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The lacie little big disk arrived today test results
- Thread starter philipma1957
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@philipma - I'm still waiting on the two fans ordered from eBay.
I was looking at system profiler and it appears the link speed for the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk is 6Gbps, but the negotiated link speed is 3Gbps. Not sure if a LaCie firmware is required to get the SSDs to work at 6Gbps or if the link speed is half due to the internal bridge.
I was looking at system profiler and it appears the link speed for the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk is 6Gbps, but the negotiated link speed is 3Gbps. Not sure if a LaCie firmware is required to get the SSDs to work at 6Gbps or if the link speed is half due to the internal bridge.
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I applied the OCZ Vertex 3 link speed fix. No change in link speed or performance on the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk. System Profiler still reads link speed 6Gbps negotiated link 3Gbps. I believe the controller is a single SATA III channel with a bridge thereby limiting each drive to 3Gbps.
On a side note, this update appears to have fixed the display instability problems I had connecting to a 2010 27" iMac in target display mode. More testing required to be definitive, especially around resume from sleep.
Note: This is an additional example of a firmware update tool working over Thunderbolt. It appears that Thunderbolt is like PCIe with a SATA III controller plugged in.
I applied the OCZ Vertex 3 link speed fix. No change in link speed or performance on the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk. System Profiler still reads link speed 6Gbps negotiated link 3Gbps. I believe the controller is a single SATA III channel with a bridge thereby limiting each drive to 3Gbps.
On a side note, this update appears to have fixed the display instability problems I had connecting to a 2010 27" iMac in target display mode. More testing required to be definitive, especially around resume from sleep.
Note: This is an additional example of a firmware update tool working over Thunderbolt. It appears that Thunderbolt is like PCIe with a SATA III controller plugged in.
Fans arrived but did not have connectors. Just placed an order for the 2 pin fan connector.
The new Sunon fan is made in Taiwan and draws .3W at 5V compared to the original .78W. This should translate to much quieter operation.
Coincidently, I noticed the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk runs much cooler under OSX than Windows 7. Not surprising because this seems to be the way everything is in Bootcamp.
The new Sunon fan is made in Taiwan and draws .3W at 5V compared to the original .78W. This should translate to much quieter operation.
Coincidently, I noticed the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk runs much cooler under OSX than Windows 7. Not surprising because this seems to be the way everything is in Bootcamp.
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yes i agree. BTW I have all parts to make a voltage regulated fw800 to dc power cable. this would make a safe portable unit.
I wonder if the LaCie power supply is the problem with the display instability.
yeah it may be. I have the ones i grabbed on ebay in white they are identical in every way to the lacie except they are white and rated for 2 amps not 3 amp like the lacie. I have opened both units and every internal part is the same. So either the 2 amp rating for the white one is too low or the 3 amp rating for the black one is too high. they are both low grade power supplies. here is a really hi quality supply that i use for many hdd cases.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEAN-WELL-S...ultDomain_0&hash=item2eb9f97a5a#ht_4175wt_907
pm me I can mail one to you. this one can be opened and has voltage adjustment 11 to 14 volts it can run 2 lacie little big disks. I have 5 or 6 spares.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEAN-WELL-S...ultDomain_0&hash=item2eb9f97a5a#ht_4175wt_907
pm me I can mail one to you. this one can be opened and has voltage adjustment 11 to 14 volts it can run 2 lacie little big disks. I have 5 or 6 spares.
I moved the power supply to different outlets. It appears the instability occurs after some time. Not an issue since I shifted to using RDP to the machine.
I decided to get another LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk and mod it with dual Samsung 830 SSDs as these should be cooler than the OCZ Vertex 3 drives. The performance bottleneck is the LaCie so both drives should be cutting edge. My main goal is cooler long term operation as this one is going behind my HTPC 24/7 without fans. I found setting Windows 7 Link Power Management to Maximum L1 cooled the drive to near OSX levels.
I decided to get another LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk and mod it with dual Samsung 830 SSDs as these should be cooler than the OCZ Vertex 3 drives. The performance bottleneck is the LaCie so both drives should be cutting edge. My main goal is cooler long term operation as this one is going behind my HTPC 24/7 without fans. I found setting Windows 7 Link Power Management to Maximum L1 cooled the drive to near OSX levels.
followup to this mod. I HAVE RUN the LBD with the pair of samsung 256 series 470 ssds in raid0 for about 60 days. Flawless still get speeds of 450 read 370 write. I use about 230gb of the 512gb. with the fan disconnected it is silent.
I built a fw800 power cable and ran it off a macbook pro 13 inch 2011 feb model it does become portable but halfs to battery around 3 to 4 hours. I did it with a none regulated cable and I even used a regulated cable. Honestly this is okay but 1 ssd models are due out soon and they pull less power.
This LBD is a really nice way boost your iMac or your mac mini. If you are like me and have a lot of drives hanging around it is kind of nice to do.
you can set the pair of ssds to raid0 raid1 or jbod all very nice options for speed.
I built a fw800 power cable and ran it off a macbook pro 13 inch 2011 feb model it does become portable but halfs to battery around 3 to 4 hours. I did it with a none regulated cable and I even used a regulated cable. Honestly this is okay but 1 ssd models are due out soon and they pull less power.
This LBD is a really nice way boost your iMac or your mac mini. If you are like me and have a lot of drives hanging around it is kind of nice to do.
you can set the pair of ssds to raid0 raid1 or jbod all very nice options for speed.
I got a reply to my inquiry of LaCie, and I was told that the +12v the LBD requires is +/- 5%. The reply came from one of their engineers in France.
Too high a voltage can damage some of the circuitry under certain operating conditions. I suspect, this is referring to some of the various operating modes for the Thunderbolt interface; perhaps when connected to other devices.
Would hate for you to damage anything by using an unregulated power source.
as I state I ran with both wires one with regulation and one without. Since this was more for can I do it if I want to not for any other reason and since. elgato is selling 240gb t-bolt ssds that run off bus power alone i won't push the diy bus power idea.
here is the first bus power thunderbolt ssd
http://www.elgato.com/elgato/na/mainmenu/products/ThunderboltSSD.html
it is 429 for a 128gb size
here is the first bus power thunderbolt ssd
http://www.elgato.com/elgato/na/mainmenu/products/ThunderboltSSD.html
it is 429 for a 128gb size
This may be useful for those waiting on the LBD eSATA version.
I've modded my LBD by removing both shipped drives and adding an Intel 520 SSD to the first drive port and an eSATA connection to the second drive port. I cut up a board from a sata to eSATA 3.5" bay device to get the eSATA port. The fan is disconnected as I can no-longer completely re-assemble the LBD with an eSATA cable running out of it, however the LBD only feels warm, say about 5-10 degrees C above ambient, but certainly cooler than when run in it's shipped config.
I presently have attached 2x3TB drives in Raid0 using an Addonics estata port multiplier, this gives 205MB/s write and 245MB/s read using Blackmagic disk speed test and the drives half full of data.
Have been running the LBD in this config for a few weeks now with zero problems. The Intel SSD is fast to boot and load apps as expected.
So pleased to have an SSD and a raid config attached to my iMac, without having to disassemble it, and with speeds way faster that FW800 (and USB3.0 for that matter).
I've modded my LBD by removing both shipped drives and adding an Intel 520 SSD to the first drive port and an eSATA connection to the second drive port. I cut up a board from a sata to eSATA 3.5" bay device to get the eSATA port. The fan is disconnected as I can no-longer completely re-assemble the LBD with an eSATA cable running out of it, however the LBD only feels warm, say about 5-10 degrees C above ambient, but certainly cooler than when run in it's shipped config.
I presently have attached 2x3TB drives in Raid0 using an Addonics estata port multiplier, this gives 205MB/s write and 245MB/s read using Blackmagic disk speed test and the drives half full of data.
Have been running the LBD in this config for a few weeks now with zero problems. The Intel SSD is fast to boot and load apps as expected.
So pleased to have an SSD and a raid config attached to my iMac, without having to disassemble it, and with speeds way faster that FW800 (and USB3.0 for that matter).
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I am a bit lazy but I can do some thing like it with photos.
not hard to do with either of these plus the LBD with cables.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10315&cs_id=1031501&p_id=8673&seq=1&format=2
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10305&cs_id=1030504&p_id=8674&seq=1&format=2
links for esata jack
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Internal-Ex...ultDomain_0&hash=item43ac49744b#ht_767wt_1066
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/NewerTech/MPQXES2/
okay I set one up. this is the monoprice link to the 2.5 inch model it is in silver it is the same as owc maximus mini
http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/firewire/usb/raid_1/Gmax_Portable
a LBD with a 256gb ssd and a hookup to the 2.5 inch raid0 unit.
notice the simple esata jack cable a 12 or 13 dollar part.
I taped it to the ssd that is on on slot of the open LBD.
put in a esata cable and attached it to the maximus mini clone under it. once it worked I put the LBD heat sink back.
the raid is 2tb.
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to mods i sent a second post in a row to show rest of photos.
I attached the front plate and left the back open I may cut a hole fit the sata cable or not. the under case works well as raid0 or raid 1. it is fast for long clones and copies. ignore that I am running a second lbd as it is my normal osx drive. this second LBD sees one drive the ssd and one raid the pair of 1tb samsungs. not sure if you can run 3tb at it if you have the 3.5 inch raid box.but adding a 256gb ssd and 2tb raid0 for well under 1k and sata II speed is nice.
the raid0 pair of samsung 1tb hdds total 2tb scores 180 read write see back magic test in thumbnails.
the ssd scores 180 write 220 read.
notice the time difference on the two screen shots. first screen shot was 1119 second was 1146 so in 27 minutes 119 gb of time machine was done. pretty fast for a pair of 2.5 inch hdds in raid0 comes to 4.5 gb a minute not bad. this is a pretty lowcost setup.
buy a 400 dollar LBD
buy a ssd lets say 150 on a sata II
buy the 2.5 inch raid0 75
buy the cable 5 bucks
you put the 2 hdds from the little big disk in the 2.5 inch raid box.
cost 630 for a ssd an a raid add on.
this setup cost 400 LBD
300 for a 256 gb ssd
75 for the raid box
5 for the cable and
the 1tb hdds cost 50 more as i sold off the 500gb hdds in the LBD for 150 and paid 200 for the pair o1tb hdds or net 50.
net 830. nice improvement add a 256 gb ssd and a 2tb raid to your machine for under 1k in most any case under 830 in this case.
I attached the front plate and left the back open I may cut a hole fit the sata cable or not. the under case works well as raid0 or raid 1. it is fast for long clones and copies. ignore that I am running a second lbd as it is my normal osx drive. this second LBD sees one drive the ssd and one raid the pair of 1tb samsungs. not sure if you can run 3tb at it if you have the 3.5 inch raid box.but adding a 256gb ssd and 2tb raid0 for well under 1k and sata II speed is nice.
the raid0 pair of samsung 1tb hdds total 2tb scores 180 read write see back magic test in thumbnails.
the ssd scores 180 write 220 read.
notice the time difference on the two screen shots. first screen shot was 1119 second was 1146 so in 27 minutes 119 gb of time machine was done. pretty fast for a pair of 2.5 inch hdds in raid0 comes to 4.5 gb a minute not bad. this is a pretty lowcost setup.
buy a 400 dollar LBD
buy a ssd lets say 150 on a sata II
buy the 2.5 inch raid0 75
buy the cable 5 bucks
you put the 2 hdds from the little big disk in the 2.5 inch raid box.
cost 630 for a ssd an a raid add on.
this setup cost 400 LBD
300 for a 256 gb ssd
75 for the raid box
5 for the cable and
the 1tb hdds cost 50 more as i sold off the 500gb hdds in the LBD for 150 and paid 200 for the pair o1tb hdds or net 50.
net 830. nice improvement add a 256 gb ssd and a 2tb raid to your machine for under 1k in most any case under 830 in this case.
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Thanks philipma1957, saved me the trouble, as well as me being out all weekend with only iPad.
I should also mention that mines run fine here fanless in this config, passively cooled in the OZ summer with ambient temps above 30c.
I've also got a Sonnet Echo Express TB PC Card adapter, this is now sitting idle as I could only get ~70MB/s write speed out of it with eSATA adapters, read was good in the 190MB/s region though. Will wait until Sonnet get their USB3.0 adapter I purchased with it going and hopefully a resolution to the slower than expected write throughput of the Echo Express.
thank you for complaining as I like the new setup I did.
Yeah the sonnet echo express has been disappointing. your idea is good. The setup I did last night is going to stick around a while. I realized if you buy a 2tb lacie
from this seller it is 533
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lacie-90001...ltDomain_0&hash=item2c61ca2e34#ht_4490wt_1141
the small 2.5 inch raid box is 83
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10305&cs_id=1030504&p_id=8674&seq=1&format=2
a 128gb ssd is 150
http://www.ebay.com/itm/128GB-Samsu...ultDomain_0&hash=item43ac51c038#ht_980wt_1106
this is less then 750
I've been playing around with different configurations of the LaCie Thunderbolt Little Big Disk in real world situations. I've found that SATA III drives perform best when run as basic disk, not software RAID. Oddly, I'm getting the same through put writing to a single basic disk as in RAID. ATTO disk bench and Crystalmark said different, but transferring 100GB of h.264 MP4 the RAID would start at the synthetic benchmark speed of 400MB/s but quickly dropped to 200MB/s. However, a single drive would start at 384MB/s and drop to 200MB/s. When writing to two drives simultaneously both can maintain 200MB/s for a total of 400MB/s. I'm using Samsung 830s and OCZ Vertex 3 MAX IOPs for testing. Obviously, the controller is the limitation here.
I'm sticking with basic drive configuration because it's more reliable and the real world speed test are not show benefit to RAID 0 configuration. The plus side is TRIM will work under Windows 7 bootcamp and OSX can read basic NTFS.
I'm sticking with basic drive configuration because it's more reliable and the real world speed test are not show benefit to RAID 0 configuration. The plus side is TRIM will work under Windows 7 bootcamp and OSX can read basic NTFS.
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I installed the newertech drivers and restarted OSX. The controller still shows up as unknown negotiated link speed of 3.0. I also successfully installed the Marvell SATA 6 controller drivers in Windows 7 x64. However, the performance was worse than the Microsoft Standard AHCI 1.0 drivers. Read remained at 248MB/s and writes fell to 187MB/s measured on ATTO with OCZ Vertex 3. The similar internal drives hit 550/514 with the Intel RST drivers. An important note is the Marvell drivers do not appear in IDE/ATAPI controllers, but listed separately under Storage Controllers. They are likely not AHCI and running through SCSI channel instead. This could potentially be installed without the AHCI hack, which would be good for those who want to maintain Sleep (S3).
I installed the newertech drivers and restarted OSX. The controller still shows up as unknown negotiated link speed of 3.0. I also successfully installed the Marvell SATA 6 controller drivers in Windows 7 x64. However, the performance was worse than the Microsoft Standard AHCI 1.0 drivers. Read remained at 248MB/s and writes fell to 187MB/s measured on ATTO with OCZ Vertex 3. The similar internal drives hit 550/514 with the Intel RST drivers. An important note is the Marvell drivers do not appear in IDE/ATAPI controllers, but listed separately under Storage Controllers. They are likely not AHCI and running through SCSI channel instead. This could potentially be installed without the AHCI hack, which would be good for those who want to maintain Sleep (S3).
Portable TBolt SSD Gods
Thank you gentleman. philipma1957 & shortcut3d you guys are mad scientists and this helps a LOT of MBA users; for all the research this buds for you!
Thank you gentleman. philipma1957 & shortcut3d you guys are mad scientists and this helps a LOT of MBA users; for all the research this buds for you!
Thanks!
There is still territory that needs to be crossed, like getting Windows to install on Thunderbolt drives.
It installs with VMware fusion but not bootcamp. at least on my lacie lbd and my pegasus. that is true.
I bumped this thread to give my long term rating of this setup.
i prefer it over the seagate thunderbolt.
and with ssd drops in price you can make some nice setups with it.
I have run this for months
( no inside fans the fans are fff'd up just too loud of a high whine)
with my samsung series 470/810 ssds as a 768gb raid0 3 ssds across two lbds and it runs more stable then the seagate t-bolt adapter.
you can buy 2 crucial ssds for 203 a piece and the lbd for 329 at amazon that comes to 732 for a raid0 512gb ssd
or a 256raid1 ssd or 2 jbod ssd at 256gb each.
you have 2 500gb hdds left over so if you sell them the build is under 650
i prefer it over the seagate thunderbolt.
and with ssd drops in price you can make some nice setups with it.
I have run this for months
( no inside fans the fans are fff'd up just too loud of a high whine)
with my samsung series 470/810 ssds as a 768gb raid0 3 ssds across two lbds and it runs more stable then the seagate t-bolt adapter.
you can buy 2 crucial ssds for 203 a piece and the lbd for 329 at amazon that comes to 732 for a raid0 512gb ssd
or a 256raid1 ssd or 2 jbod ssd at 256gb each.
you have 2 500gb hdds left over so if you sell them the build is under 650
Does anyone know which controller-chip is inside the Monoprice Raid enlosure (the enclosure in the pictures above)? I tried two different raid enclosures and none of them worked with the LBD...
lion or snow or mountain lion. and what raid cases did you try that do not work?