Telegram CEO Accuses Apple of Destroying Dreams and Crushing Entrepreneurs

[Skyscraperfan]

Apple is just an evil company. They say they do not allow third party app stores, because they want to "protect" their customers, but in fact Apple just wants to monetize its monopoly as much as possible.

If I had already paid $999 or more just for a smartphone, I would be quite angry if additionally 30% of all my in-app payments go to Apple. It is MY phone. I hope the EU will stop that.

Imagine a car manufacturer sells taxis and requests 30% of all money that the taxi drivers makes with that taxi.

 

[Wanted797]

Durov said Apple is not "happy with content creators monetizing their efforts without paying a 30% tax" and that Telegram has no choice but to disable paid posts and channels on its iOS app. "This is just another example of how a trillion-dollar monopoly abuses its market dominance at the expense of millions of users who are trying to monetize their own content," Durov continued.

You mean Telegram just doesn’t want to lose the 30% … for a digital post that costs them SFA to deliver.

 

[brofkand]

which would increase prices for those devices. no thanks. i'm not paying more than $500 for a playstation 5

🤷‍♂️ no skin off my nose

 

[deevey]

The point is made with only 5 C Suit salaries. Timmy made $250m in 2020.

You still don't seem to grasp the difference between billion and million.

 

[BootsWalking]

Nope. See, this conversation is completely lost on you people. That's not what anti-trust is.

Congress disagrees with you. That's exactly what anti-trust is, and the government will soon intervene to make that clear to you and everyone else who don't understand the antitrust laws in this country.

As a result, Apple’s control over iOS provides it with gatekeeper power over software distribution on iOS devices. Consequently, it has a dominant position in the mobile app store market and monopoly power over distribution of software applications on iOS devices.
...
Apple’s monopoly power over software distribution on iOS devices appears to allow it to generate supranormal profits from the App Store and its Services business.
...
Apple’s position as the provider of iOS enables it to designate the App Store as the sole means for app developers to distribute software to iPhone users. Apple’s public statements, including testimony by Mr. Cook that Apple’s apps “go through the same rules” as more than 1.7 million third-party apps appear to be inconsistent with Apple’s actual practices. In this case, Apple leveraged its control of iOS and the App Store to give its own apps preferential treatment, and applied a different set of rules than third-party apps, punishing them for the very conduct Apple engaged in.

Source: https://judiciary.house.gov/uploadedfiles/competition_in_digital_markets.pdf

 

[threesixty360]

The thing is every single company that complains about Apple’s practises would do and does do the same things when they are in similar positions.

Look at how Spotify treats its artists payments.
Look how MS treated its OEM’s when Bill Gates had to go to court.
Look at how FB treats its customers data in the cambridge analytica scandal.

On one hand people want free market capitalism and then you want these free market capitalists to leave money on the table. Well they won’t. That’s not capitalism. They have a duty to their shareholders to maximise their profits and that’s what they all do. ALL OF THEM.

At least Apple is up front and blatant about it. No hidden use of customers data or pretending they don’t own basically all the major services in one industry (eg google).

At one point some lobbyist in the EU or somewhere will stop Apple because someone gave them enough coin to legislate. Fine. That’s just how it goes.

But until then apple would be stupid to leave money on the table. They will ride this as long as they can. And then they’ll do something else when they’re stopped.

But as long as their customers are happy they don’t care about what other “capitalist business” think about it. Because they would all do exactly what apple is doing. They just aren’t as clever.

 

[SnappleRumors]

You still don't seem to grasp the difference between billion and million.

Still? Not following.

 

[BootsWalking]

Just like who would want to shop at Walmart if they had no productions to sell and Walmart gets more than 30%.

The national brands sold in Walmart are available in thousands of non-Walmart stores.

 

[Glideslope]

Telegram. Right up there with Parlor in my view. Waste of Bandwidth.

 

[FuzzMunky]

This whole tax nomenclature is stupid. Apple runs a store and marks up the price like any other store. Telegram and others want access to Apple ‘s user base for free, plain and simple, and be allowed to profit off of it without Apple getting anything for it.

And you pay for boxed software from a store that also marks it up. Same thing.

This is a dreadful analogy. Apple run the store and they can charge for the "boxed" software. But they are also charging for any business conducted using that software. It is more equivalent to Best Buy taking a cut from a Restaurant's profits because they bought their copy of Excel at Best Buy and this software runs their take-out computers.

 

[NightFox]

What about Amazon Prime? That's digital goods.

Do you mean Prime Video? If so, I don't believe you can sign up to that via the app, for this very reason.

 

[Norco]

Some folks have drank an excessive amount of kool-aid and don’t have much perspective. The more screws Apple turns, the louder voices will become and it will eventually be handled by governments, which they won’t enjoy. Just a matter of time.

 

[tdar]

They won’t like my response. Because it is yeah whatever.

 

[geartau]

🤷‍♂️ no skin off my nose

Apple's cut doesn't bother me. 🤷‍♂️

 

[PauloSera]

Congress disagrees with you. That's exactly what anti-trust is, and the government will soon intervene to make that clear to you and everyone else who don't understand the antitrust laws in this country.

As a result, Apple’s control over iOS provides it with gatekeeper power over software distribution on iOS devices. Consequently, it has a dominant position in the mobile app store market and monopoly power over distribution of software applications on iOS devices.
...
Apple’s monopoly power over software distribution on iOS devices appears to allow it to generate supranormal profits from the App Store and its Services business.
...
Apple’s position as the provider of iOS enables it to designate the App Store as the sole means for app developers to distribute software to iPhone users. Apple’s public statements, including testimony by Mr. Cook that Apple’s apps “go through the same rules” as more than 1.7 million third-party apps appear to be inconsistent with Apple’s actual practices. In this case, Apple leveraged its control of iOS and the App Store to give its own apps preferential treatment, and applied a different set of rules than third-party apps, punishing them for the very conduct Apple engaged in.

Source: https://judiciary.house.gov/uploadedfiles/competition_in_digital_markets.pdf

iOS devices are not a ubiquitous thing. Apple invented, owns, and controls them too.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!

Oh, he’s serious?

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!

 

[Ries]

K, you build your own smartphone platform, hardware, infrastructure, and accessories. THEN tell us HOW 30% is unfair.

So telecoms are entitled to 30% of Apple's sales right? if they don't like it, Apple can build their own hardware and infrastructure!

 

[compwiz1202]

Do you think they would get a lower cut if they sold software through regular distribution and retail channels? 30% is a pretty good deal given the exposure offered (and the absence of distribution costs).
And cut on in-app options is logical, otherwise all developers would adopt the freemium model to avoid any cost.

Exactly, if you are new, how many sales will you get outside of a major app store? Even if the other store was zero, just the volume of sales in the App Store with 30% cut would be way more. 70% of a ton is still more than 100% of near non-existent sales

 

[Alexwastaken]

Trillion dollar companies carve out exceptions for each other.

Physical goods. Groupon and Ebay don't violate Apple's iAP policy either, no special agreement in place

 

[steve333]

Congrats, Timmy
Apple has become more arrogant than Microsoft ever was

 

[v3rlon]

I don’t care how much Apple charges, but saying that they shouldn’t complain because Apple built the iPhone - which you and I pay for - is not correct

No, you bought a phone and agreed to terms of service to use the software. The people you bought the phone from and whose terms you agreed to paid for the iPhone and the software and the app store and the infrastructure. Yes, you gave them the money. You employer gives you money, but that does not give them the right to dictate where you do your banking. Once the money changes hands, it is yours.

Samsung employees can, and do, use iPhones. There are probably more than a couple of Apple employees using Windows.

You paid Apple for a product that they first paid to build and support before selling it to you. If you do not like the way they support it, you are free to 'fire them' and go to brand X or Brand Y. You do not get to dictate terms to Apple because you bought one of their phones.

 

[firewood]

It really amazes me how many developers are willing to write apps with that much of a cut.

70% of many Billions of $$$ creates a vast amount of willingness. (or %85 for small developers is a ton more than they can get from a "buy me a coffee" button on their never found web site. buys more than a coffee for many. ).

 

[v3rlon]

Except Apple forbids developers from selling software to their iOS users outside of Apple's store.


Why should Apple profit from other people's efforts?

They are perfectly free to sell software, just not on the iOS platform. They can sell me Mac, Windows, Android, Unix, or Amiga software until they are happy.

But, if you want to sell in the Apple Store, you go through Apple. This is like if you want to sell in the Best Buy store, you do so through Best Buy. If you want to sell in the Costco Store, you go through Costco. In both cases, the store gets a cut.

And Apple has enabled more dreams than that guy ever dreamed about. A billionaire whining that he doesn't make enough money.

 

[I7guy]

It's the predictable criticism of Apple by a competitor and the very predictable defence by some/many below the line. Let the games begin.

I will just say this, competition and fairness in digital markets and payment services, particularly how they are affected by the policies of the very small number of hardware and software platforms they exist on, will only become more of an interest for legislators and regulators.

Apple, and to a lesser extent Google, aren't really strategic about any of this right now and I think some pretty heavy-handed legislation and regulation will be coming their way. I wouldn't even be surprised if either or both will be broken up at some point.

The market power they exercise is just not sustainable.

It’s tough to be popular. Produce a good legal product that people like and get broken up. Excellent lessons for history.

 

[v3rlon]

That has absolutely no bearing to my point.

The fact that they spend a lot doesn’t mean that everyone else has no right to point out issues with pricing.

Their pricing is right in line with the industry, except when the industry is going out of their way to try to look good in a court case (I know, you think someone pulling a publicity stunt would be Unreal, and you would be right).

And yes, the cost to operate the store and the platform has plenty of bearing on your point.

If you want a flashlight, buy a flashlight not a laser pointer. If you want a cheese knife, buy a cheese knife, not a spoon. If you want a phone that helps you load crappy software and circumvents your privacy restrictions, buy that phone and not an iPhone.