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ieani said:
On a plane I was talking to a German lady who said she hates driving here. She said the roads are so open and smooth but the speed limits so slow. America is still ultra-conservative in this respect. So, I take most traffic laws as guides not laws. Why should I not turn on red if there is not any traffic? Why should I waste time and drive the highway at 55, 60 when I can still very safely drive them at 85, 90 and arrive much quicker? Same thing on roads as well. I can get through many more lights doing 45 or 55 then I can at 35 or 25. Of course I am just 19.

One, we do allow for a turn on red (depending on whether it is a one way street or not. In most areas it is possible to turn right at a corner with traffic traveling in both directions; both "north and south". In some areas we allow for a left hand turn after a stop; if the the street one is making the turn on from is one way, and the the street you are making the turn from is one way.

I can not speak from Germany, but an observation in Reykjavik - they don't use horns as we do in the US. At least from the view from the "Bus"; yes the drivers seem to drive aggressively. Not nearly as much as I heard of car drivers though.

I understand the need to get some place quickly. Though in the US it seems to be self defeating due to disregard to social norms.

Does it do any good for one to race ahead of me on local streets; with them weaving in on out, and cutting others off? Only to have me coast up next to them at the next stop light?

My "impression" of Germany and their "Autobahn"; is that one of a more "civilized" view on the use of the road. Slower cars to the right, and yield to those approaching on the left. At least in my view of Iceland, no one person by ownership of a certain car, owned the road. In London, in the Hammersmith-Fuller district; there was a respect of the rules of the road.

Even in Central London, the "congestion" district they imposed seems to have have worked. For I saw traffic moving during the morning rush near Westmister that I would never expect to see any where near the Federal core in the DC area.

But in many ways it is about the respect we show each other. In Iceland, they look at each person that passes in the street or road. Maybe in some hope to see if they might know each other.

In London it is harder to place a reason; other than basic human respect. I say this only after suffering food poisoning on my flight from Reykjavik to London. I felt ill on my arrival to my B&B (The Orlando Hotel). As with another thread here on MR; I arrived trying to decide which end was most important. :eek:

To make a long story short; I went in to the city of London. Those feelings of doing a "hurl" came over me. I did deep breaths. To no avail; I hurled just outside the gates of the Westminster Tube.

When I approached the reps near the gates, they were more concerned about my well being than anything else. They asked if I needed a "Chemist" {IRC} or a Doctor. They cared not where I "hurled"; but about my well being.

The point is, I feel that we in the US, only care about ourselves on the roadway (and in other aspects of our life). We have HOV lanes in my area, I have heard firsthand that is "cheaper" to pay the ticket than to obey the law.

It is about "social responsibility". It is about respecting the "Golden Rule" of :doing unto others, as one have others do unto you". It is not just about the Bible, but the basic tenants that so many other civilizations have common beliefs in. In many ways it is supporting of "common law" from England that is the basis of US law.
 
rickvanr said:
Turning right on a red is legal in Canada (except Quebec), and I don't see why it's an issue, it's perfectly safe as long as you look before you turn.
It's not quite so perfectly safe for foreigners who aren't aware of it – when I visited Canada last month I was nearly mown down like a dog until I twigged what was going on!
 
Chip NoVaMac said:
One, we do allow for a turn on red (depending on whether it is a one way street or not. In most areas it is possible to turn right at a corner with traffic traveling in both directions; both "north and south". In some areas we allow for a left hand turn after a stop; if the the street one is making the turn on from is one way, and the the street you are making the turn from is one way.

I can not speak from Germany, but an observation in Reykjavik - they don't use horns as we do in the US. At least from the view from the "Bus"; yes the drivers seem to drive aggressively. Not nearly as much as I heard of car drivers though.

I understand the need to get some place quickly. Though in the US it seems to be self defeating due to disregard to social norms.

Does it do any good for one to race ahead of me on local streets; with them weaving in on out, and cutting others off? Only to have me coast up next to them at the next stop light?

My "impression" of Germany and their "Autobahn"; is that one of a more "civilized" view on the use of the road. Slower cars to the right, and yield to those approaching on the left. At least in my view of Iceland, no one person by ownership of a certain car, owned the road. In London, in the Hammersmith-Fuller district; there was a respect of the rules of the road.

Even in Central London, the "congestion" district they imposed seems to have have worked. For I saw traffic moving during the morning rush near Westmister that I would never expect to see any where near the Federal core in the DC area.

But in many ways it is about the respect we show each other. In Iceland, they look at each person that passes in the street or road. Maybe in some hope to see if they might know each other.

In London it is harder to place a reason; other than basic human respect. I say this only after suffering food poisoning on my flight from Reykjavik to London. I felt ill on my arrival to my B&B (The Orlando Hotel). As with another thread here on MR; I arrived trying to decide which end was most important. :eek:

To make a long story short; I went in to the city of London. Those feelings of doing a "hurl" came over me. I did deep breaths. To no avail; I hurled just outside the gates of the Westminster Tube.

When I approached the reps near the gates, they were more concerned about my well being than anything else. They asked if I needed a "Chemist" {IRC} or a Doctor. They cared not where I "hurled"; but about my well being.

The point is, I feel that we in the US, only care about ourselves on the roadway (and in other aspects of our life). We have HOV lanes in my area, I have heard firsthand that is "cheaper" to pay the ticket than to obey the law.

It is about "social responsibility". It is about respecting the "Golden Rule" of :doing unto others, as one have others do unto you". It is not just about the Bible, but the basic tenants that so many other civilizations have common beliefs in. In many ways it is supporting of "common law" from England that is the basis of US law.

I may be excessive in my speed but I still think the limits should be raised.
 
ieani said:
I may be excessive in my speed but I still think the limits should be raised.

That may have merit. But many years ago I tried to follow a group of us to the Raleigh-Durham area on I-95. This was about 15-20 years ago. They were doing 20mph+ over the limit. They were weaving in and out at a much greater rate than I think we have today.

The end result, I showed up just 1/2 hour later than they did in what should have been a 5 hour trip. I was IMO much more relaxed attitude, and did not pose a threat by tail-gating or weaving in and out.

Speed limits are not just there to get $ for tickets. They are for the safety of all.
 
Jaffa Cake said:
It's not quite so perfectly safe for foreigners who aren't aware of it – when I visited Canada last month I was nearly mown down like a dog until I twigged what was going on!

Good point. I grew up being aware of it, so when I started driving it wasn't a big deal at all.

Chip NoVaMac said:
My "impression" of Germany and their "Autobahn"; is that one of a more "civilized" view on the use of the road. Slower cars to the right, and yield to those approaching on the left. At least in my view of Iceland, no one person by ownership of a certain car, owned the road. In London, in the Hammersmith-Fuller district; there was a respect of the rules of the road.

I wish the Americans I've encountered followed that rule. Slow drivers in the right lane, move over for faster drivers. I drove to the DC/ Virginia area a few summers ago, and I got extremely frustrated with the amount of people driving slow in the passing lane congesting the highway for 20-30 minutes at a time, when it was all completely unnecessary.
 
Around 110mph. Thought it was fast, but compared to a load of you guys, I guess it's not. Oh well...
 
Wow. I'm late to reply.

I work at a Chevy Cadillac Nissan dealership. I had to go pick up a 2003-ish VW Beetle Turbo 5 speed from the diagnostics shop. I drove it back to the dealership via the freeway.

My co-worker followed me in a 2005 Nissan Maxima 3.5. Needless to say, he said he hit 140 and couldn't catch up to me. I was doing over 100 mph on the onramp. I was impressed (it's not that long). I had no idea a Bug could do that. (The last time I looked at the speedometer, it was floating around 130 and I didn't look at it for the rest of the jaunt.)
 
rickvanr said:
I wish the Americans I've encountered followed that rule. Slow drivers in the right lane, move over for faster drivers. I drove to the DC/ Virginia area a few summers ago, and I got extremely frustrated with the amount of people driving slow in the passing lane congesting the highway for 20-30 minutes at a time, when it was all completely unnecessary.

But the point is, what is "slow"?

In the DC/VA area, are we considered "slow" if we are not doing 10~20mph over the speed limit? And if one were to be caught by the "few" Virginia State Police officers; how does one defend ones self for doing lets say 7mph (don't laugh, it happened to a co-worker of mine) over the limit- while most of the traffic was doing well above that.

In court, the judge did ask why my friend was pulled over. The officer responded that it was becuase he was driving under what others were :eek: at by his radar at 7mph over the limit. And he assumed that my friend was trying to "hide" something illegal by doing just over the speed limit. :eek: To the judges credit, he asked my friend why he was "speeding" over the posted limit. He responded that he did not want to "speed" but wanted to impeed the flow of traffic, so that what he thought was 5mph over the speed limit, would have been prudent and safe - both personally and legally.

According to my friend, the judge then asked the officer if he had observed others exceeding the posted speed limit; above the 7mph violation that my friend was cited. The officer answered "yes". Asked why in the circumstances would he make the stop for speeding, the officer stated that it was that "anyone doing that "slow"over the posted limit was "trying to hide something".

According to my friend, the case was dismissed with prejudice.

To be honest, just what is the "slow" lane in the likes of the DC/NOVA/MD area? In my area I peg my speed control at 10mph over the limit. on our I-495, I find it impossible to do the speed limit of 55mph. And given the speeds at which some drive, even the second most right hand lane is tough to do. And given the proper left hand exit to I-66 off of i-495 from the south - what is one to do?

As one that plans some travel to Canada; maybe you could provide some guidance.
 
fanbrain said:
Wow. I'm late to reply.

I work at a Chevy Cadillac Nissan dealership. I had to go pick up a 2003-ish VW Beetle Turbo 5 speed from the diagnostics shop. I drove it back to the dealership via the freeway.

My co-worker followed me in a 2005 Nissan Maxima 3.5. Needless to say, he said he hit 140 and couldn't catch up to me. I was doing over 100 mph on the onramp. I was impressed (it's not that long). I had no idea a Bug could do that. (The last time I looked at the speedometer, it was floating around 130 and I didn't look at it for the rest of the jaunt.)

The properly tuned VW can run circles among the "want to be's".

I have owned a New Beetle, and test drove a Cabrio for 20+ miles. There is nothing like driving a VW.

Owning a VW is an excersise in being forgiving. Very bad quality control. My 99 Bug had so many electronic issues I doubt that I will ever consider anything other than a Japanese brand. Though my dealer was great.
 
Chip NoVaMac said:
But the point is, what is "slow"?

In the DC/VA area, are we considered "slow" if we are not doing 10~20mph over the speed limit? And if one were to be caught by the "few" Virginia State Police officers; how does one defend ones self for doing lets say 7mph (don't laugh, it happened to a co-worker of mine) over the limit- while most of the traffic was doing well above that.

In court, the judge did ask why my friend was pulled over. The officer responded that it was becuase he was driving under what others were :eek: at by his radar at 7mph over the limit. And he assumed that my friend was trying to "hide" something illegal by doing just over the speed limit. :eek: To the judges credit, he asked my friend why he was "speeding" over the posted limit. He responded that he did not want to "speed" but wanted to impeed the flow of traffic, so that what he thought was 5mph over the speed limit, would have been prudent and safe - both personally and legally.

According to my friend, the judge then asked the officer if he had observed others exceeding the posted speed limit; above the 7mph violation that my friend was cited. The officer answered "yes". Asked why in the circumstances would he make the stop for speeding, the officer stated that it was that "anyone doing that "slow"over the posted limit was "trying to hide something".

According to my friend, the case was dismissed with prejudice.

To be honest, just what is the "slow" lane in the likes of the DC/NOVA/MD area? In my area I peg my speed control at 10mph over the limit. on our I-495, I find it impossible to do the speed limit of 55mph. And given the speeds at which some drive, even the second most right hand lane is tough to do. And given the proper left hand exit to I-66 off of i-495 from the south - what is one to do?

As one that plans some travel to Canada; maybe you could provide some guidance.

I was speaking more on the trip threw New York, and Pennsylvania. I was probably doing +10 on the speed limit. I mean when people doing the speed limit or slower are passing transport trucks and take 2-3 minutes to pass a couple, when they could easily pull in between two and let the cars behind pass. Now, it's the courteous thing to do, and what I expect driving on the highway, or at least what I've come to expect driving the 4-series highways in Ontario.

What would you like to know about Canadian highways? I suggest just setting the cruise around 115-120km/h, and know that the left lane is only for passing. You should be fine.
 
ieani said:
You never knoe until after you experiment a little. :D
Please don't use me or the rest of the traveling public as a guinea pig. I think doing over 130 on public roads is absolutely stupid. They aren't maintained to the levels of proper racetracks, and aren't designed with that kind of speed in mind. They do have some challenging corners around here though. Hermann Tilke should drive around here for a while. ;)
 
120mph in an 86.5 Pontiac Fiero GT, which isn't bad for a 2.8L 140HP vehicle.

I did manage to hit 155mph twice on my 93 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6D, once down a one mile stretch and again on the return trip. There's nothing like hitting an aerodynamic speed limit. :) Those bikes weren't actually capable of going that fast though (rated at around 90-95 HP), and bike speedometers are typically inaccurate in those speed ranges, so I was actually doing more like 145mph.
 
Chip NoVaMac said:
That may have merit. But many years ago I tried to follow a group of us to the Raleigh-Durham area on I-95. This was about 15-20 years ago. They were doing 20mph+ over the limit. They were weaving in and out at a much greater rate than I think we have today.

The end result, I showed up just 1/2 hour later than they did in what should have been a 5 hour trip. I was IMO much more relaxed attitude, and did not pose a threat by tail-gating or weaving in and out.

Speed limits are not just there to get $ for tickets. They are for the safety of all.

Well they just drive poorly. I drive as relaxed at 90, 100 as I do 60. I can judge traffic so I never tailgate and I rarely use my brakes. I instead can see ahead where Ill need to slow down based on traffic and just coast to match speed . Ill then drive the matched speed until I find a hole to slip through and regain my speed.

I understand your point of safety for everyone. Many drivers here in the states probably should not drive over 60 as many of them are awful drivers who shouldnt even be licensed. When Im driving, safety is a huge concern but I feel I can drive safely at high speeds and have yet to have any close calls to dissuade me. To me high speed driving makes driving much more interesting and involving. I have a lot of problems concentrating at slow speeds because my mind will drift, so I fix this by driving at a tempo requiring careful focus.
 
sushi said:
Stubeef, what are the T/O and Landing speeds in the Gulfstream?

sorry just saw this,

the max tire speed is 182 kts = 209mph
I have been on the ground through about 145kts=167mph
(High and Hot, summer day out of El Paso, no flaps, no slats)
 
ieani said:
Well they just drive poorly. I drive as relaxed at 90, 100 as I do 60. I can judge traffic so I never tailgate and I rarely use my brakes. I instead can see ahead where Ill need to slow down based on traffic and just coast to match speed . Ill then drive the matched speed until I find a hole to slip through and regain my speed.

You are rare indeed. What I love is with those that feel the need for speed, is to wave or nod at them when we catch each other at a traffic light.

To be honest though, driving at the speeds you stated can and will induce anxiety whether you know it or accept it.

I understand your point of safety for everyone. Many drivers here in the states probably should not drive over 60 as many of them are awful drivers who shouldnt even be licensed. When Im driving, safety is a huge concern but I feel I can drive safely at high speeds and have yet to have any close calls to dissuade me. To me high speed driving makes driving much more interesting and involving. I have a lot of problems concentrating at slow speeds because my mind will drift, so I fix this by driving at a tempo requiring careful focus.

All well and good for yourself, but actions such as yours may have ramifications that you are not aware of. At 90 to 100 mph, even in the DC area - you are weaving in and out of traffic to maintain that speed.

I hope that you live in the Dakotas or Wyoming in order to travel at such speeds. For I have seen people traveling speeds like you stated, that have caused accidents in their wake.

I guess the question I have for you is, why do you feel the need to break the law as you so readily have stated you have done? Keep in mind most of us understand that with speed limits, there is a certain "grace" provided - whether it is 5 or 10mph over the posted limit.

Do you feel that stop signs or traffic signals are for those that can't safely decide when to stop? Or do you feel that it is OK to steal an item from the 7-11, because the line at the register was to long and would delay your day? Or do you feel it is OK to cheat on your taxes, because the government already gets their "share"?

"Laws" are there to guide us and to provide some protection or benefit. These laws can be religious based (thou shall not steal...), common law based (a good days wages for a good days work...), or as simple as one is to observe the posted speed limit (regardless as to what you or I may think about the posted limit).

Are you saying that we can pick and choose the "laws" as we see fit? I don't think so.

For in some ways speeding on the roads is like the "broken window syndrome". In which a car can be on a street, for days on end, without a scratch on it. But break a window on that car, and it be stripped and defiled in a matter of hours, if not just a couple of days.

IMO, one can only look at the disrespect of the "law" in the past 20 to 30 years in order to see how we treat each other in the day to day dealings. It has become a situation that "I am more important" than you. And that is what "laws" were set in place to prevent.
 
leet1 said:
176mph on my Yamaha R1. Cars are boring :eek: Press gas...go. Motorcycles totally different :D

I got 170mph out of my old ThunderAce. That nice straight bit just south of Gatwick Airport. The bike could have done a bit more, but even though I was flat on the tank, my jacket was pressing into my chest and making it rather difficult to breathe. :cool:

These days, I don't tend to go that fast on the straights. A well taken corner gets my grin factor up to 10.
 
Chip NoVaMac said:
Do you feel that stop signs or traffic signals are for those that can't safely decide when to stop? Or do you feel that it is OK to steal an item from the 7-11, because the line at the register was to long and would delay your day? Or do you feel it is OK to cheat on your taxes, because the government already gets their "share"?

"Laws" are there to guide us and to provide some protection or benefit. These laws can be religious based (thou shall not steal...), common law based (a good days wages for a good days work...), or as simple as one is to observe the posted speed limit (regardless as to what you or I may think about the posted limit).

Are you saying that we can pick and choose the "laws" as we see fit? I don't think so.

Theft of a good denies the rightful owner of that good. There is a 100% probability of harm. Speeding depends on many factors. Anecdotal references to others who have caused harm, while serving as a cautionary tale, is not relavent to the probability of another individual causing harm.

Some laws protect us from guaranteed harm. Many traffic regulations are merely protocols, that outline a minimal strategy for avoiding harm, and maintaining good traffic flow. Some people have alternate strategies. For example, you're only supposed to pass on the left. On the highway I try to do that, but when someone is camping in the left lane, I will move into the right lane from a distance, so they have time to see me in it. I will then be very vigilent as I pass, in case they might migrate into my lane. You see, I know the reason for that regulation, and so when I break it, I take the appropriate precautions, so that it's no more dangerous than following the law. I believe that's the sentiment some of the speeders here are trying to convey.

And to specifically respond to your traffic signal/stop light question: Who here has not come to an intersection where you can see in all directions for kilometers on end. Do you come to a full and complete stop if there's a stop sign? Also, what if it's 4am, and there are zero vehicles or pedestrians in sight at all, and you can clearly see in all directions, and there is no red light camera. Do you wait for the light to change? When there's no traffic at all, do you respect No U-Turn signs, if you made a wrong turn and have to go back? I can understand saying no to some of these questions, but all of them? I doubt it.
 
Counterfit said:
Please don't use me or the rest of the traveling public as a guinea pig. I think doing over 130 on public roads is absolutely stupid. They aren't maintained to the levels of proper racetracks, and aren't designed with that kind of speed in mind.
Thank you. That is precisely how I feel. I have no qualms about riding in a car on the track less than six inches behind the car in front both rounding an off-camber turn doing well over 75mph-- but a track has controlled conditions! Ambulance at the ready. A crew ready to clean track spills. Clean and conditioned surfaces. All the drivers out there know to follow flags and to adhere to track ettiquete (sp?)...

I rode with one instructor driving and he said I was so different from his wife who couldn't stand his fast driving. To which I replied, "Well, you speeding on this track is fine, I trust you. I'm sure your wife trusts your driving as well. But speeding in a minivan on a public road with all sorts of other drivers and conditions is a whole 'nother thing."

He could do nothing but agree.
 
130

in a Toyota MR2 turbo. Sweetest car ever. Wish I still had it. Very stable. Dumb, though, and I was nervous the whole time: about getting a ticket, about getting a flat, about being roadkill. Now, I drive a more reasonable Camry that I'm nearly sure doesn't exceed 85 mph.
 
125 MPH in a 1994 Ford Escort GT while driving from Phoenix to Las Vegas. (Three of us in college were going to Vegas for New Years '98, had to pick up one at the Phoenix airport at 8:30 PM.) For a large part of the drive, there were three cars in a row doing 120: Brand-spankin-new '98 Corvette, us, and an early '90s Porsche 911. We'd pass the 'slow' (90 MPH) cars as a group.

It was fun. I drove about half of it, one of the others going along (who owned a Corvette,) drove the other half. The third guy was white-knuckled the whole way. (And he thought he was going to become an Air Force fighter pilot when he graduated...)

The fastest car I've ever been in was 140 MPH in a 1984 Ford Thunderbird 4 cyl Turbo. Well, we think we were going 140. The speedo only went up to 120, and the needle was about 10 MPH beyond that. Based on how long it took the needle to start dropping when he let off the gas, and how fast the needle kept dropping, we estimated 140.

Now that I'm a responsible adult, I don't advocate driving like that unless you're on a track. I don't care if you want to kill yourself, but don't put me and my family at risk from your carelessness. (I've now seen too many accidents where the idiot kid (like I was,) killed innocent bystanders, yet the idiot kid lived.)
 
About 150-160Km/h on a rented Clio in Germany... it was about to take off!! :eek:

The bummer was that all the Mercedes and Audis just kept passing me by at that speed :(
 
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