Spotify Sides With Epic Games in Battle Against Apple's App Store Fees

[eoblaed]

They can file an Amicus Brief.

They do have the resources to provide financial and legal assitance though. When in court, they can file legal briefs on their behalf as well, which is actually just more than an opinion and is listened to in legal cases.

Sure. I wonder if they would also have to reveal that both companies (Epic Games, Spotify) have strong interests held by Tencent? Tencent owns 40% of Epic Games and nearly 10% of Spotify.

It's essentially the same thing as an aggrieved person filing a complaint, leaving the room, putting on a wig and glasses, and going back into the room to file a 'yeah, me too!' complaint.

 

[davcolley]

Fortnite is crack and malware in one.

Develop your on ecosystem, phone, and computer hardware. They should be charged 50%,

 

[Seend1983]

Wow, that sounds like a really cool software experience! So all third-party apps will require some convoluted workaround? As long as it’s not Apple software right? You say this is iOS? How did I not know about this? I love figuring out puzzles! I’m gonna try this out!

You really can't argue with stupid

 

[mrcloaked]

I don't understand.

 

[hot-gril]

It sure as hell is. Do I need to flippantly list the 20 or so lock-in methods Apple uses again in this thread, too? Repurchases, switching cloud services, changing out auxiliary hardware and all that?

All to be able to shop at the other mall down the road!

You don't have to get locked in, and you knew going in what it meant. If you keep your important things on cross-platform services like I do, which is easy, there's no issue. If you go out of your way to use gimmicks like Apple Pay, you reap what you sow.

It's not just me. There are plenty of people who switch back and forth.

 

[EfratBarTal]

I love me some corporate arm-wrestling.

 

[Serrafemme]

As someone who bought Fortnite long before it ever transformed into a battle royale game, I hope Epic loses so much from this standoff. They’re biting a hand that has fed them quite well. And what a childish way to lash out back at Apple...

 

[wallaby]

If all the big companies make a stand, then Apple will be left in a bad position where their platform is missing so many of the big apps, that people will move off iOS. This is sort of how unions work - power in numbers against the big powerful player.

This is precisely what I will do if somehow Spotify is removed from the App Store. I've tried Apple Music and I just can't stand losing some of the features I get from Spotify.

Apple's stance is the equivalent of "we are the only ones who sell toilet paper, and you can only use an Apple Card to buy toilet paper." The apologist stance is "that's the cost of having Apple carry your toilet paper" but the only other option is to buy a bidet because there's no other way to get toilet paper.

Apologies to Android enthusiasts if they don't like bidets. I like Android!

 

[BeefCake 15]

Mr. Crook didn't remove Fortnite for its violent nature. He removed Fortnite because they wouldn't pay him the extortion money anymore.

How is it extortion? What makes Fortnite any different than the other arcade games paying the same fee or other consoles that do the exact same thing or even Fortnite that collects in game gambling boxes and doesn't allow others to sell them....

 

[wallaby]

That's how it should be anyways. If third party app stores were allowed, the big guys like Microsoft/Adobe would force customers to install third party app stores creating extreme complexity for users and degrading the performance of the device.

This is the state of online game stores on PC. You have:

1. Steam
2. Epic
3. UbiPlay
4. Microsoft Store
5. xBox game pass
6. EA Origin
7. GOG
8. And probably some others I'm forgetting!

It sucked at first because we all liked having one place to play our games (Steam) but it's really not that big of a deal to load another app. There's no performance degradation if you close the 3rd party store app, and "extreme complexity?" Please. It's tapping another icon and entering your credit card—the exact same pattern as the Apple App Store.

Personally I would prefer Apple just drop their draconian measures of requiring all subscriptions go through Apple. They haven't worked for it, they're just taking advantage of the fact that there are services that require subscriptions and there is no other way to access them through an app than Apple's store. Unless you count a web browser…and Apple has been woefully behind on supporting Progressive Web App features (though they have tossed a bone here at there).

Apple is being anticompetitive, period.

 

[kmann1983]

The people defending Apple remind me of the people who defend Russia for not giving many alternatives to their people. "Who wants the choice? Better to have limited options so you aren't so overwhelmed!" -- This is exactly how Apple people sound. If Apple doesn't control it, then they can't be safe! They can't trust their own competence level.

In this case, these same people also but all their own maintenance, tires, and EVERYTHING from the dealership at full price because "how can I trust Discount Tire?"

 

[bbeagle]

Apple's stance is the equivalent of "we are the only ones who sell toilet paper, and you can only use an Apple Card to buy toilet paper." The apologist stance is "that's the cost of having Apple carry your toilet paper" but the only other option is to buy a bidet because there's no other way to get toilet paper.

No, Apple's stance is equivalent to "we are the only ones who sell toilet paper for the Apple Toilet. There are other brands of toilet paper, they won't work with the Apple Toilet, but will work with any other toilet. There are many other toilets to choose from."

The ONLY place to buy Apple Toilet Paper for the Apple Toilet is at the Apple Store, but you somehow think someone can't buy Toilets and Toilet Paper?

Now, if the Apple Toilet becomes a monopoly (over 50% of the market), then the law will step in and stop Apple's practices, but until then, there is nothing illegal about it. Just like a car manufacturer selling their own custom parts that will only work in their car.

 

[mrcloaked]

Nice job.

 

[wallaby]

No, Apple's stance is equivalent to "we are the only ones who sell toilet paper for the Apple Toilet. There are other brands of toilet paper, they won't work with the Apple Toilet, but will work with any other toilet. There are many other toilets to choose from."

The ONLY place to buy Apple Toilet Paper for the Apple Toilet is at the Apple Store, but you somehow think someone can't buy Toilets and Toilet Paper?

Now, if the Apple Toilet becomes a monopoly (over 50% of the market), then the law will step in and stop Apple's practices, but until then, there is nothing illegal about it. Just like a car manufacturer selling their own custom parts that will only work in their car.

It's more complicated than that. If Apple toilet paper is more expensive than you want to pay, too bad. You have an Apple toilet and that's all you can get. If you want different toilet paper, you have to buy a whole new toilet. And there are not "many" other toilets to choose from, there is a single competitor.

 

[trusso]

I could care less about Fortnite, but I am absolutely sick of Apple’s heavy-handed authoritarianism in every little thing. This, coupled with the continued decline in hardware choice and software quality, mean that my 2010 MacBook Pro and 2010 Mac Pro will be the last Apple computers I ever own. I’ll be heading to Linux. Freedom is more important to me than some minor conveniences, and I encourage liked-minded folks to consider doing the same.

 

[bayelrey80]

Apple may feel the wrath of fortnite users! There were people willing to pick up a Samsung specifically for an exclusive fortnite skin

Except that Google booted Fornite from the PlayStorw too

 

[InnocenceMyth]

If Apple Music was a standalone business how profitable would it be?

But it’s not, is it? It’s not a standalone business complaining about the cost of performing on a platform without which it wouldn‘t exist. That would be Spotify.

 

[bayelrey80]

Cmon Spotify do the same as Epic and face a ban from Apple. Then let’s see if more apps join the movement.

I like Spotify but for me, it’s not THAT unique. If Spotify got banned, oh well, off to Apple or Amazon Music.

 

[macfacts]

"...especially when Apple does not have to pay the same fees for Apple Music."

Apple should charge itself fees? I mean, a plan in which I charge myself a dollar for every web site I visit sounds like a GREAT moneymaking scheme, until I realize that....uh....err.....

Apple should be split up

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

If Spotify and Epic don’t want to pay the price of admission, then they can do without the Apple app store. They won’t do that, though. They want to come to Apple’s home and demand what Apple does and doesn’t do in their own home.

It's not Apple's home, it's MY home, and I would like to invite them in. But Apple has built the wall around my home, and put guards patrolling it, so they can't come in.

 

[hot-gril]

It's not Apple's home, it's MY home, and I would like to invite them in. But Apple has built the wall around my home, and put guards patrolling it, so they can't come in.

If this is your way of thinking about this, you have to use Linux* if you want to be satisfied. There's no controlling every aspect of an Apple product. I see you've got the headphone jack. So do I, and I won't buy another phone that doesn't have one.

* Please nobody lecture me on GNU/Linux. I know, I don't care.

 

[BeefCake 15]

I could care less about Fortnite, but I am absolutely sick of Apple’s heavy-handed authoritarianism in every little thing. This, coupled with the continued decline in hardware choice and software quality, mean that my 2010 MacBook Pro and 2010 Mac Pro will be the last Apple computers I ever own. I’ll be heading to Linux. Freedom is more important to me than some minor conveniences, and I encourage liked-minded folks to consider doing the same.

I have and use Linux but it's far from being as mainstream as people make them out to be....still will need Apple or M$ to get many things done. In terms of basic usage and hobby projects, Linux has been good to me.
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It's not Apple's home, it's MY home, and I would like to invite them in. But Apple has built the wall around my home, and put guards patrolling it, so they can't come in.

How is this different than Sony and Nintendo?

 

[eoblaed]

Just what we need.

• Download app from iOS App Store, which gives a sense of security/safety
• App offers 'in app' purchases that direct you to an out-of-stream, off-app site
• User enters their payment information into this third party site
• User's payment information is then compromised, or used for things they didn't authorize, etc
• -- and/or -- This makes it much harder, if not impossible, for parents to meter how much their child spends on games from the App Store without banning the game altogether

There's a reason why Apple has the in-app model the way it is today, and that reason is also what helps keep the users from getting ripped off, or their bank accounts drained by industrious children.

I get that Epic Games, which already makes money hand over fist, wants to circumvent a fee and I don't think anyone would fault them for that. But, wanting to avoid that fee so much that a they're willing to fundamentally remove the payment security of in-app purchases for all apps and all users everywhere is narcissistic conceit at its height.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

That's the definition of a monopoly.

You should reference the actual definition of monopoly.

While I find the production value of the '1984' punk, and the entire orchestrated PR stunt, pretty well executed, I can't help but wonder the effect it will yield. Has this now ensured Epic Games will never be on an Apple platform again? Do they care? Does anyone?

This is just a stunt, just like Hey. They will fall in line, release an update and that will be that.

The longer this goes on, and especially if Epic can get any fellow giant companies to join them, Apple's going to start alienating more and more customers. In the case of Epic/Fortnite, this includes a historically significant demographic to Apple: kids through young adults.

Long term, Apple needs Epic more than Epic needs Apple.

Epic could stop producing games for iOS and macOS right now and Apple wouldn’t even notice. Epic apparently needs Apple more because they wouldn’t be doing this if they didn’t

The fact is, there are ways around the App Store requirement without actively and explicitly breaking the rules. For example, Epic Games can set it up so that the only way to buy V-Bucks is on the desktop, but the VBucks is tied to your account so you have access to it on any device. Tons of companies do this already - they don't advertise their premium version on the iOS app but their customers know that if they want premium they can purchase it on desktop.

And this is what they’ll probably end up doing. They knew there was a right way to do what they’re trying to do and likely have that build of the app already ready to be reviewed and posted.

 

[lazyrighteye]

The longer this goes on, and especially if Epic can get any fellow giant companies to join them, Apple's going to start alienating more and more customers. In the case of Epic/Fortnite, this includes a historically significant demographic to Apple: kids through young adults.

Long term, Apple needs Epic more than Epic needs Apple.

Short, mid, or long: there’s not a term where Apple needs Epic Games.