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Surface Devices
- Thread starter Dave245
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But this was just an A12Z processor, basically, an iPad processor from 2018. If it runs like that with that processor, on emulation...these new Macs will be insane.
We'll have to wait and see on that. I'm not disagreeing, but WWDC is biased where Apple wants to showcase their technology isn't the best idea. As @Queen6 mentioned WWDC is a sales and marketing showcase and not meant to get actual independent numbers or benchmarks.
Apple showed us carefully edited pre-recorded footage. They did not mention on what kind of configuration it was running exactly. What I could see was that Tomb Raider looked pretty bad.
In short: Their information in that respect was pretty vague. I don't say you are wrong, but maybe a little bit premature to draw conclusions?
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Macs are not known for gaming. My 13” MacBook Pro (2019) plays the Sims 4 well enough, outside of that if I want to game I play on my PS4 or XBox One.
I think Apple will do great with their own chip set, they have been killing the competition when it comes to iPad and iPhone chips, most Android phones are a couple of years behind Apple. The same thing can be said for tablets, Apple leapfrogs then when it comes to the in-house chips.
I will wait and see what happens later this year, but consider me impressed. Yesterday’s WWDC was one of the best (Alongside 2017 when they announced the iPad Pro).
I think Apple will do great with their own chip set, they have been killing the competition when it comes to iPad and iPhone chips, most Android phones are a couple of years behind Apple. The same thing can be said for tablets, Apple leapfrogs then when it comes to the in-house chips.
I will wait and see what happens later this year, but consider me impressed. Yesterday’s WWDC was one of the best (Alongside 2017 when they announced the iPad Pro).
eh, no. They will be terrible for gaming if emulation is the way to go for Macs in the future.
Given they had it all pre-planned, pre-recorded, you would think they could fake it to make it rather than it appearing as bad as it did.
After reading the news, I'm extremely relieved I my attempt to embrace the Apple ecosystem last year failed. I think I argued with some here about the possibility of this happening (@LeeW perhaps?). I like my crow deep fried, please.
That's horrid.They took a seven year old game and managed to make it look worse on a 2020 Mac than if it were running on a seven year old PC. Why even show this and pretend it looks good?
edit: didn't realize this was Shadow of the Tomb Raider. Thanks, @grmlin
Mac users might as well embrace game streaming at this point when it comes to AAA gaming. A bit ironic that most are going to have to turn to some of Apple's biggest rivals like Google, Microsoft, and Nvidia if they want to play games on the Mac.
So will these new ARM Macs allow non-Apple store apps?
That's horrid.
edit: didn't realize this was Shadow of the Tomb Raider. Thanks, @grmlin
Mac users might as well embrace game streaming at this point when it comes to AAA gaming. A bit ironic that most are going to have to turn to some of Apple's biggest rivals like Google, Microsoft, and Nvidia if they want to play games on the Mac.
So will these new ARM Macs allow non-Apple store apps?
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To be fair, Shadow of the Tombraider released end of 2018 I think.
Mac's were never a decent gaming platform, Apple will likely focus on it's own game store and a plethora of IOS games. Maybe in time, but be a good while and W10 nor Linux PC's will standstill either.
Showing Tomb Raider running on what they have now is a good illustration of Apple's SOC advancements, equally they should be realistic. Was like a second hand car salesman trying to move the oldest car on the lot LOL. Personally I think all a little too early with far too much bravado. Maybe Apple is just EOL with it's Intel designs, let's be straight they've not been much good for years now...
Q-6
Showing Tomb Raider running on what they have now is a good illustration of Apple's SOC advancements, equally they should be realistic. Was like a second hand car salesman trying to move the oldest car on the lot LOL. Personally I think all a little too early with far too much bravado. Maybe Apple is just EOL with it's Intel designs, let's be straight they've not been much good for years now...
Q-6
Why even a new mac mini or a desktop with a nice 4k/5k screen gives you options
Why even a new mac mini or a desktop with a nice 4k/5k screen gives you options
Leave the poor boy alone, his indecision is gone, he is firmly back in Apples Arms.
See what I did there.
Dave it does not take much spin from Apple to bring out the catch phrase in you, a couple of days back you were getting the Galaxy Note20
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Sorry to slow had another in the can already LOL
True, Tomb Raider didn’t look amazing. Still, it looked better than it does on my Surface Pro 7 (where it is basically unplayable at 720p) and it was emulated on prototype chip and using unfinished software.
Of course...WWDC is not an unbiased source. And Yeah, absolutely, it is premature. 🙂But if that demo was running on the A12Z processor included in the dev Mac Mini, then, it is quite impressive to me.
Still, I am not drawing conclusions and my trust on Apple is probably much lower than the average one on Macrumors. We will have to wait and see.
Ps: My problems with Apple are not about performance, so my interest in these processors is purely ‘academic’. 🙂
Apples and oranges, you can't compare a low powered surface device running with an i3 or i5 (i7?) and only a iGPU.
Maybe. But I expect these Apple processors to be equally low powered and to also have integrated GPUs. At least on base configurations. If the game was running on the A12z, that's lower power than the 15w i5-1035G4 of my Surface. And that Tomb Raider runs slowly (~20fps at 1080p, min 18:10) even on an actively-cooled laptop featuring a 10th gen i7 with the latest Iris Plus (i7-1065G7).
Future devices, yes, but they're showing off their most powerful products to showcase the power and performance.
Not for nothing, Tomb Raider runs like butter on my Razer
Why even a new mac mini or a desktop with a nice 4k/5k screen gives you options
Because I really like the iMac! my 2012 has been a dream to use over the years. It’s why I’m holding out for the new design whether it has ARM or not.
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Dave it does not take much spin from Apple to bring out the catch phrase in you, a couple of days back you were getting the Galaxy Note20
I’m still interested in the Note and the Surface Duo is definitely on my list! just because I’m happy with what Apple announced yesterday doesn’t mean I can’t also buy another device to use alongside my current iPhone 11 Pro Max.
So good, the A chips kill their iPads too.
In process of getting rid of both iPads before they become completely unusable.Windows won’t be perfect, but it will give me everything I need and want now.
I hope Apple’s transition works for you and the folks who want it.
The wall around the garden is getting taller, I have no doubt that the move to ARM will hand Apple more control but is it all bad? For the majority, probably not. Apple or someone claims in the region of 100m active Macs out there in the world. I suspect the amount of 'Pro' users represent the smallest percentage of that number and the majority are casual users.
Given the direction of Apple, the Keynote appeared to further cement their desire to appeal more to the casual user than the pro. I suspect also that we will start to see more price drops on hardware going forward and/or devices that will appeal more to the casual users whilst pulling them in further on the App/Service purchases.
For Apple and their new target audience it is a win/win, even if the wall around the garden is getting higher, it makes no real difference to the majority who are happy to be there and improving the interoperability of their devices will only serve to excite people more than ever.
ARM chips that perform really well, more GPU capability, it all adds up to positives for the masses and will let Apple grow even further.
I really want Apple to pull it off but I guess I am a dinosaur now and Apple is no longer for people like me, maybe, I don't know, time will tell
Given the direction of Apple, the Keynote appeared to further cement their desire to appeal more to the casual user than the pro. I suspect also that we will start to see more price drops on hardware going forward and/or devices that will appeal more to the casual users whilst pulling them in further on the App/Service purchases.
For Apple and their new target audience it is a win/win, even if the wall around the garden is getting higher, it makes no real difference to the majority who are happy to be there and improving the interoperability of their devices will only serve to excite people more than ever.
ARM chips that perform really well, more GPU capability, it all adds up to positives for the masses and will let Apple grow even further.
I really want Apple to pull it off but I guess I am a dinosaur now and Apple is no longer for people like me, maybe, I don't know, time will tell
This is Apple... In my view, there is nothing wrong with Apple going in this direction with their software. They have needed to do something with MacOS for quite awhile. It will be nice to have another system in the mix if they do it well, and using their own hardware may improve things... In theory this should work, I can't help but notice that this theory has been fact with IOS which is their own hardware and software, and they have stumbled on more then a few occasions. Anyone remember the "bricked" iPads? However I don't buy into the idea that their chips are better than Intel or AMD, nor do I go with the excuse that some made that Intel somehow let Apple down and that is why they don't upgrade on time. I remember how long it took them to upgrade the MacBook Pro and it had nothing to do with Intel.
If they finally pull off competent software and hardware, and improve their recent track record, good for them and all of the Apple fans that depend on them.
Surface Duo could be launching VERY soon. A guy on Twitter has found that the Duo has appeared into the Your Phone feature of Windows.
www.t3.com
Microsoft’s Surface Duo lines up Samsung Galaxy Fold 2 sucker punch
The Surface Duo is aiming to eclipse the Galaxy Fold 2 with an early release
LOL, couldn't make it up, look what just arrived. 🤣
A gift from the office.
A gift from the office.
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I’m not sure that’s true - the SoC that it was being demoed on was built for a competing device to the Surface. I think that’s where the real gains will be seen - getting enough graphics power out of the integrated chips to at least play a game. I don’t even think the Iris Plus in the Ice Lake processors would be enough for that game. I’ll buy that there’s a performance advantage - compare Fortnite on the iPad Pro to any thin and light laptop out there.
Where it gets interesting for me is can the 13” Mac start competing with the Surface book 13 with the 1650? I think the MS design has the thermal advantage here with the dGPU and CPU in separate parts of the machine.
All this said, I’m still leaning towards keeping my iPad and picking up a Windows machine to split the difference. The complete control over hardware (now including CPU design choices) and software is something that Is making me want to hedge a bit.