Thanks Apple, for the three year old Graphics Chip...

jsnuff1

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Oct 4, 2003
639
188
NY
I really dont understand it sometimes...it does not take much to please most people, but Apple seems to like pissing of its higher end consumers.


With this update Apple has effectively had the EXACT SAME GPU PERFORMANCE FOR 3 YEARS

Here are the numbers, I currently have a Santa Rosa MBP (3 years old) which I am upgrading with this update and it has a 8600m GT card

8600m GT Specs Core Clock:475MHZ Fillrate:3.8GP/s 7.6GT/s Bandwidth 22.4 GB/s

9600m GT Specs Core Clock:500MHZ Fillrate:4GP/s 8GT/s Bandwidth 25.6 GB/s

330M GT Specs Core Clock:575MHZ Fillrate:4.6GP/s 9.2GT/s Bandwidth 25.6 GB/s



So lets recap, over the past 3 years there has been a 16% GPU performance increase based on the texture fill rate, which is basically nothing considering the time span.

All they had to do was use ATI like they do on the rest of the line up, or if they love crappy nVidia so much used the 350GT. This would have yielded TWICE the performance of the 330, with a 5 watt increase in TDP...

why...so they could shave 15 minutes of battery life and save 30 dollars in component costs?

sigh...
 

gagaliya

macrumors 6502
Feb 24, 2010
280
16
i couldnt agree more, the graphic card was a major letdown. Especially bad considering you cannot upgrade it yourself like memory/hdd.

why apple didnt use a newer gpu for a $2000+ laptop is beyond comprehension.:mad:
 

mattcube64

macrumors 65816
May 21, 2006
1,271
91
Missouri
Completely agree. It's pathetic. They could have at least made the 350 a BTO option. I'd gladly pay an extra $100 for the 350, which would probably cost Apple only a few extra bucks.

VERY disappointed with the GPU; but, unfortunately, I'm not surprised.
 

PAC88

macrumors 6502
Apr 23, 2009
457
0
get a desktop people.. don't buy it if it doesn't meet your needs. when you give them your money, you're basically telling apple that they don't need to change anything.
 

iLog.Genius

macrumors 601
Feb 24, 2009
4,830
355
Toronto, Ontario
"Old" technology costs less, charge high prices in final product. Apple be getting that money!

It's sad really but those who have been following Apple for sometime now should know Apple isn't likely to use hardware that is on par or better with current technology.
 

snouter

macrumors 6502a
May 26, 2009
767
0
There is nothing surprising about this.

Apple only offers the dual core i7 for heat and battery reasons.

Similarly, they offer the 330M for heat and battery reasons.

The video cards they offer run OS X well. Apple is not committed to gaming, nor are developers.

Should they offer a higher performing card as an option? Probably. But Apple has never been much for the customizable options either.

It's more important to Apple to talk about long battery life than texture fill rates.

The Sony Vaio F laptop offer the i7 quad and a 330M and an HD screen for $1300. There are plenty of PC options with even better screens and video cards that would still leave you shy of $2000.

Apple does what they do, and people buy it. I wouldn't expect too much more from them.

I wish Toshiba and HP would get their act together and build some better laptop hardware. Windows 7 is good enough to challenge OS X at this point if PC makers would stop with the BS styling and make serious machines. They totally win in the value arena.
 

jsnuff1

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Oct 4, 2003
639
188
NY
get a desktop people.. don't buy it if it doesn't meet your needs. when you give them your money, you're basically telling apple that they don't need to change anything.

I need a laptop...and im not switching to a PC after 15 years on the mac, even though that prospect gets more and more appealing with every "update."

Lets face it, Apple is no longer the company it used to be. Its a mass market consumer company focused on high profit margins.

Sad part is that this business model works perfectly, because the "mass market" knows nothing about graphics cards, lets alone the difference between a 330 and 350...

The niche market that actually NEEDS this extra power does not matter to Apple anymore, so we are either left to accept this fact, or move on.

Sad state either way.
 

PAC88

macrumors 6502
Apr 23, 2009
457
0
I need a laptop...and im not switching to a PC after 15 years on the mac, even though that prospect gets more and more appealing with every "update."

Lets face it, Apple is no longer the company it used to be. Its a mass market consumer company focused on high profit margins.

Sad part is that this business model works perfectly, because the "mass market" knows nothing about graphics cards, lets alone the difference between a 330 and 350...

The niche market that actually NEEDS this extra power does not matter to Apple anymore, so we are either left to accept this fact, or move on.

Sad state either way.
yea.. I understand where you're coming from. I know some people need it, but the gpu is not a big deal for me.. I'm more upset that that they don't put matte screens on the 13", I have to spend an extra $1000 just to get one on the 15"
 

PacMookBro

macrumors regular
Jan 31, 2007
224
0
How disappointing with the new graphics card! Seamless graphics card switching is the price to pay. With every update Apple makes lots of money by tiny updates.
 

Tex-Twil

macrumors 68020
May 28, 2008
2,473
10
Berlin
I just went to the VAIO store (my brother wants a new pc) and for 1600€ I get the same spec PC as the high end 15". Also with 330M.

So it does not shock me to see this chip in the MBPs
 

nick9191

macrumors 68040
Feb 17, 2008
3,270
1
Britain
Lets face it, Apple is no longer the company it used to be. Its a mass market consumer company focused on high profit margins.
Yeah I remember 5 years ago when Apple's machines were as cheap as PC's, much faster and had amazing GPU's.

Oh wait...

Apple's always been like this. In fact there profit margins now are lower than any time in the past god knows how long.
 

Cali3350

macrumors regular
Feb 16, 2009
249
0
To be fair, the 330M offers more shader cores aswell, up to 48 from 32. The real world performance difference is closer to ~50%.

That said, the ram is pathetic. I didnt even realize Nvidia allowed the 330M to be made with 256MB.
 

lilo777

macrumors 603
Nov 25, 2009
5,144
0
get a desktop people.. don't buy it if it doesn't meet your needs. when you give them your money, you're basically telling apple that they don't need to change anything.
Alternatively, buy laptop from HP, DELL, Sony or Asus. They do offer better graphic cards.
 

Bitmap Frog

macrumors member
Jul 30, 2008
44
0
"Old" technology costs less, charge high prices in final product. Apple be getting that money!

It's sad really but those who have been following Apple for sometime now should know Apple isn't likely to use hardware that is on par or better with current technology.
Yeah. Right now their hardware is in rip-off territory. Obviously, they sell more than ever so they won't change pricing unless a disaster happens.

Trouble-free computing is great, but I don't think its worth 400€-600€.

As a long time fan I'm very sad this is no longer that company anymore.
 

gadgetfreaky

macrumors 65816
Oct 28, 2007
1,193
389
Couldn't agree more. NVidia has naked pictures of Steve Jobs or something to get them to keep putting that crap in.
 

Yixian

macrumors 65816
Jun 2, 2007
1,475
119
Europe
I extracted myself from the wait game a few months ago when I realised that Apple will constantly disappoint anyone who actually cares what GPU they put in their machines.

But today came around and I found myself thinking, hey, the ATI 5XXX series is out and there's just no possibly way in HELL Apple could pass them up when they are both efficient, cool and lightyears ahead of competitors, not to mention the 9600M GT.

Then I saw 330M GT, and that familiar feeling of disappointment returned.

Listen up peeps, this is how Apple makes it's profit margins from you, it's notebook customers: GPUs. They will give you a decent CPU and fairly decent specs besides but when it comes to the GPU they will gimp your machine to the tune of 3 years.

After years of seeing people almost exclusively switch to Mac from PC, only now, when it becoming so obvious that Apple will incomprehensibly fail in this aspect of their computers time after time after time worse than ever before in their god damn history, you see people on these boards regularly switching the other way.

Yeah, we can't complain, it's not an obligation for Apple to put out balanced specced computers, but it really does suck, I find myself unable to upgrade my notebook at all because you'll certainly never see me with a piece of crap peecee.
 

snouter

macrumors 6502a
May 26, 2009
767
0
I think I'm mostly upset because I own two 8600GT laptops. And they both work fine now, but they are both clearly on death watch.

I was watching mlb.com and the temp was high... I just expected the laptop to up and die right there.

Apple is know for punishing suppliers, yet they put up with nVidia's weaknesses.

I would have loved to see some ATi chips this go round.
 

Yixian

macrumors 65816
Jun 2, 2007
1,475
119
Europe
I think I'm mostly upset because I own two 8600GT laptops. And they both work fine now, but they are both clearly on death watch
Yeah, you may want to wait for the first MBP revision with a chip that's actually substantially better than the 8600M GT. As it stands the models released today are only marginally faster.
 

Quetsche

macrumors member
Mar 5, 2010
80
0
I extracted myself from the wait game a few months ago when I realised that Apple will constantly disappoint anyone who actually cares what GPU they put in their machines.

But today came around and I found myself thinking, hey, the ATI 5XXX series is out and there's just no possibly way in HELL Apple could pass them up when they are both efficient, cool and lightyears ahead of competitors, not to mention the 9600M GT.

Then I saw 330M GT, and that familiar feeling of disappointment returned.

Listen up peeps, this is how Apple makes it's profit margins from you, it's notebook customers: GPUs. They will give you a decent CPU and fairly decent specs besides but when it comes to the GPU they will gimp your machine to the tune of 3 years.

After years of seeing people almost exclusively switch to Mac from PC, only now, when it becoming so obvious that Apple will incomprehensibly fail in this aspect of their computers time after time after time worse than ever before in their god damn history, you see people on these boards regularly switching the other way.

Yeah, we can't complain, it's not an obligation for Apple to put out balanced specced computers, but it really does suck, I find myself unable to upgrade my notebook at all because you'll certainly never see me with a piece of crap peecee.
my feelings exactly. Thanks for putting words on them.
 

Ice Dragon

macrumors 6502a
Jun 16, 2009
984
20
I probably will suffice with the old graphics chip. I should... have no problem running Diablo 3 smoothly on the highest settings (I am not really a gamer after Diablo 3 so this doesn't affect me too much). What gets me is why Apple doesn't have more than 512 MB in its dedicated graphics?
 

7even

macrumors 6502a
Jan 11, 2008
957
10
Macbook Pros have always had mid-range graphics card options.

As an aside, I love how people complain when the laptops haven't been updated - then they're updated and people continue complaining :D
 

fud122

macrumors member
Aug 24, 2006
90
0
Good thing I did not wait out for these MBPs. Those new cards aren't the best but they are certainly capable but why Apple doesn't even include 1GB of dedicated memory is beyond me. I bought a Toshiba with the same card (but 1GB) and it's decent but not the best for gaming.

I just wish I had seen this laptop before though...

MSi GX640 from Amazon with Core i5, 15" (1680 x1050), ATI 5850 with 1GB memory for 1099 with a 3 year warranty.

http://www.amazon.com/MSI-GX640-098US-15-6-Inch-Laptop/dp/B0036OR9DI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1271184812&sr=1-1