Spotify Sides With Epic Games in Battle Against Apple's App Store Fees

[twocents]

This is why I have mixed feelings with Phil Schiller... seems like an alright guy in person, but occasionally comes off as arrogant "One need never pluralise Apple product names" and tone-deaf in light of Congressional investigations with the outright anti-competitive stances as you mentioned

 

[LeadingHeat]

To be clear, I think it's fine for Apple to decide what can and can't go on the App Store. But equally they shouldn't restrict users from installing apps from outside the app store.

while I agree with you mostly, I can easily see the flip side. If they download an app from the internet, and it didn’t get screened by Apple and had malware imbedded in it, Apple could technically still be held liable. Since it infected their iPhone. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Gonna be an interesting year or two as all this dust finally settles.

 

[farewelwilliams]

Problem is they can't because there's no other way to make your app available on iOS.

To be clear, I think it's fine for Apple to decide what can and can't go on the App Store. But equally they shouldn't restrict users from installing apps from outside the app store.

That's how it should be anyways. If third party app stores were allowed, the big guys like Microsoft/Adobe would force customers to install third party app stores creating extreme complexity for users and degrading the performance of the device.

 

[fluchtpunkt]

Allowing multiple payment options discourages in-app purchase since the user shouldn't be asked to enter credit card details on a mobile device. Epic is arguing for 100% of a smaller pie vs 70% of a bigger pie.

If that theory would be true Apple would not lose a single cent by relaxing their rules to allow apps that offer in-app-purchases to also offer their own payment system.

 

[mariusignorello]

2 problems:

1) EPIC would drop Apple payment to bypass parental controls, avoid accountability from Apple's dispute rules and track your identity. This would be a worse experience for consumer.

2) When consumer is not happy what happened (their kid spent $100 in V-bucks), they might not understand who is at fault and complain Apple about that instead of EPIC.

I mentioned this too. Any issues with “external billing” will be immediately pinned on Apple.

 

[Zackmd1]

You know, I would actually love to see other large developers pull the same PR stunt that Epic just pulled. Imagine if Netflix, Amazon, Microsoft, etc... all did the same thing or similar. Apple would be faced with having to remove all of these popular apps OR finally changing there polices without the government needing to get involved.

 

[boss.king]

And now begins the contest of who can pretend to care more about consumers in order to justify a larger share of the profits.

 

[JPack]

while I agree with you mostly, I can easily see the flip side. If they download an app from the internet, and it didn’t get screened by Apple and had malware imbedded in it, Apple could technically still be held liable. Since it infected their iPhone. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Gonna be an interesting year or two as all this dust finally settles.

If that were true, Apple would have been taken to court decades ago. Along with countless other computer manufacturers.

 

[noleli]

You can tell Apple didn’t make the ad because they used straight quotes around "1984" instead of proper “1984”.

 

[mariusignorello]

If that was 5-10% fee it might be a lot better then 15 to 30% fee. Apple is worth way more now, still the rich get richer and the poor developers less so.

The rich get richer because they know how to. Poor people stay poor because of a lack of financial education.

 

[TiggrToo]

On a personal level I may think about moving to Apple Music now.

I was with them until 5 minutes ago, aligning themselves to Epic (who‘s 2019 Fortnite revenue was $1.8bn) is just seedy and headline grabbing.

Granted this’ll mean very little to Spotify, but personally I don’t think I want to associate with anyone who jumps on a poisoned bandwagon.

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

If all the big companies make a stand, then Apple will be left in a bad position where their platform is missing so many of the big apps, that people will move off iOS. This is sort of how unions work - power in numbers against the big powerful player.

 

[farewelwilliams]

yes Apple is free to ask for a 30% cut IF you decide to pay with Apple

what I don’t agree with is being such a bitch about it and not even letting developers mention other payment methods ON TOP

because apple played a hand in converting a customer to a paid customer. it should be up to Netflix to convert the user to a paying customer via the web *BEFORE* the customer downloads the app.

if the customer discovered Netflix inside the app store, Apple deserves a cut.

 

[fluchtpunkt]

If third party app stores were allowed, the big guys like Microsoft/Adobe would force customers to install third party app stores creating extreme complexity for users and degrading the performance of the device.

The Mac must be a horrible platform then. Extremely complex, everyone has dozens of third party app stores installed, and the performance must be so bad.

 

[Rainshadow]

yep. I see nothing wrong with a pop up as they implemented to let the user / customer choose how they’d like to pay. It’s not like they wanted the Apple Payment option to be removed

The pop up didn’t allow the user to decide HOW they wanted to pay. It offered the user a discount forgoing a cut to the marketplace in which the seller is selling. Am I missing something? I may be...

I’m not 100% on apples side with all this, but come on. It’s like a vendor at a sports game having two listed prices - one half price that they won’t give a cut to the arena for. Really? That’s not a choice - that’s evasion of payment for services under the guise of choice. You have to pay something to the “arena”.

 

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

Here we go!!!

Who's side are you on?

 

[jole]

Is this about EPIC maximizing profits or Chinese government defending their intelligence reach?

Fortnight campaign is well planned and coordinated. How much this is decision by Tencent (largest owner of EPIC and one being targeted by Trump for their WeChat) and how much it is really EPIC management calculating that an antitrust lawsuit will eventually help them get more profit from Apple store?

Does it go higher up than Tencent: Is this strategy really decided by Chinese government to distract from case of using WeChat and TikTok to spy globally?

WeChat and TikTok clearly share data with Chinese government. This is expected, US companies are forced to do the same with US government. Does Tencent have enough control of EPIC to allow Chinese spy on platform EPIC software is installed?

 

[Stromos]

Take a second to read the complaint. Epic alleges the single option / Apple payment processing is at issue and monopolistic, not the store. I tend to agree given the law.

Look at it from the store out, not from the product down. For instance, say that a mall forced every store to use the mall's credit card processing service. That's ok because there are many malls and business/consumer choice. But now assume that the mall also makes its own product (phone?), and the only way to sell for the phone is through its mall using its processing service.

If I sell my product online direct from me and I also sell at Walmart can I stand in Walmart advertising you should buy direct from me?

Do you have a choice to do research and decide to buy direct from me?

Apple doesn’t force people to buy anything directly from Apple but if you are in Apples store you are paying a premium for said store to keep running.

I can walk into Best Buy and look around and not buy a thing. Go home and order it all directly. In fact stores like Best Buy are dying because that very thing is happening more and more. Amazing a company protecting itself.

 

[CNiles38006]

Good. Spotify is infinitely better than AM.

I don’t even use Apple Music despite having an iPhone, Mac Mini and Apple TV 4K. On each of those devices I use Spotify.

 

[farewelwilliams]

If that was 5-10% fee it might be a lot better then 15 to 30% fee. Apple is worth way more now, still the rich get richer and the poor developers less so.

5-10% would probably be a money losing venture for Apple considering the amount they reinvest back in to developer resources and services.

 

[lantree]

Why not buy subscriptions and in game stuff direct from the company’s web site instead.
Sometimes big savings can be made this way.

 

[kyleh22]

BOLD. Epic is really going all in on this...

 

[Populus]

Cmon Spotify do the same as Epic and face a ban from Apple. Then let’s see if more apps join the movement.

 

[farewelwilliams]

third party apps should be allowed on iOS just like they are allowed on OS X.

then the iOS store wouldn't be as big as it is today and small developers suffer from that.

would you rather have 100% of a small pie or 70% of a much bigger pie?

 

[HudsonSteele]

Take a second to read the complaint. Epic alleges the single option / Apple payment processing is at issue and monopolistic, not the store. I tend to agree given the law.

Look at it from the store out, not from the product down. For instance, say that a mall forced every store to use the mall's credit card processing service. That's ok because there are many malls and business/consumer choice. But now assume that the mall also makes its own product (phone?), and the only way to sell for the phone is through its mall using its processing service.

I disagree. Its more like, a customer comes into a store, says "I need your store to provide a service people are going to pay me for but you don't get anything." That is literally what they are requesting.