Spotify Lauds $2 Billion EU Fine, Says Apple Has 'Muzzled' Streaming Music Services

[Jensend]

Are you suggesting
1) Spotify service is cheaper?
2) Spotify are paying more to artists per play than Apple?

1) Yes and no
2) no

but here is an example. Check the link.

Spotify slides you about $0.003 - $0.005 per stream, while Apple Music hands out around $0.01​

That link says

That works out as an approx revenue split of 70/30 - so that’s 70% to the artist/rights holders and 30% to Spotify.

Apple Music has the same standard subscription cost, but apparently pays 2 to 3 times as much per stream. How do you think that's possible, given that it would be absurd for Apple to give between 150%-200% of the subscription cost to the rights holders.

I know the reason, do you?

 

[Analog Kid]

Apple and "free service" should never be used in the same sentence. Also, US has no business interfering into the business between other countries.

Sorry, I rounded kind of carelessly there, I probably should have used exponential notation... Their $1x10^-6/user service.

You just said that companies need to follow the laws of the countries they do business in. If you want to do business in the US, the laws say you can't provide support to pirates or regimes sponsoring terrorism. In the EU the laws say you have to let the most recognized brand in streaming advertise through your service for free $99/year without limit.

 

[Neg4433]

It’s insane how end users defend a trillion dollar company. First of all, I’m not a Spotify nor a music streaming fan. All those services are a rip off for artists and consumers. Also the 30% cut apple insists on keeping is ripping developers off. Even after the regulation for allowing installations outside of AppStore like every other computer platform including the Mac, they still try to rip developers off with ridiculous fees and agreements although they won’t use their AppStore and servers. You think if Spotify releases their App on their website with just a single download button, people will not install it? As a consumer and developer, I praise EU’s decision for steering Apple to a consumer and developer friendlier direction. If you have apple stocks, then I understand the defensive stand for the company but if you are just a regular consumer, then it’s just ridiculous.

Edit: was wrong about the developer fee. Corrected my post.

 

[falainber]

Sorry, I rounded kind of carelessly there, I probably should have used exponential notation... Their $1x10^-6/user service.

You just said that companies need to follow the laws of the countries they do business in. If you want to do business in the US, the laws say you can't provide support to pirates or regimes sponsoring terrorism. In the EU the laws say you have to let the most recognized brand in streaming advertise through your service for free $99/year without limit.

Incorrect. Spotify does not want to advertise through Apple service. They want to advertise through their own service delivered via their own app. Apple uses their gateway powers to tell other companies what they can and can't advertise in their own apps. EU put a stop to this ridiculous practice.

 

[Analog Kid]

Incorrect. Spotify does not want to advertise through Apple service. They want to advertise through their own service delivered via their own app. Apple uses their gateway powers to tell other companies what they can and can't advertise in their own apps. EU put a stop to this ridiculous practice.

Oh, no Apple service involved then. Not sold through the Apple distribution network, not running on Apple developed hardware or utilizing Apple developed firmware and APIs? You make it sound like Apple won't let Spotify advertise through their Android app.

 

[JapanApple]

I did not get it. Are you saying that Spotify offers free tier with ads which has some limitations and that's a problem, but you don't have a problem with Apple Music because it does not have ad supported option at all? As I see it, in this regard Spotify is way better than Apple Music but you want it to be even better.

I am sorry thought you had something to add /understand the subject matter of this thread and or worthwhile to add. Since you don't know what you are referring to in this discussion. Sorry.

 

[steve09090]

1) Yes and no
2) no

That link says

Apple Music has the same standard subscription cost, but apparently pays 2 to 3 times as much per stream. How do you think that's possible, given that it would be absurd for Apple to give between 150%-200% of the subscription cost to the rights holders.

I know the reason, do you?

Nope. Tell me.

But I’m wondering. Why do Spotify keep 30% of the money? Shouldn’t they allow Artists to use Spotify without having to pay them?

 

[contacos]

Apple plans to appeal the decision and has claimed that the EC's view is misguided and has been heavily influenced by Spotify's complaints.

If I read the decision by the EU correctly, they (at least) partially fined Apple nearly 2 billion for lying.

„The Commission also justifies the current billion-dollar fine by the fact that Apple provided incorrect information in the administrative proceedings and that the amount should be deterrent.“

 

[TheMountainLife]

Having had multiple credit card dispute with Spotify. I despise Spotify and I think anyone who uses their services is making a serious mistake. Apple is far from perfect, but when comparing business practices, they are an absolute saint, as compared to Spotify, based on my personal experiences

Dang what happened where you had to dispute charges multiple times? I've been subbed to the Hulu + Spotify bundle for 6 years and their individual plan maybe another 5 years before that with no issues with billing or services.

Its perplexing how consumers continue to buy from companies that are known to be harmful to the environment, mistreat/exploit their employees, animals, so on so fourth but some draw the line at a music streaming service lol.

 

[falainber]

Oh, no Apple service involved then. Not sold through the Apple distribution network, not running on Apple developed hardware or utilizing Apple developed firmware and APIs? You make it sound like Apple won't let Spotify advertise through their Android app.

Since when the company that develops API can mandate what the app developed with this API can and can't advertise? "sold through the Apple distribution network" it is not. The app is not being sold, it is free. Besides, what Apple is doing is a typical racket. Spotify can easily distribute their own app. They don't need Apple help with that. But Apple insists that Spotify use their App Store and then imposes ridiculous rules. RICO act is waiting to be applied to Apple. We here that US government is preparing to charge Apple. Let's see which charges they are going to bring.

 

[Zest28]

I wonder if Spotify should be forced to allow musicians to host 3 songs from an album on Spotify and then inform listeners that they should subscribe to Tidal to listen to the remainder of the album since Tidal offers musicians better royalties for streaming. 🤔

The EU will never do this, because Spotify is an EU tech company.

 

[contacos]

Because Spotify had to yell “Uncle”, because they can’t compete with what Apple Music have. Not to mention, Apple actually pays their artists.

I don’t care if this is European pride or not. This is Spotify being absolutely anti competitive. They want to shut down their competition. Period.

Because they can’t compete with superior product.

Apple should just retaliate by getting rid of Apple Music in EU. See how that will hurt European music industry.

You are going against what Apple themselves are saying. Apple is basically arguing that Spotify is the „winner“ and Apple is just trying to compete with them in the music market.

 

[Zest28]

Nope. Tell me.

But I’m wondering. Why do Spotify keep 30% of the money? Shouldn’t they allow Artists to use Spotify without having to pay them?

Because Spotify is an EU company.

If EU tech companies charge 30% on artists, it is fine.

 

[falainber]

I wonder if Spotify should be forced to allow musicians to host 3 songs from an album on Spotify and then inform listeners that they should subscribe to Tidal to listen to the remainder of the album since Tidal offers musicians better royalties for streaming. 🤔

Define "better". Do you really believe that any artist, in total, gets more money from Tidal than they get from Spotify? That's just a typical case of volume discount.

 

[JLL]

Second from a developer perspective, some users here claim that Spotify pays 99$ a year which is false. The enterprise fee for developers is 299$ a year.

The Enterprise Program is for distributing internal apps in a company and not for App Store apps.

 

[DrRadon]

I come from a time where a 70% cut for the software releasing party was considered great and groundbreaking.

 

[JLL]

Apple Music has the same standard subscription cost, but apparently pays 2 to 3 times as much per stream. How do you think that's possible, given that it would be absurd for Apple to give between 150%-200% of the subscription cost to the rights holders.

I know the reason, do you?

Do tell.

 

[falainber]

I come from a time where a 70% cut for the software releasing party was considered great and groundbreaking.

Spotify is a music service. They don't sell software.

 

[Jensend]

Pay more to use their service

The standard paid tier for both services in the US is $10.99. I haven't compared other countries.

Nope. Tell me.

Because Spotify has a free option. The rights holders don't get as much money per stream for ad-supported free users. Paid subscriptions likely have the same royalties on Spotify and Apple Music.

 

[treacher]

Apple is a good company.

 

[neilpmas]

Spotify thinks they should freeload off of Apple's success instead of risking billions on R&D of their own platform.

Also
They don't want to go web only.
They think Apple should front the server bill to serve billions of copies of their app updated weekly.
They think Apple should run notification servers for free.
They think Apple deserves $0 for putting them on the front page of the App Store which gets half a billion visitors a week.
They think Apple deserves $0 for constantly building/updating not-perfect-but-way-better-than-other-platform developer tools.

Because somehow they think $99/year ought to be enough to cover those costs, right? Nevermind paying the human $20/hr to review their app weekly.

Stop whining Spotify. Maybe you should start paying more to the artists while you're at it, like Apple is doing.

It won’t save you, Spotify.

Spotify Takes on $1.3B in Debt

Spotify is offering $1.3 billion in exchangeable notes it can pay off with cash or stock, while building its war chest for acquisitions or other purposes.

www.billboard.com

Tick tock, tick tock. That 1.3 billion dollar debt looms.

Is this meant to be sarcastic? I can’t tell. Anyway, for scale Apple has over 100billion in debt.

 

[Zachari]

It's not up to you or Apple to determine rule compliance. Get to grips with reality.

This guy literally defending a government entity 😂 EU is a stain on the history of the world. You think any of that 2 billion dollars will end up doing anything good? Nah, it won’t. It will go to rich oligarchs.

 

[treacher]

Everyone is corrupt.

 

[macduke]

Yeah and Spotify supports Joe Rogan who has been spreading AIDS denialism lately.

You know, maybe if they weren’t paying out A QUARTER BILLION DOLLARS to Rogan on his new contract which isn’t even exclusive, they wouldn’t be so hard up for cash. Fools.

 

[paul4339]

Apple will just appeal the fine and get it chopped down 1/3.. just like their antitrust fine in France a few years ago.

Their appeal is probably going to be based on "an effort by the Commission to enforce the DMA before the DMA becomes law”… and by making the case that the $2B was just an over inflated number to suit the financial strength of the company - like in France it was slashed.