Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Status
Not open for further replies.
I will never quite know what led to the FA appointing such an mediocre manager in charge of England.
The job was originally offered to Luiz Felipe Scolari, who accepted but got cold feet at the level of media intrusion he and his family would be subjected to by the English media.

One would suppose that in turning to McClaren the FA were looking for a degree of continuation – he'd been a coach under Sven-Göran Eriksson of course, who despite some rather revisionist opinions had a good spell as England manager. There was also a clamouring from some to see an Englishman appointed in the role, and McClaren to be fair ticked these boxes. A safe pair of hands rather than a dynamic appointment, one might say. There may also have been an element of panic after not getting their original choice, and a desire to be seen as making a firm, decisive decision.

I think the fact that he'd coached England under Eriksson contributed to his downfall though, rather than helping him. It's not uncommon to see assistants or coaches struggle when they take over as manager, as their relationship with the players has to change overnight and they can sometimes struggle to get the players' respect – and I think McClaren had a real problem with this. At times he seemed to be trying to be the pally coach rather than a respected manager.

I wouldn't call McClaren a poor manager per se – he's had a couple of successes over the course of his career, with unfancied clubs – but international management at that level was above him unforunately.
 
And it's been confirmed that Schteve has been appointed manager of Forrest. Wonder if he'll don a green jumper for his press conference ;)
 
Our worst performance in quite some time. We missed Oguchi Onyewu at the back. If we make it to the final the Mexicans will humiliate us.

I wouldn't go that far yet. Didn't Mexico just lose a bunch of players to failed drug tests? It will be difficult to dominate with five players out.

It doesn't look good right now, but maybe it will be the kick in the ass that they need?
 
Columbus lost a must-win game at home to Chicago, 1-0 to our hated rivals after a late goal. I was so glum after the USA result I haven't read any of the match reports, and I don't want to. We simply cannot find the back of the net. :(

I wouldn't go that far yet. Didn't Mexico just lose a bunch of players to failed drug tests? It will be difficult to dominate with five players out.

It doesn't look good right now, but maybe it will be the kick in the ass that they need?

Of the five that have been sent home, two are starters, one is an impact sub and two are bit players who won't make a difference. The biggest blow is probably the loss of their starting keeper, Guillermo Ochoa. Their backup keeper is not nearly as good. Aside from Ochoa they've lost Sinha, an experienced attacking midfielder (an impact sub), and Fransisco Javier Rodriguez. Rodriguez was a first choice defender, so that might hurt them too.

However, even after losing those players they won their next match 5-0 (albeit against a hapless Cuba). Their offensive capability is undamaged. The question is, will Ochoa and Rodriguez's absences be felt when they come up against a decent team like Honduras who can actually put them under pressure?

Despite stinking up the joint on Saturday, USA are still probably the second best team in the competition on paper, possibly even the best. But they are playing well below their potential. We have a tendency to play to the level of our opposition against middling Central American/Caribbean sides.

I still personally think Mexico will win the Gold Cup, and Chicharito will dominate every defense he comes up against. USA's defense is a shambles at the moment, I don't even want to think what the Little Pea would do to us. Gio Dos Santos is having a decent tournament as well, meaning that Mexico have a dangeorus, productive strike partnership - something the US has not had in years. It's a tough tournament for USA fans: we are hosting the tournament, yet the Mexicans are filling up our stadia with their fans and thumping every team in sight. :eek:

I reckon Forest have made a good appointment there.

I agree with your assessment above; McClaren seems a good manager, but not a great one. He is perfectly competent up to a certain level, and that level is reached (in England) at about midtable in the Premier league. Anything above that seems beyond him. He did a good job at Twente, not so good at Wolfsburg (although his successor did even worse). I think he's a good choice for a Championship club looking for promotion.
 
Last edited:
It's a tough tournament for USA fans: we are hosting the tournament, yet the Mexicans are filling up our stadia with their fans and thumping every team in sight. :eek:

That's always the case though, that Mexico has home-field advantage in the U.S. unless they can schedule them for someplace like Minneapolis or Boston. At some point we have to just shrug it off and play through it.

On the bright side, our record vs. Mexico in recent years has been pretty good. Away from Azteca (which is such a completely ridiculous kind of home field advantage that it should be its own category), the U.S. has only lost once to Mexico since 1999. Unfortunately, that one game was the last Gold Cup final in 2009.
 
That's always the case though, that Mexico has home-field advantage in the U.S. unless they can schedule them for someplace like Minneapolis or Boston. At some point we have to just shrug it off and play through it.

It doesn't really seem to matter where they schedule them, Mexico fans always outnumber USA fans on US soil. It is indeed something we are used to. There is still a big disconnect between your stereotypical American sports fan and people who go watch professional soccer in this country. If even a quarter of the people who watch NFL tuned in to MLS/USA matches, it would be a huge transformation.

On the bright side, our record vs. Mexico in recent years has been pretty good. Away from Azteca (which is such a completely ridiculous kind of home field advantage that it should be its own category), the U.S. has only lost once to Mexico since 1999. Unfortunately, that one game was the last Gold Cup final in 2009.

And that 2009 result was dreadful. I think the Panama match was a big wakeup call - CONCACAF is generally improving in terms of quality, and the USA has to take every match very seriously. Panama aren't going to win this tournament. And unless we can convincingly beat teams like them we won't have a shot at winning either. Our next match is against lowly little Guadeloupe. Anything less than a 4-5 goal thrashing by the USA will be a disappointment. But the real task begins after the group stage.

If Honduras beats Jamaica in the final match of Group B (and one would expect that, depsite Jamaica's positive start), then USA has to get past Honduras to advance to the semifinals (probably against either Costa Rica or Jamaica). The Hondurans will be a significantly tougher obstacle than Panama. If we fail to make it to the final it might put Bob Bradley's job in jeopardy.
 
It doesn't really seem to matter where they schedule them, Mexico fans always outnumber USA fans on US soil. It is indeed something we are used to. There is still a big disconnect between your stereotypical American sports fan and people who go watch professional soccer in this country. If even a quarter of the people who watch NFL tuned in to MLS/USA matches, it would be a huge transformation.

I am assuming that Team USA doesn't have a home stadium and operates a traveling roadshow policy, do you think this has any impact on the level of support? The home nations had the same policy a few years back when Hampden and Wembley were being developed, while moving the fixture around gave other parts of the country a chance to see the team, I found the novelty soon wore off and it didn't really feel like the national team until they were back at the home stadium.
 
A very interesting point.

I have no data to back this up, but I think the question is a mix of logistical realities and sporting culture intertwined. Americans do not have a national stadium for any sport. I think it comes down to the fact that the country is too large (and the population too widely distributed) to designate one location for premier sporting events. The Olympics have come here several times, and always to quite different parts of the country. The next time we host a World Cup, we will simply choose the best stadia currently available and rely on our existing infrastructure to carry us through. There are no automatic choices where to play, because we have many venues that are more than good enough.

If we designate a national stadium for our national team to use, it would lead to geaographic isolation for many fans. Locating it on the east coast would alienate west-coast fans, especially the Latin-American fans that US Soccer is trying to bring into the fold. Locating on the west coast would alienate the east coast population centers. Locating in the geographic center of the country would alienate almost everyone.

In theory, a national stadium would have several clear advantages - it would be a very large (probably 70-80,000+ capacity), soccer-specific stadium, the national team would have a true physical "home", and it could serve as a quality venue for an MLS team and future World Cup matches. On the other hand, it would mean that half of the USA fans would always have to travel thousands of miles to see their national team play at "home".

In short, having a national stadium is an idea totally alien to the American sporting landscape. In the future the best MLS stadia might begin to replace NFL stadia for World Cup and other tournaments as the former are built to larger cpacities, but I doubt we'll ever have our own version of Wembley Stadium or Estadio Azteca.

Or, to try and paint it in a more positive light, team USA will always be at home whenever they play in the US. In that sense, growing the fan base is the key challenge for the future.
 
I am assuming that Team USA doesn't have a home stadium and operates a traveling roadshow policy, do you think this has any impact on the level of support? The home nations had the same policy a few years back when Hampden and Wembley were being developed, while moving the fixture around gave other parts of the country a chance to see the team, I found the novelty soon wore off and it didn't really feel like the national team until they were back at the home stadium.

Correct, there is no home stadium that Team USA uses exclusively, or even most of the time. The catch-22 is that the same places that have many soccer supporters are also places with large Hispanic populations, which makes for a hostile crowd if we're hosting any Latin American team. (Even a small country like El Salvador has so many expatriates in Los Angeles that their fans would vastly outnumber Americans at a game played in southern California.) So unless we're playing a team like Canada or Trinidad & Tobago, there's no home advantage to speak of.

It makes a lot of sense though. The London metro area has a far higher proportionate of the UK's population than any comparable US city, and it isn't as if soccer is far more popular in any one major city, so it's not like there's an obvious choice as permanent host.
 
Not so! Los Angeles has hosted the Summer Olympics twice.

2 out of 8 were the same then. ;) But they were over 50 years apart and I don't think any venue was used in both 1932 and 1984.

aloofman said:
The catch-22 is that the same places that have many soccer supporters are also places with large Hispanic populations, which makes for a hostile crowd if we're hosting any Latin American team. (Even a small country like El Salvador has so many expatriates in Los Angeles that their fans would vastly outnumber Americans at a game played in southern California.) So unless we're playing a team like Canada or Trinidad & Tobago, there's no home advantage to speak of.

True - BUT there is increasing evidence that some immigrant families end up supporting the US or MLS in the second generation. The people US Soccer target for new fans are not immigrants, but immigrants' children.

It's a slow process, and the reality is that Mexico (as one example) will always be more crazy about the game than the US - but in a couple generations I think our national team will have a lot more support, to the extent that we finally "own" some of our own stadia in terms of numbers of supporters. Not to mention that our talent pool will improve, boosted by children of immigrants who become professional footballers and opt to play for the US national team.
 
Last edited:
We went to see England play at Old Trafford as part of the pre-World Cup warm up in 2006, when as Fuzzy says the team were touring the country while Wembley was redeveloped. I wouldn't really entertain going to see them play in London as it's a bloody long (and expensive) trip down there, but Manchester is obviously a lot closer.

There was talk in some quarters of building the new national stadium in the Midlands so it would be more accessible from all parts of the country, but that was really never going to happen...
 
It makes a lot of sense though. The London metro area has a far higher proportionate of the UK's population than any comparable US city, and it isn't as if soccer is far more popular in any one major city, so it's not like there's an obvious choice as permanent host.

Indeed, London contains about 20% of England's population (and 80% of Man U's supporters:D). On the other hand, 80% of the country don't live there! I suppose the biggest cities in the US (New York/LA) each only contain 5% of the population (figures off the top of my head). The problem is London is at a geographic corner of the country, albeit all roads/rails point to there. I hadn't heard of the Midlands suggestion but it would have made sense before they re-developed Wembley.

The situation in Scotland is a bit different, Hampden is located in Glasgow which similar to England contains about 20% of the population. Over half the population is within the 'central belt' containing Glasgow and Edinburgh, so the location on paper is good. However perversely the majority of Scotland supporters do not come from the Rangers or Celtic fan bases and therefore outside of Glasgow! The reason we ended up with a national stadium was quite accidental, Queens Park were (100+ years ago) a force in Scottish football so they had a decent stadium which developed into a neutral (not Rangers or Celtic) venue for cup finals and then the national team.
 
There was talk in some quarters of building the new national stadium in the Midlands so it would be more accessible from all parts of the country, but that was really never going to happen...

It was going to be next door to the NEC. It was a couple of miles from Birmingham International Airport, already had a mainline railway station on site and had easy access to the M1, M40, M42, M5 and M6. It was also a greenfield site and would have been competed years before the Wembley redevelopment and would have needed less a third of the final Wembley budget.

Never mind, Wembley has got a great big fancy arch and who gives a toss about the fans anyway. :rolleyes:
 
On a bit of a tangent, the League One and League Two Play-off Finals were held at Old Trafford this year as Wembley was needed for the Champions League Final that weekend. A couple of the newspaper columnists commented on how this was unfair on the supporters of southern clubs who might find themselves in these matches, as they'd have to face a long and expensive trip up north to Manchester if they wanted to see their teams vie for promotion.

Never mind that us t'Northerners have an equally long and expensive trip down south to London the rest of the time! :rolleyes:

...would have needed less a third of the final Wembley budget.
So, if my sums are right, we would have somewhere in the region of £600 million saved?

Imagine the good you could do with that money in so far as grassroots football is concerned...
 
Last edited:
To the topic of a USA hosted world cup

Besides a lack of fans (comparatively) it seems tht as Long as MLS is operating through the summer, this may impact chances. Thoughts?

I have recently started following some MLS, mostly because of the break in epl, it's not particularly interesting to me...but maybe I just need to get to know more players. It doesn't help my city has no team, despite a massive Hispanic population..but then one wouldn't expect Phoenix to do anything that might be well received in the Hispanic community.

It's also a shame that galaxy games are not televised on fsn much, due to the fox west deal I guess..at least via cable. I may switch to satellite as it offers more league games all over, including the us.

Unfortunately trying to even discuss football here is difficult, it's just not widely followed. Glad I found this thread!
 
On a bit of a tangent, the League One and League Two Play-off Finals were held at Old Trafford this year as Wembley was needed for the Champions League Final that weekend.

We used to have a nice sensible approach up here, if a semi-final was between two clubs such as Motherwell and Aberdeen, the game would be held a location in between such as McDiarmid Park (Perth home of St Johnstone). However since the SFA had to pay money to buy and redevelop Hampden everything is now held there to try and repay it.

To the topic of a USA hosted world cup

Besides a lack of fans (comparatively) it seems tht as Long as MLS is operating through the summer, this may impact chances. Thoughts?

Lack of fans didn't stop them hosting one before (which I thought was quite well attended?), and FIFA would be more interested in making money from sponsorship than putting fans best interests first. I'm also sure MLS would be persuaded to make way for a World Cup! Besides, what happens at the moment to all the players called up for international duty?

Unfortunately trying to even discuss football here is difficult, it's just not widely followed. Glad I found this thread!

You're welcome, but ask that you state your chosen team so that we can ridicule you.
 
We used to have a nice sensible approach up here, if a semi-final was between two clubs such as Motherwell and Aberdeen, the game would be held a location in between such as McDiarmid Park (Perth home of St Johnstone). However since the SFA had to pay money to buy and redevelop Hampden everything is now held there to try and repay it.
You're welcome, but ask that you state your chosen team so that we can ridicule you.
Same as with the FA Cup Semi-Finals now, all played at Wembley instead of a suitable neutral club ground. The Manchester City - Manchester United Semi-Final really highlighted the silliness of it. As ever, money makes the decision.

You're welcome, but ask that you state your chosen team so that we can ridicule you.
Welcome indeed h00ligan, but he's right you know – we've a mast around here somewhere and expect your colours to be nailed to it. ;)
 
Also not so! The L.A. Memorial Coliseum and Rose Bowl were used for both.

Touché. But using two venues twice since 1932 hardly counts as having a designated national stadium, now does it? ;) Particularly since a lot of development has taken place in cities accross the country - there are more potential Olympic-quality venues now than ever. Los Angeles would probably get a few games in any upcoming US-hosted world Cup though.
 
I grew up watching Manchester United, dad always had them on...so that stuck. he was at heart a Sheffield United fan first and forest, but after we moved over, not much chance to see them. I grew up in the Brighton anyway :) then, of all places, Deal.

Football is the only team sport I watch and without many here watching I don't have the benefit of heated rivalries...so I tend to have favorites on many teams, with a few teams I just like seeing fail (Chelsea :) )

That said, there are some players on united I think are complete #%}#%. Also not happy with all the Berbatov kerfuffle.

As a result of limited coverage in my area, and downloading a lot of the matches, I'll usually be a couple of days behind this thread when the new season begins.

Begin the crucification for being a Man U fan. ...and go!
 
i don't think having a dedicaded stadium to the national teams matters much for the popularity of football, i think it only makes sense for countries where there is one really crowed metropolitan area, which has a big amount of the population
Austria also has a stadium for the national team (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst-Happel-Stadion) but it still can be problematic to fill it up if it isn't a game against a high profil opponent

on the other side Germany has _no_ official stadium and has already played in 39 cities already for their home games
 
Looks like Blackburn are claiming a "potential club record deal" as they complete their sale of Phil Jones to United. That would peg Jones' price at over £17 million.

h00ligan said:
Begin the crucification for being a Man U fan. ...and go!

Welcome to the thread. I have the honor to inform you that I am a Liverpool supporter when it comes to english football, just to let you know you're starting off on the wrong foot with me. ;)

on the other side Germany has _no_ official stadium and has already played in 39 cities already for their home games

Germany is a good example - nobody would question their passion for the beautiful game, but they do not have a national stadium.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.