So... about that Macbook screen wash-out

[sammy2066]

Companies cannot charge an increased restocking fee even if you buy, return, buy, return. If you're going to return and pay the 10% restocking fee and walk out with another MB I'd question why.

I would say to them that all you want is a straight exchange. No restocking fee should be applied because it's a straight exchange. If you were going to give the MB and walk out with a MBP, I would also say the fee should be waived. However, if you're going to return the MB for a refund then I would say they are within their right to charge the restocking fee. However, you may be able to tell them you'll take store credit in exchange for waiving the restocking fee. I did that. Now, had they already had the new Airs in stock I would have just told them to give me the Air, I pay the difference and they waive the restocking fee. The goal is to allow Apple to keep their cash as it was already realized and you walk out with the same or better machine.

Going back to your original question though, there is no legal right for a company to increase a restocking fee due to a second return. If there is suddenly some right then I'd like to see that posted in plain english on the receipt.

Well, I just returned it. The guys working at their so-called "Genius" bar were idiots. They probably felt better about themselves, because they thought I did not know what I was rambling on about ... 9C8C, 9C89 ....

They probably thought I was some half-informed dimwit trying to ac smart. But that's how it always is for me, even at the Apple Store. They rarely ever have answers for the questions I ask.

I feel great, having gotten back 90% of my money. Although I do feel bad about the restocking fee, but oh well.

 

[PresentACat]

The narrow viewing angle exacerbates the black level issues. The previous MB had a not so great display too but without the glass had better viewing angles. This allowed you to still get adequate visuals without searching for the few º's of viewable sweet spot in the new MB's.

I personally think the problem goes beyond this, I'm not sure there is ANY vertical angle at which the grey-blacks is not a rather large issue. The backlighting almost seems uneven so that there is no way to fix it with a movement of the head. The top alway looks darker and the bottom lighter. To get the bottom to go to reasonable black levels you must cause the top of the screen to turn negative.

That said you can see how this would be a nice screen otherwise when you are viewing things that don't make the issue too obvious.

 

[NC MacGuy]

I personally think the problem goes beyond this, I'm not sure there is ANY vertical angle at which the grey-blacks is not a rather large issue. The backlighting almost seems uneven so that there is no way to fix it with a movement of the head. The top alway looks darker and the bottom lighter. To get the bottom to go to reasonable black levels you must cause the top of the screen to turn negative.

That said you can see how this would be a nice screen otherwise when you are viewing things that don't make the issue too obvious.

Precisely. I was being kind to not upset the "my screen is beautiful" members who can't be told it's not quite. The backlight/limited angle issue is another problem - I didn't want to get into that.

Obviously Apple has found their market base and they will accept it because they've been told it's better, spent the money and therefor see it as better.

 

[hogfaninga]

Precisely. I was being kind to not upset the "my screen is beautiful" members who can't be told it's not quite. The backlight/limited angle issue is another problem - I didn't want to get into that.

Obviously Apple has found their market base and they will accept it because they've been told it's better, spent the money and therefor see it as better.

That is sad especially for many of us who have owned and been loyal to Apple for a long time. There is no doubt that Apple's QC and quality overall has taken a major dive in the last few years. I guess as long as the computers look pretty and are considered the in thing then their market base is happy. The new crop of new Mac user (for the large part) doesn't know what Apple was and the quality they use to have. That is why I hope they lose their lawsuit with Psystar. It will help force them to build better quality machines with more options for the consumer and the Pro alike.

 

[NC MacGuy]

That is sad especially for many of us who have owned and been loyal to Apple for a long time. There is no doubt that Apple's QC and quality overall has taken a major dive in the last few years. I guess as long as the computers look pretty and are considered the in thing then their market base is happy. The new crop of new Mac user (for the large part) doesn't know what Apple was and the quality they use to have. That is why I hope they lose their lawsuit with Psystar. It will help force them to build better quality machines with more options for the consumer and the Pro alike.

Frankly, I think the new MB's are worlds ahead of the plastibooks in overall QC. My MB was probably the best Apple product, save display, that I've purchased since the Intel transition. Unfortunately the mediocre quality materials used can't be QC'ed. The panels are just okay and obviously they've found a market.

 

[workerbee]

With the ever decreasing cost of panels these days, I can't for the life of me see why Apple sacrificed the beauty and functionality of the new MB with such a mediocre display. Everything else on mine is as perfect as could be.

Maybe to get as many people as possible to buy a more expensive MBA or MBP?
Same as not having a non-glossy option for the iMac, really -- Apple is fully aware that a lot of professionals would be perfectly happy with such a beast, and now more or less have to buy a much more expensive Mac Pro + ACD combo.

 

[Rogue68]

I so wanted it to work out... Trying to put my experiences with the gloss in non-ideal settings aside, last night I set myself up to watch Paris Texas with the perfect viewing scenario: dim lighting in the room, dark curtain behind me, screen calibrations perfected.

I still couldn't find a non-traumatic viewing angle: either blacks at the top of the screen were sheer mirrors and the blacks at the bottom of the screen were ok, or the blacks at the top of the screen were fine and the blacks at the bottom were pale grey. All the way through I could see my own ugly mug in the blacks centre screen.

This is a real bore now. I can switch on my old TiBook anywhere except outdoors in bright sunshine and it's ready to go. No squinting, no funny variations, no weird contrasts or changing colours.

I really want to love this machine but not being able to SEE what I'm looking at on it properly is sucky too far.

I have one more week to play around before the 14 day return deal is up. If I can't get used to this misery or fix it this poor old MB is going back.

BTW, the guy who served me at the London Apple store told me Apple are bringing out a matte screen filter. I don't know how true that is or when it'll arrive, but that might offer some people some hope :-\

 

[PresentACat]

I so wanted it to work out... Trying to put my experiences with the gloss in non-ideal settings aside, last night I set myself up to watch Paris Texas with the perfect viewing scenario: dim lighting in the room, dark curtain behind me, screen calibrations perfected.

I still couldn't find a non-traumatic viewing angle: either blacks at the top of the screen were sheer mirrors and the blacks at the bottom of the screen were ok, or the blacks at the top of the screen were fine and the blacks at the bottom were pale grey. All the way through I could see my own ugly mug in the blacks centre screen.

This is a real bore now. I can switch on my old TiBook anywhere except outdoors in bright sunshine and it's ready to go. No squinting, no funny variations, no weird contrasts or changing colours.

I really want to love this machine but not being able to SEE what I'm looking at on it properly is sucky too far.

I have one more week to play around before the 14 day return deal is up. If I can't get used to this misery or fix it this poor old MB is going back.

BTW, the guy who served me at the London Apple store told me Apple are bringing out a matte screen filter. I don't know how true that is or when it'll arrive, but that might offer some people some hope :-\

I think the glossy-ness is not an issue. At least I mean that it is a personal taste issue, whereas the arse-awful blacks are just not on.

I bought my Mac from the online store. I have 14 days to "change my mind", but is says I have to have not opened the products, is this true?

If they need me to say it is faulty I have a few small complaints that suffice for returning it as broken.

 

[Ryffie]

I think it depends on where you live. For me I only need to pay the shipping cost back.

 

[PresentACat]

I think it depends on where you live. For me I only need to pay the shipping cost back.

Same here, it just says I need to pay shipping, however it says to see what that entails read a 'Paragraph D' which doesn't appear to bloody exist (I'm in the UK btw). But it says If i change my mind about it I can return it, but it must not have any of the 'security seals' broken.

I guess this means you have to not have opened/used it?

 

[MacsBestFriend]

i want to see the real life percentage of who has a messed up macbook! are they all like this?

 

[jamescwarren]

Putting these 'problems' aside for just a moment. I am thinking of buying the new MacBook to upgrade my 1st genaration white MacBook. I love the Pro but really can't justify the price gap for a bigger screen and better graphics. I've never thought anything wrong of the screen on my current MacBook. I've had people come up to me at school and say how the screen is so clear it's almost like looking at a photo. Is the new Aluminium MacBook's screen better than the white plastic MacBook's? If it is, that's perfect for me.

 

[NC MacGuy]

Putting these 'problems' aside for just a moment. I am thinking of buying the new MacBook to upgrade my 1st genaration white MacBook. I love the Pro but really can't justify the price gap for a bigger screen and better graphics. I've never thought anything wrong of the screen on my current MacBook. I've had people come up to me at school and say how the screen is so clear it's almost like looking at a photo. Is the new Aluminium MacBook's screen better than the white plastic MacBook's? If it is, that's perfect for me.

That's really up to you. I've owned two MB's before and the screen was never an issue with me. The new one is different and I didn't like it. Here's to hoping the Gen. B MBA's have the same panel they did originally.

 

[mcdj]

I still couldn't find a non-traumatic viewing angle: either blacks at the top of the screen were sheer mirrors and the blacks at the bottom of the screen were ok, or the blacks at the top of the screen were fine and the blacks at the bottom were pale grey. All the way through I could see my own ugly mug in the blacks centre screen.

I really have to wonder if some people simply have defective screens. The tone of this entire thread and others like it seem to indicate that every new MB is suffering from these issues.

I for one, can say without a doubt, that while my screen does go negative when viewed from too low an angle, and washes somewhat out at too high an angle, there is a definite sweet spot, with a useable range of maybe 5-10 degrees, where the blacks go neither negative or wash out to light grey.

Is it the most even screen I've ever seen? No. But dark movies are certainly watchable for me. And I do not have a bluish tint as some have mentioned.

 

[Ryan T.]

I really have to wonder if some people simply have defective screens. The tone of this entire thread and others like it seem to indicate that every new MB is suffering from these issues.

I for one, can say without a doubt, that while my screen does go negative when viewed from too low an angle, and washes somewhat out at too high an angle, there is a definite sweet spot, with a useable range of maybe 5-10 degrees, where the blacks go neither negative or wash out to light grey.

Is it the most even screen I've ever seen? No. But dark movies are certainly watchable for me. And I do not have a bluish tint as some have mentioned.

Yeah I'd have to agree -- my screen isn't the greatest ever but it's certainly usable, especially after applying one of the color profiles posted here.

 

[NC MacGuy]

Yeah I'd have to agree -- my screen isn't the greatest ever but it's certainly usable, especially after applying one of the color profiles posted here.

"Isn't the greatest" reads you're not enthralled with it. For the premium price, I expected an above average display. It's average at best. It gets worse with the glass over it. Had Apple started with an above average panel behind the glass, it probably would've worked. My MB was the first display in all the Apple products I've ever owned that needed to be tweaked. Usually it's open it up and use it. This time not the case. The MBP & iMacs with the glass aren't nearly as bad - I've come to the conclusion that the display is not worth my $$$$'s.

 

[mcdj]

For the premium price, I expected an above average display.

All this talk about what a premium priced computer should come with... At what price point would it be ok for the screen to be the way it is? $700? $500? $400? Apple just doesn't make computers in that price range, so Im not sure calling their low end computer "premium" is truly accurate.

Premium ($1500+) Sony laptops have premium screens. But their chassis is squeaky plastic. Their trackpads have buttons that kill your fingers. They're chunky (and fugly) compared to the MB, their processor is slower (in the MB's price range), their drives are lower capacity, and they don't run OSX. All this for about the same price as a MB 2.4, if not a little more.

Call me crazy, but I'll take a solid aluminum chassis, a mouse you can click comfortably, a faster processor, a bigger hard drive, and most importantly, OSX, over a lesser Windows computer with a better screen, any day of any week. The MB's screen may be "average", but only when compared to average PCs, which the Macbook trumps in every other aspect.

 

[NC MacGuy]

All this talk about what a premium priced computer should come with... At what price point would it be ok for the screen to be the way it is? $700? $500? $400? Apple just doesn't make computers in that price range, so Im not sure calling their low end computer "premium" is truly accurate.

Premium ($1500+) Sony laptops have premium screens. But their chassis is squeaky plastic. Their trackpads have buttons that kill your fingers. They're chunky (and fugly) compared to the MB, their processor is slower (in the MB's price range), their drives are lower capacity, and they don't run OSX. All this for about the same price as a MB 2.4, if not a little more.

Call me crazy, but I'll take a solid aluminum chassis, a mouse you can click comfortably, a faster processor, a bigger hard drive, and most importantly, OSX, over a lesser Windows computer with a better screen, any day of any week. The MB's screen may be "average", but only when compared to average PCs, which the Macbook trumps in every other aspect.

I think I paid $1,703 with tax. Face the fact that the computer with all its really good and premium parts in many other ways still uses a "less than" display.

Rationalize away but you can get a better display on a $700 pc. You don't get it - I think the computer is great but am disappointed in the display only. In Apples infinite wisdom, there's no way of getting a premium screen on the computer even by paying extra which I gladly would have.

Again it's what Apple tells you you need and those like yourself following blindly without honest, albeit negative feedback, allow them that freedom. How cheap to put that display in such an otherwise beautiful piece.

 

[clyde2801]

At the OKC Apple store

Having them look at my macbook, and see if they agree with me on the display. BTW, I've got the dreaded 9c89. The genius went out back to see if he could find anything about the problem I've been having with washout and lack of detail on blacks.

To be honest, while I've been walking around waiting for my appointment (there was some redheaded hippie chick hogging the geniuses) I looked at the macbooks and the macbook pros. To be honest, I'm not happy with any of the ones on display. I wonder if it's the glossy displays.

 

[mcdj]

I think I paid $1,703 with tax. Face the fact that the computer with all its really good and premium parts in many other ways still uses a "less than" display.

Rationalize away but you can get a better display on a $700 pc. You don't get it - I think the computer is great but am disappointed in the display only. In Apples infinite wisdom, there's no way of getting a premium screen on the computer even by paying extra which I gladly would have.

Again it's what Apple tells you you need and those like yourself following blindly without honest, albeit negative feedback, allow them that freedom. How cheap to put that display in such an otherwise beautiful piece.

Umm, I thought I was facing the fact. I clearly said I'd rather have an aluminum Macbook, even with a less than stellar display, than any PC, even if the PC had a stellar screen. The construction of the chassis, the design of the trackpad/button, and OSX go a long way in mitigating other less than premium features IMO. Heck, I'd rather have an 800x600 VGA CRT and OSX than a 1900x1200 LCD with Vista. Yes, you may be able to get a better display on a $700 PC, but it would still be a $700 PC, and that is a deal breaker. A $500 PC screen on a $1700 Mac is not a deal breaker, for me anyway, and I suspect many others.

 

[Ron21]

Can someone please explain this to me:



This is the same image that is being used as the wallpaper. How is it that in one the car is purplish and in the other the car is the correct blue color??? How come when I set it as the wallpaper the colors get all messed up?

 

[mcdj]

Can someone please explain this to me:



This is the same image that is being used as the wallpaper. How is it that in one the car is purplish and in the other the car is the correct blue color??? How come when I set it as the wallpaper the colors get all messed up?

Dunno what's causing that, but I can assure you it has nothing to do with a problem with your monitor or anything in this thread. It probably has something to do with the embedded color profile in the photo...either QuickLook or SysPrefs is ignoring the photo's profile. Are you using any software besides SysPrefs to set your wallpaper? If so, try making a Wallpaper folder in ~/Pictures, copying the photo there, then setting it as your desktop via SysPrefs.

 

[Ron21]

Dunno what's causing that, but I can assure you it has nothing to do with a problem with your monitor or anything in this thread. It probably has something to do with the embedded color profile in the photo...either QuickLook or SysPrefs is ignoring the photo's profile. Are you using any software besides SysPrefs to set your wallpaper? If so, try making a Wallpaper folder in ~/Pictures, copying the photo there, then setting it as your desktop via SysPrefs.

I always use SysPrefs.

Putting it into the pictures folder did the trick. When I drag the image manually to set it as wallpaper the colors get all screwed up. Thanks for the help!

 

[sahni130]

Is it THAT bad? I have one on order.
Am I going to look at it and think "That is at least average notebook quality" or am I going to be hankering for my old laptops screen?
Is it a case of looking bad in comparison to excellent screens, or just being awful?

The screen on the MB is still a beautiful screen, it's just not as good as the MBA's or the MBP's screen.

 

[rutiger]

I really have to wonder if some people simply have defective screens. The tone of this entire thread and others like it seem to indicate that every new MB is suffering from these issues.

I for one, can say without a doubt, that while my screen does go negative when viewed from too low an angle, and washes somewhat out at too high an angle, there is a definite sweet spot, with a useable range of maybe 5-10 degrees, where the blacks go neither negative or wash out to light grey.

Is it the most even screen I've ever seen? No. But dark movies are certainly watchable for me. And I do not have a bluish tint as some have mentioned.

i planned on getting a new mb. i currently have a mbp (latest gen before the newest) and mba. i even listed them for sale. i wanted the mb as it's the best of both machines i have. then i went to look at the mb and the screen is really bad. i checked every machine at two apples stores and even loaded some cal profiles from this thread on them. i also had my mba with me to compare. a number of apple employees came over to see what i was doing and they all agreed that my mba screen was substantially better than the mb even with the custom cal profile. i was most concerned with the blacks, but a few employees made note of how whites were also much better. after i started attracting the attention of other customers i think the employees wanted me to get out. also, some guy came in while i was testing this and argued about the restocking fee and he hadn't bought one yet. i assume he's been reading these threads.