.

No complaints here - regarding SL's UI enhancements; Exposé's integration with the Dock & with Quick Look, new scrollable and hierarchical interface for Stacks, all sporting new 'Illuminous' theme and effects, gorgeous new interface for Quicktime X, 4x higher resolution in iChat, SL's UI enhancements are far from so-so, and easily outclass the competition. Changes under the hood; new multi-threaded/Cocoa Finder, Open CL, Grand Central, 64-bit hybrid, Exchange support, Wake on Command, faster boot, wake, and shut down times, faster Time Machine back-ups, faster Spotlight searches, column selection in Preview, Keyboard Substitutions, et. al., make it all the more compelling as a significant upgrade.

What is this Illuminous theme you're talking about?
 
I was one of those individuals that held out on the 3G. So the 3GS was a huge jump from the 2G (2.5G).

I think a lot of people were expecting each revision to be as "new" and exciting as the first iPhone.

Snow Leopard and the 3GS are very similar in that some people wanted something that looked new or different, but there were really only "under the hood" changes.

I think that this just means that when OS 10.7 and the 4th Generation iPhones are released, there will be more major (visual) changes implemented. Keeping in mind that Apple is and probably has been working on both.


i wanted to get the 2g when it first came out... but it was not available where i was at that time.

i held out on the 3g as well and am now with a 3gs (we have something in common then!) which was why i said the 3gs outsold the 3g (obviously not the only reason).

I guess as apple people we do want apple to give us something special everytime. I know thats not realistic at all but its good to know we can depend on apple for that to a certain extent.

I really only wished that the iphone 3gs had a front facing camera so i could vblog and upload/video journals. That would have been great. No doubt be it 2g, 3g or the 3gs, it being a software platform is by far one of the best phones out there. Its just that the jumps that apple took to get from one to the other was bit frustrating for us holding out for a new phone.

You're one of the few rational posters in this thread. Thanks for that.
 
The level of fanboyism in this thread is ridiculous.

So listen up fanboys, these are my opinions....

Snow Leopard is very disappointing. Even for £25. It's nothing short of a service pack. MS would have been crucified if they released that.
My iPhone 3G is awsome, but the battery really really sucks.
My Mac Mini Rocks but has limited memory expansion and a crap GPU
My Dell Mini 9 running Leopard is fantastic, but the keys are fiddly.
My iMac 24" @ 2.8Ghz was very very overpriced.
OSX crashes more than XP.
Windows 7 does rock, but is still just windows.

Conclusion. No Apple or Microsoft product is perfect.

No amount of criticising people who criticise apple is going to make Steve Jobs want to bum you, kiss you, or give you a job.

I have hugely enjoyed this thread, i have not laughed so much in ages. But one thing is disturbing me fanboys......Not one of you complained about what I said about Steve Jobs not wanting to kiss you.......I really thought that was a masterpiece :)
 
I for one am not disappointed in SL. I can say this thread has made me laugh.
My SL is stable like a great windows xp install. I think with a .1 or .2 update it will be back to beyond reporach. But that is how brand new software works.

SL is more than some service pack and if you call it that then you do not know what a service pack is. This is a whole new os that was made to look almost exactly like the last.
A service pack does not change every feature they are made to be cumlative updates to fix bugs and issues and release very small updates to poorly executed systems. To this end Xp sp2 was the first itteration of wireless management. The sp1 and orignal had poor implamentation of wireless control. They did not change it from 32 bit to 64 bit. They did not spread the process out. They gave it a face lift and some a drop of new back end code to control the cards drivers. That is what a service pack does. It tweaks bits that do not work with new hardware and new developments.

Sl however did not change the GUI it changed the guts. Short of the pictures on your screen everything is new. Now should they have done that and changed the pictures on the screen that is debatable but the fact it is a new OS is not .
 
I have hugely enjoyed this thread, i have not laughed so much in ages. But one thing is disturbing me fanboys......Not one of you complained about what I said about Steve Jobs not wanting to kiss you.......I really thought that was a masterpiece :)

We don't need to comment or complain about what you are writing. It's amusing enough for us to watch you trying to make out with yourself what with resurrecting crap you wrote a day ago to try to get more attention.
 
Get a PC. Get Windows. Enjoy. The rest of us will happily continue with Apple and OS X.

Oh. Don't forget to install a really good Antivirus on Windows - or you will get some nasty surprises. Hope you also enjoy Windows Updates - you'll get a healthy dose of those each and every month.

:)

Also. It's 'faltering' and not 'faultering' :D

I have a problem with the comment about antivirus. I don't care what operating system you are using you need a good antivirus program if you are going to be online. OS X is not immune to viruses, neither is Unix, Linux etc.

To the OP: this update was more about how the OS operates with the hardware, and does not contain any flashy new upgrades. This update is significant because it moves OS X completely to a 64 bit operating system and is designed to make the Mac run better with 64 bit programs, as well as improve the ability of the machine to run multiple programs at the same time. In short it's all under the hood and you won't see a majority of the improvements, but it does make the operating system optimized for running multiple 64 bit programs.
 
My copy of SL is arriving tomorrow, so I don't have first-hand knowledge YET. However, what promises did Apple make regarding SL that were not true? A lot of people were expecting some huge leap in performance, but Apple never promised that. The leap in performance will come with applications that are written to take advantage of the hooks SL provides to improve how multiple cores/CPUs and GPUs are utilized.

SL is a refinement of an already great OS. Did anyone consider that SL is part of a larger plan at Apple to optimize and reduce the footprint of the OS in order to shoehorn it into as yet unreleased mobile devices? (hint: tablet). There is a bigger picture here, and SL is just one small component. Watch for SL to be the springboard to more mobile offerings from Apple.
 
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