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jeremiah256

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Aug 2, 2008
1,442
1,168
Southern California
I think I wrote this elsewhere but I'm transitioning from a traditional computer to using iOS as my default platform. With my personal use case, I am not able to fully transition to iOS as my only OS, but it has reached the point where I no longer need to use a laptop as powerful (or as heavy as my 2011 model) as a MBP. This is something I thought about doing when 9.3 came out as I love the form factor of the iPad, and something I've fully decided to do since the iPad Pro was released. This thread was started in part to praise Steve Jobs' vision, but also to either validate or invalidate my decision before I invest my money, and gain insight into how I have to change my workflow . What I've learned so far:

1. Cloud storage is key. I trust the cloud. Between Microsoft, Google, and Apple, I easily have 1.5 TBs of cloud storage available. But @Night Spring, @Rhonindk, and @sparksd brought up a good point: backup needs to be immediate or you could lose data. Up until now, I had planned on buying a Wi-Fi only iPad and relying on tethering it to my phone. But I don't always immediately do that when I've made changes to files and if I'm going to be using an iPad as my main driver, that is a weakness. So my iPad Pro should have LTE.

2. Meta data. I already opened apps and files from the springboard using Spotlight. I don't care where something is as I have a search engine on my phone that will find it. Thanks to @Capt T and @TrueBlou for noting that you can use search within the Mail App. It was right there in front of my eyes, I don't know how I missed it. As long as the individual files in my project are all tagged or use the same naming convention, they show up as one. I'm hoping iOS 10 allows you to select more than one item at a time, enables more tagging of files, and expands Spotlight's capabilities.

3. Mediated App Stores. At this point, I'm still going forward with my transition, but it's been delayed about a month since we had an emergency where my wife's MBA had to be replaced last weekend. It was such a smooth procedure. I haven't had to migrate a Mac in about 4 years, so I forgot how easy Time Machine makes it. It just so happens, at work, they switched me from a desktop PC to laptop PC. It was like night and day. Horrid experience. Not totally Microsoft's fault, as some of the desktop applications don't seem to migrate well, but it made me think. Like with using Android or ChromeOS devices, using Apple devices means I can grab any other Apple device and restore using iCloud, Time Machine, and the Mac OS and iOS app stores. Microsoft devices can be restored from backup, but they are sorely lacking on the app store front. And with a traditional computer, if I've misplaced my copy of the program or lost the key, I'm toast. My original plan was to replace my current MBP 2011 with my Surface 3 as my "I still can't do this on my iPad" backup device, then buy an iPad Pro as the device I use 99% of the time while iOS continues to evolve. Now I'm planning on selling my Surface 3 - which I like but doesn't fit into my new model - and buying a refurbished MBA as the companion device to my iPad Pro.
 

rowspaxe

macrumors 68020
Jan 29, 2010
2,214
1,009
Have you ever run an uninstall program on Windows? It takes a lot longer than dragging your app to trash.
it runs in the background
[doublepost=1460423270][/doublepost]
The uninstaller is also a lot more effective though. Apples method tends to leave piles of stuff sitting in Application Support/ frequently to the tune of GBs of needless cruft if you have used a lot of apps.
This has gotten a lot better in later versions of Windows--there is still probrably some registry clutter--but uninstalls seem pretty robust
 

spiderman0616

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2010
5,113
6,495
I'm now using an iPad Pro as my main computer. When I was using a MacBook Pro as my main computer, the only thing I ever really used Finder for was to access Dropbox or iCloud Drive. Both services are available on my iPad and function identically to how they functioned on my Mac.

When my parents switched from a PC to an iPad as their main computer, I almost immediately stopped getting tech support calls from my parents, because they were no longer able to mess up files or directories on their machines, and they could no longer infect their OS with viruses.

I say good riddance to finder.
[doublepost=1460424187][/doublepost]
it runs in the background
[doublepost=1460423270][/doublepost]
This has gotten a lot better in later versions of Windows--there is still probrably some registry clutter--but uninstalls seem pretty robust
I never want to deal with a registry ever again.
 

Digital Skunk

macrumors G3
Dec 23, 2006
8,085
903
In my imagination
I'm sure you'll know this, but some people might not, but in Mail if you hold down and from the pop up scroll to the right, you can choose Add Attachment.

From there you can add any Apple supported file format (txt/pdf/MP3/MP4/pages/numbers/whatever) from iCloud Drive, OneDrive, Dropbox, maybe more I don't use any others.

In the default mail app you can click on the paper clip and access anything in iCloud Drive, plus if you click on locations I also have Box, Dropbox, Transmit and BitTorrent sync as possible locations.

Thanks gentlemen. This was all new to me. I was so turned off by not being able to do that before that I haven't tried recently. Having this available really makes much of the need for a filesystem moot.

I'm now using an iPad Pro as my main computer. When I was using a MacBook Pro as my main computer, the only thing I ever really used Finder for was to access Dropbox or iCloud Drive. Both services are available on my iPad and function identically to how they functioned on my Mac.

When my parents switched from a PC to an iPad as their main computer, I almost immediately stopped getting tech support calls from my parents, because they were no longer able to mess up files or directories on their machines, and they could no longer infect their OS with viruses.

My mother stopped calling me too. She uses an iPhone and an iPad mini exclusively.

She gets to use all of the same apps and has the same functionality. MS Office and mail and web surfing, with the occasional Facebook and photo sharing. If she had a larger iPad or a Pro it'd be overkill.
 
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dk001

Contributor
Oct 3, 2014
8,998
13,188
Surf Sand and Sun
...
My mother stopped calling me too. She uses an iPhone and an iPad mini exclusively.

She gets to use all of the same apps and has the same functionality. MS Office and mail and web surfing, with the occasional Facebook and photo sharing. If she had a larger iPad or a Pro it'd be overkill.

There in lies the split.
You either can use a tablet as your primary pc or not. Your mom can. Great!
As a user all people fall into one of three buckets:
  1. A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  2. A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  3. You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.
I am leaving out those who don't use anything. Personally I tried and need a notebook/desktop. That's me.
btw: MSO on a tablet is not the same as on a notebook. That's aside from not having all the parts of MSO available.

Disclaimer: I am not counting the Surface Pro and similar devices as a tablet.
 
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spiderman0616

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2010
5,113
6,495
There in lies the split.
You either can use a tablet as your primary pc or not. Your mom can. Great!
As a user all people fall into one of three buckets:
  1. A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  2. A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  3. You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.
I am leaving out those who don't use anything. Personally I tried and need a notebook/desktop. That's me.
btw: MSO on a tablet is not the same as on a notebook. That's aside from not having all the parts of MSO available.

Disclaimer: I am not counting the Surface Pro and similar devices as a tablet.
Your MSO comment also depends on the user though. I get free Office 365 through work, and for the things I personally do with Office, the iPad works just fine. I know there are people out there who do crazy macros and stuff with Excel, but I personally don't. So Office is not necessarily a key differentiator for some users.
 

Night Spring

macrumors G5
Jul 17, 2008
13,836
6,923
  • A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  • A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  • You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.

I'm not sure what you mean by 3. But your first two items don't say anything useful, because those categories are changing rapidly these days. Before the 12.9 iPad Pro was released, I was in your group 2. I needed my laptop/desktop to do my work, and my iPad was mainly for personal entertainment. But since I got my 12.9 iPad, I've started doing my work mostly on my iPad, retired my laptop, and keep my desktop for those rare tasks that can't be done on an iPad.

Basically, what people are trying to figure out is which category they fit in, and why. Pointing out there are these categories might help in focusing the discussion, but it doesn't help people figure out which group they belong in.
 

dk001

Contributor
Oct 3, 2014
8,998
13,188
Surf Sand and Sun
Your MSO comment also depends on the user though. I get free Office 365 through work, and for the things I personally do with Office, the iPad works just fine. I know there are people out there who do crazy macros and stuff with Excel, but I personally don't. So Office is not necessarily a key differentiator for some users.

Very true. For a general user the tablet version does all they need. Even for those who need more functionality the tablet often does just enough.

It is usually cut / dry. Either it works for your needs or doesn't.
For me and many others, "technical, engineering, regulatory, legal, etc"... there is no way.
[doublepost=1460476708][/doublepost]
I'm not sure what you mean by 3. But your first two items don't say anything useful, because those categories are changing rapidly these days. Before the 12.9 iPad Pro was released, I was in your group 2. I needed my laptop/desktop to do my work, and my iPad was mainly for personal entertainment. But since I got my 12.9 iPad, I've started doing my work mostly on my iPad, retired my laptop, and keep my desktop for those rare tasks that can't be done on an iPad.

Basically, what people are trying to figure out is which category they fit in, and why. Pointing out there are these categories might help in focusing the discussion, but it doesn't help people figure out which group they belong in.

3... I have run into a number of folks who really should use a notebook or could use just a tablet however their personal justification is "I want to use what I want, not what I need". They do their utmost to make it work.

Trial and error. Personally, I experimented. iPad, ASUS Transformer, Samsung Tab, etc... seeing if I could make a tablet work and like you, relegate my desktop/notebook to the "seldom if ever" use case. I was a Number 3 during that time. After failing repeatedly, I seriously looked at what I needed vs. what a tablet could do and settled into my current use model. Notebook - task use, Tablet - consumptive use, Smartphone - mobile connectivity.
 
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jamesrick80

macrumors 68030
Sep 12, 2014
2,659
2,216
Deleting the app does delete the data stored inside the app. Sometimes, if you reinstall an app immediately after deleting it, you get back the data because it hasn't been overwritten yet. And many apps now store their data in the cloud, so they sync back the data on reinstallation. But basically, if you delete an app and there's no cloud syncing, then it is bye-bye data!
I don't even wanna discuss one of my ipad air horror stories where I deleted a app and lost all of my data....whenever i can get saved something to onedrive, box, or dropbox I try my best put it there for now....I'm don't even use any of my ipad pro storage because of the cloud and my fear of accidently deleting a app and all of my data going. That's why I believe more storage is in a ipad is negligible without a proper file system.
 

rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
13,719
11,400
As a user all people fall into one of three buckets:
  1. A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  2. A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  3. You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.
Personally, I'm in number 2. However, the iPad is much more handy and convenient for certain tasks (e.g. web browsing, reading and annotating PDF, reading comics, etc). Aside from the iPad, I also have a couple of Kindle Paperwhite (one for novels and one for fanfics). :p

My desk looks like Picard's:

picard-surrounded-by-padds.jpg



It is usually cut / dry. Either it works for your needs or doesn't.
For me and many others, "technical, engineering, regulatory, legal, etc"... there is no way.
[doublepost=1460476708][/doublepost]

3... I have run into a number of folks who really should use a notebook or could use just a tablet however their personal justification is "I want to use what I want, not what I need". They do their utmost to make it work.

Trial and error. Personally, I experimented. iPad, ASUS Transformer, Samsung Tab, etc... seeing if I could make a tablet work and like you, relegate my desktop/notebook to the "seldom if ever" use case. I was a Number 3 during that time. After failing repeatedly, I seriously looked at what I needed vs. what a tablet could do and settled into my current use model. Notebook - task use, Tablet - consumptive use, Smartphone - mobile connectivity.
My (personal) notebook is already in the "seldom if ever" use case. However, when I need it, I need it - no substitutions allowed. Of course, at work I'm on the work-supplied desktop.
 
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iRaynor SK

macrumors 6502
Nov 15, 2014
492
91
Banská Bystrica, Slovak Republic
I just want better file exchange between apps. "Open with..." can handle only one file per instance.

In Windows 10 Mobile (I have Lumia) is one shared sandboxed place for my all files. And it is shared by my all apps. And system filesystem is hidden like in iOS. Just try to edit website with Textastic and then copy edited files to BitSync (it synchronise my files on Mac, iPad and NAS). Yea, one by one file. System supported sync is missing in iOS.

I want Mission Control on my iPad :-( and better multitasking. And ability to run apps while they are in background, for example when I download big file and use Home button to push app to background, downloading will stop.
 
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spiderman0616

macrumors 603
Aug 1, 2010
5,113
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Very true. For a general user the tablet version does all they need. Even for those who need more functionality the tablet often does just enough.

It is usually cut / dry. Either it works for your needs or doesn't.
For me and many others, "technical, engineering, regulatory, legal, etc"... there is no way.
[doublepost=1460476708][/doublepost]

3... I have run into a number of folks who really should use a notebook or could use just a tablet however their personal justification is "I want to use what I want, not what I need". They do their utmost to make it work.

Trial and error. Personally, I experimented. iPad, ASUS Transformer, Samsung Tab, etc... seeing if I could make a tablet work and like you, relegate my desktop/notebook to the "seldom if ever" use case. I was a Number 3 during that time. After failing repeatedly, I seriously looked at what I needed vs. what a tablet could do and settled into my current use model. Notebook - task use, Tablet - consumptive use, Smartphone - mobile connectivity.
I'm down to exactly two things I still need a notebook for, and one of them is just because one of the apps I use regularly doesn't have any kind of cloud integration for downloading files. I am continuing to be surprised by how well the iPad Pro is standing in for my laptop. Most of the stuff the media tells me I can't do on an iPad is completely wrong or out of date.
 

Digital Skunk

macrumors G3
Dec 23, 2006
8,085
903
In my imagination
There in lies the split.
You either can use a tablet as your primary pc or not. Your mom can. Great!
As a user all people fall into one of three buckets:
  1. A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  2. A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  3. You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.
I am leaving out those who don't use anything. Personally I tried and need a notebook/desktop. That's me.
btw: MSO on a tablet is not the same as on a notebook. That's aside from not having all the parts of MSO available.

Disclaimer: I am not counting the Surface Pro and similar devices as a tablet.

I would agree. But in talking about the common user, the ones that just use MSO to type and input data, etc., and the ones that surf the web and do those basic tasks that in truth ANY device can excel at . . . . the tablet works.

I'm a college professor that on occasion goes to a laptop/desktop to work, but that's just building lessons. After that, it could be tablet all the way with the minor tweak of a presentation or syllabus here and there.

I guess I would fit into category number 3 on your list.
 

oneMadRssn

macrumors 603
Sep 8, 2011
5,837
13,581
There in lies the split.
You either can use a tablet as your primary pc or not. Your mom can. Great!
As a user all people fall into one of three buckets:
  1. A tablet will suffice as the primary computing device
  2. A notebook will suffice as the primary computing device
  3. You don't care and will utilize what you want even though you fit into 1 or 2.
I am leaving out those who don't use anything. Personally I tried and need a notebook/desktop. That's me.
btw: MSO on a tablet is not the same as on a notebook. That's aside from not having all the parts of MSO available.

Disclaimer: I am not counting the Surface Pro and similar devices as a tablet.

I don't think it's about whether the device will suffice (or put another way, it's not about what the device can or can't do) because both tablets and notebooks can pretty much do the same things at this point and thus I think most people can get done whatever it is they need to be done on either device.

The inquiry, rather, is which device is best or most efficient for a given user's work-flow. The iPad is probably best for people who only need to focus on one thing at a time, or whose workflow is linear (app1, then app2, then app3, then finish on app4). The notebook is best for people who need to focus on more than one app at any given time, or whose workflow is multi-leveled and circular (app1, then app2 and app3, then app4, then finish back on app2).

Again, at this point I can get close to 100% of my work done on either device. Currently though, I work on a notebook. On an iPad, my fingers would be very tired, the screen would be very smudged, and the work would take at least twice as long.
 

rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
13,719
11,400
Wow. I also like reading fanfic, but it never occurred to me to have a device just for that!
In fairness, two Kindle Paperwhites is still cheaper than one iPad mini. :p

Kindle kinda sucks for organization so when Amazon released the higher PPI model, I got one for dedicated fanfic use (USB sideload only, not connected to Amazon account) and kept the old one for Kindle-purchased ebooks.
 

Osty

macrumors 6502a
Jul 15, 2008
561
518
Melbourne, AU
When I want to get rid of an app on the PC, I have to go through an "uninstall". On a Mac, I drag the application to the trash.

Sure, that's how you get rid of the binaries and libraries but the app will still leave a lot of cruft in ~/Library and sometimes /Library

The shift in UI and UX design is to, over time, make interacting with computers less about me conforming to the device and the device conforming to me.

That's called 'levels of abstraction' and while you take the optimistic view, to me this trends is adding more and more performance overhead (hence the need to constantly upgrade) and less visibility to what the computer is actually doing (hence the need to implicitly trust the vendor).

Abstracting more and more functionality away is a double-edged sword. Yes, it empowers users who want to use a computer for a fixed task in a fixed way, as mandated by a developer. But it takes away our freedom to use the device in other ways not intended by the device manufacturer or developer.

It's not entirely altruistic and is part of a general trend (or war if you believe Cory Doctorow) to take general purpose computers out of the hand of the general population.
 
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Commy1

macrumors 6502a
Feb 25, 2013
728
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I hope that Apple innovates beyond the need for a traditional file system. People want what is familiar but I'm sure it could be done some other way.
 
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Night Spring

macrumors G5
Jul 17, 2008
13,836
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In fairness, two Kindle Paperwhites is still cheaper than one iPad mini. :p

Kindle kinda sucks for organization so when Amazon released the higher PPI model, I got one for dedicated fanfic use (USB sideload only, not connected to Amazon account) and kept the old one for Kindle-purchased ebooks.

Heh. I like that the new one is for fanfic! :D

I download fanfic in ePub format to iBooks. At first I was diligently sorting them into "collections" to separate them from other reading material, but I eventually got tired of sorting and now have everything thrown together without any organization.

I did consider using different apps for different types of books, but never did find an ebook app I liked as well as iBooks.
[doublepost=1460513771][/doublepost]
It's not entirely altruistic and is part of a general trend (or war if you believe Cory Doctorow) to take general purpose computers out of the hand of the general population.

I do know what you mean, but you've got to admit, the general population was never in control of computers to begin with. For the vast majority of people, computers are this complicated thing they don't understand how to customize to "do what they want." I mean, I don't think my Mom quite understands what the difference is between "web site" and "web page." Just the other day, she was having trouble with iTunes, and I didn't know if her iMac was running OS X or Windows -- it has both OS installed through Bootcamp. After several minutes of trying to get the information from her over FaceTime, I finally asked her to point the camera at her computer so I could see the computer screen (it was running OS X). That's the kind of user who finds iOS easy to use, and finds it freeing to not have to deal with the complexities of desktop operating systems.
 
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Osty

macrumors 6502a
Jul 15, 2008
561
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Melbourne, AU
I do know what you mean, but you've got to admit, the general population was never in control of computers to begin with. For the vast majority of people, computers are this complicated thing they don't understand how to customize to "do what they want." I mean, I don't think my Mom quite understands what the difference is between "web site" and "web page." Just the other day, she was having trouble with iTunes, and I didn't know if her iMac was running OS X or Windows -- it has both OS installed through Bootcamp. After several minutes of trying to get the information from her over FaceTime, I finally asked her to point the camera at her computer so I could see the computer screen (it was running OS X). That's the kind of user who finds iOS easy to use, and finds it freeing to not have to deal with the complexities of desktop operating systems.

Yes I can admit it, doesn't mean I have to like it though!

Generally the issue you cite is/was one of education. It's wonderful that the general population of non-technical people can use these devices to accomplish their tasks and not be left behind. I woulnd't want to take that away from them.

Equally, I don't want to live in a world where technical users are forced down that path either. I'm a dying breed, I know, I prefer manual transmissions on cars and I prefer cooking with an oven and stove, not shoving a TV dinner in a microwave.
 
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Night Spring

macrumors G5
Jul 17, 2008
13,836
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I don't want to live in a world where technical users are forced down that path either

I sometimes do wonder how a generation that grows up on sandboxed/walled systems will learn coding and system administration/maintenance. Then I just shrug and think that the education system will adapt to teach the necessary skills to the next generation of computer professionals. My dad grew up on a farm, and was fit and muscular from the physical labor he did growing up. Today, city raised athletes achieve the same kind of build by working out in gyms.
 

whtrbt7

macrumors 65816
Jun 8, 2011
1,015
73
Traditional file management I think is tough to justify for mobile appliances that need information faster and faster. We need a large pool of files handled via indexing system that can smartly identify things we need to work with when and where we are working on them. Apple has part of this built already with their spotlight indexing system but it needs to be smarter without user interaction. Realistically the indexer needs to read all files and automatically identify keywords as well as geocache/synchrocache file usage so it will recommend the data when and where you need it. Also for project management, it would be better to have files tagged under code name or project name so you can bring up all files pertaining to project. There is a lot that can be done with UI and UX in this regard.
 
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Osty

macrumors 6502a
Jul 15, 2008
561
518
Melbourne, AU
My dad grew up on a farm, and was fit and muscular from the physical labor he did growing up. Today, city raised athletes achieve the same kind of build by working out in gyms.

Interesting metaphor but flawed. Set aside the differences in upbringing and there's nothing inherently stopping someone working on their physical development on a farm or in a gym: resistance is resistance. To stick with your metaphor though, Apple's asking us to learn to box with a hand tied behind our backs.

I've trained with bodybuilders (in gyms) and Strength athletes (outdoors with non-standard apparatus) and the differences in their functional abilities and performance is staggering. Bodybuilders and 'fitness models' look good but are far from healthy and functional on the inside.

Your dad, was likely a much more robust, healthier and resistant to disease than the pampered modern athlete, many of whom owe their success to performance enhancing substances. Do a search on rates of illness among athletes and you'll see what I mean.
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Traditional file management I think is tough to justify for mobile appliances that need information faster and faster.

That sounds great, but until universal, low cost, very fast wireless broadband is a reality, the cloud isn't worth a cup of cold pi$$ to most of humanity.

We need a large pool of files handled via indexing system that can smartly identify things we need to work with when and where we are working on them. Apple has part of this built already with their spotlight indexing system but it needs to be smarter without user interaction. Realistically the indexer needs to read all files and automatically identify keywords as well as geocache/synchrocache file usage so it will recommend the data when and where you need it.

That's a long way off. I'm continually disappointed by Apple's smarts. Google is better at it, but that comes at huge personal cost over our data and privacy. That recommended 'data' usually ends up being adverts anyway.

Why not add telemetry from wearables while you are at so I can get automatic recommendations for restaurants when I'm hungry and brothels when I'm horny. No thanks.


Also for project management, it would be better to have files tagged under code name or project name so you can bring up all files pertaining to project. There is a lot that can be done with UI and UX in this regard.

Traditional filesystems can already do this.

Nothing you've said is a justification for a sandboxed mobile/cloud-based file system at the expense of user access.
 

whtrbt7

macrumors 65816
Jun 8, 2011
1,015
73
Different strokes for different folks. When I say that mobile appliances don't really need a traditional file system, I mean that even without Internet access, people are more inclined to want to get to their files faster than thumbing through a file system. Cloud computing is ok at this point but as you said, universal, low cost, high bandwidth wireless broadband is currently in a state of development. Funny thing though is that people without infrastructure already built like in Africa have access to mobile technologies more readily than countries with developed traditional comms pipelines.

Google and Apple do a pretty decent job at pseudo AI for guessing what is coming next in terms of tech needs but they both have issues at the current moment especially with their digital assistants. Google has a vested interest in obtaining personal data so it can sell ads to generate income. Apple on the other hand is more interested in obtaining your personal data and locking it into iCloud so they can sell you hardware to match with their software. Both companies already aggregate health and telemetry data from their wearables in order to improve both product lines as well as create new ways for them to generate cash flow. I don't mind getting recommendations for my own files, I normally mind getting an ad pushed in my face for something I didn't want or need. The times when I do accept ads is when I have a vested interest in obtaining other data where a fair exchange of ad watching to information exchange is required.

Lastly, traditional file systems don't already auto-tag for circumstantial data like projects. Some systems can data mine your documents for this data but the results are inconclusive for automatically being able to assign correct tags without human intervention. If we take a look at databases, some of them can organize data in this manner but the problem with the current system is that it still doesn't tag files without human intervention. Automation can be a huge benefit in these circumstances. It's not about a sandboxed mobile/cloud-based file system, it's more about organization of data and being able to query it intelligently online and offline without really having to spend the effort to do so.

I used to organize things into directories and then sub directories until I had a huge directory tree that went at least 10 levels deep. The problem with this kind of behavior is that I lose things inside of the sub directories all the time and nothing is really organized, it's just nested. With a smarter indexing system that can automatically assign tags and other correlated data, we can essentially just dump all of our files into a large pool and then request files from keywords or when one of the markers for location or time are met. It would be an intelligent system where you can easily just see all files at once, a specific set of files depending on situation, or a single file upon request. I'm not sure if I'm making a huge amount of sense this late at night but it's a good topic of conversation for building stuff for the future. I could be really quacked out too but that's normally just chalked up to my different viewpoint on the issue.
 

Osty

macrumors 6502a
Jul 15, 2008
561
518
Melbourne, AU
Different strokes for different folks. When I say that mobile appliances don't really need a traditional file system, I mean that even without Internet access, people are more inclined to want to get to their files faster than thumbing through a file system. Cloud computing is ok at this point but as you said, universal, low cost, high bandwidth wireless broadband is currently in a state of development. Funny thing though is that people without infrastructure already built like in Africa have access to mobile technologies more readily than countries with developed traditional comms pipelines.

Google and Apple do a pretty decent job at pseudo AI for guessing what is coming next in terms of tech needs but they both have issues at the current moment especially with their digital assistants. Google has a vested interest in obtaining personal data so it can sell ads to generate income. Apple on the other hand is more interested in obtaining your personal data and locking it into iCloud so they can sell you hardware to match with their software. Both companies already aggregate health and telemetry data from their wearables in order to improve both product lines as well as create new ways for them to generate cash flow. I don't mind getting recommendations for my own files, I normally mind getting an ad pushed in my face for something I didn't want or need. The times when I do accept ads is when I have a vested interest in obtaining other data where a fair exchange of ad watching to information exchange is required.

Lastly, traditional file systems don't already auto-tag for circumstantial data like projects. Some systems can data mine your documents for this data but the results are inconclusive for automatically being able to assign correct tags without human intervention. If we take a look at databases, some of them can organize data in this manner but the problem with the current system is that it still doesn't tag files without human intervention. Automation can be a huge benefit in these circumstances. It's not about a sandboxed mobile/cloud-based file system, it's more about organization of data and being able to query it intelligently online and offline without really having to spend the effort to do so.

I used to organize things into directories and then sub directories until I had a huge directory tree that went at least 10 levels deep. The problem with this kind of behavior is that I lose things inside of the sub directories all the time and nothing is really organized, it's just nested. With a smarter indexing system that can automatically assign tags and other correlated data, we can essentially just dump all of our files into a large pool and then request files from keywords or when one of the markers for location or time are met. It would be an intelligent system where you can easily just see all files at once, a specific set of files depending on situation, or a single file upon request. I'm not sure if I'm making a huge amount of sense this late at night but it's a good topic of conversation for building stuff for the future. I could be really quacked out too but that's normally just chalked up to my different viewpoint on the issue.

I do agree with you in principle and I can understand the appeal of a sufficiently developed AI system that can respond to and anticipate what I want and when I want it without having to thumb through a touch-based OS, which as we're discovering is pretty lame for getting things done with traditional approaches to input.

That said, with my desktop systems (and Android phone), I know the file system intimately, I've put files where I want them according to a taxonomy that suits my brain and my workflow and I know where they are. I've got projects under revision control with Git, network shares to local and remote servers using NFS and SSHFS, I make use of diff, meld, grep, sed, python, awk and other utilities to glue workflows together much more efficiently than I can with iOS sharesheets and other cute features.

Advocates and sellers of your brave new world want me to give up that control, store my data on their computers so they can mine/tag/process it and serve/sell me curated information based on what they *think* I want. I'm not ready for that world; I'm not ready to lose control over my computing or my data.
 
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