Thanks Apple, for the three year old Graphics Chip...

[highscheme]

Yeah, its the biggest disappointment.

All they had to do was have a $100 option between 512gb GPU & 1 GB GPU and this would have been the update I wanted. I am surprised they left out IPS screens, but I can deal with that at least.

 

[Nickpress]

2 weeks ago I got a Gateway laptop NV79 for 1300$ :

- i7 620M
- 8 GB DDR3
- 1000 GB HD
- 17.3 LED Display
- ATI 5650 1 GB Dedicated video card
- 9 Cells Battery high capacity

* I got about 2h of battery surfing the web and 1h if im playing World of Warcraft. I can bake a egg on the keyboard when I'm playing games. I still love this laptop. Great performance for the price but only if plug with the power coard on my desktop office.

* The major apple strengh is the around 8-10 h of battery. Had the same Gateway laptop part in the MBP and im preaty sure you will get around 1-2 h of battery to just like Gateway or others Laptop. You cant have kickass performance and 10h battery life. Apple is going for the battery stamina and im preaty sure its a good move for what apple user are looking to do with they laptop.

* I also have a MBP 13 inch and l love it just because I can use it quickly in the bedroom or when I watch TV in my family room without having issue with the fan intake, battery life and heat.

 

[hcmitchellr]

The GPU is why I am buying the cheap 13" Pro instead of a nice 17". If I have to buy crap, might as well spend the least amount on it.

Yes, I have to buy because I support 2 companies who use Macs and my old Macbook is going out. Yes, I also know that the 13" has an even lower-end GPU, but nothing from nothing...is nothing.

On the upside, I can also buy a hight-end PC with all the specs I want and buy it and the 13" MacBook pro for less than just a high-end Mac.

I am just disappointed I couldn't have a single latop.

 

[sixwings]

I'm happy with the video card, but that isn't really a big thing for me. I just like OSX so much more than windows that I will pay a premium to use it. I also really like the battery life as I often get stuck in rooms that have no power outlets/are general pieces of crap (I'm an auditor).

I don't understand why they can't make a higher end video card an option.

 

[panzer06]

Good thing I did not wait out for these MBPs. Those new cards aren't the best but they are certainly capable but why Apple doesn't even include 1GB of dedicated memory is beyond me. I bought a Toshiba with the same card (but 1GB) and it's decent but not the best for gaming.

I just wish I had seen this laptop before though...

MSi GX640 from Amazon with Core i5, 15" (1680 x1050), ATI 5850 with 1GB memory for 1099 with a 3 year warranty.

http://www.amazon.com/MSI-GX640-098US-15-6-Inch-Laptop/dp/B0036OR9DI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1271184812&sr=1-1

That MSI system has great specs for a great price but it's not a Mac running OS X.

I happen to really enjoy Macs and OS X for my work. Very stable and reliable. However, I've given up on Apple for movies and gaming. I sold my iMac 24 3.06 8800GS, and my uMBP 2.8 in anticipation of this update, hoping Apple would finally see the light and move just a bit toward function (vs form). No such luck.

The ASUS G73 ($1199 @ BB) in my sig handles all my mobile gaming and Blu-ray movie duties and this little used ($600) uMB handles my work. It has everything I could want but it is definitely not pretty, weighs 7.5 lbs and the battery life is under 2 hours (Ac Adapter is 150 watts).

Certainly not really Apple's style but I agree with everyone complaining that Apple could have moved more toward higher performance if they created a model 3mm thicker to accommodate more cooling and a 12.7mm optical drive.

I've given up and will just buy used systems as needed and stick with ugly overweight Windows laptops for all my gaming needs. Not the ideal solution but it certainly answers the the people posting "if you don't like what Apple is offering don't buy it". Instead of owning two or three new Macs I'll just keep a used workhorse around and vote with my $$$.

Since most people people would find this solution unacceptable, they will continue to buy Macs regardless of the specs and nothing will change. Such is life.

Cheers,

 

[fud122]

That MSI system has great specs for a great price but it's not a Mac running OS X.

I happen to really enjoy Macs and OS X for my work. Very stable and reliable. However, I've given up on Apple for movies and gaming. I sold my iMac 24 3.06 8800GS, and my uMBP 2.8 in anticipation of this update, hoping Apple would finally see the light and move just a bit toward function (vs form). No such luck.

The ASUS G73 ($1199 @ BB) in my sig handles all my mobile gaming and Blu-ray movie duties and this little used ($600) uMB handles my work. It has everything I could want but it is definitely not pretty, weighs 7.5 lbs and the battery life is under 2 hours (Ac Adapter is 150 watts).

Certainly not really Apple's style but I agree with everyone complaining that Apple could have moved more toward higher performance if they created a model 3mm thicker to accommodate more cooling and a 12.7mm optical drive.

I've given up and will just buy used systems as needed and stick with ugly overweight Windows laptops for all my gaming needs. Not the ideal solution but it certainly answers the the people posting "if you don't like what Apple is offering don't buy it". Instead of owning two or three new Macs I'll just keep a used workhorse around and vote with my $$$.

Since most people people would find this solution unacceptable, they will continue to buy Macs regardless of the specs and nothing will change. Such is life.

Cheers,

I agree with you. Part of me wanted to see Apple be more multimedia friendly with this update (Blue ray, HDMI, better graphics) but I guess that was wishful thinking... I wish I could have a 13" MBP as a secondary computer but for the price it sells I can buy 3-4 netbooks. I just have my big Toshiba and a small Asus netbook to carry around now. Works for the time being.

 

[panzer06]

I agree with you. Part of me wanted to see Apple be more multimedia friendly with this update (Blue ray, HDMI, better graphics) but I guess that was wishful thinking... I wish I could have a 13" MBP as a secondary computer but for the price it sells I can buy 3-4 netbooks. I just have my big Toshiba and a small Asus netbook to carry around now. Works for the time being.

So true. I really wanted BR-Rom and HDMI but knew it would never happen.

Wait for the refurbs and used 13" MBPs later this year and early next. They will be only twice as expensive as a netbook and come with OS X.

Cheers,

 

[itommyboy]

So many people still buying into the memory myth (much like megahertz myth).

48 processing cores in the new high end units = way nicer than the last few rev's cards.

Plain. And. Simple.

 

[Hydroxs]

So many people still buying into the memory myth (much like megahertz myth).

48 processing cores in the new high end units = way nicer than the last few rev's cards.

Plain. And. Simple.

Nvidia graphics architecture hasn't changed much from the 8000 series to the 330 series. What is sad is the memory bandwidth. With the higher resolution mbp, 25.6 GB/s is going to be a bottleneck for gaming.

 

[neteng101]

The ASUS G73 ($1199 @ BB) in my sig handles all my mobile gaming and Blu-ray movie duties

I thought the BB model only came with 1 500GB drive and no Blu-ray drive? And the BB one seems to have an LCD panel that's super yucky - I checked it out in store, muddiest of colors on that screen, 1600x900 only despite being a 17.3"... though I hear the 1080p display is a lot better but its almost impossible to find one of them in stock anywhere.

 

[cderalow]

everyone seems to be leaving out a vital portion of GPU specs, # of processors

8600m GT 9600M 330M

Stream Processors 32 32 48
Core Clock (MHz) 475 500 575
Memory Clock (MHz) 700 900 1066
Maximum Memory 512MB 512MB 1024MB
Memory Interface 128-bit 128-bit 128-bit


as others have said, for 8600GT users, expect double the graphics performance.

for 9600GT users (like myself) don't expect as much.

 

[Pressure]

It must be a price thing.

Geforce GT 330M has a thermal design power of 23 Watt.

Radeon Mobility HD 5830 (Broadway LP, Juniper based has 800 Stream Processors) has a thermal design power of 24 Watt in its lowest clocked configuration.

Radeon Mobility HD 5650 (Madison Pro, Redwood based has 400 Stream Processors) has a thermal design power of 15 to 19 Watt.

 

[joina]

everyone seems to be leaving out a vital portion of GPU specs, # of processors

8600m GT 9600M 330M

Stream Processors 32 32 48
Core Clock (MHz) 475 500 575
Memory Clock (MHz) 700 900 1066
Maximum Memory 512MB 512MB 1024MB
Memory Interface 128-bit 128-bit 128-bit


as others have said, for 8600GT users, expect double the graphics performance.

for 9600GT users (like myself) don't expect as much.

the 330m in mbp is not 1024 it is 512 or even worse 256

 

[gagaliya]

look at the headline news, steve job actually mentioned the graphic in the new mbp, here's the quote:

We chose killer graphics plus 10 hour battery life over a very small CPU speed increase. Users will see far more performance boost from the speedy graphics.

is this a joke? or is the 330M the new mbp using a super custom version that is completely different than the regular 330M from nvidia? wtf...

 

[Quetsche]

look at the headline news, steve job actually mentioned the graphic in the new mbp, here's the quote:



is this a joke? or is the 330M the new mbp using a super custom version that is completely different than the regular 330M from nvidia? wtf...

in this quote, i believe steve jobs is actually talking about the 13" MBP, not the bigger ones.

edit: damn you macrumors, why won't you let me quote quotes. :/

 

[panzer06]

I thought the BB model only came with 1 500GB drive and no Blu-ray drive? And the BB one seems to have an LCD panel that's super yucky - I checked it out in store, muddiest of colors on that screen, 1600x900 only despite being a 17.3"... though I hear the 1080p display is a lot better but its almost impossible to find one of them in stock anywhere.

You are correct 1x500GB (I had a second one sitting in a drawer so I threw it in. Nothing on it yet.) I also had an external BD-Rom drive that I took apart and added.

The 1600x900 displays are very inconsistent as to quality. Mine is very bright (though not MBP bright) and has decent viewing angles and relatively dark blacks. The 1080p version on the X1, A1 & A2 versions is a better display but you just can't find them in stock anywhere. If I didn't have all the spare gear laying about and was willing to spend $300+ and wait for a month I would have gotten the 1080p version.

But for raw portable gaming power you just can't beat that ATI 5870.

Cheers,

 

[trip1ex]

Yeah MBPs generally have better batteries, monitor panels and casings than the Windows laptops available for $500 less.

Also most likely quieter too boot. Not to mention added software like iPhoto and iMovie. Not sure you can get anything like those programs built-in on a Windows laptop.

 

[panzer06]

Yeah MBPs generally have better batteries, monitor panels and casings than the Windows laptops available for $500 less.

Also most likely quieter too boot. Not to mention added software like iPhoto and iMovie. Not sure you can get anything like those programs built-in on a Windows laptop.

Not true about quiet when running Windows. Every time I fired up a game on my Windows 7 bootcamp on my now sold uMBP 2.8 the fans went to full speed.

Great under OS X though.

Cheers,

 

[Gomff]

Yeah MBPs generally have better batteries, monitor panels and casings than the Windows laptops available for $500 less.

Also most likely quieter too boot. Not to mention added software like iPhoto and iMovie. Not sure you can get anything like those programs built-in on a Windows laptop.

None of these things will matter to the spec die hards....It's all about the hardware in their eyes, and if you disagree then you're just a gullible Apple fanboy.

Honestly, people bitched and whined about the Core 2 Duo and they got i5 / i7, so now the GPU isn't good enough. If the new Macbook Pros came with ATI 5xxx cards then people would complain about the heat and battery life hit.

The moaning about GPU performance is < 90% about not being able to play whatever Windows game on higher settings, while still being able to tote a Macbook Pro look cool with.

 

[vs.fanboyism]

Dealbreaker

The lame graphics card definetely is the dealbreaker for me. If the update had included a powerful gfx-card and an IPS-panel, steve would have converted another pc-user. my money would have been his profit.

well, he ****ed it up. now i will stay a pc-user and HP, lenovo, maybe sony will get my money.

i guess i won't be the only one. let's hope this poor update-policy will be reflected in sales numbers. dear, apple-lemmings, please get reasonable and teach steve the only lesson he understands: non-consumption

 

[vasuba]

None of these things will matter to the spec die hards....It's all about the hardware in their eyes, and if you disagree then you're just a gullible Apple fanboy.

Honestly, people bitched and whined about the Core 2 Duo and they got i5 / i7, so now the GPU isn't good enough. If the new Macbook Pros came with ATI 5xxx cards then people would complain about the heat and battery life hit.

The moaning about GPU performance is < 90% about not being able to play whatever Windows game on higher settings, while still being able to tote a Macbook Pro look cool with.

Or it could just be the fact superior spec machines can be gotten for half the price?

Apple makes great machines but the "apple tax" on their hardware is getting to be a bit much when the entire industry is getting cheaper overall for parts while offering just as good reliability for the most part or better in cases of like ASUS.

 

[Jarcrew]

Or it could just be the fact superior spec machines can be gotten for half the price?

That's exactly the point he was making - at some point, there's a trade-off between spec-fetishism and design. If you were willing to carry around a laptop that was 6" thick, you could probably cram a Nehalem and dual ATIs in it, but that would suck and nobody would enjoy using that computer.

Apple's trade-offs have always been closer to the spec end of the spectrum in favour of design. But we've known that for years.

Plus, it's not like Apple tells you any different. You know exactly what's in these things, so if they're not suitable for your requirements and you buy them anyway, you're probably too stupid to use a computer.

 

[panzer06]

None of these things will matter to the spec die hards....It's all about the hardware in their eyes, and if you disagree then you're just a gullible Apple fanboy.

Honestly, people bitched and whined about the Core 2 Duo and they got i5 / i7, so now the GPU isn't good enough. If the new Macbook Pros came with ATI 5xxx cards then people would complain about the heat and battery life hit.

The moaning about GPU performance is < 90% about not being able to play whatever Windows game on higher settings, while still being able to tote a Macbook Pro look cool with.

This is true to a point. I would love to carry a single machine when I travel. I'd be fine with a 6.5lb MBP that provided good gaming performance in Windows and still had OS X for work (+Blu-ray for my movies).

And I personally don't care about battery or heat since my laptops are always connected to power or on a desk (except in the car at rest areas accessing my in vehicle mobile access point for work).

That's exactly the point he was making - at some point, there's a trade-off between spec-fetishism and design. If you were willing to carry around a laptop that was 6" thick, you could probably cram a Nehalem and dual ATIs in it, but that would suck and nobody would enjoy using that computer.

Apple's trade-offs have always been closer to the spec end of the spectrum in favour of design. But we've known that for years.

Plus, it's not like Apple tells you any different. You know exactly what's in these things, so if they're not suitable for your requirements and you buy them anyway, you're probably too stupid to use a computer.

And as long as people keep buying really slick looking overpriced Apple gear nothing will change!

Cheers,

 

[hcmitchellr]

So many people still buying into the memory myth (much like megahertz myth).

48 processing cores in the new high end units = way nicer than the last few rev's cards.

Plain. And. Simple.

It is a Mid-Range GPU in a top-dollar system.


Plain. And. Simple

No matter how Apple or fanboys spin it, it is not up to the task of running new games (in OSX or Windows via Bootcamp) or advanced 3d design apps. I do both and got burnt bad on my current Mac because I stupidly went against what I knew and fell for the spin.

I still recommend Macs for users who do not need power, but those who do need it need to look elsewhere. You are just going to drop a lot of money for a lot of hurt.

 

[vasuba]

In the end it doesnt come down to spec fetishism though. It comes down to the fact the "Apple Tax" is becoming more and more an obsolete joke.

We are paying a premium price for Lower end Laptops. I rather enjoy the Macs and what they offer overall but its becoming increasingly difficult to justify while the PC market prices continue to decrease. 800 dollar laptops are outperforming 2 grand MBP. The Reliability arguement is not applicable either as Apple isnt even considered the best company in that category anymore