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I think it's true from things I've read.

NEVER abandon a child. Karma will come back and get you.

Absolutely. Karma's a ***** and sometimes she needs a push, but she'll find you and when she does, it's never pretty.
 
If anyone has read the Isaacson book, it didn't exactly paint a "pretty picture" of Steve either. That is as Steve wanted it, he wanted the "REAL" story to be told. For a man that was idolized by so many Mac addicts, fanboi's and geeks... he wanted it known that for all his good he was still very human IMHO. I've been told in the past that Steve had a real issue with people that idolized him for what he did at Apple and I think in hindsight, looking at the Isaacson book, I think he wanted people to idolize Apple on product vs. idolize HIM for making Apple. I think he felt undeserving on other accounts (his life away from 1 Infinite Loop). It gave him credit where it was due but it was pretty coherent and clear in showing that he could be an incredible asinine jerk and that he was far from perfect. I think the human element showed latter in life, when he was humbled by his own mortality. His Princeton speech showed that a lot too IMHO.

Ironically, where Steve was generally keen to micro-manage and pour over every detail in his life seeking perfection... it's sort of his memoir by Isaacson that eschewed that and let it get down to brass tacks on who Steve was and what he really did away from the limelight and pomp and circumstance. He wanted Walter to get it right and didn't want to get in the way of it all to mess it up and polish it to the point he could thump his chest and receive total accolades. He wanted to, "Keep it real."

I think at that stage of Steve's life, it tells a lot about the man and where he'd come from to where he'd ended up. To be honest, he'd probably approve of this book as well. I think he knew that the one area where polish and acclaim wasn't deserved, it was on his life away from Apple. I think he knows there's a lot of things he got wrong, but I also believe he knew there wasn't much avenue to fix it.

I don't doubt that this form of tell-all is being done to capitalize, but can you really blame her? She went through hell, loved a man that toyed with her emotions regularly and then had a child out of wedlock (at a time it was more frowned upon than today) and struggled continuously because of Steve's unwillingness to accept and embrace his own daughter. I mean, in a way he did... he named the Lisa project after her. Latter in life he did visit her. Yet, none of that makes up for all of the suffering, all of the time he distanced himself from her, all of the lack of a "NORMAL" father he was to her. I think his ex deserves every cent she gets from it and has every right to tell this story.

I don't think it's a case where Steve was necessarily a "knowing jerk" about things inasmuch as he was just incredibly quirky... not necessarily always calculating but more a sort of blockade because he couldn't handle it. I mean, Steve was gifted... but I think his incredible gifts came with an incredible price. I don't think he often knew what would come of those actions... but I do think he knew that for all of his fame and fortune and acclaim, that while he could handle some of that... it was real life that he struggled most with. For all of his intellect and ability, I think there came a penance or price in the matter. He wasn't anything like a normal person. I don't think being cold-hearted was necessarily something he wanted to be, it was just a demon he couldn't wrestle away.

I think he had a social connect when it came to selling, but a social disconnect when it came to relationships and real life and how to conduct one. He was a P.T. Barnum-type figure who could hawk and sell anything, could build and help create fantastic goods with the right people and the tenacious drive/streak in him (and the relentlessness of which he pushed his workers), but he struggled just having a simple friendship or relationship. I mean, if you read the Isaacson book about his relationship with Joni Mitchell... you pretty much can see that totally. The whole situation was as quirky as anything I've ever read.

He was young, going through life knowing that he was orphaned (and embattled by it) and was insanely competitive to the point where if you weren't on his level, blood or not blood (i.e. even his parents and step-parents), he tended to drive on past you and focus on the end game for him and Apple. He loved his step-parents and embraced them as his own, but his intellect compared to his Dad sort of led him to distance himself, especially after learning that his Mom and Dad weren't blood-related. So... how normal is that? I could understand the outrage at his blood parents that he exhibited, but distancing yourself from your parents because they're not blood-related (i.e. you're adopted) and because you idolized someone that isn't superior in intellect to you? I went further in college than my father but I never, remotely, would consider not idolizing him for the awesome person he is. I could see that being completely troubling to someone that was as intellectually competitive and driven to not have his father be the smartest person he knew. That was his core value and to him, the world had failed him at that age.

I feel, in a lot of ways, that Apple was his reality distortion field. The place he went where his life was at his best. Where he could create things, where the world was his stage... where the dynamics of his family struggles fell to the background. That was until later in life when he established his family and had a wife that understood and grounded him. A woman could see through his B.S. and call him out on it, that understood him for all of his oddities. At that point, Apple became something even bigger/better... but only because his own life at home was on a different plane than anything he'd had prior. He'd finally met his match and she knew how to keep him in-check and deal with him.

I ask Apple luddite's (those that generally can't accept anyone that comments on Steve not lauding him with praise) not to look at this as Jobs' legacy and vision being sold down the river by someone trying to make a quick buck. I see this as someone, knowing that Jobs' persona draws tons of people in, having an opportunity to benefit herself by telling the truth and putting it into a book. Do I expect it to always be flattering? Obviously not. The Isaacson book was far from and it was openly advocated by Steve! I look at it being a release for Steve. A way to finally let the world know who he really was, for better (his achievements at Apple) and for worse (his poor choices, mistakes, troubled personal and family life, asinine decisions, neglect of key people, etc.). I see this extending from that. I see this being an outlet to help Lisa and her mother heal.
 
I'm not defending Jobs in anyway but I think people forget the age he was when essentially thrown into success.

There aren't many 22/23 year olds I know that aren't arrogant and believe anything is possible along with not really understanding how things said can upset and be offensive to others.

As we get older we become (or should!) a lot wiser and understand people's feelings and how a simple snide remark could hurt someone.

I also think that many didn't stand up to Jobs, I can understand why, but those that did seemed to gain his respect. That's essentially what you have to do with those types of characters, stand up to them, but not just to argue for the sake of it but have a leak proof argument or something incredibly concrete that makes your point worth listening too.
 
Interesting that when a woman writes a book she's "cashing in" or a "gold digger" but when a man backed my a major corporation rushes out a book to capitalize on an untimely death (with movie rights pre-sold!) y'all rush to bookstores.
 
Interesting that when a woman writes a book she's "cashing in" or a "gold digger" but when a man backed my a major corporation rushes out a book to capitalize on an untimely death (with movie rights pre-sold!) y'all rush to bookstores.

Brennan wrote about her off and on five year relationship with Jobs.

Walter Issacson wrote an authorized biography.

Big difference.

I read Issacson's book, but have no interest in Brennan's.
 
From what I have seen from the Jobs movie. Steve was complete low life scum for kicking out his pregnant and letting his child's mother live on Welfare for 2 years whilst Jobs says he refuses to take responsibility the child and claims he is sterile.

This in my books is a very bad thing to do and like the guy a whole lot less in knowing this.

Somebody please educate me if this is not the truth.

It's very true, and its also fairly common among professional athletes. It could be a fear of commitment (I have five kids, first at 22 like Steve, let me tell you the first was terrifying!) or a fear that someone will drag them down right as they achieve personal/professional success or just be a distraction at the worst possible time.

I think with Steve it was a combination of all the above.
 
If you read the Isaacson biography Steve wasn't ever a "family man" even after he got married to Laurene and had three more kids. Laurene said he was a distant father, and I believe that.

I got the impression from the Isaacson biography that Steve Jobs loved two things in the world: Apple and Pixar. His total love, passion and devotion to those two companies made them the great companies they are. The humans in his life were just background noise.
 
The curse of geniuses.

What makes them achieve incredible things also bedevils them by societal rules.

If society recognized that geniuses are typically erratic and will not follow "norms", then maybe people would understand?
 
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Sure sounds like it, but to be honest, I think you're right - it's the price of being a genius. It's hard for anyone to balance a home life and being a genius which has the pull of trying to create, evolve and excel at what you do.

I think the possibility of him bring a prick is just a lack of skills on one hand (ie. how to deal emotionally with people) b/c the other hand is working on the genius side and truly has to no time, or room to develop the other skills.

Maybe not right, maybe not acceptable, but a consequence, I believe so.

Thomas Edison was also considered a crazed man. The stereotypical "mad scientist" caricature is mostly derived in Albert Einsteins image. So yes, that is the price of genius. The price of genius is being misunderstood by us mere mortals who simply can't see the world the way they do.

Steve Jobs actually said these things. In order to look ahead and do whats right, you have to be willing to be misunderstood.

A lot of people also don't consider that he was a young man in his early 20s. I'm sure theres many of us here who are young and in their 20s who couldn't even begin to imagine to have accomplished the things he had at his age. As Jobs got older, he became much more compassionate (especially in his final years), and tempered his emotions. The kinds of bright people that Jobs attracted and inspired certainly wouldn't have looked to him as a leader if they despised him. They were the ones who did understand his genius.

----------

I also think that many didn't stand up to Jobs, I can understand why, but those that did seemed to gain his respect. That's essentially what you have to do with those types of characters, stand up to them, but not just to argue for the sake of it but have a leak proof argument or something incredibly concrete that makes your point worth listening too.

Larry Ellison and Ed Catmull both said these things about Steve. They said Steve wanted to argue, he would say things to stir the pot, because he didn't respect you if you didn't have a point of view and passion behind your arguments. He made decisions based on these arguments. He would literally test you to see if you truly had insight and perspective. It was very easy to gain his respect and trust if you showed him these things. If you were full of hot air, he wouldn't hesitate for one second to tell you.
 
Ironic how it is available first on Amazon's Book Store and not Apple's..

How so? Jobs was a SOB to Brennan and at times the daughter they shared. So it seems quite expected and even predictable that it would be on Amazon before Apple b/c it's an Apple competitor in the digital media and devices space.

It seems to me it would be ironic if the book first appeared on the Apple Book Store and led the sales chart there given that this book appears to be a not-so-flattering "tell all" book on their relationship.
 
Larry Ellison and Ed Catmull both said these things about Steve. They said Steve wanted to argue, he would say things to stir the pot, because he didn't respect you if you didn't have a point of view and passion behind your arguments. He made decisions based on these arguments. He would literally test you to see if you truly had insight and perspective. It was very easy to gain his respect and trust if you showed him these things. If you were full of hot air, he wouldn't hesitate for one second to tell you.

Interesting. No doubt he wouldn't have been easy, even to the extent of trying to argue down your concrete evidence but perseverance would be key I think until it got through to him.

Good point about the genius aspect as well, you're absolutely right and ironically we need people in the world like this, without them it would likely be a very boring place to live.
 
If anyone has read the Isaacson book, it didn't exactly paint a "pretty picture" of Steve either. That is as Steve wanted it, he wanted the "REAL" story to be told. For a man that was idolized by so many Mac addicts, fanboi's and geeks... he wanted it known that for all his good he was still very human IMHO. I've been told in the past that Steve had a real issue with people that idolized him for what he did at Apple and I think in hindsight, looking at the Isaacson book, I think he wanted people to idolize Apple on product vs. idolize HIM for making Apple. I think he felt undeserving on other accounts (his life away from 1 Infinite Loop). It gave him credit where it was due but it was pretty coherent and clear in showing that he could be an incredible asinine jerk and that he was far from perfect. I think the human element showed latter in life, when he was humbled by his own mortality. His Princeton speech showed that a lot too IMHO.

Ironically, where Steve was generally keen to micro-manage and pour over every detail in his life seeking perfection... it's sort of his memoir by Isaacson that eschewed that and let it get down to brass tacks on who Steve was and what he really did away from the limelight and pomp and circumstance. He wanted Walter to get it right and didn't want to get in the way of it all to mess it up and polish it to the point he could thump his chest and receive total accolades. He wanted to, "Keep it real."

I think at that stage of Steve's life, it tells a lot about the man and where he'd come from to where he'd ended up. To be honest, he'd probably approve of this book as well. I think he knew that the one area where polish and acclaim wasn't deserved, it was on his life away from Apple. I think he knows there's a lot of things he got wrong, but I also believe he knew there wasn't much avenue to fix it.

I don't doubt that this form of tell-all is being done to capitalize, but can you really blame her? She went through hell, loved a man that toyed with her emotions regularly and then had a child out of wedlock (at a time it was more frowned upon than today) and struggled continuously because of Steve's unwillingness to accept and embrace his own daughter. I mean, in a way he did... he named the Lisa project after her. Latter in life he did visit her. Yet, none of that makes up for all of the suffering, all of the time he distanced himself from her, all of the lack of a "NORMAL" father he was to her. I think his ex deserves every cent she gets from it and has every right to tell this story.

I don't think it's a case where Steve was necessarily a "knowing jerk" about things inasmuch as he was just incredibly quirky... not necessarily always calculating but more a sort of blockade because he couldn't handle it. I mean, Steve was gifted... but I think his incredible gifts came with an incredible price. I don't think he often knew what would come of those actions... but I do think he knew that for all of his fame and fortune and acclaim, that while he could handle some of that... it was real life that he struggled most with. For all of his intellect and ability, I think there came a penance or price in the matter. He wasn't anything like a normal person. I don't think being cold-hearted was necessarily something he wanted to be, it was just a demon he couldn't wrestle away.

I think he had a social connect when it came to selling, but a social disconnect when it came to relationships and real life and how to conduct one. He was a P.T. Barnum-type figure who could hawk and sell anything, could build and help create fantastic goods with the right people and the tenacious drive/streak in him (and the relentlessness of which he pushed his workers), but he struggled just having a simple friendship or relationship. I mean, if you read the Isaacson book about his relationship with Joni Mitchell... you pretty much can see that totally. The whole situation was as quirky as anything I've ever read.

He was young, going through life knowing that he was orphaned (and embattled by it) and was insanely competitive to the point where if you weren't on his level, blood or not blood (i.e. even his parents and step-parents), he tended to drive on past you and focus on the end game for him and Apple. He loved his step-parents and embraced them as his own, but his intellect compared to his Dad sort of led him to distance himself, especially after learning that his Mom and Dad weren't blood-related. So... how normal is that? I could understand the outrage at his blood parents that he exhibited, but distancing yourself from your parents because they're not blood-related (i.e. you're adopted) and because you idolized someone that isn't superior in intellect to you? I went further in college than my father but I never, remotely, would consider not idolizing him for the awesome person he is. I could see that being completely troubling to someone that was as intellectually competitive and driven to not have his father be the smartest person he knew. That was his core value and to him, the world had failed him at that age.

I feel, in a lot of ways, that Apple was his reality distortion field. The place he went where his life was at his best. Where he could create things, where the world was his stage... where the dynamics of his family struggles fell to the background. That was until later in life when he established his family and had a wife that understood and grounded him. A woman could see through his B.S. and call him out on it, that understood him for all of his oddities. At that point, Apple became something even bigger/better... but only because his own life at home was on a different plane than anything he'd had prior. He'd finally met his match and she knew how to keep him in-check and deal with him.

I ask Apple luddite's (those that generally can't accept anyone that comments on Steve not lauding him with praise) not to look at this as Jobs' legacy and vision being sold down the river by someone trying to make a quick buck. I see this as someone, knowing that Jobs' persona draws tons of people in, having an opportunity to benefit herself by telling the truth and putting it into a book. Do I expect it to always be flattering? Obviously not. The Isaacson book was far from and it was openly advocated by Steve! I look at it being a release for Steve. A way to finally let the world know who he really was, for better (his achievements at Apple) and for worse (his poor choices, mistakes, troubled personal and family life, asinine decisions, neglect of key people, etc.). I see this extending from that. I see this being an outlet to help Lisa and her mother heal.

This is a very excellent post. I won't go on and rehash any of it. I'll just say that I scratch my head when I see people say things like, "Maybe this will be more revealing than the Isaacson book, and tell us what the real Steve Jobs was like." I don't know what book you read, but the Isaacson book tells a story of a man who, while genius on some levels was a complete horse's ass starting from about 16 until he got into his mid-30s. He was a flawed human being, like most of us. To me it doesn't diminish his genius. And I accept the fact that he grew as a person. But the Isaacson book did not idolize him.
 
Not sure what to think of an ex-girlfriend of a recently deceased man wanting to capitalize on his fame... On the other hand, the curious within me is kind of intrigued since this part of Steve Jobs isn't very explored. But it's a dirty interest. Like being interested in an article in a tabloid.

Well, she didn't manage to capitalize on his wealth when she was a single mother and the father of the child was worth about $200 million...


From what I have seen from the Jobs movie. Steve was complete low life scum for kicking out his pregnant and letting his child's mother live on Welfare for 2 years whilst Jobs says he refuses to take responsibility the child and claims he is sterile.

That said, I know fathers who are worse than Jobs. An awful lot worse.
 
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In an alternate universe, alternate-Steve took out the trash, did the dishes, and snuggled up on the couch with his sweetie, falling asleep together watching "Friends" on TV. Alternate-Steve had an idea for a revolutionary smartphone in the back of his head, but he was content with his simple life and could never motivate himself to do the work necessary to bring it to fruition. :eek:
 
I met Steve when he was 21 and worked with him. I didn't have any visibility into his private life.

But the notion that Steve was not a great boyfriend/partner at 21 isn't a big shock to me. Nor should it be to anyone that a driven 21 year old isn't good relationship material.
 
Brennan wrote about her off and on five year relationship with Jobs.

Walter Issacson wrote an authorized biography.

Big difference.

How so? They're both books. One is of someone's personal experiences with a man, the other was rushed out to capitalize on that man's death and made the people involved a whoooole lotta money. Neither is more legitimate than the other, and the catcalls of "cashgrab" and "gold digger" towards the one written by a female (and the one that stands to make far less money) seem hypocritical and gross.
 
Wow, Steve Jobs sounds like the kind of person you just wouldn't want to be around. So many stories of him being a complete prick. Maybe that's the price of genius.

He was a prick. That is the price of genius.

A lot of Genius level type people are not very nice/sociable people that you would want to live with on a daily basis.
 
I was reading about it earlier online and it doesn't surprise me at all. Steve Jobs was never the warmest of men. He was known for be a shrewd businessman but thats what it took for him to get to the place he was before he past.
 
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