Steve Jobs Suggests Blu-ray Not Coming to Mac Anytime Soon

[Carniphage]

Except the Music download industry as been at it for quite some time, and they still haven't killed off the CD. How long do you think video is going to take ?

The question is not "When will Apple kill off the CD?" No one cares about that.
The question is "When will Apple have a profitable digital music distribution network." - and I think you will find that was quite a while ago.

Like it or not, the transition to internet distributed video has already started. Apple does not need to kill-off disk-based video. It just needs to get a sufficient chunk of the distribution market - and let Moore's law do the rest of the work.

Sabotaging its own nascent efforts by supporting BluRay would be a perverse move wouldn't it?

C.

 

[Carniphage]

if you can't read then I give up...

the link actually explains that c. 50% of consumers in music /video are shunning downloads..

Sorry, the link I read said this:

A survey of over 1,000 people by research firm Ipsos MediaCT found that 64 per cent preferred physical discs for their games over digital copies.
Newspapers followed closely with 63 per cent opting for hard copies. Conversely music and film were considerably lower, with a respective 45 and 51 per cent shunning digital.
“I believe the preference for physical discs amongst next gen gamers reflects the potential value they derive from the pre-owned market, which is holding up the preference for physical – this is unlike the music and film markets,” said Ipsos MediaCT director Ian Bramley.
“Physical games discs have a long and well-established history, which is a deep mindset to change – particularly when gamers build a physical collection as they fear losing digital versions. And in-store browsing is also important to buyers.”

MCV is a games magazine, so its about games.

C.

 

[peppespizzapie]

a load of bullocks!!

And this from a man who produced the most BEAUTIFULL things on earth?? Now satisfite with ******** like enything else the the best (blue ray) ??
Stevie, whazzup, dont they wanne pay you enough?? You still wanne continue with the crap YOU call hd in itunes and thrue apple tv?? You let customers pay MORE for buying (again what YOU call HD) films for youre so called hd??
YOUR hd sucks stevie!! Sucks BIG time! It has NOTHING to do with hd what you are selling!! The picture quality SUCKS and yourse (so called) dolby digital sound STINKS!! Sometimes, Stevie, its even plain MONO on the films YOU sell as being dolby digital 5.1

Get off it, pay the people!! Like you they have been working for it. And it SHOWS!!! 1080P is QUALITY!!! What YOU are trying to sell is BULLOCK! CRAP!

 

[KnightWRX]

The question is not "When will Apple kill off the CD?" No one cares about that.
The question is "When will Apple have a profitable digital music distribution network." - and I think you will find that was quite a while ago.

Like it or not, the transition to internet distributed video has already started. Apple does not need to kill-off disk-based video. It just needs to get a sufficient chunk of the distribution market - and let Moore's law do the rest of the work.

Sabotaging its own nascent efforts by supporting BluRay would be a perverse move wouldn't it?

C.

Why would it be sabotaging ? You could and still can play music CDs on Macs and yet they are now the #1 digital download store on the Internet, even if CD sales are still king. So why would the same not apply to movies/TV shows...

Are you even thinking your arguments through ?

 

[Carniphage]

Why would it be sabotaging ?

Tesla have a view on the future of motoring. They (rightly or wrongly) believe the future is electric vehicles.

Consequently they don't offer a gas-engine version. Despite it being a popular way to power a car. It just does not fit with their view of the future.

C.

 

[KnightWRX]

Tesla have a view on the future of motoring. They (rightly or wrongly) believe the future is electric vehicles.

Consequently they don't offer a gas-engine version. Despite it being a popular way to power a car. It just does not fit with their view of the future.

C.

Why did you ignore the rest of my post. Reply to this part :

You could and still can play music CDs on Macs and yet they are now the #1 digital download store on the Internet, even if CD sales are still king. So why would the same not apply to movies/TV shows...

Are you even thinking your arguments through ?

Until you do, conversation over, you've lost.

 

[xbjllb]

If you buy a Mac, you don't get the BluRay. Tant Pis!

This is not a complex problem.
If you want BluRay, buy a Vaio. or a Dell. What exactly is the problem?

C.

To the core of the question. And thanks to all who've taken on the brattiness far better than I could have.

C: C!!! We're here because we care about Apple. And our greater experience in life (mine going on six decades) leads us to believe that Apple will absolutely fail if they continue their current path, as many other Number One corporations before them HAVE ALREADY. We've seen it before, and we'll see it again, while you don't even know who Shirley Bassey IS.

Apple DOES need Blu-ray. Apple DOES need desktop computers, and flagship ones at that, that have all the bells and whistles BEFORE anyone else. So they can charge their premium prices and DESERVE them, and NOT just for a quick processor switch to fake the update number at the MacRumors "When To Buy A Mac" Page while they hope no one is looking.

Not an archaic OS and hardware and system where, IF you get this extra thing, and jump through these extra hoops, and run WINDOWS, you can watch a Blu-ray disc on the cutting edge video card of THREE YEARS AGO.

Are you beginning to get it? We're fighting for Apple to be cutting edge, to EARN the Apple premium for something other than fad iCrap for iKiddies cool dude Steve Jobs crapped out one day while thinking of how to copy other hardware and how to bring back old fads.

And you keep saying it's just fine, APPLE DOESN'T NEED TO BE CUTTING EDGE.

You are WRONG. WE"VE seen companies fail before; you either haven't or haven't learned anything from them or learned the wrong things.

You ARE Steve Jobs. And you ARE the weakest link.

 

[Carniphage]

Why did you ignore the rest of my post. Reply to this part :
Until you do, conversation over, you've lost.

Didn't realise you were the referee of this match!


Every Mac can play CDs.
But no one ever does.

Instead this is what happens.
1) Insert a CD in slot.
2) Press Rip - and shift the content into iTunes.
3) Press eject
4) Return disk to shelf. And then never ever touch it again.

This mechanism allowed customers to build-up a media collection in iTunes before the store was off the ground. The CD slot let them transfer their purchased collection into the digital realm.

A BluRay slot in a Mac would be a very different mechanism. A built-in device for supporting Sony's vision of the media future. Not Apple's.

This is Apple's commercial decision to make. They might have gotten it wrong. But if they have, they will pay for the error.

C.

 

[Surreal]

Why did you ignore the rest of my post. Reply to this part :



Until you do, conversation over, you've lost.

If someone buys a physical copy, where is Apple's cut? Much the opposite of getting a cut, they pay to provide that ability.

Thenthere is apple's lesson learned about mindshare. Allowing blu Ray only increases the likelihood that people will think of blu Ray for purchasing movies for their Mac instead of iTunes.


(and, just to be clear, I actually strongly prefer CDs. I do, however, understand the business sense in this.)

 

[xbjllb]

This is Apple's commercial decision to make. They might have gotten it wrong. But if they have, they will pay for the error.

C.

Just so we understand that YOU understand you are lobbying for Apple's FAILURE, and instead of trying to argue to turn them around and stop them from going over the cliff, you are choosing to push them over it with your position.

You can stop now. We know who the true consumer supporters of Apple are, and how they see the issue. For everything negative I've said about Steve Jobs, and it has been considerable, the end result would be IF HE LISTENS to me and the others here, and ignores you and your ilk, he will not have only saved his own job but Apple itself.

 

[Carniphage]

(and, just to be clear, I actually strongly prefer CDs. I do, however, understand the business sense in this.)

A rational viewpoint.

Just a quick question. If you were prevented from ripping CDs by means of aggressive copy protection. And you could no longer put music on an iPod etc.

Would you *still* prefer CDs?

C.

 

[KnightWRX]

Didn't realise you were the referee of this match!


Every Mac can play CDs.
But no one ever does.

Evidence ?

A BluRay slot in a Mac would be a very different mechanism. A built-in device for supporting Sony's vision of the media future. Not Apple's.

This is Apple's commercial decision to make. They might have gotten it wrong. But if they have, they will pay for the error.

C.

Again, Sony's vision ? Haven't you been proven wrong enough times yet ? Blu-ray is an industry effort, it is not Sony's effort. Do we need to cite the dozens of sources showing that Sony is not even a majority stake holder in the Blu-ray consortium and that even Apple is part of the board of directors ?

Delusional as always. Again, I'm not referee, but you've lost. You have nothing, you're just speculating and being paranoid that big bad Sony is out to get you.

If someone buys a physical copy, where is Apple's cut? Much the opposite of getting a cut, they pay to provide that ability.

Thenthere is apple's lesson learned about mindshare. Allowing blu Ray only increases the likelihood that people will think of blu Ray for purchasing movies for their Mac instead of iTunes.

You didn't even answer my premise. CD playback always worked and still does on Mac. This hasn't hurt iTunes. Why would Blu-ray playback hurt iTunes ?

You're like Carniphage in that you don't actually answer, you spin and rant.

 

[xbjllb]

A rational viewpoint.

Just a quick question. If you were prevented from ripping CDs by means of aggressive copy protection. And you could no longer put music on an iPod etc.

Would you *still* prefer CDs?

C.

Do you have any idea how many music professionals (people who make their living creating, recording, and selling music) don't have iPods, never did, and never will? People to whom music is work don't need it with them 24/7, for it is, work.

Your and Steve Jobs' vision of the future doesn't exist yet, and if humanity chooses to remain humanity, won't ever. I'm referring to the endgame ultimate goal of all this, where all humans are plugged into 10G or whatever it will be called with Steve Jobs' iBrain chip, 24/7, at the beck and call of their employers, the government, and their families, with no way to turn it off and no escape, and worst of all, no DESIRE to ever turn it off because you'll miss catching the next episode of Idol as it goes down and have to hear the "news" from someone else.

In the meantime, back on planet earth, in the here and now, it will be decades before governments in the throes of the GreatEST Depression, will have the money for broadband to all reaches of their realms. And plastic discs will be with us for longer than anyone realizes.

To this day, DAT, two full decades after being declared dead as a consumer format and certainly so, exists in every pro and the majority of semi-pro recording studios as an archival medium and, in some rare cases, a method of delivery. And that's for something far more complex than a plastic disc, and I can still buy blank DAT tapes. And that's a format that didn't rely on a second coming like vinyl via DJ's and clubs.

It must suck to be so inexperienced in life and know so much. Wrong.



P.S. I can see it now. Dateline 2025: Steve Job's brain (transferred into a mainframe at death and running Apple the past decade and a half) declared yesterday that Apple users have NO NEED WHATSOEVER for an ON-OFF switch in the new Apple iBrain chip. While the Apple faithful, 90% under 17 years of age, lined up in queues that stretched around entire city blocks to be the first implanted with the newest version of the device.

Orwell was able to see it decades ago.

 

[Carniphage]

Delusional as always. Again, I'm not referee, but you've lost. You have nothing, you're just speculating and being paranoid that big bad Sony is out to get you.

Can you talk to person who disagrees with you without being rude?

Sony are a well established technology company like Apple. And just like Apple, they are out to make money. Just like everybody else.

They do this by developing technologies and benefitting from the licence fees, sales of hardware and so on.

Yes, Sony are not the only company behind BluRay, but they are the largest single contributor to the project. And stand the most to gain from its success.

Sony and Apple have different views on how the future of media will develop.

That difference of opinion is not a bad thing. Competition and choice are not really bad things.

C.

 

[KnightWRX]

Yes, Sony are not the only company behind BluRay, but they are the largest single contributor to the project. And stand the most to gain from its success.

I'm being rude and yet you keep repeating falsehoods as if they were gospel ? Do you even wonder why people don't want to discuss with you ?

You've been proven wrong, again and again, on this very point and yet you still come back with it.

Discussion over, this is not a difference of opinion, this is you not accepting the truth. Any arguments you bring forth is tainted by your warped world view and is thus invalid.

 

[Carniphage]

I'm being rude and yet you keep repeating falsehoods as if they were gospel ? Do you even wonder why people don't want to discuss with you ?

You've been proven wrong, again and again, on this very point and yet you still come back with it.

Discussion over, this is not a difference of opinion, this is you not accepting the truth. Any arguments you bring forth is tainted by your warped world view and is thus invalid.

Erm.

Can you cite any evidence (at all) that supports whatever it is that you think you have proven.

And please, try it without the name calling. It does not really support your argument.

C.

 

[KnightWRX]

Erm.

Can you cite any evidence (at all) that supports whatever it is that you think you have proven.

And please, try it without the name calling. It does not really support your argument.

C.

Cite evidence ? It's all over this thread. You've been claiming Sony is a majority holder of blu-ray interest and people have been debunking you every step of the way, yet you come back and state again Sony is a majority holder...

Do I really need to go back through this thread to dig everything up ? Go back to page 1, read the replies to your posts, and then drop the gospel against Bad Evil Sony.

As for name calling, report my post, let the moderators judge it. I don't see where I used name calling in this instance. I stated my opinion about your posts and I stand behind what I said.

 

[xbjllb]

I'm being rude and yet you keep repeating falsehoods as if they were gospel ? Do you even wonder why people don't want to discuss with you ?

You've been proven wrong, again and again, on this very point and yet you still come back with it.

Discussion over, this is not a difference of opinion, this is you not accepting the truth. Any arguments you bring forth is tainted by your warped world view and is thus invalid.

Knight, C is unfortunately behaving like a net succubus that just wants to keep an argument going at any cost. It's a British attention-craving pastime, often carried out by drunks in pubs. Monty Python made quite a bit of sport with it in several skits.

It's fine as long as you're aware of it and can use it to make your extremely valid points, but you'll be having to do it over and over.



P.S. Apple MAY be paying him by the word.

 

[macdrew]

If you haven't realised *MATE* the world doesn't all have flat rate internet; so what, the US has flat rate internet, well, what about the rest of the world? epic fail on your part, try again and this time realise that the product is going to be shipped world wide

Why is that Apple's problem? It sounds like you live in a low tech country, so why should Apple lower their standards to accomodate a backwards infrastructure? That would make no sense. Put pressure on your representatives or internet providers to get up to speed... Apple shouldn't have to play to the lowest common denominator just to make you happy, that's not how they roll.

 

[bartzilla]

So because he won't support a standard that you want him to, You vilify someone.

Yes, I know, what a shock. It isn't like that happens in droves here every time Microsoft don't support a standard that Apple are pushing.

 

[xbjllb]

Why is that Apple's problem? It sounds like you live in a low tech country, so why should Apple lower their standards to accomodate a backwards infrastructure? That would make no sense. Put pressure on your representatives or internet providers to get up to speed... Apple shouldn't have to play to the lowest common denominator just to make you happy, that's not how they roll.

No, of course not, how Apple rolls is dictating to countries of the world in the throes of the GreatEST Depression to hurry up and get broadband to everyone so that piracy can continue unabated and they can then do to the film industry what they did to the record industry; become the sole distribution outlet after destroying all other avenues of sale via easy piracy.

And by going down that dark road, Apple via Steve Jobs opened itself up to all sorts of government intrusion, eager to make deals to get their hooks into those iBrain "always-on" implant chip plans of his. You can have all sorts of monopolies as long as the gov is your silent partner.

 

[macdrew]

Could you stream me Avatar in BR quality, please? Apple might be ahead of the game but Apple fans clearly are not. By using iTunes they are still watching sub-DVD quality movies whilst the world moved on to BR quality.

No, plenty of people have 20 to 108Mbps connections now, so streaming isn't a problem, and why would you want to watch it in iTunes? That's what the AppleTV is for... very few can tell the difference between BR and DVD quality, even fewer even care. So you are arguing for 2% of the market, yawn... 98% of the market is what Apple is focused on over the next 5 years.

 

[Carniphage]

Cite evidence ? It's all over this thread. You've been claiming Sony is a majority holder of blu-ray interest and people have been debunking you every step of the way, yet you come back and state again Sony is a majority holder...

I believe I said "largest single contributor"

But whover owns BluRay, Be it Sony, the Pope or Paris Hilton, the argument does not really change.

Here's what I have been saying...
Apple entered the digital music player business when it's competitors were selling physical format players. Physical CD players, Minidiscs and so on. Formats that were developed by Philips, Sony and others.

Apple disrupted this market by adopting a file-based player. And later built on this by selling music directly as files using an Internet based solution.
This business model has worked for Apple. It has been very sucessful. And it is rational for Apple to try the same trick with movie and TV.

This is a commercial strategy which may bite Apple in the ass. But companies are allowed to pursue commercial strategies. And an open market means that if consumers don't like it, they are free to go elsewhere.

Since BluRay appeared, Apples share price has continued to rise. So if this is hurting Apple it is not hurting by much.

As for name calling, report my post, let the moderators judge it. I don't see where I used name calling in this instance. I stated my opinion about your posts and I stand behind what I said.

I must have been "paranoid" or had a "warped world view" to come to that conclusion.

C.

 

[xbjllb]

That's what the AppleTV is for... very few can tell the difference between BR and DVD quality, even fewer even care. So you are arguing for 2% of the market, yawn... 98% of the market is what Apple is focused on over the next 5 years.

Apple charges a premium not for being cool; not for being Apple; not for something flushing out of Steve Jobs.

Apple charges a premium for the ONLY LOGICAL reason it can in a market in a depressed economy; because Apple products are supposed to be BETTER by being CUTTING EDGE.

Being cutting edge means you give people what they need BEFORE THEY EVEN REALIZE they need it.

Being cutting edge means you give people the latest technology BEFORE ANYONES ELSE DOES.

Not a single item of iCrap is, or has ever been, CUTTING EDGE. What it is is rehashed old fads and reworked versions of failed product.

And the only way it has changed life is in the negative. People and CORPORATIONS now answer 15-20% of their e-mail because it's impossible to do so on the go. Where they used to answer 98% of it AT THEIR DESKS.

People plugged into the net in public are zombies unaware of the world around them. Texting alone has resulted in how many hundreds of millions of needless traffic deaths?

Now kids can make drug and sex hookup dates right under Mom and Dad's noses. That's progress.

But I digress. Apple will fail if it continues to insist that by hawking the lastest iFad, even to the tunes of billions in sales, it is being progressive.

It ISN'T. It is devolving, not evolving.

I don't care how many hundreds of millions you throw at the net and the mainstream media, sooner or later people blink and you don't have on any clothes.

Apple is getting to that point, and there will be darn few of the old high end high ticket base left to save it, and no reason to either.

 

[D*I*S_Frontman]

The big "ifs"

If Apple can upgrade the iTunes Movie in the following ways, I'd be more than happy to say "forget commercial Blu-Ray playback":


.....1. 1080p resolution

.....2. a codec equal to or superior to that of Blu-Ray's
..............(a pixelated 1080p is worse than a tighter 720p)

.....3. All the extra features and surround options of a
..............conventional Blu-Ray commercial release


If Apple does that, I'll be down with Steve all the way. If I have to start my movie night download @ 5:30pm for an 8:00pm showing due to bandwidth issues, I could live with that.

Until those thresholds are reached, however, I'll stick with Blu-Ray and join the chorus of those who would beg Steve Jobs to reconsider his decisions in this regard. I still like optical media for archives of huge files/projects.

I'll be holding out on any further Apple CPU purchases until the situation is rectified, one way or the other, and encouraging others to do the same.