The 2022-2023 Football Thread

[Scepticalscribe]

Seems Mudryk might be heading to Chelsea since Shaktar want every last penny for him. And Chelsea, as always, are willing to pay mug money.

Also VVD's injury is looking like a bad one.

Yes, Virgil van Dijk's injury does seem to be quite serious; however, since his earlier injury - the one occasioned by that appalling, reckless, and dangerous tackle by Pickford - I don't think that VVD has ever been quite the same player, and was never quite as effective in his specific role, where he had been magisterial, commanding, controlling; I would go so far as to argue that it is possible that his earlier injury cost Liverpool - or, at the very least, had a major impact on - Liverpool's campaign to retain their title.

Re Mudryk, Arsenal have increased their opening bid, and have since submitted a second bid; I imagine that they will have to submit a third - and possibly fourth - bid. This - bidding war (which can only suit Shaktar) may run until the close of the transfer window.

Ordinarily, I would concede that Chelsea have access to greater resources, and thus, would expect that they could win this battle for the player's signature, bu tMudryk has made his own wishes known, and his clear preference for Arsenal as his preferred destination should not be discounted in any bidding war, or subsequent negotiations.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I think Lampard’s time is up.

In general, I do not favour teams making a sacrificial offering - an absurdly easy sacrificial offering - of their managers, when underperforming, or undermotivated, players are often equally culpable for a sequence of poor, or dire, results.

Yes, teams should be coached properly, and mentored, and motivated, and coaches should be aware of - and learn how to deal with, if they cannot emulate - fresh tactical developments (such as pressing).

However, there are exceptions to my distaste for sacrificing managers when a team underperforms, and Lampard - whom I deeply dislike - is an exception. When the inevitable occurs, I shall not express any regret.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

@Apple fanboy: Just read in the Guardian of the death of David Gold, the joint chairman of West Ham, who seems to have been highly regarded and well respected. There is a nice piece in the Guardian about him.

 

[Apple fanboy]

@Apple fanboy: Just read in the Guardian of the death of David Gold, the joint chairman of West Ham, who seems to have been highly regarded and well respected. There is a nice piece in the Guardian about him.

Yes I heard the news earlier. Hopefully we can get 3 points tonight against Leeds as a fitting tribute. We need them!

 

[MBAir2010]

what a cracker of a goal by Poledance!

this is fun, just watching 2 random football teams!
Aston Villa and Wolves

 

[daneoni]

Spurs have become painful to watch. Playing with fear and anxiety.

EDIT: Seems they woke up

 

[Apple fanboy]

2-1 up from a goal down. Come on boys. You can do it!

 

[Scepticalscribe]

So, West Ham secure a point from their encounter with Leeds, Villa draw (one all) with Wolves, at the foot of the table, Forest defeat Southampton by a goal to nil, and Spurs - how Spursy is that? - not just defeat, but utterly destroy Crystal Palace (who are by no means a poor team) by four goals to nil.

 

[Silencio]

Forest's win puts Everton in the drop zone.

It's the manager's job to get the players performing and motivated. If they can't do that, they need to be sacked, and Lampard certainly deserves to be sacked. Not that I think the Toffees' squad is all that great, but they shouldn't be getting relegated.

The soap opera that is the USMNT descends to deeper lows than ever before with the Reynas and Berhalters descending into Hatfields vs McCoys territory. None of these people should represent US Soccer ever again, and Gio Reyna should expect a Karim Benzema-style freeze-out from the national team after all this.

 

[Boidem]

Yes, Virgil van Dijk's injury does seem to be quite serious; however, since his earlier injury - the one occasioned by that appalling, reckless, and dangerous tackle by Pickford - I don't think that VVD has ever been quite the same player, and was never quite as effective in his specific role, where he had been magisterial, commanding, controlling; I would go so far as to argue that it is possible that his earlier injury cost Liverpool - or, at the very least, had a major impact on - Liverpool's campaign to retain their title.

His previous injury was knee ligaments, this one is hamstring. I'm not even sure if it's the same leg. So I doubt itf it's affected his performance, as hes' been just as good in other games. What has changed, is that he's now having to deal with the failure of the midfield to defend higher up the pitch, so is often in a much more chaotic situation. Remember; Liverpool lost one less game than City last season, and conceded the same number of goals. The problem isn't VVD. But now he's going to be out for a while, Liverpool have an even bigger headache. The reliance on key individuals is never going to work; you need 2 players of equal quality in virtually every position, and only City really have that. Given that, you have to ask why they are trailing Arsenal by so many points.

Arsenal have Spurs away next, who will be wanting revenge. But, Spurs. Will the curse of St Totteringham return? Then it's Man U at home. A better Man U than the one which beat them earlier on. And City in mid Feb. Plus cup games. So, entering a challenging period. This is what will define their season.

 

[Boidem]

The soap opera that is the USMNT descends to deeper lows than ever before with the Reynas and Berhalters descending into Hatfields vs McCoys territory. None of these people should represent US Soccer ever again, and Gio Reyna should expect a Karim Benzema-style freeze-out from the national team after all this.

You know that the rest of the world cares little about the circus that is 'US Soccer', don't you? It's where old players go to die.

Oh, and it's 'football', btw. Not soccer.

 

[daneoni]

Can kinda see why big clubs haven't gone for Zaha after Utd. Too many off days and poor injury record.

 

[MBAir2010]

The soap opera that is the USMNT descends to deeper lows than ever before with the Reynas and Berhalters descending into Hatfields vs McCoys territory. None of these people should represent US Soccer ever again, and Gio Reyna should expect a Karim Benzema-style freeze-out from the national team after all this.

During the first stages of the World Cup,
I suggested to a stranger while blabbing about the tournament
that the USA should stop playing the sport
and use that money to lower the price of mayonnaise and other foods in the country.

They agreed!

 

[Boidem]

Loyalty, schmolalty!

I tried and tried
but I can support a club that I do not agree with on and off the pitch.
and on the pitch they embarrassed me way too much for my support.

You don't really understand football, do you? Thats not how it works. Still; there are other sports for you to enjoy.

I would qualify that with what I said earlier - there is nothing wrong with being a neutral fan. But yes, here in the US especially I cringe when I see an Old Firm, Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea, Real Madrid, Barca, PSG, or Juve shirt in a pub. 99% of the time it's an obnoxious Johnny-come-lately bragging about 'their' team's dominance and showing 1) a lack of respect for everyone else, 2) an embarrassing level of ignorance of the game in a broader sense.

When Liverpool won the CL/PL the same thing happened. I had previously very rarely run across glory-hunter 'Pool fans. For obvious reasons. But after 2020 if I saw a fan with a new Liverpool shirt I became cautious before getting chatty. I bet a few of those 2020 Liverpool 'fans' used to support another CL-winning club, And they are probably back to their Real Madrid shirts now...

Nothing wrong with going to a game between other clubs, and rooting for one over the other in that moment. I've done that; cheered for Arsenal and Chelsea women's' teams in separate games. That's fine for a 'one off' (I don't have a preference for any women's team at all). I've cheered for various local teams whilst abroad etc. It's nice to enjoy the moment, be part of the atmosphere and that. I've nothing wrong with that. It's the cynical switching of teams when one isn't doing as well, for one that is, that's verbotten. 'You only sing when you're winning'. I agree re Man U, Barca, Juve, Real tops etc. It's embarrassing. I have Spain and Belgium tops, but I got them because I liked the design, and they were cheap in sales, plus they're good for cycling in. I think it's ok to wear tops if you like the design or ethos of a club, ie St Pauli for their anti-fascist stance (but don't pretend to be a fan unless you have at least some loyalty and connection with the club), but the top club jersey thing is just cringe. Still; at least you don't see as many Man U tops when abroad these days, and that can only be a good thing...

Divorce happens, one can even change for Android but changing club? That's heresy.

Innit doh. Pick a club; stick with it. That's the rules.

 

[Boidem]

I supported West Ham as my godfather used to take me as a boy. Not quite the glory boys off 66, but not too long after. It was also my most local division one club.
In those days it was standing on the terrace and the chants were not very PC. Especially if Spurs were at our place! As a young boy I didn’t really understand half what they were singing.

I grew up in East London in the 70s and 80s, and West Ham had too large a racist hooligan element for it to be a safe place for anyone who wasn't white (and male tbh). The hissing at Spurs games is one of the most despicable things that happens at grounds, it still does, and is disgusting, especially given the club's ownership. The club has made big efforts to stamp racism out, but it still exists in pockets. It's beyond 'not very PC'. Every club has a bad element, but West Ham's has been far too prominent. Absolute scum. What I have noticed though, is that the move to the municipal athletics track seems to have changed the dynamic somewhat; the scum don't seem to be nearly as visible and vocal (aided probably by far better security systems and surveillance than at Upton Park). And many of the old school racists have fled to Essex, because 'too many foreigners in London' or some other such nonsense, so hopefully are otherwise occupied fighting in pubs and clubs in Billericay and Basildon these days. Good riddance.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I grew up in East London in the 70s and 80s, and West Ham had too large a racist hooligan element for it to be a safe place for anyone who wasn't white (and male tbh). The hissing at Spurs games is one of the most despicable things that happens at grounds, it still does, and is disgusting, especially given the club's ownership. The club has made big efforts to stamp racism out, but it still exists in pockets. It's beyond 'not very PC'. Every club has a bad element, but West Ham's has been far too prominent. Absolute scum. What I have noticed though, is that the move to the municipal athletics track seems to have changed the dynamic somewhat; the scum don't seem to be nearly as visible and vocal (aided probably by far better security systems and surveillance than at Upton Park). And many of the old school racists have fled to Essex, because 'too many foreigners in London' or some other such nonsense, so hopefully are otherwise occupied fighting in pubs and clubs in Billericay and Basildon these days. Good riddance.

I think the racism was prevalent at many clubs. None of it was good. It’s not all gone (as in society as a whole), but it is getting better. I think going to games is a lot safer these days than in my youth. Hopefully we can continue to improve society until it doesn’t matter where you are from, colour of your skin or gender. One day.

 

[Silencio]

You know that the rest of the world cares little about the circus that is 'US Soccer', don't you? It's where old players go to die.

Oh, and it's 'football', btw. Not soccer.

Most countries only care about their own internal dramas, true enough. This particular kerfuffle is worthy of anything England or France's federations can muster up. It's really the logical result of all the nepotism that has held sway there over the decades. The talent is improving on the pitch, but the organization needs a thorough housecleaning.

Yes, it's obviously "football" or "association football", from which the word "soccer" derives. I have to refer to the US's federation as US Soccer because that's what they call themselves.

I barely pay any attention to MLS, but anecdotally I feel like the quality of the league and the players it produces has improved quite a bit. Now old players clearly go to Saudi Arabia to die.

Ah, 80s football in London. Must've been a helluva time. Even us sheltered Americans heard of the fearsome reputations of the West Ham and Millwall hooligans.

 

[Boidem]

I think the racism was prevalent at many clubs. None of it was good. It’s not all gone (as in society as a whole), but it is getting better. I think going to games is a lot safer these days than in my youth. Hopefully we can continue to improve society until it doesn’t matter where you are from, colour of your skin or gender. One day.

Sure, but it was particularly bad at clubs like West Ham, also Millwall and Chelsea, yet not the same level at Spurs or Arsenal, for example. Other clubs, such as Leeds, Cardiff, Birmingham and Luton, also have/had strong hooligan following. The worst behaviour I've witnessed, in terms of racism and general hate, was from WH fans, I'm sorry to say. But then I'd never have gone anywhere near a Millwall game (closest was Bradford V Millwall in a playoff final at Wembley a few years back, and the massive police presence prevented me from even seeing any Millwall fans anyway as I was in the Bradford crowd). Things have improved massively I agree though.

Yes, it's obviously "football" or "association football", from which the word "soccer" derives. I have to refer to the US's federation as US Soccer because that's what they call themselves.

It's football. That's all you need to know.

Now old players clearly go to Saudi Arabia to die

True. 🤣

 

[MBAir2010]

You don't really understand football, do you? Thats not how it works. Still; there are other sports for you to enjoy.

besides goalkeeping even while I was in my 50's, being part of a fan club base since 1997
and meeting the owner of that club twice,
coaching the sport, knowing the difference between formations
and accurately predicting subs during the match I guess not.

I know how to ignore things tho!

 

[Lord Blackadder]

'Soccer' is a 19th century English term for football that has persisted in certain places outside Great Britain, predominately (but NOT exclusively) the US. Nothing wrong with it, I use the terms 'soccer' and 'football' interchangeably. Anyone who complains should be sentenced to read The Ball is Round nonstop in one session.

The soap opera that is the USMNT descends to deeper lows than ever before with the Reynas and Berhalters descending into Hatfields vs McCoys territory. None of these people should represent US Soccer ever again, and Gio Reyna should expect a Karim Benzema-style freeze-out from the national team after all this.

It's really ugly, and nobody wins or comes out looking good. There is a long history of feuding between ex-USMNT players, this is just another chapter of that, sadly. It also exposes the major flaw with the sport in the US - it's dominated by an inbred cadre of entitled, middle class, predominately white people who treat the professional game as an extension of posh youth soccer academies. A self-defeating culture.

If the Reyna family thought Berhalter's behavior in 1990 was irredeemably bad, why have they remained silent about it for 3 decades? If it was (as was claimed) forgiven, is it appropriate to use it as a weapon now, in retaliation for your (adult) child not getting playing time? Doesn't that massively cheapen the purported purpose of tattling on him? Now we look at the prospect of a plodding 'investigation' by some legal eagles that will stir the pot further, while a perennially minimally effectual US Soccer org scrambles to keep things together.

Regardless of the outcome Berhalter's status has become frail if not untenable, the Reynas have soiled their legacy, US Soccer are showing no growth in handling things, the USMNT are thrown into turmoil for the foreseeable future, and Gio Reyna comes off as a spoiled brat and may have damaged what was (and may still hopefully be) a promising career. It's a lose-lose, as I said.

I barely pay any attention to MLS, but anecdotally I feel like the quality of the league and the players it produces has improved quite a bit. Now old players clearly go to Saudi Arabia to die.

I have been watching the league pretty closely for over ten years now, and the standards have risen in a big way. You see far more players in the prime of their careers, more players from Europe and South America, and the stadia are almost all purpose-built affairs that would put many European grounds to shame.

Also, you'll never get accosted by a skinhead or hit with a bottle of urine at an MLS match.

 

[daneoni]

The way Shaktar and Benfica's hierarchy have been moaning is comical. But Utd, City, and Chelsea are somewhat to blame for the precedent they've set. Now European clubs expect to fleece them for every penny.

Pep looks serious tonight. Has fielded arguably his strongest team and i don't see how Chelsea get anything from this match.

 

[timber]

The way Shaktar and Benfica's hierarchy have been moaning is comical. But Utd, City, and Chelsea are somewhat to blame for the precedent they've set. Now European clubs expect to fleece them for every penny.

Pep looks serious tonight. Has fielded arguably his strongest team and i don't see how Chelsea get anything from this match.

Yeah it's really a lot of fun to have endless pits of dubious money start a prospective deal by derailing your players with pie in the sky contracts before even talking with those that own their contract rights.

 

[MBAir2010]

Yippie, El Plastico soon!

 

[daneoni]

Yeah it's really a lot of fun to have endless pits of dubious money start a prospective deal by derailing your players with pie in the sky contracts before even talking with those that own their contract rights.

That's basically how football transfers have worked for decades though

 

[timber]

Doesn't make it any nicer and since Bosman and the endless pit of oil or worse money the results are a lot worse.